Related
Looks like HTC has done it again and delivered a phone that should run crazy fast on paper BUT the actual performance is sub-par compared to other phones:
HTC Nexus One (FAILphone):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvzxZ8tOBcQ
HTC Magic and HTC Liquid Benchmark:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O36LA6EhZg4
I don't think that Neocore benchmarks the entire system, maybe more on the graphics chip. I don't know any specifics on the N1's graphics capabilities, but the 1 ghz snapdragon cpu is a definite boost from its predecessors.
Do you work for Apple?
How does it do on PiBenchmark? That would provide more relevant results with its Snapdragon processor.
andythefan said:
I don't think that Neocore benchmarks the entire system, maybe more on the graphics chip. I don't know any specifics on the N1's graphics capabilities, but the 1 ghz snapdragon cpu is a definite boost from its predecessors.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
doesn't the liquid come with an underclocked snapdragon?
I have a Magic that is rooted and tweaked to all hell and have played with the nexus. There is no doubt that the Google phone out performs any other phone that HTC has released. Ive seen it first hand. Its very fast and can handle so many things going on at the same time it makes my tummy tickle.
You are an idiot. Get your panties out of a bunch because you are pissed at the price and that it has no AT&T 3G. Should we all be pissed that the Droid only works on Verizon? Should we all be pissed that the iPhone only has AT&T 3G? The Nexus One is designed to be on T-Mobile. Sure, it will technically work on any GSM provider, but that isn't what it was intended to do. Google must have some deal with T-Mobile since they offers the most android phones.
And about the performance, that only shows video performance, and we dont know for sure what the N1 and A1 have in terms of a GPU
staulkor said:
And about the performance, that only shows video performance, and we dont know for sure what the N1 and A1 have in terms of a GPU
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I thought neocore tested the graphics chip with 3d benchamarking?
andythefan said:
I don't think that Neocore benchmarks the entire system, maybe more on the graphics chip. I don't know any specifics on the N1's graphics capabilities, but the 1 ghz snapdragon cpu is a definite boost from its predecessors.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's called system on a chip.
and the telling comparison is the Acer Liquid with its ~750MHz Snapdragon CPU (underclocked) vs. the Nexus One with its 1GHz Snapdragon CPU.
Looks like HTC screwed up again.
Ohhh. The other posters are pissed because their Messiah phone is a big FAIL?
What are you, 15 years old? Get off of mommy's computer and stop *****ing because you can't use the N1 on your network and get 3G.
Im guessing the benchmark isnt accurate. It goes beyond common senese that the fps are the same as the magic.
Maedhros said:
Im guessing the benchmark isnt accurate. It goes beyond common senese that the fps are the same as the magic.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually ... it goes nicely with HTC's track record of under-performing hardware.
We have too many variables that makes comparing these results difficult. The HTC Magic and Liquid are running 1.6, while the Nexus is running 2.1. There are dramatically different levels of overhead on different Android system versions. There could be way more overhead on Android 2.1 than on 1.6. Additionally, you forgot to mention that the Nexus One is running at a resolution 2.5 times that of the HTC Magic.
Just because you're not going to buy the Nexus (because you recently purchased another handset and are trying to justify your purchase, or because it doesn't support your carrier's 3G frequencies, or otherwise) doesn't mean you are obliged to spam these forums with "OMG THIS PHONE IS FAIL"
the resolution used on the n1 is far higher than on the older devices remember
coolVariable said:
It's called system on a chip.
and the telling comparison is the Acer Liquid with its ~750MHz Snapdragon CPU (underclocked) vs. the Nexus One with its 1GHz Snapdragon CPU.
Looks like HTC screwed up again.
Ohhh. The other posters are pissed because their Messiah phone is a big FAIL?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The only FAIL here are your posts. You sound like a Droid owner, pissed that your phone is about to lose top dog status. Just crawl back into your parents basement, fire up your xbox, and shoot some 12 year olds. It will help you get over the fact that you are a huge FAIL.
lol @semantics now thats funny man
I have had this phone for three weeks now and one thing its not is SLOW. Its way faster than my 3GS and my Mytouch.
I got 27.4 FPS on my G1.
I'm pretty sure the N1 isn't slower then the G1. That would be stupid.
I don't give a damn, I'm buying this joint day 1!! LOL
my theory:
1. Neocore is designed to work with android 1.6 and Open GL ES 1.1
2. The Liquid A1 has the same processor (albeit underclocked) and the same screen resolution as the N1 so you would expect them to perform similarliy. They dont perfrom the same so you must look at the differences between the phones. The biggest to me is the fact that the Liquid A1 has Android 1.6 and Open GL ES 1.1, the sweet spot for Neocore.
3. The N1 had Android 2.1 and Open GL ES 2.0, specs that are not supported by Neocore. How can Neocore accurately test the N1 when it does not support its specifications? The slowness is not due to poor hardware, rather it is due to old software trying to run on the latest hardware.
Found the following entry at: http://www.greenecomputing.com/apps/linpack/linpack-by-device/ (Samsung Galaxy S - Position 6)
1000.0MHz samsung/GT-I9000/GT-I9000/GT-I9000:2.2/FROYO/XXJP7:user/release-keys
I know thats possible to set the note manually, but maybe JP7 is inofficially out now.
Is there a download available?
See also: http://samsunggalaxysforums.com/showthread.php/1268-you-will-hate-me-for-this-but...
hmmm our galaxy benchmarks seems bit slow compare to desire doesn't it?
Think Froyo with JIT enabled will boost up our galaxy.
JIT is not working in JP1/2/3.
http://androidandme.com/2010/05/news/jit-performance-boost-coming-with-android-2-2/
Why do u think its not working?Look at the scores of Droid 2 which comes with FROYO. It has the same scores as SGS. Looks like the jit is more optimised fro qualcomm CPUs.
Aery said:
JIT is not working in JP1/2/3.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In fact, it's disabled in JP1 and JP2, but it is enabled in JP3.
Mikulec said:
Why do u think its not working?Look at the scores of Droid 2 which comes with FROYO. It has the same scores as SGS. Looks like the jit is more optimised fro qualcomm CPUs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was just thinking the same thing..
Mikulec said:
Why do u think its not working?Look at the scores of Droid 2 which comes with FROYO. It has the same scores as SGS. Looks like the jit is more optimised fro qualcomm CPUs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can understand it is more optimized for qualcomm's cpus but there is a 100% difference in the score.
Seems a bit odd to me.
Mikulec said:
Why do u think its not working?Look at the scores of Droid 2 which comes with FROYO. It has the same scores as SGS. Looks like the jit is more optimised fro qualcomm CPUs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sigh. Damn the N1.
More optimized for Qualcomm CPUs??? Isn't the CPU part of both the Samsung Hummingbird and the Snapdragon in essence the same ARM11 Cortex-A8? Yes they have some minor differences but please, nearly 3 times difference????? I'm beginning to think that Linpack is favoring Qualcomm chips!
And something else! How the hell did the Nexus One score 78 MFLOPS ?!?!?!?!?!?!?
Lets get back to the more important thing - what about the JP7, fake or real?
All I can say is that the snapdragon CPU and Hummingbird are built on the same architecture so they should perform quite close to each other.
Only thing that will prevent it from such a thing are drivers. But just wait I think Samsung will show the true power of the device with 2.2 soon.
they all based on coretex a8 more or less, if that what you say.
like Motorolas using TI OMAP 3 dont get high scores, so is galaxy s.
never get 30MFlops.
There is another thread somewhere that mentioned jp7 so yes i think its out in the wild somewhere.
I dont know , but maybe VFP (FPU hardware) functionality enabled in 2.2 snapdragon .
(limpack is FPO intensive).
For example: (in s3c6410 arm v6)
(mod enables VFP)
Average Linpack scores :
Stock: ~2.8 - 3.0
Stock w/ JIT: ~4.5
Stock w/ this mod: ~4.6
Stock w/ Jit & this mod: ~7.5 - 7.7
http://forum.sdx-developers.com/android-2-1-development/arm11-optimized-libdvm-so-3587/
edit: "(limpack is FPO (floating point operations) intensive)" instead "(limpack is FPU intensive)"
I'm hoping Samsung has put a performance-leach on the test versions because they want to blow peoples minds once they release it properly.
It's a bit of a stretch though...
pepitodequetequejas said:
(limpack is FPU intensive).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If true, this makes linpack a very very poor benchmark for phone speed... Nothing really uses the FPU on a phone besides for graphics, and that is all done by the graphics chipset and not the CPU anyway.
RyanZA said:
If true, this makes linpack a very very poor benchmark for phone speed... Nothing really uses the FPU on a phone besides for graphics, and that is all done by the graphics chipset and not the CPU anyway.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes , my slower (800Mhz armv6 wm) i8000 can easily beat my SGS in
FPO per second with chainfire moded libraries ( enables VFP ).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LINPACK
Pardon my language, but the benchmarks made me cry WTF is up with Samsung. but then Linpack may have a multiplier x2 if it sees Motorola as the brand name or something. LOL
After All why do we care about Linpack score?
OrionBG said:
After All why do we care about Linpack score?
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Because the kind of geeks who read a forum like this our obsessed with benchmarks and anything they can point to to say they've got the best geek-toy on the planet currently!
MomijiTMO said:
Sigh. Damn the N1.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, damn the N1. LOL. Seriously, I have one, and it's such a love/hate relationship:
Perfect form factor/size/weight (well, wouldn't mind a 4" screen).
Great button layout.
Quality build.
Gets the latest greatest Google sh*t first.
Horrible touchscreen - almost impossible for me to type anything on it.
Horrible red bias to the screen/display.
Horrible pink dot in pictures.
Unusable in sunlight.
So close to the perfect phone, but not quite.
Same can be said for our SGS, though. Hardware pretty damned sweet. Screen accurate and beautiful and useable in sunlight, weight perfect, size perfect, works in sunlight. Of course, out of the box it's almost unusable because of the lag! At least the SGS can be fixed with software for the most part. The N1's flaws are hardware and permanent. I'm not even sure HTC attempted to fix any of them in later builds of the phone.
If froyo is optimized for snapdragon processors then why samsung used humingbird processor
Why do you assume this? The two cpu's share much in common.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
jaysins said:
Why do you assume this? The two cpu's share much in common.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
benchmarks and system speed
dadyal said:
benchmarks and system speed
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why would Samsung make their own chip? Put simply, because they can. Samsung has the facilities and expertise needed to make their own chip, and by so doing they avoid the need of purchasing chips from another vendor (in this case, their competition: Qualcomm).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://pocketnow.com/hardware-1/snapdragon-versus-hummingbird
dadyal said:
If froyo is optimized for snapdragon processors then why samsung used humingbird processor
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
because they didn't want to use the ****ty gpu that comes with the original snapdragon (the newer snapdragon like in the dhd has a good gpu).
Because hummingbird is vastly superior in real world scenarios
Quadrant and linpack as well as most CPU benchmarks that rely on math being done by FPU run much quicker on the snapdragon because of its 128 bit register vs hummingbirds 64. I believe the snapdragons can turn half of it off to save power too. This explains part of the benchmarks but the hummingbird has optimizations snapdragon doesn't, and vise versa,but is suppose to be faster in most real world scenarios as Samsung claims and judging by browser load time comparisons I've seen and how well it runs android 2.1 I'd be inclined to agree. It keeps up with a nexus running 2.2 which is very reassuring so I'd worry less on benchmarks if I were you unless you really feel the need to show your friends how fast your phone can calculate pi to nth degree.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
@ darkimmortal, Is it really? Then why does my n1 with its "crap" snapdragon CPU run everything faster?
On paper yes hummingbird is better, but in the real world as you put it, its only as good as the software that runs on it, and I've not found anything yet that runs faster thanks to having a hummingbird than it would on say an n1 or desire.
The sgs is crippled by rfs, no processor can make up for that. In 3d games the sgs out performs any snapdragon based phones
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
jaysins said:
It keeps up with a nexus running 2.2 which is very reassuring so I'd worry less on benchmarks if I were you unless you really feel the need to show your friends how fast your phone can calculate pi to nth degree.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No disrespect but a well setup nexus on 2.2 is noticeably faster than even the most streamlined lag fixed sgs. The sgs wins the quadrant benchmark but in actual use the nexus is a fair bit faster.
tameracingdriver said:
@ darkimmortal, Is it really? Then why does my n1 with its "crap" snapdragon CPU run everything faster?
On paper yes hummingbird is better, but in the real world as you put it, its only as good as the software that runs on it, and I've not found anything yet that runs faster thanks to having a hummingbird than it would on say an n1 or desire.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You take into consideration just the CPU, N1 and SGS's file systems are different resulting in SGS to be bottlenecked; SGS's main plus is the GPU power, try running those types of GPU heavy items on N1 and they will not run as well. That's the main benefit of Hummingbird compared to Snap but don't just rely on comparing CPU's, there are more things at work here.
tameracingdriver said:
No disrespect but a well setup nexus on 2.2 is noticeably faster than even the most streamlined lag fixed sgs. The sgs wins the quadrant benchmark but in actual use the nexus is a fair bit faster.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Quadrant doesn't mean much, placebo effect at work here. Just a benchmark and doesn't translate (much) into real-world performance. Remember that Google also developed 2.2 almost specifically with Nexus One in mind resulting in more benefits on a N1 than a lot of phones.
lokhor said:
In 3d games the sgs out performs any snapdragon based phone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Admittedly I've not tried them all, and I admit the sgs runs the graphics benchmarks in quadrant noticeably faster, but the games I've tried all run about the same, so what good is that super powerful gpu if nothing takes advantage of it?
Try some gameloft games like asphalt 5, the sgs is a lot smoother
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Ill give it a try. Games are nice but not my main use, the ones I've tried so far including some 3d ones have been fine on the n1 so far.
Hummingbird is the processor of choice for the two most famous smartphones in the world at the moment. Our best among the rest Galaxy and the Iphone 4. So it's the winners choice.
tameracingdriver said:
Ill give it a try. Games are nice but not my main use, the ones I've tried so far including some 3d ones have been fine on the n1 so far.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You could try using a GPU benchmark rather than a system wide benchmark to determine GPU power. Neocore for example is strictly GPU and SGS outperforms N1 almost two-fold.
Again, that is a benchmark and you just have to try out different apps and games to test out GPU's for yourself.
Well for what its worth I've just tried asphalt 5, on the n1 and honestly its just as smooth as on the sgs, so in the end I still say there seems no real advantage in the real world.
dnsp said:
Hummingbird is the processor of choice for the two most famous smartphones in the world at the moment. Our best among the rest Galaxy and the Iphone 4. So it's the winners choice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
makes me wonder, if only Samsung could put iOS4 into Galaxy. we would have the fastest phone for sure,
unfortunately they builded Apple hardware and loaded crapy Android,
tameracingdriver said:
Well for what its worth I've just tried asphalt 5, on the n1 and honestly its just as smooth as on the sgs, so in the end I still say there seems no real advantage in the real world.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry mate but I have to disagree. Having owned a Nexus One, a HTC Desire and a SGS, I can tell you that the Nexus One was the fastest for opening apps, market, etc. The SGS fell between the nexus and the desire. I think each processor has been optimised for different things.
There is a HUGE difference in the graphics department. Asphalt, especially the old hardware accelerated versions (the new ones are dumbed down so they work on the snapdragon phones) were extremely laggy on the nexus and desire. on the SGS theyre very smooth and dont have the annoying multitouch bug.
Try the other gameloft games (sandstorm), polarbit (toon warz), pretty much all of the (few) 3d intensive apps. Very noticeable.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WNt1EQYheQ
the difference in performance was the reason I switched, esp the annoying multi touch, and welcomed my way into a world of sgs lag issues and a non working gps
Im not a big gamer but I do occasionally pull out a title. The differences in the processors is also apparent if you use rockplayer to watch videos.
imho, I preferred the hardware and AOSP feel of the nexus but wish the hummingbird processor+gpu had been used instead of the snaprdragon (or alternatively the snapdragon with a better gpu).
sonci said:
makes me wonder, if only Samsung could put iOS4 into Galaxy. we would have the fastest phone for sure,
unfortunately they builded Apple hardware and loaded crapy Android,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hope you're kidding on this one!
iOS is a closed system with a closed mind. Apps have to go trough intensive aprouval for the AllMighty and AllKnowing apple before hitting the market and, for small idiotic mistake, like a logo to close to the one of the AllMighty, it won't be aprouved.
And not to talk about all the iTune that you have to install just to get it to sync/update... you think Kies is crappy, try iTune on windows...you'll get a couple of services in the background in bonus with the resource hog app!
And, on another note, you should all take in consideration all the GPU intessive task in android, Gaming is only part of it... don't forget browsing, gallery, video playback (you can record a 720p video and watch it back full fluid).
Frankly, I don't realy get all the fuss about the so called "lag" on SGS... I don't realy get any at all and I'm still on the original (no lag fix) rom...
I have to go and pay my bill up to date tomorrow. I am very seriously thinking about the evo shift for obvious reasons. Does anyone have any thoughts on this subject or actually bought it? I'm interested in what you have to say.
herbthehammer said:
I have to go and pay my bill up to date tomorrow. I am very seriously thinking about the evo shift for obvious reasons. Does anyone have any thoughts on this subject or actually bought it? I'm interested in what you have to say.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not really sure what those obvious reasons are. The EVO Shift 4G has a slower processor, worse GPU, smaller screen, LCD instead of SAMOLED, and on all other points save Android 2.2 just about comes even with the Epic 4G. It's an attractive phone, and it probably has reasonable build quality (haven't had one in my hands yet) but I fail to see why it would be worth switching from an Epic 4G for.
Trade the best phone on sprint for a midrange phone? GREAT IDEA. /s
Electrofreak said:
I'm not really sure what those obvious reasons are. The EVO Shift 4G has a slower processor, worse GPU, smaller screen, LCD instead of SAMOLED, and on all other points save Android 2.2 just about comes even with the Epic 4G. It's an attractive phone, and it probably has reasonable build quality (haven't had one in my hands yet) but I fail to see why it would be worth switching from an Epic 4G for.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't believe the processor is slower. Just because it has a slower clock speed doesn't make it slower.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
True...but its slower. Hummingbird is the fastest mobile processor until the dual cores come out.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Electrofreak said:
I'm not really sure what those obvious reasons are. The EVO Shift 4G has a slower processor, worse GPU, smaller screen, LCD instead of SAMOLED, and on all other points save Android 2.2 just about comes even with the Epic 4G. It's an attractive phone, and it probably has reasonable build quality (haven't had one in my hands yet) but I fail to see why it would be worth switching from an Epic 4G for.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the only really good thing with the sliding keyboard is that it has no spring for it to kick out/back in. so less of a chance of it snaping/breaking anything. but its annoying to slide it. quadrant score on my store demo got 1298. beat our demo Evo by 200. so its not too bad actually for speed
I could swap phones with my old lady. She's got my evo. She doesn't really care about bigger badder better. Stuff I didn't like with the evo was its battery life, the radios were kinda deaf, and it wasn't very tolerant to temperature in the summer. Taking samsung out of the picture really narrows down the choices.
Yes, I'm impatient waiting for the real samsung update. That's my issues of obvious reasons. Plus, there's a lot of community development for htc compared to epic. Which will come first, official froyo or final (not beta or rc) cyanogen? That is the 164,000 dollar question. No 4g love either yet. I know, I'm ungrateful and too picky...
My wife traded her transform for one today, it pulled a 1634 in quadrant and over 34 in linpack before we left the parkinglot... maxed at 59fps too. 100% stock obviously.
Sent from my HERO200 using XDA App
I'm due 4 an upgrade in Feb..it was going to be an evo but damn that phone flys!
Sent from my HERO200 using XDA App
nope itll take something better than the epic for that
id love an epic with no 4g
it seems largely based off the g2 to me...so it should be similar?
And even though its 800mhz, its still better than the Evo's at 1ghz.
Also, it should be a whole lot more dev friendly since htc likes to use the same stuff, so it should be easy to OC it to a stable 1.6ghz like the g2 or a 2ghz unstable bull
But I think that'd still be a major downgrade from the epic.
The only upside in my opinion is the better development its guaranteed to have,or atleast easier development since its basically already been worked on so much as the Desire Z
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
muyoso said:
Trade the best phone on sprint for a midrange phone? GREAT IDEA. /s
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm going trade my epic in tomorrow for a sanyo m1 lol
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
No, but I am jumping ship for the atrix!
Boo
raylusk said:
I don't believe the processor is slower. Just because it has a slower clock speed doesn't make it slower.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Trust me, it's slower. I'm a tech blogger and I've written about Hummingbird and Snapdragon. Google "Hummingbird vs. Snapdragon" and click the first link.
The Hummingbird beats Snapdragon MHz for MHz in processing power due to some heavy tweaking by the engineers at Intrinsity (which is now owned by Apple, the bastards!)
The MSM7630 in the HTC Knight is Qualcomm's 2nd-Gen "low-end" Snapdragon. It's not really a Snapdragon per se (Qualcomm chose to omit that brand from the MSM line of SoCs), but it's got the Scorpion CPU inside which is the backbone of the Snapdragon platform. It features a better graphics GPU than its Snapdragon predecessors, an Adreno 205 instead of an Adreno 200, which just about doubles graphics performance from what I've seen. However, it still doesn't come close to the PowerVR SGX540 our Epic 4G is rocking, which is still nearly twice as powerful as the Adreno 205. One other improvement the MSM7630 has is that it's manufactured on the 45 nm feature size, whereas the first-gen Snapdragons like the one in the EVO 4G are running on a 65 nm process, and are significantly less power efficient. The Epic 4G however already is on the 45 nm process and achieves about the same level of power efficiency.
From a hardware standpoint, going from an Epic 4G to an HTC EVO Shift 4G is a downgrade in every way.
Electrofreak said:
Trust me, it's slower. I'm a tech blogger and I've written about Hummingbird and Snapdragon. Google "Hummingbird vs. Snapdragon" and click the first link.
The Hummingbird beats Snapdragon MHz for MHz in processing power due to some heavy tweaking by the engineers at Intrinsity (which is now owned by Apple, the bastards!)
The MSM7630 in the HTC Knight is Qualcomm's 2nd-Gen "low-end" Snapdragon. It's not really a Snapdragon per se (Qualcomm chose to omit that brand from the MSM line of SoCs), but it's got the Scorpion CPU inside which is the backbone of the Snapdragon platform. It features a better graphics GPU than its Snapdragon predecessors, an Adreno 205 instead of an Adreno 200, which just about doubles graphics performance from what I've seen. However, it still doesn't come close to the PowerVR SGX540 our Epic 4G is rocking, which is still nearly twice as powerful as the Adreno 205. One other improvement the MSM7630 has is that it's manufactured on the 45 nm feature size, whereas the first-gen Snapdragons like the one in the EVO 4G are running on a 65 nm process, and are significantly less power efficient. The Epic 4G however already is on the 45 nm process and achieves about the same level of power efficiency.
From a hardware standpoint, going from an Epic 4G to an HTC EVO Shift 4G is a downgrade in every way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
do you think it would be possible for you to do the same type of review on the camera for the epic against the evo and the iphone 4g? I read your last blog on the processors, and I must say dude im prety technical and you blew me away with your analysis!
boominz28 said:
do you think it would be possible for you to do the same type of review on the camera for the epic against the evo and the iphone 4g? I read your last blog on the processors, and I must say dude im prety technical and you blew me away with your analysis!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Eh, I'm not a photo guy, I don't do cameras. I don't know jack about all that stuff and I'm afraid I wouldn't do a very good job. :-\
I have been getting bugged to do a review of Cortex-A9 (specifically Tegra 2, Orion, OMAP 4400 etc) as well as the 2nd/3rd gen Snapdragons, but I'm working on my CCNA and MSCITP certifications right now and I'm trying not to let myself get too distracted; once I start researching and writing all of my spare time gets flushed down the crapper!
flawlessbmxr said:
the only really good thing with the sliding keyboard is that it has no spring for it to kick out/back in. so less of a chance of it snaping/breaking anything. but its annoying to slide it. quadrant score on my store demo got 1298. beat our demo Evo by 200. so its not too bad actually for speed
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the5ifty said:
My wife traded her transform for one today, it pulled a 1634 in quadrant and over 34 in linpack before we left the parkinglot... maxed at 59fps too. 100% stock obviously.
Sent from my HERO200 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The problem is that you guys are using Quadrant and Linpack. Snapdragon CPUs always perform better in Quadrant because it isn't a well-built benchmark. Linpack is fooled by Snapdragon's Virtual Floating Point extension.
I'd like to see the scores it gets on Smartbench 2010, a new benchmark tool that I'm still not sure I trust completely but definitely seems to be more accurate than Quadrant.
herbthehammer said:
I could swap phones with my old lady. She's got my evo. She doesn't really care about bigger badder better. Stuff I didn't like with the evo was its battery life, the radios were kinda deaf, and it wasn't very tolerant to temperature in the summer. Taking samsung out of the picture really narrows down the choices.
Yes, I'm impatient waiting for the real samsung update. That's my issues of obvious reasons. Plus, there's a lot of community development for htc compared to epic. Which will come first, official froyo or final (not beta or rc) cyanogen? That is the 164,000 dollar question. No 4g love either yet. I know, I'm ungrateful and too picky...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you guys read any posts from the senior members/devs? QUADRANT IS A JOKE. It caters toward snapdragon SoC's quadrant means nothing in R/L speeds.
sent from my brain telepathically :-D
herbthehammer said:
I have to go and pay my bill up to date tomorrow. I am very seriously thinking about the evo shift for obvious reasons. Does anyone have any thoughts on this subject or actually bought it? I'm interested in what you have to say.
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if you're gonna trade-in, trade-in for an upgrade like a Tegra 2 chipset phone. Not a downgrade to a HTC Swift.
FYI, Sprint has no Tegra 2 phones in their stables right now.
Go with the Evo 4g , or something other than a Samsung phone I just swapped it for my wife's Evo and I don't regret it!support wise is a lot better (meaning custom roms, etc...). The only thing I miss is the SAMOLED thats it. The Evo Shift feels very smooth just like a G2 and once someone ports that Desire Z rom its going to be very nice!
For me, the most important downgrade would be the lack of a front-facing camera on the Shift. When I am deployed, it would be much nicer to be able to video-chat with my wife when I can find a wifi spot with my Epic.
So I like many of you am thinking of jumping to tegra 2 within the.next year. I personally build pcs for myself and have always been a loyal fan of geforce gpu cards and nforce boards. So when I learned of tegra 2 I nearly creamed my pants. But after modding my phone running midnight I've turned this into a beast. Scoring 1100/2700 in smartbench and 2000 in quadrant I went looking for any benches tegra 2. I found a quadrant bench of the bionic and it scored around 2200. I know benches mean nothing but these scores are pretty close. What do you guys think are gonna be some advantages you see speed wise with tegra? Im trying to determine if the jump would be worth it...
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Tegra 2 will murder Epic's gpu,i would say its 3-4 times more powerfull.But who want Tegra without Super Amoled?lol,not me.
Good point lol I know samsung sucks at updates but I think if they get the sgs2 right ill be looking forward to it. Samoled is amazing. I want a 42 inch samoled tv. Wow I just really thought about that and it sounds amazing.
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lviv73 said:
Tegra 2 will murder Epic's gpu,i would say its 3-4 times more powerfull.But who want Tegra without Super Amoled?lol,not me.
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The Tegra 2 GPU is not 3-4 times more powerful...if anything the GPU is where the Epic is closest to the Tegra 2..(of course the Tegra 2 GPU supports some nice new protocols but in terms of raw power)
RushAOZ said:
So I like many of you am thinking of jumping to tegra 2 within the.next year. I personally build pcs for myself and have always been a loyal fan of geforce gpu cards and nforce boards. So when I learned of tegra 2 I nearly creamed my pants. But after modding my phone running midnight I've turned this into a beast. Scoring 1100/2700 in smartbench and 2000 in quadrant I went looking for any benches tegra 2. I found a quadrant bench of the bionic and it scored around 2200. I know benches mean nothing but these scores are pretty close. What do you guys think are gonna be some advantages you see speed wise with tegra? Im trying to determine if the jump would be worth it...
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Here is the things to consider besides quadrant being flawed:
1) The Tegra 2 right now is not optimized and is not using the dual core..its only using 1 core..Dual Core support and optimizations will come with Honeycomb..
2) The Hummingbird is also not optimized and will be optimized in Gingerbread
3) The GPU on the Epic dithers at 24bit while Tegra 2 still does 16bit dithering...
4) The GPU on the Epic is FPS locked...so its definitely capable of more..
Its kinda hard to say what the performance will be of both once the smoke clears..but the Tegra 2 is 40nm and is based of Cortex A9 which give it a lot of advantages..the disadvantages would lie in whether or not applications would support dual core and if they will when and how efficiently..
I estimate though Tegra 2 would definitely win on CPU processing from 25%-100% depending on whether or not it can use both cores..and in terms of GPU it would be around the same to 50% better depending if there is dual core support or not...(assuming that we unlock the FPS and find a way to make it dither the same amount of bits)
Edit: Forgot to add a conclusion~~
Conclusion is that a Tegra 2 is definitely an upgrade BUT until Honeycomb comes into play we would definitely be competitive...beyond that we won't be a slouch(I mean people still use EVOs even though ours is superior by a good margin)..but its no question Tegra 2 will surpass us..
Oh and on the Nvidia tibit...I am pretty pissed at them after what they did with the laptops..they have been serving faulty chipsets for laptops for YEARS and bribing manufacturers to use them..which has me pretty pissed...even though I hear latest chipsets 400+ series are ok..but I probably won't be buying a nvidia laptop for a while..desktop gpus are ok with me though..
RushAOZ said:
Good point lol I know samsung sucks at updates but I think if they get the sgs2 right ill be looking forward to it. Samoled is amazing. I want a 42 inch samoled tv. Wow I just really thought about that and it sounds amazing.
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Usually TVs tend to be Passive Matrix OLED and not Active Matrix OLED..anyways..that said I have seen an OLED TV at CES 2011..Don't now exact size it was as I viewed from a distance and had a person distracting me..I think it was 32"-46" somewhere there..and I'll tell you this IT WAS OUT OF THIS WORLD...or more precisely in this world..it was like looking through a glass window and they could pop out any time..thats how realistic it looked...I mean those 3rd TVs are suppose to "come out" but I think thats over-rated..look at an OLED TV and thats where its at..it was simply amazing...
Check out Galaxy S2.
I want the atrix on sprint. Seriously though has spelrint even announced any dual cores coming out this year?
Sent from my Evo Killer!!!
musclehead84 said:
I want the atrix on sprint. Seriously though has spelrint even announced any dual cores coming out this year?
Sent from my Evo Killer!!!
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I'm sure i wasn't the only one that noticed that none of the big CES phones were for sprint.... I don't think sprint even had a showing at CES
Were waiting for the 12th for they're announcement. The attic does sound amazing... but I don't like Motorola at all. I hate the droids and every moto phone I've had screwed me one way or another. I just hope that sprint nails the best version of the sgs2. Epic 2 4g
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I thought it was Feb 7th?
ort84 said:
I thought it was Feb 7th?
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it Is 8)
http://www.androidcentral.com/whats-sprint-conjuring-feb-7
I'm personally waiting for orion to make the jump to dual core. The tegra 2 is a nice upgrade for a non-hummingbird
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What in your opinion is going to be the best dual core processors? Example tegra, Orion,nvida etc.
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Anybody know the specs on the supposed epic 2?
Sent from my Evo Killer!!!
RushAOZ said:
Were waiting for the 12th for they're announcement. The attic does sound amazing... but I don't like Motorola at all. I hate the droids and every moto phone I've had screwed me one way or another. I just hope that sprint nails the best version of the sgs2. Epic 2 4g
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That is true of all phones except the razor. That was one well made phone, even see ones at least based off them these days. Those used to not break, remember when cell phones didn't break daily?
I'm sure soon the quadcore in the new ngp psp is going in a phone.
I just doubt seriously that it makes much of a difference at all as android at this point is not capable of running multiple threads from my understanding. The Nvidia GPU in the tegra 2 phones is pretty much on the same performance level as ours so thats not even a factor.
The rumor mill has GB offering up true multi core support on the phone, we will see how that goes, because the rumor mill had froyo supporting it too.
Multi core CPU's are awesome if you are endlessly running multiple cpu intensive tasks, on your phone I doubt you will be.
musclehead84 said:
What in your opinion is going to be the best dual core processors? Example tegra, Orion,nvida etc.
Sent from my Evo Killer!!!
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Orion! I mean hummingbird is te best single core...so why would samsung pass the crown? Lol but nah the tegra is probably gonna be the worst since its the first, but just because its the worst does not mean its bad at all lol
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Dungeon Defender on the Optimus 2X
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_C4TtJ4--i8
musclehead84 said:
What in your opinion is going to be the best dual core processors? Example tegra, Orion,nvida etc.
Sent from my Evo Killer!!!
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Hard to say really...there really is no benchmarks or live phones to tell..
The Tegra 2 seems to support more new specs/features on their GPU...the Orion will be bundled with the MALI-400 and the snapdragon has its Adreno which seems to be promising performance on par with our current Hummignbird but will have a 1.2ghz dual core which might help it in cpu (Though Tegra 2.5 will come this year too with 1.2ghz), the OMAP chose the SGX540 which is hard to say how they will utilize it..
See its kinda a mixed bag...as we don't have any phones to try out..
IF I were to guess out of all the Dual cores this year..the best performance would either be the Tegra 2.5 or the Orion..:/
xjman said:
I'm sure soon the quadcore in the new ngp psp is going in a phone.
I just doubt seriously that it makes much of a difference at all as android at this point is not capable of running multiple threads from my understanding. The Nvidia GPU in the tegra 2 phones is pretty much on the same performance level as ours so thats not even a factor.
The rumor mill has GB offering up true multi core support on the phone, we will see how that goes, because the rumor mill had froyo supporting it too.
Multi core CPU's are awesome if you are endlessly running multiple cpu intensive tasks, on your phone I doubt you will be.
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Multi-core support comes with Honeycomb :/..but yeh the 4 core CPU and a SGX543MP4+ does look rather sweet on that PSP..
I could write a monster post here, since comparing SoC architecture is a hobby of mine.
But, I'm tired, so I'm just going to drop links and say a few words.
http://briefmobile.com/lg-optimus-2x-benchmarked-defies-special-relativity
http://www.nvidia.com/object/IO_90715.html
Obviously NVIDIA's stuff has to be taken with a grain of salt (it has a certain amount of marketing spin thrown in) but thus far has been fairly accurate when compared to actual performance numbers.
Samsung is using Tegra 2 (we've caught them accepting orders for large numbers of Tegra 2 processors) so Orion is either still in the works or has been placed on the backburner. TI is prepping their OMAP 4400, which hopefully will feature some tweaks (not something TI is known for however) to keep it competitive with the fairly hard-copy Tegra 2 ARM Cortex-A9.
And let's not forget Qualcomm. They may not be technically using Cortex-A9, but with their license to customize the ARM instruction set and CPU architecture as they see fit (something that NVIDIA, Samsung, and TI haven't paid to do), they have the ability to modify their SoCs to remain competitive, no matter what the other guys do. Their only major drawback is the time and money they need to spend on R&D.
Alright, I didn't want to write a book so I'm going to stop myself here. If you want to see me rattle on for pages about this stuff, read this thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=907182
Mighty442 said:
Dungeon Defender on the Optimus 2X
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_C4TtJ4--i8
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Runs exactly the same as it does on my epic, I'm not sure the point with that?
gTen we will see if its there when its released. Until then all those dual cores don't do much.