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Let's be honest to ourselves here guys, out beloved Moto X Style was officially released in September which means this phone has now been out for at least 3 months and while all the effort that has since been put in this devices by key developers and people from day 1 up till now is very much appreciated and will continue to be appreciated, the development of this device compared to most flagships has been slow motion.
I am just trying to understand what the hell went wrong with this phone that made it end up with such super slow motion development, as when I originally bought the device I was thinking this phone would be at least in the top 20 most active phones on XDA development wise.
It had so much going for it, easy root, easy unlockable bootloader, a pretty much almost complete stock version of android, kernel sources released and motorolas good track record of updating their flagship phones in a timely manner and good hardware to accompany the great bloatware free stock software and a cheap price compared to some other flagships from other companies such as Samsung and Sony
With all this in mind I thought developers would flock to this device and we would have a massive development forum with loads of options between custom roms, mods, themes and other tweaks etc
But this is far from the case and I know the Nexus 6P being released probably had something to do with it, Still this should have been at least in top 20
At first I thought when Android 6.0 MM will be released development will increase then we needed the kernel sources as that was apparently not enough, then we had kernel sources but apart from 1 or 2 roms showing up being in alpha stages nothings changed too much.
This is such a disappointment to say the least.
If only I could understand why this is happening maybe something could be done to fix this or increase the development of this phone, I dont know maybe get some developers from the nexus 6p forums on here some how ...
Any ideas why this has happened and if anything can be done to increase development?
IS THERE ANY WAY WE AS A COMMUNITY CAN GET MORE DEVELOPERS TO WORK ON THIS DEVICE?
djsynth said:
If only I could understand why this is happening maybe something could be done to fix this or increase the development of this phone, I dont know maybe get some developers from the nexus 6p forums on here some how ...
Any ideas why this has happened and if anything can be done to increase development?
IS THERE ANY WAY WE AS A COMMUNITY CAN GET MORE DEVELOPERS TO WORK ON THIS DEVICE?
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I think it's due to a combination of factors, such as :
1) The popularity of the phone/ manufacturer. These figures show Lenovo/Motorloa in 5th place for sales, having a 3.7% market share in Q3 2015
2) The OS (Android) has improved a lot over recent years, to the extent where a lot of people (like me) are happy to stay with stock
3) With phones getting more expensive, more people are put off from unlocking their bootloader due to warranty issues
4) I'm no longer convinced about the benefits of custom ROMs - seems a lot of the time they break more things than they fix. Maybe a lot of other people now think the same.
5) Some apps, for example ones for mobile banking or subscrition TV & Video, will not work with a rooted phone.
In the past I've had various phones from various manufacturers, and I'd say if you get your kicks from installing custom ROMs, then buy a Nexus.
When i had the one plus one there were so many roms that was a brain storm... I prefer some and reliable roms than a plethora where you get confused!!!
2) The OS (Android) has improved a lot over recent years, to the extent where a lot of people (like me) are happy to stay with stock
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4) I'm no longer convinced about the benefits of custom ROMs - seems a lot of the time they break more things than they fix. Maybe a lot of other people now think the same.
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IMO you hit the nail on the head. I love this phone. I had the MXPE 2014 as well, was not a fan. Also owned the original, Loved it.
This MXPE has been great in imo, the lack of development has not been disappointing to me. The stock rom is really pretty good, there are minor tweaks that can be done but most can do these on their own.
I used to be a flash-aholic, but like @GretaLewd has stated...custom roms tend to break things. I'm more in favor of kernel development. But how many different kernels can you have? One way or another they'll be the same.
I also own a Nexus 6P, but my MXPE is my go to device.
I see users complaining about this phone constantly, I really don't think it matters what phone you put in the hands of those users...they would still find fault and complain.
Motorola and Lenovo did good by this device, I just hope they keep up with incrementals for a while.
Isn't the 64bit cpu reason because it takes more work to get cm/aosp roms?
Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
Good thread. Would love to hear more thoughts
Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
Ordered the device today. Hope slow development doesn't disappoint me on this device, as others have stated...
I have been using this device for 2 months now. I am happy with it an didn't face a single issue. I can do a little bit tweaking myself using Xposed.
So far the slow development doesn't bother me.
Only buy a device for what it can do out of the box, not what you hope it will be able to do with additional modding and development... Nothing else is guaranteed!
As it stands I'm very happy with my rooted stock Style, not need for custom roms.
chrisund123 said:
Only buy a device for what it can do out of the box, not what you hope it will be able to do with additional modding and development... Nothing else is guaranteed!
As it stands I'm very happy with my rooted stock Style, not need for custom roms.
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That's a good way to approach Android phones I suppose but I believe
it's still nice to buy a phone that's great out of the box and good development wise, usually flagships tend to have good development and then the mid range and low end phones tend to get smaller developments but I guess there's an exception to everything.
patt2k said:
Isn't the 64bit cpu reason because it takes more work to get cm/aosp roms?
Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
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I doubt that's the reason since 64 Bit has been the standard since Lollipop and pretty much all the flagships have a 64bit cpu since the beggining of 2015 but that doesn't stop other development forums from flourishing.
GretaLewd said:
I think it's due to a combination of factors, such as :
1) The popularity of the phone/ manufacturer. These figures show Lenovo/Motorloa in 5th place for sales, having a 3.7% market share in Q3 2015
2) The OS (Android) has improved a lot over recent years, to the extent where a lot of people (like me) are happy to stay with stock
3) With phones getting more expensive, more people are put off from unlocking their bootloader due to warranty issues
4) I'm no longer convinced about the benefits of custom ROMs - seems a lot of the time they break more things than they fix. Maybe a lot of other people now think the same.
5) Some apps, for example ones for mobile banking or subscrition TV & Video, will not work with a rooted phone.
In the past I've had various phones from various manufacturers, and I'd say if you get your kicks from installing custom ROMs, then buy a Nexus.
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Thank you for your break down on your thoughts of the subject and I must admit you've mention some very valid points here especially Point 1,2 and 5 but I think out of all of these its Point 1 and 2 that are the most significant, I suppose Motorola have a really small market share explains the lack of adoption between developers when comparing to some of the more prominent manufacturers such as samsung.
and The Android Stock OS has improved significantly within the past couple of years adding some new features that previously people had to root their phones to acomplish such as full app permission controls and backing up app data which google does for you now.
You need to follow development before buying a device these days. i.e. always wait at least 1-2 months. If you follow the development forums you would get an idea if developers are interested in said device or not. I for one, bought it right after I found out that AICP (CM12) rom was being developed. I was interested in running CM13 instead of other AOSP variations. And before I got the device the first (almost daily driver) builds were already uploaded.
Once cm is solid quite a few roms will pop up. Won't be long now.
Official MM has only been out for our phone for a little over a month. give it some time it may pick up. either way it's still an awesome phone out the box... and as stated above, once CM13 is stable im sure we'll see some of the other custom ROMs that are based off it.
GretaLewd said:
2) The OS (Android) has improved a lot over recent years, to the extent where a lot of people (like me) are happy to stay with stock
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This is a great point, but I'd like to add that this is especially applicable to our MXPE. We're really close to stock as it is, so there's little motivation to go ROM to debloat like there is on Samsung, LG, and similar phones. On the flip side, we have a lot of really neat features (active display, approach, accelerator gestures, voice controls) that we would lose if we went ROM.
For me, these two points combine, leaving me with little motivation to ROM my phone, especially since I can could get most of the advantages of CyanogenMod with something like GravityBox, which will allow me to keep the Motorola features (I'm currently unrooted because of the warranty, but I'll be rooted in the future for sure) . Of course, these are my own personal opinions, but I suspect that they reflect at least some of the mindset of this community.
I agree with others, that custom roms are often more trouble than they're worth. The only reason to use them these days is if your device isn't going to be updated to the latest version of Android.
Ever since moto introduced 99% stock android + moto display, roms have been entirely unnecessary for me. I used to rom my phones to gain greater flexibility + customizability. Now that I have stock android + Xposed, I doubt I will ever flash another custom rom again.
I'm still waiting for custom super roms that will make this device best in the market. Why can we have a rom with 1080p display, tweak kernel with better control for heating issue for overall battery life and speed?
Sent from my XT1575 using XDA Free mobile app
The biggest issue is that developers don't support devices they don't own. With the launch of the nexus 6 (not the 6p) most developers got it and had no need to update to a y newer devices.
Also to the comment that all flag ships are 64 bit this is not the case. If you look the most popular devices as far as developers are concerned are non 64 bit.
Also as android matures you will see less and less roms. As it will be come harder. There are very few real development teams. Most are just kitchen sink roms. A base with tons of cherry picks and a new name. Nothing even worth looking at twice. But more developers are closing up the source of their projects because of these types of roms.
To be honest most users have no point in flashing roms. Only those that like the development side of it will continue to mod roms and flash things.
If i knew that this phone pixel xl has a very few ROMs and MODs i wouldn't really buy it, i prefer oneplus phones... it's just disappointing
driss.sadok said:
If i knew that this phone pixel xl has a very few ROMs and MODs i wouldn't really buy it, i prefer oneplus phones... it's just disappointing
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7.x seems like it was a real challenge for developers with the a/b partitions etc. Hoping the 8 treble improvements will help that situation out. The Sony theming engine already has helped me via substratum.
Still I'm thinking the stock room hasn't given me any reason to move. In general the deviations from AOSP I like.
But yes, sure isn't a Nexus 5.
I think it's down to the price. I see no reason to buy this to Dev on over any other device Pixel just isn't value for money and nowhere near as popular as some of the other devices out there
People griping about "Very Less DEVS" certainly won't improve the situation. Thread reported to mods. If you want to complain, at least use the right forum.
I'd rather have "very less" stable quality software rather than the trash I see in some of the custom roms.
Android has matured a significant amount since the EZroot days of the Droid 1 days to the point where the OS already comes from factory with the customization that people used custom ROMs for.
That, plus the frequency of monthly updates and the need for the rom developer to keep up with the monthy updates PLUS incorporating new ways to circumvent the safetynet check has made modifying less sought after.
I'm pretty sure the majority of people people that rooted and ran ROMs were for the purpose of increasing functionality and not solely for the purpose of saying "I modified my phone".
Placebo init.d scripts and build.prop days flooded the "developer" community for some time until people caught up with it. If a company could incorporate ways to increase speed and battery life without losing functionality, wouldn't you think they would do it so they can have an edge against their competition?
So I ask, what are you looking for in a custom rom that isn't available right now?
ChongoDroid said:
I'd rather have "very less" stable quality software rather than the trash I see in some of the custom roms.
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Have to agree. I am running rooted stock and have all the mods I need with great battery life. I get the need for some people wanting to run custom roms for missing options from the stock rom, but with custom roms also comes with bugs.
Yea when I originally purchased this last year I figured the dev community would be huge. Don't get me wrong I appreciate the awesome ROMs we have just thought it would be a bigger scene. Seeing as how the phone is very expensive and if you want an unlocked bootloader you have to buy it through Google it makes sense (yes some Verizon models could be unlocked before updating). In general I still love the phone and it's by far better than anything I've had before. I don't upgrade phones often because I always wait for very good deals (Pixel for $140 new) so I'll likely have this for years.
ins5736 said:
People griping about "Very Less DEVS" certainly won't improve the situation. Thread reported to mods. If you want to complain, at least use the right forum.
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THANK U but i think this forum is the discussion too, so it's the right place to complain.. i wasn't complaining only for mods, roms too ... i think u get my point
scottjal said:
7.x seems like it was a real challenge for developers with the a/b partitions etc. Hoping the 8 treble improvements will help that situation out. The Sony theming engine already has helped me via substratum.
Still I'm thinking the stock room hasn't given me any reason to move. In general the deviations from AOSP I like.
But yes, sure isn't a Nexus 5.
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i have substratum and i am always on swiftblack, i'm getting bored so can u please link the sony one ? hahahaha i think our phone is only limited in stock system.
richii0207 said:
Android has matured a significant amount since the EZroot days of the Droid 1 days to the point where the OS already comes from factory with the customization that people used custom ROMs for.
That, plus the frequency of monthly updates and the need for the rom developer to keep up with the monthy updates PLUS incorporating new ways to circumvent the safetynet check has made modifying less sought after.
I'm pretty sure the majority of people people that rooted and ran ROMs were for the purpose of increasing functionality and not solely for the purpose of saying "I modified my phone".
Placebo init.d scripts and build.prop days flooded the "developer" community for some time until people caught up with it. If a company could incorporate ways to increase speed and battery life without losing functionality, wouldn't you think they would do it so they can have an edge against their competition?
So I ask, what are you looking for in a custom rom that isn't available right now?
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well i agree with u, and concerning your question i would say that if we can have a different room rather than the stock i would be happy, i used to have, nexus5, N6, N5x, N6P, 1+1 and 1+3.. i always look for something really different than the stock android, like miui or flyme os.. or at least a rom with plenty of features. i am just get bored to have always the same stock system as there is no other cutom oreo rom. i'm not a professional and i never tried to coock some here but i always change and flash my phone and even my family and friends phones . pixel xl is amazing especially with software updates and google things, even the camera app is the best so far and we recently have this new option of "AR STICKERS"... but i am bored that this phone doesn't really make me work on it.
i hope u get the message
aholeinthewor1d said:
Yea when I originally purchased this last year I figured the dev community would be huge. Don't get me wrong I appreciate the awesome ROMs we have just thought it would be a bigger scene. Seeing as how the phone is very expensive and if you want an unlocked bootloader you have to buy it through Google it makes sense (yes some Verizon models could be unlocked before updating). In general I still love the phone and it's by far better than anything I've had before. I don't upgrade phones often because I always wait for very good deals (Pixel for $140 new) so I'll likely have this for years.
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what u said is exactly what i meant by making this post, and honestly this phone is the best so far, i just expected more devs on it as it's a huge phone especially a google phone.
To the OP,
It's been pretty clear for some time that there aren't many rooms for the Pixel XL: are you sure that you really could not have known this before you got one?
I'm not that bothered that there isn't much development: less is more, there's less necessity than a few years ago and the pace of updates and safetynet make this a more intensive task (as mentioned by others). I have root and only use this for very specific features like adblocking.
I've had 3 OnePlus phones (2, 3 & 5) and each generation of Nexus/Pixel (bar two: GNex and N6... I had the Pixel 2 but returned it as faulty). A number of the roms/mods for 1+ are attempts to replicate Nexus/Pixel features, with the rest fairly pointless shortcuts and 'features' of little value (and often already accessible through an app). Substratum does most all you need for theming, and xposed (apparently almost ready for Oreo as the biggest jump was to Nougat) takes care of much of the other stuff.
driss.sadok said:
well i agree with u, and concerning your question i would say that if we can have a different room rather than the stock i would be happy, i used to have, nexus5, N6, N5x, N6P, 1+1 and 1+3.. i always look for something really different than the stock android, like miui or flyme os.. or at least a rom with plenty of features. i am just get bored to have always the same stock system as there is no other cutom oreo rom. i'm not a professional and i never tried to coock some here but i always change and flash my phone and even my family and friends phones . pixel xl is amazing especially with software updates and google things, even the camera app is the best so far and we recently have this new option of "AR STICKERS"... but i am bored that this phone doesn't really make me work on it.
i hope u get the message
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I think you may have bought the wrong phone if u expected that you were going to need to be replacing the ROM... IMHO, none of the custom ROMs are going to be better optimisized, and its just a fact that none will be utilisizing the latest new android features, being as they are always months behind Google's releases....
custom roms tend to be far better suited for older phones, EOL devices, etc...
you can still get a ton of customizations on the stock ROM, but it comes down to custom kernels, launchers and root apps that can modify the ROM, etc....
I'm curious, what are the compelling features that u need out of rom that u can't get on stock?
driss.sadok said:
THANK U but i think this forum is the discussion too, so it's the right place to complain.. i wasn't complaining only for mods, roms too ... i think u get my point
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The mods must agree with me, not you. Enjoy complaining in the correct forum.
kboya said:
To the OP,
It's been pretty clear for some time that there aren't many rooms for the Pixel XL: are you sure that you really could not have known this before you got one?
I'm not that bothered that there isn't much development: less is more, there's less necessity than a few years ago and the pace of updates and safetynet make this a more intensive task (as mentioned by others). I have root and only use this for very specific features like adblocking.
I've had 3 OnePlus phones (2, 3 & 5) and each generation of Nexus/Pixel (bar two: GNex and N6... I had the Pixel 2 but returned it as faulty). A number of the roms/mods for 1+ are attempts to replicate Nexus/Pixel features, with the rest fairly pointless shortcuts and 'features' of little value (and often already accessible through an app). Substratum does most all you need for theming, and xposed (apparently almost ready for Oreo as the biggest jump was to Nougat) takes care of much of the other stuff.
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I miss Xposed. So. Freaking. Much.
But not enough to to go back to nougat lol
Last Xposed report was almost ready for Oreo.. a few weeks back
Thank u guys, i know my subject is annoying, but i think i am just addicted to changing all time, and to this forum too lol. but if really Xposed comes to nougat, that would help my sickness
I have had no urge to install a custom ROM or even a kernel since I got the Pixel XL (right after release). Besides my being annoyed by Google putting the search bar on the bottom of the home launcher page and making it non-deletable or even movable, I have been totally happy with bootloader unlocked and rooted stock. My only development frustration is the moving target that the TWRP devs seem to be chasing and the SuperSU transition. I am liking Magisk so far, but I had got used to Chainfire's apps and have a hard time accepting this change LOL.
2nd hand Pixel XL's will swell the user base
liam_davenport said:
I think it's down to the price. I see no reason to buy this to Dev on over any other device Pixel just isn't value for money and nowhere near as popular as some of the other devices out there
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Cheaper 2nd hand XL's will make this phone more popular - I just got mine for £340 and am very pleased with it. (I should be as my previous phone was a Nexus 4 which I loved and nurtured for over 4 years!)
Having said that I'm on 8.1 stock unlocked but not yet rooted.
I'm waiting to see what Project Treble will bring.
I'd love to get some totally un-biased views here, including pros and cons. This will probably also help others given the current circumstances and wading through old threads containing up to 4000 posts is a real PIA. Current info condensed into one new thread would be great and not introduce clutter in the ROM threads.
Given that even if we get Oreo, there will most likely be no further official updates, just wondering, from all of you who have used many ROMs, what is an honest view of which ROMs are nearly bug free? Are any bug free? For me stuff like call and camera issues are a total deal breaker. I use my phone for personal and work, including interstate and minor overseas travel. Not going to even install any ROM that is compromised in some way.
I put OmniROM MM on my Oppo Find 7 and that was fantastic. It even got updated to Nougat and I think still has updates so I reset it to a non rooted, stock (Omni) state and passed it on to my eldest daughter. It's being enjoyed and well used still.
I'd really like to get that kind of service life from my Axon 7 as it is a very good phone still.
I reccomend Oreo AEX,although i heard that dualsim is not currently working
Just like asking "what are the best headphones?", or "what are the best speakers?", the only real way to tell how well a certain ROM will work for YOU on YOUR PHONE is to try it. Even between phones of the exact same model, there will always be different experiences across users. Backup, wipe, flash & see if the features/performance you find are what work for you.
Well that won't be happening. I use it for work. Can't be flashing it all the time. Just needs to work and leave it alone.
RobboW said:
Well that won't be happening. I use it for work. Can't be flashing it all the time. Just needs to work and leave it alone.
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I'd use raystef's stock based roms then, check them out.
Most are nougat, one is oreo beta, pick your poison.
I've had really good experiences with Official lineageOS. It has been a seamless process without any hitches. I'm personally waiting for the official release of lineageOS 15.1 (if and when it comes out). I've installed lineage on various devices and have been super happy with all of them. My Moto G Titan feels like a new phone after I've installed it.
Victor13f said:
I've had really good experiences with Official lineageOS. It has been a seamless process without any hitches. I'm personally waiting for the official release of lineageOS 15.1 (if and when it comes out). I've installed lineage on various devices and have been super happy with all of them. My Moto G Titan feels like a new phone after I've installed it.
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It's very device specific though. Sometimes a custom ROM (such as LOS, OMNI etc) will work well on one type of phone and be buggy on a different one. Not all phones work the same on them and I think the Axon 7 is one of those that ends up with buggy ROMs. The camera and DAC are complications that can be hard to get running well, also dual SIM can be an issue and I use it all.
If it's a choice between custom with bugs or stay on stock Nougat I would stay stock.
RobboW said:
If it's a choice between custom with bugs or stay on stock Nougat I would stay stock.
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The feedback on LOS doesn't seem to be too bad and I do understand that since I am also still stock but the problem is that the stock ROM is filled with bugs aswell. The screen brightness bug I get sometimes, the call bug, my Google play store crashes often, my GPS doesn't work properly etc etc. Those are all bugs the stock ROM itself has.
coming from the HTC m8 and this is the second closest thing to a cheap phone that throwing build quality away! (or is all glass). the first being the HTC 10 which is actually cheaper at 160$ but for people on that side of xda said that its battery cant handle anything. what about the Axon 7? I'd be flashing Stock on day one so skin isn't a factor for me.
No. the phone has a very good hardware, but the software is very unstable and nothing works. stay away.
Mine works. Still my daily driver on stock Oreo. I think many people stuff with their phones too much and ruin them.
I have bought mine several weeks ago and I am quite happy about it. A good thing is that there are lots and lots of working ROMs and utilities for it. It is almost unbrickable also.
I love the phone. I prefer Huawei but zte is great too. THe axon 7 is a great phone but the axon m is on sale everywhere for 200. I would get that. comes with the 821 and 4 gb of ram and fold in half screen.
I'm still using my Axon 7 as a daily driver. I think for $200 it's still a solid buy in 2019.
dodo34 said:
No. the phone has a very good hardware, but the software is very unstable and nothing works. stay away.
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Can you elaborate more on what you mean by the software is unstable and nothing works? Just curious because I've been running all versions of stock Android and never encountered anything unstable, nor would I claim that nothing works. Phone works awesome even in 2019. Sure we don't have any updated cellular bands, or most recent hardware, but the phone is still solid for general use.
brian117 said:
Can you elaborate more on what you mean by the software is unstable and nothing works? Just curious because I've been running all versions of stock Android and never encountered anything unstable, nor would I claim that nothing works. Phone works awesome even in 2019. Sure we don't have any updated cellular bands, or most recent hardware, but the phone is still solid for general use.
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If you are ok with being on Nougat for the rest of the time you have this phone, then it is a good deal for you, use Nougat stock and stay there. Everything Oreo is broken in some way and drains more battery, ZTE gave us broken Oreo and quit dev for this phone.
Then there is Pie GSI via Treble, which will break more features and opens up another mess of things to learn, and you will be flashing things almost daily trying to fix something, which will most likely break something else.
Hardware specs are good, but software is a mess. Unless like I say, stay on Nougat.
As much as I love my Axon 7, and not going to replace it anytime soon, I think the Pocophone F1 is a much better choice hardware-wise in 2019 and it costs not much more than 200$.
totnakina said:
If you are ok with being on Nougat for the rest of the time you have this phone, then it is a good deal for you, use Nougat stock and stay there. Everything Oreo is broken in some way and drains more battery, ZTE gave us broken Oreo and quit dev for this phone.
Then there is Pie GSI via Treble, which will break more features and opens up another mess of things to learn, and you will be flashing things almost daily trying to fix something, which will most likely break something else.
Hardware specs are good, but software is a mess. Unless like I say, stay on Nougat.
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What about the LOS and PIE based roms? From reading some of those threads it appears they work well? No?
Hi,
I was wondering if Android 10 based ROMs from maybe our favourite devs, say the unofficial Lineage OS 17, RR8 etc would be available and developed upon in the future.
I know the phone is getting old, and many people might have jumped ship towards newer ones, so are some of the devs still rocking the V20, or at least interested in developing for it.
It's hard to get a unified voice to predict, but in case someone knows some of the devs, it'd be nice to hear from them about this.
The biggest problem with those roms will be the lack of volte and wifi calling, those things are already a necessity to me.
I just bought my mint v20 tmobile version and frankly I am stunned by the lack of devlopment for this phone! For what many deem the last of the great flagship phone ever made ...it is stunning. I am comong from a leeco lemax 2 which has an extremely active development forum, I was so hoping to be able to install the latest greatest android and pixel OS ...but it is like a freaking ghost town. I know I would donate for a good OS on the latest android. Sad.
Alpha Omega might work on one, and it would be great. He might be our only hope.
Even without voLTE or WiFi calling, it'd be awesome to see some or even one Android Q ROM!
Personally I'd love a Paranoid Android ROM now they're back