Database Users

Why does DE get to keep warranty and not the regular version when bootloader is unloc

I don't like the black and white color scheme. The phones are identical and yet one gets to keep the warranty. It doesn't make any sense to me.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

It's an unfair world we're living in.

Mastaking said:
I don't like the black and white color scheme. The phones are identical and yet one gets to keep the warranty. It doesn't make any sense to me.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
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Click to collapse
Motorola needs to sell phones. That's what they do. To do that, they need to be friends with the carriers. Carriers don't want you unlocking your phone and uninstalling all the junk they put there. They make money from that junk. So you need to be discouraged from doing that.
Now, Motorola was actually nice enough to sell phones directly, outside of the carriers, to the general public. These phones are unlocked and easily rooted. That's great!
The cup is half full, not half empty.

maratd said:
Motorola needs to sell phones. That's what they do. To do that, they need to be friends with the carriers. Carriers don't want you unlocking your phone and uninstalling all the junk they put there. They make money from that junk. So you need to be discouraged from doing that.
Now, Motorola was actually nice enough to sell phones directly, outside of the carriers, to the general public. These phones are unlocked and easily rooted. That's great!
The cup is half full, not half empty.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hear that and in a Macro way that does make sense, but when I think about it in a selfish Micro way I just can't help but feel that it doesn't make any sense that they would let you keep your warranty if it has the words Developers Edition on your phone.

Mastaking said:
I hear that and in a Macro way that does make sense, but when I think about it in a selfish Micro way I just can't help but feel that it doesn't make any sense that they would let you keep your warranty if it has the words Developers Edition on your phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm guessing it's largely about the subsidy. If the carrier is footing the bill for your phone up front, they don't want you running out and doing something they might have to support, thus costing them twice. It's probably easier to void the warranty for all subsidized versions rather than keeping track of who paid full price and who took a subsidy.

binary visions said:
I'm guessing it's largely about the subsidy. If the carrier is footing the bill for your phone up front, they don't want you running out and doing something they might have to support, thus costing them twice. It's probably easier to void the warranty for all subsidized versions rather than keeping track of who paid full price and who took a subsidy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a very good point.

EDIT: Yes, you do keep the warranty. Sorry for the misinformation below (retained so that the following replies continue to make sense)
You actually DON'T keep warranty with the Dev Ed if you unlock the bootloader.
There's a statement in the box (just got my VZW Moto X DE yesterday) that states as soon as you unlock, you void the warranty and are on your own.
Thus, the only difference is that Motorola willingly gives DE owners the unlock code without having to surreptitiously hack the phone.
I was under the initial impression that you keep warranty. But you do not. Despite whatever the Moto website says.

rfulcher said:
You actually DON'T keep warranty with the Dev Ed if you unlock the bootloader.
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Click to collapse
You do, in fact, keep the warranty. I think it's funny that you say "despite what Moto says" - Moto provides the warranty. Why is what they say not valid?
http://motorola-blog.blogspot.com/2013/11/you-asked-we-listened-announcing.html
Requesting an unlock code will no longer void the device’s warranty
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

rfulcher said:
You actually DON'T keep warranty with the Dev Ed if you unlock the bootloader.
There's a statement in the box (just got my VZW Moto X DE yesterday) that states as soon as you unlock, you void the warranty and are on your own.
Thus, the only difference is that Motorola willingly gives DE owners the unlock code without having to surreptitiously hack the phone.
I was under the initial impression that you keep warranty. But you do not. Despite whatever the Moto website says.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Odds are, the retail packaging was never updated when they made their change.

imnuts said:
Odds are, the retail packaging was never updated when they made their change.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apparently, that is the case. Mea culpa.
"Despite what Motorola says" I stated because one of the reasons I bought the DE was that I was under the impression that the warranty would be preserved. Then, opening the box and seeing that cautionary pamphlet, I (wrongly) assumed that I had misinterpreted Motorola's website claims regarding the DE. What I didn't do was go back and confirm via Motorola's website.
Sorry for any confusion, and thanks to binary visions and imnuts for the correction!

The pamphlet is being edited to display the same language we have on the web site on new units. Sorry your unit did not come with an updated psmphlet but the web site language and new legal agreement takes precedence.
Sent from my XT1058 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

Plug phone in, run a couple commands, copy key, goto Motorola's official unlock site, paste code, get email from Motorola, copy another code in that email. Run command. Profit. I think that is pretty much how you unlock the carrier versions. It's not any having and is an official procedure from Motorola. What's the difference for the DE versions?
Sent from my XT1056 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

dobbs3x said:
Plug phone in, run a couple commands, copy key, goto Motorola's official unlock site, paste code, get email from Motorola, copy another code in that email. Run command. Profit. I think that is pretty much how you unlock the carrier versions. It's not any having and is an official procedure from Motorola. What's the difference for the DE versions?
Sent from my XT1056 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
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Click to collapse
A) not all the carrier versions can be unlocked, and
B) only the DE versions maintain their warranty after unlocking, as already stated above

Don't blame Motorola. Carriers require locked bootloaders. When you get unlocked phones usually you can do whatever you want to it. The warranty thing is a nice addition but I've never broken a phone to the point where I couldn't fix it myself. Personally I don't see an issue with the colors the warranty is just a bonus.
Sent from my Nexus 5

We're talking about the carrier variants that can be unlocked. We already know why AT&T and Verizon variants can't be unlocked, and that's completely irrelevant to this thread.

freak4dell said:
We're talking about the carrier variants that can be unlocked. We already know why AT&T and Verizon variants can't be unlocked, and that's completely irrelevant to this thread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same premise applies in the poster's comments above you. The carrier doesn't want to encourage this behavior so while they don't stop you from unlocking, they don't want to cover the related warranty issues.
Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk

I can't really see how that is true since t mobile and sprint both have and embrace the nexus program. In fact the t mobile moto x is the XT1053... Same exact phone as the gsm Dev edition save for the words on the back. Hell, if woven white was available through moto maker, I could go build a woven white back and black front phone and have the words "Developer Edition" put on the back and it would simply be the exact same.
I don't really understand the warranty thing with t mobile since a 32gb moto maker x is the exact same price and exact same model with the same process for unlocking. For Verizon I get it because they already have a locked phone policy, but t mobile doesn't. In fact, T-Mobile says they carry the phone but it isn't a T-Mobile branded phone (which is why they don't have Wi-Fi calling on it).
As well, functionality wise, if you want a nice looking unlocked moto x for at&t, you moto make a t mobile version and unlock it.
At least Motorola has a no questions asked return policy. I unlocked mine and was able to return it. Of course I flashed back to stock (huge pain compared to normal fastboot) and relocked it prior to returning. One thing they don't mention is they pay for return shipping, contrary to their website.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

arcanexvi said:
Same premise applies in the poster's comments above you. The carrier doesn't want to encourage this behavior so while they don't stop you from unlocking, they don't want to cover the related warranty issues.
Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The carrier has no say in a manufacturer's warranty, especially when the carrier doesn't even sell the phone.

freak4dell said:
The carrier has no say in a manufacturer's warranty, especially when the carrier doesn't even sell the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It does as far as warranty facilitation. You will no longer be able to walk into your carrier store for support. You'd need to work with Motorola directly. While you may be covered with Moto, your carrier isn't obligated to assist you.
Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk

arcanexvi said:
It does as far as warranty facilitation. You will no longer be able to walk into your carrier store for support. You'd need to work with Motorola directly. While you may be covered with Moto, your carrier isn't obligated to assist you.
Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With the US XT1053, you were never able to walk into a carrier store in the first place. T-Mobile does not sell this phone. They will not support it if you walk into a store, regardless of whether you are unlocked or not. And before somebody tries to say that it's still carrier-associated because they have the carrier name on the website when you order, well, so does the Verizon Dev Edition. The warranty is still valid on that when unlocking. Verizon won't help you with that, either, but Motorola will. That's what needs to happen with the T-Mobile X as well.
Sprint is slightly different, but as mentioned, they sell the Nexus phones in their store, which are also not warranty-voided if unlocked. I'm pretty sure they could manage to figure out how to handle the X, too.

Someone root and unlock dis bish

Save me from having to get the Nexus 6 monstrosity.

LifeAsADroid said:
Save me from having to get the Nexus 6 monstrosity.
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Click to collapse
this only factor its keeping me from over hype myself to this phone, if someone roots and unlocks bootloader this beast. will be the android phone of the year on size specs and battery.

That's where I am. N6 is too big. I have a Moto X and Nexus 7 (both 2013), and the N6 is just too big, based on the PhoneArena size comparisons. I need root, so the N6 has a slight advantage right now.
I love the idea of a Nexus phone, but the Turbo has most of the features I would want, like Moto Apps (same/similar to Moto X), wireless charging, amazing battery, and it's not so big. I know the N6 will be easy to root/unlock, but I don't if that is enough to outweigh the size.
Price is still an unknown on the Turbo, too. I have to think it's less than the $649 of the N6.
Semi-related.. Another thing I was thinking about the other day.. the Turbo has capacative buttons, with no menu button. My Moto X has on-screen buttons and does show the three dots from time to time that works as a menu button on the right side of the nav bar. How would the Turbo handle such a situation? Would the developer be forced to make a menu button somewhere in their app?

Don't forget about the note 4
Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2

I'm confident we'll get root. Almost every phone out there has gotten root, most without much delay.
Time will tell though

This might be the first phone I might not care about root. I don't use hotspots. Its 90% pure Android with actually useful extra features. With 3 gigs of ram and that battery, do I really care about bloat apps? I think maybe unicon and xposed might be my only reasons. And there not just haves. Of course I want root. Its my phone. But it won't be a deal breaker for me.

I've been spoiled by Xposed, and do use hotspot for my N7. I also use some Tasker profiles that need root, so it's kind of a must for me. I agree with @rajuabju, at the rate things have been going, it won't be more than a few months. Who knows, maybe this latest Moto exploit will work. Or maybe the middleman will have codes for the Turbo. We'll know in a few weeks, I guess.

fury683 said:
I've been spoiled by Xposed, and do use hotspot for my N7. I also use some Tasker profiles that need root, so it's kind of a must for me. I agree with @rajuabju, at the rate things have been going, it won't be more than a few months. Who knows, maybe this latest Moto exploit will work. Or maybe the middleman will have codes for the Turbo. We'll know in a few weeks, I guess.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol, exactly why I won't get a phone without root. Xposed and the hacked hotspot app for VZW. Also why I would like it "permanently" unlocked (like the RAZR HD was - a blown fuse that can't be fixed or "patched" once destroyed), easier to flash SuperSU.zip onto the phone after every update without worrying about "is it safe to take the update or not? Will I lose root?"

How much success has there been unlocking bootloaders on these Verizon Motorola devices in the past year or two?

grin0048 said:
How much success has there been unlocking bootloaders on these Verizon Motorola devices in the past year or two?
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Click to collapse
My Verizon Moto Maker Moto X is unlocked. The Chinese middleman was unlocking Moto X and another Moto phone.. Maxx or Ultra, maybe?
And SunShine seemed to work on most Droids.
Unless you were being sarcastic, in which case, you got me.

fury683 said:
My Verizon Moto Maker Moto X is unlocked. The Chinese middleman was unlocking Moto X and another Moto phone.. Maxx or Ultra, maybe?
And SunShine seemed to work on most Droids.
Unless you were being sarcastic, in which case, you got me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, wasn't trying to be sarcastic at all. I've been rolling with my S3 for the past 2.5 years and haven't been paying very much attention outside of that. I was somewhat aware that it was possible to pay some...one...thing...idk to get some of these Motorola devices unlocked--what a strange situation that is.

grin0048 said:
How much success has there been unlocking bootloaders on these Verizon Motorola devices in the past year or two?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would say there are probably equal odds that SunShine works for Turbo, or that Moto patched it. But given the propensity to root/unlock devices, it will happen rather quickly.

Sunshine won't work for the Droid Turbo, yet.
It only works for 4.4.3 and below, the Turbo will undoubtedly be released on 4.4.4 or 5.0, but that doesn't mean it won't eventually work. It's the only hope though.

I've been out of the CDMA loop for years and years and years now. Don't these phones use SIMs now? Is it just a matter of software unlocking GSM frequencies or is it still completely different hardware?
I was a phablet user for 2 years but went back to a N5 and am actually liking the smaller form factor, and would get this over the N6. A stock 5.0 port making this GPe would sure be sweet.
This phone looks geeat, but I'm on TMo.

Poi25 said:
I've been out of the CDMA loop for years and years and years now. Don't these phones use SIMs now? Is it just a matter of software unlocking GSM frequencies or is it still completely different hardware?
I was a phablet user for 2 years but went back to a N5 and am actually liking the smaller form factor, and would get this over the N6. A stock 5.0 port making this GPe would sure be sweet.
This phone looks geeat, but I'm on TMo.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The SIM is for LTE only, I believe. The rest is done over CDMA. I believe the N6 has a US edition and a world edition, so the US edition will work with all major carriers on all bands and won't really be "different". The Droid line is Verizon exclusive, so it will be locked to CDMA and Verizon's LTE bands.

grin0048 said:
No, wasn't trying to be sarcastic at all. I've been rolling with my S3 for the past 2.5 years and haven't been paying very much attention outside of that. I was somewhat aware that it was possible to pay some...one...thing...idk to get some of these Motorola devices unlocked--what a strange situation that is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you could pay a middle man to send you an unlock code but you needed to pass along your IMEI number to get it...now, sunshine seems to unlock just about all of the Moto phones from 2013 afaik...
i HIGHLY doubt sunshine will work out of the box on a Turbo..but heres to hoping...

Metfanant said:
you could pay a middle man to send you an unlock code but you needed to pass along your IMEI number to get it...now, sunshine seems to unlock just about all of the Moto phones from 2013 afaik...
i HIGHLY doubt sunshine will work out of the box on a Turbo..but heres to hoping...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I used the MiddleMan for my Moto G while I was on a prepaid Verizon plan. $45 well spent.
I was VERY lucky to have gotten my Verizon HTC One M7's bootloader unlocked the first day it came out Verizon blundered and didn't turn off that capability through HTC right away.

Will this beast be available worldwide or only in the US ?
PLEASE say worldwide.

roddem said:
Will this beast be available worldwide or only in the US ?
PLEASE say worldwide.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
PLEASE don't troll threads with your stupid questions that have nothing to do with the topic.

Metfanant said:
you could pay a middle man to send you an unlock code but you needed to pass along your IMEI number to get it...now, sunshine seems to unlock just about all of the Moto phones from 2013 afaik...
i HIGHLY doubt sunshine will work out of the box on a Turbo..but heres to hoping...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you're going to comment on a dev forum, at least understand the terminology before you use it... otherwise it makes you seem ignorant. "UNLOCKED" and "UNLOCKING THE BOOTLOADER" are two very different things that have ZERO to do with one another.
All LTE CDMA phones for the past 2 years that use a SIM are "unlocked", as this refers to the carrier lock that is placed on the device when it is sold in bulk to network providers (which is why you have three network settings in your phones setting menu - LTE, GSM, and Global). Don't use terminology you don't understand, as you're adding to the ignorance too many seem to have about what unlocking is and what unlocking a bootloader is. It makes it only that much harder for other individuals to get the correct information, and is the reason why a VZW rep tried to tell me I don't need a developer edition to unlock my phone, because all LTE devices are unlocked when I tried to explain I was looking for a developer edition so I could unlock the bootloader.
Very few Verizon phones have the capability to unlock the phone's bootloader, which allows for rooting without an exploit and the ability to flash custom ROMs (firmware), such as Cyanagenmod. Those of you believing root will appear on any new Motorola phones are not well versed in Motorola phones sold by Verizon. Dan Rosenberg, who is the person anyone with a Motorola device on Verizon has to to thank for the last half decade of being able to root your Motorola VZW phones, has repeatedly posted on numerous threads for over a year to not expect for your Motorola devices to be rooted and if you want root, either buy a Nexus or buy a Developer Edition (if VZW is going to release any more editions after the S5 is not known and information about Developer Editions for the Note 4 Droid Turbo have been repeatedly ignored by VZW's Public Affairs office). This is due to the fact VZW has wizened up and made finding an exploit on anything past 4.4.4 nigh impossible. Exploits that allow root access are not easy to find (taking several months for most VZW Moto root exploits) and as soon as one is found, within a matter of weeks, if not days, VZW will push an automatic update, forcing your phone to update to patch the exploit. This is why when you root your phone you're told to disable OTA updates at the apk level by freezing the update apk or removing it all together after making a backup of it.
Many Motorola users got a surprise in late Spring when a Moto employee "accidentally" included the exploited code that allowed you to blow the fuse and unlock the bootloader of devices running 4.4.2. That was a once in a billion opportunity that will probably never happen again. Every time an exploit has been found that allowed root access or the ability to unlock the bootloader (which was only recently cracked in the past year, possibly two... to put that in perspective, it took over half a decade for Dan Rosenberg to find the exploit that allowed the internal fuse to be blown, unlocking the bootloader). Exploits are not easy things to find, especially in Motorola devices running on VZW's network.
To all of those that like to post root bounties... BUY A DEVELOPER EDITION. You'll pay $300 for a device and then offer $300+ for a root bounty... which is the cost of developer edition device... considering VZW offers Edge, you no longer have to pay full retail in one go for a DE. From this point forward, VZW customers need to comprehend the fact that rooting will continue to be increasingly difficult to perform, most especially on Moto phones running on VZW's network. If you want root access, buy the S5 developer edition or wait until the first week of december to see if a developer edition for the Note 4 will be released (if a Note 4 DE is going to be released, it will occur within the 4 - 6 weeks following it's RTM on 10/23 [Thursday]).

Verizon Moto G bootloader unlock exploit

I haven't posted on XDA for a while, but recently my friend purchased a Verizon Motorola G for himself and couldn't find a way to unlock the bootloader.
Being *that* kind of friend and all, I did a bit of research and discovered this:
http://blog.azimuthsecurity.com/2013/04/unlocking-motorola-bootloader.html
I was curious if this exploit was still viable, so I quickly captured the latest OTA update of the Verizon Moto G firmware and started IDA...
Amazingly, although the exploitation method would have to be a little different due to changes in the TrustZone kernel,
the original arbitrary memory writing vulnerability still existed and could be exploited.
Code:
int __fastcall smc_vector(int code, int arg1, int arg2, int arg3, int alwaysZero)
{
.........
do
{
*(_DWORD *)(_R6 + 4 * v40) = dword_FC492C8[v40];
++v40;
}
while ( v40 < 4 );
.........
}
The only downside is that to perform said exploit, the smc call would have to execute in kernel context (i.e. kernel space).
Has anyone capitalized on said vulnerability yet and built a bootloader unlocker using this method, or do I have to get to work
and release my own ""exploit"" for this bug?
Or is there some other technical problem hindering the feasibility of all of this?

joshumax said:
I haven't posted on XDA for a while, but recently my friend purchased a Verizon Motorola G for himself and couldn't find a way to unlock the bootloader.
Being *that* kind of friend and all, I did a bit of research and discovered this:
http://blog.azimuthsecurity.com/2013/04/unlocking-motorola-bootloader.html
I was curious if this exploit was still viable, so I quickly captured the latest OTA update of the Verizon Moto G firmware and started IDA...
Amazingly, although the exploitation method would have to be a little different due to changes in the TrustZone kernel,
the original arbitrary memory writing vulnerability still existed and could be exploited.
Code:
int __fastcall smc_vector(int code, int arg1, int arg2, int arg3, int alwaysZero)
{
.........
do
{
*(_DWORD *)(_R6 + 4 * v40) = dword_FC492C8[v40];
++v40;
}
while ( v40 < 4 );
.........
}
The only downside is that to perform said exploit, the smc call would have to execute in kernel context (i.e. kernel space).
Has anyone capitalized on said vulnerability yet and built a bootloader unlocker using this method, or do I have to get to work
and release my own ""exploit"" for this bug?
Or is there some other technical problem hindering the feasibility of all of this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
SunShine will unlock the XT1028.
http://theroot.ninja
I was under the assumption that old exploits like this won't wouldn't work on the Moto G...you haven't tried this yet, correct?

d4rk3 said:
SunShine will unlock the XT1028.
http://theroot.ninja
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't trust or like SunShine that much; nor does my friend have the money to purchase the app.
d4rk3 said:
I was under the assumption that old exploits like this won't wouldn't work on the Moto G...you haven't tried this yet, correct?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Old exploits probably won't work out-of-the-box with the Moto G, things have changed...however the code above was in the latest firmware revision of the Verizon Motorola G,
which to me means that theoretically a few smc calls could unlock the Motorola G for good.
And no, sadly I haven't tried this yet, but it still *should* be possible.

XT1028 not unlockable with Sunshine
Sunshine will only unlock Android 4.4.3 and earlier on the Moto G. Verizon pushed the 4.4.4 update out via OTA long before November when Sunshine released support for the Moto G. You would have had to have bought your Moto G earlier in the year and would have had to continually refuse OTA updates to use it. And I also have read some people saying the OTA update went ahead and automatically installed itself anyway despite the phone's owner saying no.
---------- Post added at 10:26 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:07 AM ----------
joshumax said:
I don't trust or like SunShine that much; nor does my friend have the money to purchase the app.
Old exploits probably won't work out-of-the-box with the Moto G, things have changed...however the code above was in the latest firmware revision of the Verizon Motorola G,
which to me means that theoretically a few smc calls could unlock the Motorola G for good.
And no, sadly I haven't tried this yet, but it still *should* be possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I suspect this exploit is what the Sunshine developer used in Weaksauce 2.0. But that temproot program has only been written for the HTC. It does not work on the Moto G.
Statements by jcase several months ago claim there is no known exploit for 4.4.4 on the Moto G and that Sunshine 3.0 when it is released in January will not work for the Moto G.
I cannot believe jcase is unaware of this exploit, however. So this indicates to me that jcase deliberately lied a few months ago. My guess is that he has figured out that Verizon has been watching and reading his public statements on this forum, and he knows that Verizon is extremely slow at releasing updates, and he does not want them to rush out an OTA update before he gets Sunshine 3 shipped.
Hopefully that is the case, and hopefully Verizon does not consider YOU worth following, and does not rush an update for Lollipop out for the Moto G. before Sunshine 3 releases.
Otherwise you may have just scotched it for the rest of us.

joshumax said:
I don't trust or like SunShine that much; nor does my friend have the money to purchase the app.
Old exploits probably won't work out-of-the-box with the Moto G, things have changed...however the code above was in the latest firmware revision of the Verizon Motorola G,
which to me means that theoretically a few smc calls could unlock the Motorola G for good.
And no, sadly I haven't tried this yet, but it still *should* be possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We don't trust or like you, either. Also, that vuln in your OP is long patched and non-useful.

joshumax said:
I don't trust or like SunShine that much; nor does my friend have the money to purchase the app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yawn, it is safe, it works, and we are upfront about what we do.
joshumax said:
Old exploits probably won't work out-of-the-box with the Moto G, things have changed...however the code above was in the latest firmware revision of the Verizon Motorola G,
which to me means that theoretically a few smc calls could unlock the Motorola G for good.
And no, sadly I haven't tried this yet, but it still *should* be possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That vulnerability is confirmed patched in the MotoG, and has no chance of working. The "unlock function" in trustzone is disabled once fully booted.
tmittelstaedt said:
Sunshine will only unlock Android 4.4.3 and earlier on the Moto G. Verizon pushed the 4.4.4 update out via OTA long before November when Sunshine released support for the Moto G. You would have had to have bought your Moto G earlier in the year and would have had to continually refuse OTA updates to use it. And I also have read some people saying the OTA update went ahead and automatically installed itself anyway despite the phone's owner saying no.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is true, and it sucks, but it still works on most out of box.
tmittelstaedt said:
---------- Post added at 10:26 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:07 AM ----------
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
tmittelstaedt said:
I suspect this exploit is what the Sunshine developer used in Weaksauce 2.0. But that temproot program has only been written for the HTC. It does not work on the Moto G.
Statements by jcase several months ago claim there is no known exploit for 4.4.4 on the Moto G and that Sunshine 3.0 when it is released in January will not work for the Moto G.
I cannot believe jcase is unaware of this exploit, however. So this indicates to me that jcase deliberately lied a few months ago. My guess is that he has figured out that Verizon has been watching and reading his public statements on this forum, and he knows that Verizon is extremely slow at releasing updates, and he does not want them to rush out an OTA update before he gets Sunshine 3 shipped.
Hopefully that is the case, and hopefully Verizon does not consider YOU worth following, and does not rush an update for Lollipop out for the Moto G. before Sunshine 3 releases.
Otherwise you may have just scotched it for the rest of us.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually no, WeakSauce2 targets dmagent, like WeakSauce1, its almost identical in fact, is very specific to HTC and the vulnerability is original to research done by myself and @beaups.
I haven't lied about jack, and dont appreciate eluding that i was, even "to hide" from Verizon.
Common sense says this vulnerability is patched, as it is fairly old. Actual effort to look at the trustone proves this.

jcase said:
I haven't lied about jack, and dont appreciate eluding that i was, even "to hide" from Verizon.
Common sense says this vulnerability is patched, as it is fairly old. Actual effort to look at the trustone proves this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No offense intended jcase but I have worked for software companies since 1990 (not as a developer - in accounting and later IT) and I have to believe that you don't quite really understand what you did with Sunshine.
As long as breaking root on phones was a hackers contest, and the exploit scripts were free, the phone companies and software companies didn't really give a damn about you or what you did or anything else that the security people came up with. They were fat, dumb, and happy and lazy and were contented to let Google and the manufacturer deal with security with minimal effort on their part.
The minute you started charging money, you became public enemy #1 to Verizon and any other carrier who wants to control their users. Because they know this - as long as the cracks are free the developers aren't going to have any incentive to wrap them in a slick wrapper that Ma and Pa Kettle can download, stick in a credit card number and click.
Once you start charging - why then you know (or will discover if you don't know already) that the revenue you get is directly proportional to how easy you make the package to run for Ma and Pa Kettle. And it really doesn't take a lot of extra work. For every 10% easier you make Sunshine to use, your going to see 1000% increase in revenue. Verizon knows this. Google knows this. Motorola knows this. And that is what scares them. Their goal right now is to shut you down. And they are gonna do it by doing whatever they can to break your stuff as quickly as possible.
Do you know how hard it is to find a cheap used Verizon Moto G nowadays off Ebay or someplace with 4.4.3 or earlier on it? Ever since November when you released support, Ebay has had a run on those phones. And Ebay is flooded now with Verizon Moto G's that have 4.4.4 on them and a bunch of panicked sellers who are doing whatever possible to make it hard for the buyers to determine what the Android version is.
A couple days after you released weaksauce2 the m8 sold out in every Verizon store in my city. Sold out - or recalled - or withheld, I don't know what.
Verizon and friends don't care about people like me who spend the hours of time on these forums to research to figure out what's what. They care about Pa Kettle who gets on Play Store, downloads an app and runs it and the app pops up a screen saying "you must root your phone to run this app" complete with an auto-installer that downloads and installs Sunshine and executes it for them. Pa Kettle is just going to fork over the $25 and think nothing of it and ca-ching there slips another phone out of the carriers control - a phone that can get ad-blocker loaded on it, a phone that can get that idiotic NFL garbage unloaded from it - a phone the carrier figures they have lost.
From their point of view you are stealing their customers. They don't care as much about the revenue from the wireless plan as they care about their ability to track their customers intimate buying habits and sell them to the highest bidder. They paid damn good money for the cost of the phone hardware so they could snare another mark to sell advertising to and you came along and flushed that money down the crapper with your software.
I guarantee to you there's been much discussion about Sunshine in the Verizon boardrooms. If your not lying now on these forums or at least being very evasive about what your working on, you should be. Their gunning for you.

That's a neat theory, but I can assure you the mfr's patch tactics have been no different with sunshine than they have been with our other (free) releases. Further, based on our sales #'s, I can assure you that sunshine has not caused any phones to sell out...its not like we have 1000's upon 1000's of sunshine sales. Lastly, your theory that "they don't care as much about the wireless plan revenue" is pure tin foil hat stuff.

I dont think you understand what I do, I work with carriers, OEMs and the like. I've trained some them, I go out to dinner with them, I've invited them to my home, I exchange christmas gifts with them, I have met their families. Their cell phone numbers are in my contacts list. I'm drinking my coffee from a cup one of them gave me, right now. When I am stuck, I've gone to them for help more than I can count. This is my industry, and these people are my friends. These people are not fat dumb or lazy. They care deeply about security, and work their butts off with the limited resources they have. The good ones engage the "hackers", and actually enjoy it. Many of them are on a skill level above and beyond myself.
I'm actually a firm believer they would rather see something packaged and sold, than out in the open, as it results in many times less people using it, as well as the time packaging it will stop or greatly slow down anyone trying to use the material for bad purposes (malware etc). Honestly, they probably don't care how something is distributed at all.
Verizon MotoG with 4.4.2 is is $65 at bestbuy and something like $75 at walmart, how do I know this, we bought many.
I've not lied nor been evasive, I've actually been more open on what I am doing with my time. We are working on 3.0 to add more support to HTC. These people know me enough to know they can ask what I am working on, and I give them a straight answer. More often than not, I will email the company who is responsible for what I find, and let them know before, or at release time when I release something. Often I will give them details and source code not public.
tmittelstaedt said:
No offense intended jcase but I have worked for software companies since 1990 (not as a developer - in accounting and later IT) and I have to believe that you don't quite really understand what you did with Sunshine.
As long as breaking root on phones was a hackers contest, and the exploit scripts were free, the phone companies and software companies didn't really give a damn about you or what you did or anything else that the security people came up with. They were fat, dumb, and happy and lazy and were contented to let Google and the manufacturer deal with security with minimal effort on their part.
The minute you started charging money, you became public enemy #1 to Verizon and any other carrier who wants to control their users. Because they know this - as long as the cracks are free the developers aren't going to have any incentive to wrap them in a slick wrapper that Ma and Pa Kettle can download, stick in a credit card number and click.
Once you start charging - why then you know (or will discover if you don't know already) that the revenue you get is directly proportional to how easy you make the package to run for Ma and Pa Kettle. And it really doesn't take a lot of extra work. For every 10% easier you make Sunshine to use, your going to see 1000% increase in revenue. Verizon knows this. Google knows this. Motorola knows this. And that is what scares them. Their goal right now is to shut you down. And they are gonna do it by doing whatever they can to break your stuff as quickly as possible.
Do you know how hard it is to find a cheap used Verizon Moto G nowadays off Ebay or someplace with 4.4.3 or earlier on it? Ever since November when you released support, Ebay has had a run on those phones. And Ebay is flooded now with Verizon Moto G's that have 4.4.4 on them and a bunch of panicked sellers who are doing whatever possible to make it hard for the buyers to determine what the Android version is.
A couple days after you released weaksauce2 the m8 sold out in every Verizon store in my city. Sold out - or recalled - or withheld, I don't know what.
Verizon and friends don't care about people like me who spend the hours of time on these forums to research to figure out what's what. They care about Pa Kettle who gets on Play Store, downloads an app and runs it and the app pops up a screen saying "you must root your phone to run this app" complete with an auto-installer that downloads and installs Sunshine and executes it for them. Pa Kettle is just going to fork over the $25 and think nothing of it and ca-ching there slips another phone out of the carriers control - a phone that can get ad-blocker loaded on it, a phone that can get that idiotic NFL garbage unloaded from it - a phone the carrier figures they have lost.
From their point of view you are stealing their customers. They don't care as much about the revenue from the wireless plan as they care about their ability to track their customers intimate buying habits and sell them to the highest bidder. They paid damn good money for the cost of the phone hardware so they could snare another mark to sell advertising to and you came along and flushed that money down the crapper with your software.
I guarantee to you there's been much discussion about Sunshine in the Verizon boardrooms. If your not lying now on these forums or at least being very evasive about what your working on, you should be. Their gunning for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

jcase said:
I dont think you understand what I do, I work with carriers, OEMs and the like. I've trained some them, I go out to dinner with them, I've invited them to my home, I exchange christmas gifts with them, I have met their families. Their cell phone numbers are in my contacts list. I'm drinking my coffee from a cup one of them gave me, right now. When I am stuck, I've gone to them for help more than I can count. This is my industry, and these people are my friends. These people are not fat dumb or lazy. They care deeply about security, and work their butts off with the limited resources they have. The good ones engage the "hackers", and actually enjoy it. Many of them are on a skill level above and beyond myself.
I'm actually a firm believer they would rather see something packaged and sold, than out in the open, as it results in many times less people using it, as well as the time packaging it will stop or greatly slow down anyone trying to use the material for bad purposes (malware etc). Honestly, they probably don't care how something is distributed at all.
Verizon MotoG with 4.4.2 is is $65 at bestbuy and something like $75 at walmart, how do I know this, we bought many.
I've not lied nor been evasive, I've actually been more open on what I am doing with my time. We are working on 3.0 to add more support to HTC. These people know me enough to know they can ask what I am working on, and I give them a straight answer. More often than not, I will email the company who is responsible for what I find, and let them know before, or at release time when I release something. Often I will give them details and source code not public.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is 5.0 or 5.0.2 going to get Pie or cfroot on xt1028 Verizon when it comes out?

cell2011 said:
Is 5.0 or 5.0.2 going to get Pie or cfroot on xt1028 Verizon when it comes out?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Neither

Won't it be rootable or boot loader unlocked ever? If not I'll sell it and get 1031 boost. Do you this 1031 will ever get lollipop?

jcase said:
I dont think you understand what I do, I work with carriers, OEMs and the like. I've trained some them, I go out to dinner with them, I've invited them to my home, I exchange christmas gifts with them, I have met their families. Their cell phone numbers are in my contacts list. I'm drinking my coffee from a cup one of them gave me, right now. When I am stuck, I've gone to them for help more than I can count. This is my industry, and these people are my friends. These people are not fat dumb or lazy. They care deeply about security, and work their butts off with the limited resources they have. The good ones engage the "hackers", and actually enjoy it. Many of them are on a skill level above and beyond myself.
I'm actually a firm believer they would rather see something packaged and sold, than out in the open, as it results in many times less people using it, as well as the time packaging it will stop or greatly slow down anyone trying to use the material for bad purposes (malware etc). Honestly, they probably don't care how something is distributed at all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your not working with the upper level execs. Your working with the lower level people who have no control over what their company does. Their upper execs tell them "make the phone so that we own it completely even if the customer forks over their money or your fired" and they work their butts off to do that. I'm not talking about the lower level people and I think you know that.
The upper level execs set the company culture. And the company culture at Verizon is the customer is nothing more than fodder. If Verizon's company culture gave a damn about the customer they would have both bootloader locked and bootloader unlocked phones for sale in the retail outlets. If bootloader locking is such a security advantage the customers would buy them over bootloader unlocked phones. But no, instead, the bootloader locking is hidden away and the only way to buy one that can be unlocked is to pay ten times more for one. Your friends may be friends with you but they are supporting their families off of that company. They cannot go against that culture even though they probably would agree with me that Verizon should give customers a choice about buying a locked or unlocked phone.
Verizon does not need to force Motorola to refuse to hand out bootloader unlock codes for the Moto G. Nor do they need to make it insanely difficult to do a network unlock. Verizon posts a statement on their website saying that after you have owned your carrier-subsidized phone for a year you can network-unlock it. But they say NOTHING about bootloader-unlocking it. And if you try calling Verizon's support and asking for a network unlock code you will waste hours of time. I finally got a support tech in Verizon who was willing to look at their own website - after they told me Verizon didn't unlock phones - and do what she needed to do to answer my question - which is, when I am ready to network-unlock my phone, I have to call in and get the request escalated to 3rd tier before I'll be talking to a tech that even knows what network unlocking _is_. And the FCC - who forced them to allow for network unlocking - didn't force them to bootloader unlock. And of course they won't do it.
Verizon could go to Motorola and say "every phone that is 2 years old or older you are free to hand out bootloader unlocks on" But they won't.
No, you are very naive if you think that your friends who work at the carriers represent the carrier's approach and view of it's customers. They don't. I have no doubt that they are nice people. But the organization they work for is rotten to the core. I judge carriers by how they treat their customers. I judge them about how they treat me. And when I bought my phone and called into Verizon asking about what date I would get my phone network unlocked - just as a test to see if Verizon is really upholding the terms of it's agreement with the FCC where the FCC required them to network unlock phones - I was repeatedly lied to by their support people. So I am not basing my statements about that carrier on reading some crank who is spewing on the Internet against the carrier because he doesn't want to pay his phone bill. I'm basing them on how I've been treated. Where I live Verizon is a requirement due to coverage issues. But I have no qualms about what kind of a company I'm dealing with. I'm dealing with a company that buys phones by the hundreds of thousands from Motorola at $50 per device, marks them up 100%, and has a contract with Motorola that says Motorola must advertise a MSRP of $200, so that the sheeple who walk into the Verizon store think they are "gettin a deal" I don't trust them any further than I could spit a rat.
The PC community - Dell, HP, and all the rest of them - worked with Microsoft to develop a standard for encrypted bootloaders too. But ya know what? Microsoft put into the standard for encrypted bootloaders a requirement that the customer and go into BIOS and turn them off. PC makers that don't adhere to this aren't allowed to advertise compliance with the security standard. Verizon has that behavior as a model. But instead of requiring Motorola to make turning off encryption an option for the customer, they did exactly the opposite.
You can go and buy a brand new low-end PC today in the $250 range. That's a cheap PC equivalent to a cheap phone. But it's bootloader encryption is customer-selectable. The same should be the case for cell phones. When you released Sunshine you firmly put yourself behind that ideal. But don't for a second believe that your friends are working for a carrier that has any other position that your software is completely opposite what they believe.

jcase said:
I dont think you understand what I do, I work with carriers, OEMs and the like. I've trained some them, I go out to dinner with them, I've invited them to my home, I exchange christmas gifts with them, I have met their families. Their cell phone numbers are in my contacts list. I'm drinking my coffee from a cup one of them gave me, right now. When I am stuck, I've gone to them for help more than I can count. This is my industry, and these people are my friends. These people are not fat dumb or lazy. They care deeply about security, and work their butts off with the limited resources they have. The good ones engage the "hackers", and actually enjoy it. Many of them are on a skill level above and beyond myself.
I'm actually a firm believer they would rather see something packaged and sold, than out in the open, as it results in many times less people using it, as well as the time packaging it will stop or greatly slow down anyone trying to use the material for bad purposes (malware etc). Honestly, they probably don't care how something is distributed at all.
Verizon MotoG with 4.4.2 is is $65 at bestbuy and something like $75 at walmart, how do I know this, we bought many.
I've not lied nor been evasive, I've actually been more open on what I am doing with my time. We are working on 3.0 to add more support to HTC. These people know me enough to know they can ask what I am working on, and I give them a straight answer. More often than not, I will email the company who is responsible for what I find, and let them know before, or at release time when I release something. Often I will give them details and source code not public.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They all come with 4.4.4 out of the box. Sucks that people charge for this even worse people actually spent money... Left this phone cuz of its horrible Dev capabilities. Got an lg g3 now. Would have loved to had a non Verizon moto g
Sent from my XT1028 using XDA Free mobile app

tmittelstaedt said:
Your not working with the upper level execs. Your working with the lower level people who have no control over what their company does. Their upper execs tell them "make the phone so that we own it completely even if the customer forks over their money or your fired" and they work their butts off to do that. I'm not talking about the lower level people and I think you know that.
The upper level execs set the company culture. And the company culture at Verizon is the customer is nothing more than fodder. If Verizon's company culture gave a damn about the customer they would have both bootloader locked and bootloader unlocked phones for sale in the retail outlets. If bootloader locking is such a security advantage the customers would buy them over bootloader unlocked phones. But no, instead, the bootloader locking is hidden away and the only way to buy one that can be unlocked is to pay ten times more for one. Your friends may be friends with you but they are supporting their families off of that company. They cannot go against that culture even though they probably would agree with me that Verizon should give customers a choice about buying a locked or unlocked phone.
Verizon does not need to force Motorola to refuse to hand out bootloader unlock codes for the Moto G. Nor do they need to make it insanely difficult to do a network unlock. Verizon posts a statement on their website saying that after you have owned your carrier-subsidized phone for a year you can network-unlock it. But they say NOTHING about bootloader-unlocking it. And if you try calling Verizon's support and asking for a network unlock code you will waste hours of time. I finally got a support tech in Verizon who was willing to look at their own website - after they told me Verizon didn't unlock phones - and do what she needed to do to answer my question - which is, when I am ready to network-unlock my phone, I have to call in and get the request escalated to 3rd tier before I'll be talking to a tech that even knows what network unlocking _is_. And the FCC - who forced them to allow for network unlocking - didn't force them to bootloader unlock. And of course they won't do it.
Verizon could go to Motorola and say "every phone that is 2 years old or older you are free to hand out bootloader unlocks on" But they won't.
No, you are very naive if you think that your friends who work at the carriers represent the carrier's approach and view of it's customers. They don't. I have no doubt that they are nice people. But the organization they work for is rotten to the core. I judge carriers by how they treat their customers. I judge them about how they treat me. And when I bought my phone and called into Verizon asking about what date I would get my phone network unlocked - just as a test to see if Verizon is really upholding the terms of it's agreement with the FCC where the FCC required them to network unlock phones - I was repeatedly lied to by their support people. So I am not basing my statements about that carrier on reading some crank who is spewing on the Internet against the carrier because he doesn't want to pay his phone bill. I'm basing them on how I've been treated. Where I live Verizon is a requirement due to coverage issues. But I have no qualms about what kind of a company I'm dealing with. I'm dealing with a company that buys phones by the hundreds of thousands from Motorola at $50 per device, marks them up 100%, and has a contract with Motorola that says Motorola must advertise a MSRP of $200, so that the sheeple who walk into the Verizon store think they are "gettin a deal" I don't trust them any further than I could spit a rat.
The PC community - Dell, HP, and all the rest of them - worked with Microsoft to develop a standard for encrypted bootloaders too. But ya know what? Microsoft put into the standard for encrypted bootloaders a requirement that the customer and go into BIOS and turn them off. PC makers that don't adhere to this aren't allowed to advertise compliance with the security standard. Verizon has that behavior as a model. But instead of requiring Motorola to make turning off encryption an option for the customer, they did exactly the opposite.
You can go and buy a brand new low-end PC today in the $250 range. That's a cheap PC equivalent to a cheap phone. But it's bootloader encryption is customer-selectable. The same should be the case for cell phones. When you released Sunshine you firmly put yourself behind that ideal. But don't for a second believe that your friends are working for a carrier that has any other position that your software is completely opposite what they believe.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tldr, you have no idea what your are talking about or who you are even talking to. If you think a single "high level exec" cares or even knows what an unlocked bootloader is, you are sadly mistaken.
Spend another 20 years in corporate america, like I have, and then maybe you'll have some wisdom to share in your lectures.

Hallaleuja brotha
Sent from my XT1028 using XDA Free mobile app

tmittelstaedt said:
Your not working with the upper level execs. Your working with the lower level people who have no control over what their company does. Their upper execs tell them "make the phone so that we own it completely even if the customer forks over their money or your fired" and they work their butts off to do that. I'm not talking about the lower level people and I think you know that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have, and I do.
tmittelstaedt said:
The upper level execs set the company culture. And the company culture at Verizon is the customer is nothing more than fodder. If Verizon's company culture gave a damn about the customer they would have both bootloader locked and bootloader unlocked phones for sale in the retail outlets. If bootloader locking is such a security advantage the customers would buy them over bootloader unlocked phones. But no, instead, the bootloader locking is hidden away and the only way to buy one that can be unlocked is to pay ten times more for one. Your friends may be friends with you but they are supporting their families off of that company. They cannot go against that culture even though they probably would agree with me that Verizon should give customers a choice about buying a locked or unlocked phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not going to go over the reasons why bootloaders are locked again. Feel free to search for one of the dozen times I've replied, I think I did it recently on google plus. You don't have an understanding why these bootloaders are locked.
I do not agree that the average user should have a device with an unlocked bootloader, the shear number of people emailing me daily on this that have absolutely nothing to do with me is enough to prove that point.
tmittelstaedt said:
Verizon does not need to force Motorola to refuse to hand out bootloader unlock codes for the Moto G. Nor do they need to make it insanely difficult to do a network unlock. Verizon posts a statement on their website saying that after you have owned your carrier-subsidized phone for a year you can network-unlock it. But they say NOTHING about bootloader-unlocking it. And if you try calling Verizon's support and asking for a network unlock code you will waste hours of time. I finally got a support tech in Verizon who was willing to look at their own website - after they told me Verizon didn't unlock phones - and do what she needed to do to answer my question - which is, when I am ready to network-unlock my phone, I have to call in and get the request escalated to 3rd tier before I'll be talking to a tech that even knows what network unlocking _is_. And the FCC - who forced them to allow for network unlocking - didn't force them to bootloader unlock. And of course they won't do it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
CMDA is a whitelist technology, it is not "unlocked" like GSM. Their devices are not "LOCKED" to their network, they network itself does the rejection. Their few devices that do support GSM, tend not to be network locked (some were locked against certain carriers).
CDMA != GSM
tmittelstaedt said:
Verizon could go to Motorola and say "every phone that is 2 years old or older you are free to hand out bootloader unlocks on" But they won't.
No, you are very naive if you think that your friends who work at the carriers represent the carrier's approach and view of it's customers. They don't. I have no doubt that they are nice people. But the organization they work for is rotten to the core. I judge carriers by how they treat their customers. I judge them about how they treat me. And when I bought my phone and called into Verizon asking about what date I would get my phone network unlocked - just as a test to see if Verizon is really upholding the terms of it's agreement with the FCC where the FCC required them to network unlock phones - I was repeatedly lied to by their support people. So I am not basing my statements about that carrier on reading some crank who is spewing on the Internet against the carrier because he doesn't want to pay his phone bill. I'm basing them on how I've been treated. Where I live Verizon is a requirement due to coverage issues. But I have no qualms about what kind of a company I'm dealing with. I'm dealing with a company that buys phones by the hundreds of thousands from Motorola at $50 per device, marks them up 100%, and has a contract with Motorola that says Motorola must advertise a MSRP of $200, so that the sheeple who walk into the Verizon store think they are "gettin a deal" I don't trust them any further than I could spit a rat.
The PC community - Dell, HP, and all the rest of them - worked with Microsoft to develop a standard for encrypted bootloaders too. But ya know what? Microsoft put into the standard for encrypted bootloaders a requirement that the customer and go into BIOS and turn them off. PC makers that don't adhere to this aren't allowed to advertise compliance with the security standard. Verizon has that behavior as a model. But instead of requiring Motorola to make turning off encryption an option for the customer, they did exactly the opposite.
You can go and buy a brand new low-end PC today in the $250 range. That's a cheap PC equivalent to a cheap phone. But it's bootloader encryption is customer-selectable. The same should be the case for cell phones. When you released Sunshine you firmly put yourself behind that ideal. But don't for a second believe that your friends are working for a carrier that has any other position that your software is completely opposite what they believe.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bootloaders are not encrypted.
I'm not insulting you here but I'm being to the point. You lack a fundamental understanding of each aspect of this conversation, which makes much of it not even worth replying to.
You don't have an understanding of the industry, of me, or how the devices work themselves.

Gsm rules
Sent from my XT1028 using XDA Free mobile app

Cdma will be extinct soon anyways soon

beaups said:
We don't trust or like you, either. Also, that vuln in your OP is long patched and non-useful.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm going to ignore any insults directed directly to me, because I understand people forget there's an actual person behind the text.
It seemed too good to be true, I just wanted some confirmation on whether the vuln was truly patched or not.
Have fun insulting others in teh interwebs

Wish Lenovo would just let us unlock our bootloaders.

These phones aren't new anymore. What's the point of only letting Dev versions of the MAXX be unlocked. I find it rather annoying especially since the other phones on the list aren't Dev only. Anyone think sending enough demand will get us results and we can finally unlock our phones or is it pointless? And I recently found out the the Sunshine APK will not unlock Motorola phones on 4.4 even though they said version 3 would be our savior.

This has been brought up so many times for every locked phone. It's pointless its not moto of lenovo its Verizon that wants the phone locked. So yes its pointless.
sent from "my kungfu is stronger then yours" XT1080

its not moto its verizon, thank them.

Motorola is just a contract manufacturer of the phones. The brand is owned by Verizon. It's their choice, not Lenovo's. It was remarkable that Verizon allowed a dev version at all.
(But, I agree that it would be great if the phone was allowed to be unlocked as soon as it was two years past active sales, just as a policy. Of course they're still selling this phone now so that helps nobody at the moment.)
Now we all know - if you want a phone that can be unlocked, don't ever, ever buy a Droid from now on.

I figured it was Verizon when we're still waiting for Lollipop. After enough complaining to Motorola the best I got was included into soak tests. But it was just to late for Lollipop.

new open-source motorola bootloader unlock via trustzone exploit

This can probably be ported to the Turbo since it works on a 2014 X
http://bits-please.blogspot.com/2016/02/unlocking-motorola-bootloader.html
https://github.com/laginimaineb/Alohamora

Beaups exploit could be redone as well. He released how. It's mostly no one is doing it.

_ck_ said:
This can probably be ported to the Turbo since it works on a 2014 X
http://bits-please.blogspot.com/2016/02/unlocking-motorola-bootloader.html
https://github.com/laginimaineb/Alohamora
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The vulnerability he is using is old (he first disclosed it ~6 months ago) and does not apply to the turbo.
Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

mrkhigh said:
Beaups exploit could be redone as well. He released how. It's mostly no one is doing it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Right. Droid Turbo owners don't need a "new" exploit. The one being used still works!
If someone doesn't like paying for the packaged solution (Sunshine) that contains that exploit, then repackage it. It's been publicly released.
Oh, but re-coding would require work!
However, the payment in this case is fair to reward the time and money the devs invested. Without them, there would be no solution.

ChazzMatt said:
Right. Droid Turbo owners don't need a "new" exploit. The one being used still works!
If someone doesn't like paying for the packaged solution (Sunshine) that contains that exploit, then repackage it. It's been publicly released.
Oh, but re-coding would require work!
However, the payment in this case is fair to reward the time and money the devs invested. Without them, there would be no solution.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Amen
Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

I don't really understand the complaints coming from people about the charge for sunshine unlock. I was happy to find out that I could unlock/root with a few clicks and not worry about doing all the leg work, especially considering I don't have the skill set required to be confident of not brick in my device with a more extensive unlock/root process.
Time is money and some individual(s) put time into developing something that some people are happy to have access to and pay for. Simple fact is, if you have an issue with paying for such a thing, then don't... But don't hate on the guys that are profiting from a skill set that not everyone is capable of, especially if said hater isn't capable or willing to provide an equally usable product.
Sent from my DROID Turbo using Tapatalk

rg449 said:
I don't really understand the complaints coming from people about the charge for sunshine unlock. I was happy to find out that I could unlock/root with a few clicks and not worry about doing all the leg work, especially considering I don't have the skill set required to be confident of not brick in my device with a more extensive unlock/root process.
Time is money and some individual(s) put time into developing something that some people are happy to have access to and pay for. Simple fact is, if you have an issue with paying for such a thing, then don't... But don't hate on the guys that are profiting from a skill set that not everyone is capable of, especially if said hater isn't capable or willing to provide an equally usable product.
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The problem people have had with Sunshine is that root/bootloader unlock methods have traditionally been given for free—because they've been easier to crack.
Recently hacking has become more and more difficult—which makes developers have to spend more, and want more to make up for their losses on modding.

tecsironman said:
Amen
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rg449 said:
I don't really understand the complaints coming from people about the charge for sunshine unlock. I was happy to find out that I could unlock/root with a few clicks and not worry about doing all the leg work, especially considering I don't have the skill set required to be confident of not brick in my device with a more extensive unlock/root process.
Time is money and some individual(s) put time into developing something that some people are happy to have access to and pay for. Simple fact is, if you have an issue with paying for such a thing, then don't... But don't hate on the guys that are profiting from a skill set that not everyone is capable of, especially if said hater isn't capable or willing to provide an equally usable product.
Sent from my DROID Turbo using Tapatalk
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Agreed!
Latiken said:
The problem people have had with Sunshine is that root/bootloader unlock methods have traditionally been given for free—because they've been easier to crack.
Recently hacking has become more and more difficult—which makes developers have to spend more, and want more to make up for their losses on modding.
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See Above! You get way more value for $20 then was ever given for free... and just because something used to be given away does not imply that it will continue to be in the future. Smart phones are still a relatively new product in the market and with Dev's who have now been through years of the exploiting, modifying, retiring cycle, there has to be incentive for them to stay engaged.
Additionally, I'll remind you that it hasn't been long since bounties were the norm. Everybody would post their promise to pay before and during development, then an exploit would be found and the bounty threads would clear out. Can't blame them for getting wise about collecting.

mng777777 said:
Agreed!
See Above! You get way more value for $20 then was ever given for free... and just because something used to be given away does not imply that it will continue to be in the future. Smart phones are still a relatively new product in the market and with Dev's who have now been through years of the exploiting, modifying, retiring cycle, there has to be incentive for them to stay engaged.
Additionally, I'll remind you that it hasn't been long since bounties were the norm. Everybody would post their promise to pay before and during development, then an exploit would be found and the bounty threads would clear out. Can't blame them for getting wise about collecting.
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Actually, no you don't get more for paid methods. It's a one time unlock, and is device specific.
Let me reiterate that I am in no way complaining about Sunshine. I love the devs' work on our devices.
What I'm saying is that people's disappointment is understandable.
However, the devs already published the exploits and documents; all that's left is for someone to use them.
People have nothing to complain about now.

I get your point and I am in agreement with you. I didn't mean to imply that I'm not.
I'd like to clarify though, what I meant when I said you get more is that downloading an apk, pressing a few buttons, and spending all of 3 minutes to be unlocked is far simpler than it ever was in the past. I'm just pointing out that they went the extra mile to build an apk that's simple and elegant and does the heavy lifting for you whereas in the past we had to boot to recovery, flash, boot to boot loader, run adb, etc. The threads were full of people stuck and confused. Sunshine adds great value to the less savvy user and at least simplicity for the more savvy users.
Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

mng777777 said:
I get your point and I am in agreement with you. I didn't mean to imply that I'm not.
I'd like to clarify though, what I meant when I said you get more is that downloading an apk, pressing a few buttons, and spending all of 3 minutes to be unlocked is far simpler than it ever was in the past. I'm just pointing out that they went the extra mile to build an apk that's simple and elegant and does the heavy lifting for you whereas in the past we had to boot to recovery, flash, boot to boot loader, run adb, etc. The threads were full of people stuck and confused. Sunshine adds great value to the less savvy user and at least simplicity for the more savvy users.
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That is great to see as well; however, that makes development that much harder, and o know for a fact the people that whine about Sunshine's cost would deal with the difficulty of using fastboot and adb in order to save $25.
It is great, however, for less experienced people, and it's overall function. $25 is a steal for a fully moddifable device that was locked down so well.

Latiken said:
That is great to see as well; however, that makes development that much harder, and o know for a fact the people that whine about Sunshine's cost would deal with the difficulty of using fastboot and adb in order to save $25.
It is great, however, for less experienced people, and it's overall function. $25 is a steal for a fully modifiable device that was locked down so well.
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This response below is not necessarily directed towards you, but really for the entire discussion in this thread. I'm just quoting your post as it's a good point to continue the discussion.
1) I can't believe people who are buying $600 phones are complaining about $25 bootloader unlock. And I don't care if you got the phone for $200 on contract or even as a "free upgrade". You are STILL paying $600 for the phone over the course of the contract.
2) No one is forcing anyone to pay for bootloader unlock. Your phone will still work like when you bought it, and you bought locked down.
If you bought this phone, you knew it was locked down and bought it anyway (or should have known). Everyone knows Verizon locks down their phones. Don't buy a Verizon phone if you don't like Verizon's policies. (The XT1250 has free bootloader unlock and is the Droid Turbo under another name, same bands, etc and runs on Verizon. So, I don't want to hear that you NEED Verizon. You may need Verizon but you don't need Verizon phones. Look at the non-Verizon Nexus 6 as another example.) This phone went for an entire YEAR locked down, and people are complaining when there's finally a solution?
3) Someone mentioned the bounty threads.
Droid Turbo Bootloader unlock bounty reached over $5,000 before the op stopped counting.
Running Total: $5,140 for bootloader unlock / $3,370 for root access
http://forum.xda-developers.com/droid-turbo/general/bounty-unlock-bootloader-root-turbo-t2927958
It was actually MORE, but the op gave up counting. Go look at the first post and read some of the amounts... user names are listed.
I want to know if everyone who who pledged $25, $50, $100, even $200 actually bought Sunshine? If they didn't, then they had no intention of ever paying anyway. Sunshine is a way to put your money where your mouth is.
and last...
4) I think people should rant more towards Verizon than devs who overcome Verizon's shortsightedness.
There's no valid reason to lock down the bootloader. None of the other Motorola Quarks have that condition -- same hardware, in at least one case the EXACT SAME FCC ID. Ever since the FCC made Verizon open up their LTE network to other phones not certified by Verizon (the XT1250 U.S. Moto Maxx -- the XT1254 Droid Turbo clone -- runs just fine on Verizon with a Verizon sim card, as does a non-Verizon Moto Nexus 6) and made Verizon also open up their phones to work on OTHER LTE networks (many people are running the XT1254 Droid Turbo on AT&T and T-mobile), what are Verizon's justifications?
Unlocking the bootloader through Motorola -- as I have done with two of my three Quarks -- acknowledges you are voiding any warranty claims. So, that's actually LESS liability and cost for Verizon in support if they allowed users to unlock bootloader. It's a nonsensical leftover from a bygone era when Verizon tried to lock their devices to only their network.
Until Verizon realizes they need change their intransigence, we need devs to help. And for devs to invest tremendous time and money, they need to be reimbursed for bricked phones and time invested they could be doing other things.

ChazzMatt said:
This response below is not necessarily directed towards you, but really for the entire discussion in this thread. I'm just quoting your post as it's a good point to continue the discussion.
1) I can't believe people who are buying $600 phones are complaining about $25. And I don't care if you got it for $200 on contract or even as a "free upgrade". You are STILL paying $600 for the phone over the course of the contract.
2) No one is forcing them to pay it. Everyone knows Verizon locks down their phones. Don't buy a Verizon phone if you don't like Verizon's policies. (The XT1250 has free bootloader unlock and is the Droid Turbo under another name, same bands, etc and runs on Verizon. So, I don't want to hear that you NEED Verizon. You may need Verizon but you don't need Verizon phones. Look at the non-Verizon Nexus 6 as another example.) This phone went for an entire YEAR locked down, and people are complaining when there's finally a solution?
3) Someone mentioned the bounty threads.
Droid Turbo Bootloader unlock bounty reached over $5,000 before the op stopped counting.
Running Total: $5,140 for bootloader unlock / $3,370 for root access
http://forum.xda-developers.com/droid-turbo/general/bounty-unlock-bootloader-root-turbo-t2927958
It was actually MORE, but the op gave up counting. Go look at the first post and read some of the amounts... user names are listed.
I want to know if everyone who who pledged $25, $50, $100, even $200 actually bought Sunshine? If they didn't, then they had no intention of ever paying anyway. Sunshine is a way to put your money where your mouth is.
and last...
4) I think people should rant more towards Verizon than devs who overcome Verizon's shortsightedness.
There's no valid reason to lock down the bootloader. None of the other Motorola Quarks have that condition -- same hardware, in at least one case the EXACT SAME FCC ID. Ever since the FCC made Verizon open up their LTE network to other phones not certified by Verizon (the XT1250 U.S. Moto Maxx -- the XT1254 Droid Turbo clone -- runs just fine on Verizon with a Verizon sim card, as does a non-Verizon Moto Nexus 6) and made Verizon also open up their phones to work on OTHER LTE networks (many people are running the XT1254 Droid Turbo on AT&T and T-mobile), what are Verizon's justifications?
Unlocking the bootloader through Motorola -- as I have done with two of my three Quarks -- acknowledges you are voiding any warranty claims. So, that's actually LESS liability and cost for Verizon in support. It's a nonsensical leftover from a bygone era when Verizon tried to lock their devices to only their network.
Until Verizon realizes they need change their intransigence, we need devs to help. And for devs to invest tremendous time and money, they need to be reimbursed for bricked phones and time invested they could be doing other things.
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One reason I love Motorola is because of their near-stock Android with actually useful enhancements, and the fact that you can unlock their devices straight from them.
Had I researched and known that the Verizon XT1254 was locked down before purchasing it, I might've gone for another one.
But hey, I got a wicked deal on a $270 blue Turbo, AND we got Sunshine like a month after. I got some serious luck.

ChazzMatt said:
Droid Turbo Bootloader unlock bounty reached over $5,000 before the op stopped counting.
Running Total: $5,140 for bootloader unlock / $3,370 for root access
http://forum.xda-developers.com/droid-turbo/general/bounty-unlock-bootloader-root-turbo-t2927958
It was actually MORE, but the op gave up counting. Go look at the first post and read some of the amounts... user names are listed.
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Click to collapse
For the most part bounties don't pay, more often than not it costs me more to buy the phones than I got from the bounties. Exception being the first motorola bounty I collected

jcase said:
For the most part bounties don't pay, more often than not it costs me more to buy the phones than I got from the bounties. Exception being the first motorola bounty I collected
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Out of curiosity. Did sunshine's $25 a pop pay off well? Mind you I'm not asking for dollars and cents. Merely is it a hobby that funds itself. Or a hobby that doesn't? Or is it actually a source of income?
I'm often curious the stats of bootloader unlocks/roots performed but in this instance that would be an invasion of privacy...

mrkhigh said:
Out of curiosity. Did sunshine's $25 a pop pay off well? Mind you I'm not asking for dollars and cents. Merely is it a hobby that funds itself. Or a hobby that doesn't? Or is it actually a source of income?
I'm often curious the stats of bootloader unlocks/roots performed but in this instance that would be an invasion of privacy...
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SunShine funds further research, its not my job, much of the research goes no where, much of it results in dead phones, sometimes it works out. Would be right for me to discuss numbers, I'm not the only one involved.