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I have been a pen/tablet enthusiastic for many years and have owned (and still own) loads of tablet over the years. I currently own and use 4 window based pen-tablets (2 XP, 1 Vista, and 1 Window 7), 2 iPads, 2 iPod touch, Apple Macbook Pro (2009), Apple Macbook Air 13" (2012), Samsung Galaxy Note 5.3, and then the latest Galaxy Note 10.1. I also used to own loads of Window powered PDAs, palm, casio, etc.
As you can see for the list above, I have been looking for the perfect computing experience, especially the pen/tablet experience. I bought the Note 10.1 because of my Note 5.3. IMHO, the Note 10.1 is a decent pen-tablet, and it had made vast improvement over the Ntoe 5.3 in terms of hardware. However, it is the software where I feel is limiting the Note 10.1 from being a perfect pen-tablet machine.
People have already disregard the window based PC as being a serious tablet and they are rightfully so. The XP, Vista, and Window 7 while can be used to run as a tablet, have never been designed for tablet. So my experience with them have always been frustrating. HOWEVER, it was a pleasant surprise to me when I loaded the release preview of Window 8 few weeks ago onto 3 of my old Window tablets.
I have a Samsung Q1UP (6 year old, XP, w/resistive pen, 2GB ram, 64GB SSD), a HP 2710P (4 years old, w/Wavcom pen, 1GB ram, 80GB HDD), an ACER W500 (2 year old, w/touch pen, 2GB ram, 32GB SDD), and when loaded with the Window 8, all 3 machines even though are old have given me a VERY good pen/tablet experience. All 3 tablets now run much faster and very very smooth. The surprise comes when all these tablets are now running more like an Andriod/IOS instead of a typical window os. You can smoothly scroll, zoom, etc just like an iPad or Galaxy Note. The battery life seems to have improved in all these machines, and the time from sleep to logon screen is about 2-3 seconds. Loading programs used to take forever under the old OS, but now I can load excel, word, one-note, etc from cold in about 2 seconds.
Now to the most important part, the pen use with Window 8. The handwriting recognition is much better and faster than the Note 10.1 (for all 3 devices with the resistive pen, wavcom pen, and touch pen). The S-Note in the Note 10.1 is just a tiny program, but the One-Note is a full blown application with seamless integration with Office and Sky Drive, etc.
With the new tablets coming designed specifically with Window 8 in mind, I think Microsoft has risen the par on tablet competition. As the upcoming Samsung Series 5 hybrid tablet, for example, is coming with a $650 based price, 11 hrs battery life (with the optional keyboard), 750g weight, and can run all window software. Even though I have not seen, touch or used one of these new machines, the fact that Window 8 has turned my 6 years old tablet into a brand new machine is exciting for me.
Please don't get me wrong. I think the Samsung Note 10.1 is a decent machine which I will definitely keep. I bought it because I can carry it all day and not worry about battery, and I hardly need to run any PC applications these days when I am out. More importantly if I plan to use the PC all day, I probably need to bring the charger with me which will bring the weight up to 1kg or more. Since I carry my camera with me all day, the Note 10.1 is a better choice for me.
However, if you are looking into serious note taking and also need to run pc applications, I think the Window 8 tablets may be a good alternative. We will all know if this is true when the machines are officially announced in late Oct.
PS: I am in absolutely no way affiliated with any of the companies mentioned about, I am just giving my take on using all these devices over the years.
Good post.
What's your take on the new slate 5 vs surface pro?
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Well you are comparing apples and oranges and also making the logical fallacy that just because you like something others will as well. Based upon your large collection of tablets, price is not a big issue for you. You just want the best tablet experience, period. Thats all good, but the majority of buyers don't share your enthusiasm.
Keep in mind that most people think of their tablets as an accessory and not a primary computing device. As soon as you get much above the $500 price point you are getting into primary computing device territory. But with an 11.6 inch screen, tablets do not offer enough real estate to be an ultrabook replacement, especially for a business person running larger format legacy corporate software. I would go blind trying to read my company's database forms on an 11.6 inch HD screen - they cant just be resized as a Word document can be.
Also, will most business people think touch and pen input are worth trading in their 15 inch ultrabook screens for? I have been using Office for 20 years and never once felt the need to touch the screen. Office needs two things - lots of screens space and a mouse, a W8 Tablet offers neither.
Samsung makes a good profit on the SGN10.1. They could easily drop the price another $50 and still make money. In addition, one would assume that Samsung will be updating the SGN10.1 to the Note 2.0 software which is far far superior. Whereas W8 is a bit of a lumbering behemoth that will take years to see any major upgrades, Android can change and improve quickly. Also Android is far more customizable. Dont forget that word on the street is Windows 8 as a true desktop OS sucks and wont see broad corporate acceptance.
So you have to ask yourself, will the market as a whole be ready to pay 30% more for a device that does a lot of things (touch and pen) on a Windows device they may not need? Don't forget that we are already competing with very good 7 inch tablets that cost less than a third the price of the new W8 tablets.
Windows 8 tablets will be stuck in the middle. Too expensive for the casual user and too small for the serious user. When it comes to tablets most people want one that costs the least and does the job well enough. Think of it like cars. They sell a lot more Ford Focuses than Porsche 911's. The Porsche is a better car but the Ford just does the job for less. SGN10.1 will continue to be the cheapest usable pen input large format tablet on the market for the foreseeable future. It may not work quite as well as the W8 tablet but it works well enough for 1/3 less.
The good news is the competition will force Android to be better but no, I think Android has got little to worry about from Windows 8.
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mitchellvii said:
Well you are comparing apples and oranges and also making the logical fallacy that just because you like something others will as well. Based upon your large collection of tablets, price is not a big issue for you. You just want the best tablet experience, period. Thats all good, but the majority of buyers don't share your enthusiasm.
Keep in mind that most people think of their tablets as an accessory and not a primary computing device. As soon as you get much above the $500 price point you are getting into primary computing device territory. But with an 11.6 inch screen, tablets do not offer enough real estate to be an ultrabook replacement, especially for a business person running larger format legacy corporate software. I would go blind trying to read my company's database forms on an 11.6 inch HD screen - they cant just be resized as a Word document can be.
Also, will most business people think touch and pen input are worth trading in their 15 inch ultrabook screens for? I have been using Office for 20 years and never once felt the need to touch the screen. Office needs two things - lots of screens space and a mouse, a W8 Tablet offers neither.
Samsung makes a good profit on the SGN10.1. They could easily drop the price another $50 and still make money. In addition, one would assume that Samsung will be updating the SGN10.1 to the Note 2.0 software which is far far superior. Whereas W8 is a bit of a lumbering behemoth that will take years to see any major upgrades, Android can change and improve quickly. Also Android is far more customizable. Dont forget that word on the street is Windows 8 as a true desktop OS sucks and wont see broad corporate acceptance.
So you have to ask yourself, will the market as a whole be ready to pay 30% more for a device that does a lot of things (touch and pen) on a Windows device they may not need? Don't forget that we are already competing with very good 7 inch tablets that cost less than a third the price of the new W8 tablets.
Windows 8 tablets will be stuck in the middle. Too expensive for the casual user and too small for the serious user. When it comes to tablets most people want one that costs the least and does the job well enough. Think of it like cars. They sell a lot more Ford Focuses than Porsche 911's. The Porsche is a better car but the Ford just does the job for less. SGN10.1 will continue to be the cheapest usable pen input large format tablet on the market for the foreseeable future. It may not work quite as well as the W8 tablet but it works well enough for 1/3 less.
The good news is the competition will force Android to be better but no, I think Android has got little to worry about from Windows 8.
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Just to better understand your argument, are you including Windows 8 RT in your Windows 8 grouping? Because, that's the version that you want to use when comparing apples to apples (e.g., Android/Apple tablets to Windows 8 tablets), not the X86 Intel versions as you did in your post. For instance, the price point argument, as well as the Ford Focus vs. 911 analogy, will not be applicable, because the products are in different categories/segments (I can't imagine someone cross-shopping a Focus and a 911).
My point is that pound for pound, at least with the Samsung units, you will pay signficantly more for the same level of tablet, even the RT. As a matter of fact the W8 RT offering from Samsung will be slightly worse than the SGN10.1 since the screen is larger with roughly the same resolution. If you dont like the SGN10.1 screen youll hate the W8 RT screen.
For me at least, the primary benefit of Windows over Android is Office programs like Access. Word and Excel are emulated on Android just fine. I dont believe W8 RT will even run Access and if it does I believe the screen is too small to use it effectively with forms designed for a larger screen.
Again, what is the benefit to the consumer of using touch with Office? There is none. So you are trading in a big screen that you do need for touch that you dont.
Tablets are not laptop replacements and if you price them like one you are going to have a problem. They need to be priced like an accessory. Right now at least, Android does that better at the SGN10.1 price. Even $500 is close to being too high.
My conclusion is that W8 Tablets will be too much for a tablet and do too little to replace a laptop. Just my opinion. It may sell gangbusters but I dont think so. We'll have to wait and see. Nevertheless, its presence in the marketpalce will make Android products better
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mitchellvii said:
Well you are comparing apples and oranges and also making the logical fallacy that just because you like something others will as well. Based upon your large collection of tablets, price is not a big issue for you. You just want the best tablet experience, period. Thats all good, but the majority of buyers don't share your enthusiasm.
Keep in mind that most people think of their tablets as an accessory and not a primary computing device. As soon as you get much above the $500 price point you are getting into primary computing device territory. But with an 11.6 inch screen, tablets do not offer enough real estate to be an ultrabook replacement, especially for a business person running larger format legacy corporate software. I would go blind trying to read my company's database forms on an 11.6 inch HD screen - they cant just be resized as a Word document can be.
Also, will most business people think touch and pen input are worth trading in their 15 inch ultrabook screens for? I have been using Office for 20 years and never once felt the need to touch the screen. Office needs two things - lots of screens space and a mouse, a W8 Tablet offers neither.
Samsung makes a good profit on the SGN10.1. They could easily drop the price another $50 and still make money. In addition, one would assume that Samsung will be updating the SGN10.1 to the Note 2.0 software which is far far superior. Whereas W8 is a bit of a lumbering behemoth that will take years to see any major upgrades, Android can change and improve quickly. Also Android is far more customizable. Dont forget that word on the street is Windows 8 as a true desktop OS sucks and wont see broad corporate acceptance.
So you have to ask yourself, will the market as a whole be ready to pay 30% more for a device that does a lot of things (touch and pen) on a Windows device they may not need? Don't forget that we are already competing with very good 7 inch tablets that cost less than a third the price of the new W8 tablets.
Windows 8 tablets will be stuck in the middle. Too expensive for the casual user and too small for the serious user. When it comes to tablets most people want one that costs the least and does the job well enough. Think of it like cars. They sell a lot more Ford Focuses than Porsche 911's. The Porsche is a better car but the Ford just does the job for less. SGN10.1 will continue to be the cheapest usable pen input large format tablet on the market for the foreseeable future. It may not work quite as well as the W8 tablet but it works well enough for 1/3 less.
The good news is the competition will force Android to be better but no, I think Android has got little to worry about from Windows 8.
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WOW!! I wished someone had warned me about troll living here and that no comments other than good Note 10.1 comments are allowed in this forum. This will be my last post in the forum, leaving you alone to harass other people.
The observation in my original post is based on actual experience. Yours seemed to be based on pure speculations and imaginations. I truly doubt you have similar experience before making your comments. I welcome you to try them first and proof me wrong, or stop making illogical fallacy.
1. I read many of the owners who bought the Note 10.1 because of the S-Pen. Some owners even suggested potential buyers to look elsewhere if they are purely looking for an Android tablet as there are better alternatives out there. At present, only the Note 10.1 and Window tablets offer pens experience, so I don’t understand why you think it is an apple to orange comparison.
2. When I composed the list of devices I own, I was hoping to give some background on the wide variety of devices/OS I have used, so that I can make my points. But you turned it into a show-off list.
3. You mentioned “…20 years and never once felt the need to touch the screen”, then you went to buy the Note 10.1 and other touch devices, interesting!
4. The ACER W500 Win 7 tablet I bought 2 years ago brand new was $550 then (the Note 10.1 is about the same price range). The hardware was mediocre at the time, and it sucked with Win 7. I was amused how Window 8 has turned it into a very respectable tablet, with very fast and accurate hand writing recognition, and good note experience with One-Note, then further suggested today’s hardware could only do better. You turned it into a Ford and Porsche comparison. I bet you had never owned a Porsche before, so it is a mood point arguing with you here.
5. You must be the CFO of Samsung as you knew how much profit they are making on the SGN10.1, and can easily drop the price by another $50. BTW, Samsung also makes the upcoming Window 8 tablet with MSRP of $649 and respectable hardware (S-PEN, 11.6” , 1366 x 768, 2GB Ram, 9 hrs battery life, 750g, and 64GB SSD http://www.engadget.com/2012/08/29/samsung-announces-series-5-slate-series-7-slate/). Based on your insider knowledge, Samsung could also easily drop the price by another $50 for the Window tablet. Then there are other tablets makers that produce cheaper devices.
6. I had never once suggested Window 8 will take over Android or even compete with it, so I think you are making your comments based on illusion.
Best wishes!
Lol, i guess your definition of "troll"is anyone who disagrees with you? You come to the SGN10.1 Forum announcing that our tablet is "just ok" while the W8 tablets will be the Second Coming and you don't expect any pushback?
I made the argument that the W8 tablets will have a difficult time finding their place in a competitive market. Many pundits online agree with me. Too expensive for a tablet, too small for a laptop. You imply that I said you were bragging about all your tablets. I simply said that you were concerned more about performance than price. How did you get from that that i said you were bragging?
As far as knowing the Samsung can cut the price of the SGN10.1 and still make money that is a well established fact. Google is your friend.
Oh well, if you must leave I am sorry. Im sure there is someone in here that will miss you praising the W8 tablets and putting down the SGN10.1.
P.S. Actually I am a BMW man myself. The center console on Porsche is too wide and presses against my shin because I am tall. The Ford/Porsche comparison was an attempt to compare a tool which can do the job at a lower cost vs one that offers good things but perhaps things that cost conscious people dont need.
Touch with Office is a perfect example of this. Why does anyone need touch with Office? Id rather have a 15 inch screen.
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---------- Post added at 10:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:34 AM ----------
For those who feel, as the OP does, that I am pulling my concerns about W8 Tablets from my backside, here is a quote from PCWorld Magazine:
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscent..._8_tablets_have_what_it_takes_to_succeed.html
There are a number of issues that could make Windows 8 tablets dead on arrival, or at least a very tough sell. Two of the biggest will be price, and confusion over differences between Windows on ARM (WOA) tablets, and x86/x64 architecture tablets.
ARM-based devices will probably be better tablets than their x86/x64 counterparts. WOA tablets will most likely be lighter, cooler, have longer battery life, and--most importantly--be cheaper. ARM-based tablets will be more on par with the competing tablets already in the market like the iPad, Motorola Xoom, Samsung Galaxy Tab, and others.
That all sounds great, but WOA tablets also come with significant handicaps that nullify most of what makes a Windows 8 tablet appealing. For example, WOA tablets can’t run traditional Windows software--they require apps written for the Metro UI.
Wes Miller from GetWired.com and Directions on Microsoft poses the question, “For enterprises who will have to rewrite their (non-Web) applications in Metro for WOA anyway, the question comes up, "why wouldn't I rewrite it for iOS instead?", since there is no way to run non-Microsoft Win32 apps on WOA.”
The bigger issue for WOA tablets is that Microsoft has revealed they are intended for “unmanaged environments”. What that translates to is that WOA tablets will not be able to connect to Windows domains and be managed like x86/x64 Windows 8 tablets, and other Windows systems.
Amobi says that there are arguments to be made for and against WOA tablets, and it’s still too early for a final verdict. But, he stresses, “If they cant join domains--game over.”
No worries. We still have x86/x64 Windows 8 tablets to fall back on, right? True, but there are some caveats.
An x86/x64 tablet is just squeezing a notebook or desktop into a touchscreen, flat-panel form factor. That has advantages, but we also know that running Windows takes a fair amount of processing horsepower and memory. While it may be possible to run Windows 8 with less RAM, 4GB is probably the minimum for acceptable performance. That is four times what most ARM tablets use.
When you build a tablet on x86/x64 architecture, and try to beef up the RAM to deliver adequate performance, the tablet starts to face other issues. As previously mentioned, users want tablets that are thin, light, and have endurance to last all day on a single charge. It is unlikely that x86/x64 tablets can truly compete with ARM-based rivals in these areas.
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As I have stated, W8 Tablets will be stuck in the middle. RT too underpowered to run true Windows software and Pro too small to run true Windows software properly.
DOA.
Hopefully these facts have taken some of the emotion out of this argument.
What the heck OP, please respond to my original question!
New slate 5 vs surface pro. Based on your experience, should we (consumers) wait for the SP release before purchasing.
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mitchellvii, you are assuming too much and treating your "opinion" as the gospel truth.
Have you used OneNote on a tablet computer? S-Note is the extremely light version of OneNote when it comes to note-taking (not doodling or sketching, etc). It is certain that it will get better over time, but the current/first generation is a good introduction to what it can do in the future.
From drawing and sketching point of view, I can make the same argument that you are making for Office and touch. Note 10.1 most likely won't replace anyone's Wacom tablet to produce art on a 10.1" screen. With the same perspective as yours, this falls right in the middle: not enough for professionals and little more than people who aren't into drawing/sketching necessarily.
Just like the OP, I'm not putting down the Note 10.1; I'm actually waiting for the UPS truck to bring a 32GB version today. However, you don't have to blindly defend it when an alternative view is presented. Just embrace the fact that for every device with additional features (e.g., being able to run OneNote and a full OS on a tablet), there's a segment out there. If you are outside of that segment or find some of those features not very useful for your way of using a tablet, it's perfectly fine, as long as you realize the advantages and disadvantages of each device with an open mind.
tenderidol said:
mitchellvii, you are assuming too much and treating your "opinion" as the gospel truth.
Have you used OneNote on a tablet computer? S-Note is the extremely light version of OneNote when it comes to note-taking (not doodling or sketching, etc). It is certain that it will get better over time, but the current/first generation is a good introduction to what it can do in the future.
From drawing and sketching point of view, I can make the same argument that you are making for Office and touch. Note 10.1 most likely won't replace anyone's Wacom tablet to produce art on a 10.1" screen. With the same perspective as yours, this falls right in the middle: not enough for professionals and little more than people who aren't into drawing/sketching necessarily.
Just like the OP, I'm not putting down the Note 10.1; I'm actually waiting for the UPS truck to bring a 32GB version today. However, you don't have to blindly defend it when an alternative view is presented. Just embrace the fact that for every device with additional features (e.g., being able to run OneNote and a full OS on a tablet), there's a segment out there. If you are outside of that segment or find some of those features not very useful for your way of using a tablet, it's perfectly fine, as long as you realize the advantages and disadvantages of each device with an open mind.
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The OP said:
"Please don't get me wrong. I think the Samsung Note 10.1 is a decent machine which I will definitely keep."
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Nice of him to let us know our SGN10.1 is "a decent machine" (compared to the glowing oracle of W8). I consider that a put-down.
"Blindly defending"? As in, just making up stuff you mean? Did you even bother read the article? Lol. Read it and get back to me on my blind defense.
mitchellvii said:
The OP said:
Nice of him to let us know our SGN10.1 is "a decent machine" (compared to the glowing oracle of W8). I consider that a put-down.
"Blindly defending"? As in, "just making up stuff" you mean? Did you even bother read the article? Lol. Read it and get back to me on my blind defense.
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You really must love the Note 10.1 like your significant other. Calling it a "decent machine" is an insult? As I mentioned above, keep an open mind, and you'll be able to see the strengths and the weaknesses of each device.
mitchellvii said:
The OP said:
Nice of him to let us know our SGN10.1 is "a decent machine" (compared to the glowing oracle of W8). I consider that a put-down.
"Blindly defending"? As in, just making up stuff you mean? Did you even bother read the article? Lol. Read it and get back to me on my blind defense.
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Yes you are. You posted an article filled with opinions from Mar and think that these are facts. They are not.
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mitchellvii said:
"Blindly defending"? As in, just making up stuff you mean? Did you even bother read the article? Lol. Read it and get back to me on my blind defense.
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So, stating someone else's opinion is a fact, now? Got it! Let me find that Verge review and link it here as the "fact" about Note 10.1.
Again... I purchased the damn thing and will be using it to its full potential. However, unlike you, I'll keep an open mind and try the Samsung Smart PC offerings (specifically the Series 5). If it performs well, it'll replace the Note 10.1 (or I may keep both, since they serve different functions); if not, I'll continue to use it happily.
tenderidol said:
Have you used OneNote on a tablet computer? S-Note is the extremely light version of OneNote when it comes to note-taking (not doodling or sketching, etc). It is certain that it will get better over time, but the current/first generation is a good introduction to what it can do in the future.
From drawing and sketching point of view, I can make the same argument that you are making for Office and touch. Note 10.1 most likely won't replace anyone's Wacom tablet to produce art on a 10.1" screen. With the same perspective as yours, this falls right in the middle: not enough for professionals and little more than people who aren't into drawing/sketching necessarily.
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Three things are missing from this conversation to make it worthwhile.
1) Everyone uses their tablets differently. A gamer, heavy productivity user, graphic artist, reader, and someone who uses it primarily for consumption all have different needs. And someone's personal weighting of those things determine which product is "best" for them. I could easily see someone needing OneNote (and MS Office in general) jumping on W8 just for that. Same thing for a graphic artist who wants access to desktop versions of tools they typically use. How many of them there are and how well W8 tablets do more pedestrian things will determine their success, not our discussion.
2) We're comparing something that doesn't exist to something that does. Unless you all intend to go out and buy an Acer W500 with 4 hours of battery life and that weighs two pounds this is at best a theoretical conversation until actual W8 tablets are in people's hands and can be evaluated in real-world use. And don't forget the Pro tablets come with all the stuff we love about Windows: 1) driver incompatibilities, 2) control panel, and 3) multiple menus, clicks, and "enters," to launch or access something. The UI formally known as Metro doesn't hide the fact that there's a huge resource intensive hulk of an OS to be tamed running in the background. How many general-use iPad candidates do you think will find that acceptable? And they’re MS’s bogie, not the 20% of the tablet market that’s using Android.
3) Until the complete feature set is known for both RT and Pro tablets and what apps will be available to them initially you can't have a price-value conversation. I highly doubt entry-level consumer targeted RT tablets will do some of things being discussed. Similarly if a loaded Pro tablet is $1K that changes the conversation when comparing it to a $500 Android tablet.
I'll check back in with you guys once the tablets are in people's hands for a while and then we can have a legitimate conversation of the pros and cons of each.
BTW, here's an excerpt of a review of the HP TouchPad when it was first released. Just because a monolithic company launches something its success isn't guaranteed. It’s too early to say whether W8 tablets will be a Zune or an XBox 360 for MS and no one here can do anything but proffer an opinion as to which way it will go.
"You would almost think that webOS had been designed for tablets from the very beginning. It feels more native to tablets than any other software on any other tablet, despite being an almost exact translation of the phone interface (minus almost all of the bezel gestures). Multitasking on anything else feels almost stupid compared to Cards. An open app is a card. You can stack them, sort them, re-arrange them, and when you're done, close them. Juggling a bunch makes you feel like you're getting stuff done. Palm's big tablet adaptation, panes, is a straight riff on the iPad Twitter UI. So in email and other complex apps, you slide layers—inboxes, message lists, actual messages—back and forth to move between them. Notifications, which pop down from the top of the scree, let you flip through the pile, one at a time, without ever opening the app-handy if you get IMs from five different people. They're great ideas."
BarryH_GEG said:
Three things are missing from this conversation to make it worthwhile.
1) Everyone uses their tablets differently. A gamer, heavy productivity user, graphic artist, reader, and someone who uses it primarily for consumption all have different needs. And someone's personal weighting of those things determine which product is "best" for them. I could easily see someone needing OneNote (and MS Office in general) jumping on W8 just for that. Same thing for a graphic artist who wants access to desktop versions of tools they typically use. How many of them there are and how well W8 tablets do more pedestrian things will determine their success, not our discussion.
2) We're comparing something that doesn't exist to something that does. Unless you all intend to go out and buy an Acer W500 with 4 hours of battery life and that weighs two pounds this is at best a theoretical conversation until actual W8 tablets are in people's hands and can be evaluated in real-world use. And don't forget the Pro tablets come with all the stuff we love about Windows: 1) driver incompatibilities, 2) control panel, and 3) multiple menus, clicks, and "enters," to launch or access something. The UI formally known as Metro doesn't hide the fact that there's a huge resource intensive hulk of an OS to be tamed running in the background. How many general-use iPad candidates do you think will find that acceptable? And they’re MS’s bogie, not the 20% of the tablet market that’s using Android.
3) Until the complete feature set is known for both RT and Pro tablets and what apps will be available to them initially you can't have a price-value conversation. I highly doubt entry-level consumer targeted RT tablets will do some of things being discussed. Similarly if a loaded Pro tablet is $1K that changes the conversation when comparing it to a $500 Android tablet.
I'll check back in with you guys once the tablets are in people's hands for a while and then we can have a legitimate conversation of the pros and cons of each.
BTW, here's an excerpt of a review of the HP TouchPad when it was first released. Just because a monolithic company launches something its success isn't guaranteed. It’s too early to say whether W8 tablets will be a Zune or an XBox 360 for MS and no one here can do anything but proffer an opinion as to which way it will go.
"You would almost think that webOS had been designed for tablets from the very beginning. It feels more native to tablets than any other software on any other tablet, despite being an almost exact translation of the phone interface (minus almost all of the bezel gestures). Multitasking on anything else feels almost stupid compared to Cards. An open app is a card. You can stack them, sort them, re-arrange them, and when you're done, close them. Juggling a bunch makes you feel like you're getting stuff done. Palm's big tablet adaptation, panes, is a straight riff on the iPad Twitter UI. So in email and other complex apps, you slide layers—inboxes, message lists, actual messages—back and forth to move between them. Notifications, which pop down from the top of the scree, let you flip through the pile, one at a time, without ever opening the app-handy if you get IMs from five different people. They're great ideas."
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With the exception of one person, we are all on the same page here. Below is an excerpt from the OP. To me, it overlaps very well with your points and my argument. Somehow, this was turned into "How dare you put down Note10.1? Windows 8 tablets are DOA!" bickery.
With the new tablets coming designed specifically with Window 8 in mind, I think Microsoft has risen the par on tablet competition. As the upcoming Samsung Series 5 hybrid tablet, for example, is coming with a $650 based price, 11 hrs battery life (with the optional keyboard), 750g weight, and can run all window software. Even though I have not seen, touch or used one of these new machines, the fact that Window 8 has turned my 6 years old tablet into a brand new machine is exciting for me.
Please don't get me wrong. I think the Samsung Note 10.1 is a decent machine which I will definitely keep. I bought it because I can carry it all day and not worry about battery, and I hardly need to run any PC applications these days when I am out. More importantly if I plan to use the PC all day, I probably need to bring the charger with me which will bring the weight up to 1kg or more. Since I carry my camera with me all day, the Note 10.1 is a better choice for me.
However, if you are looking into serious note taking and also need to run pc applications, I think the Window 8 tablets may be a good alternative. We will all know if this is true when the machines are officially announced in late Oct.
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[email protected] said:
WOW!! I wished someone had warned me about troll living here and that no comments other than good Note 10.1 comments are allowed in this forum. This will be my last post in the forum, leaving you alone to harass other people.
Best wishes!
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[email protected], welcome. Sorry about the resident W8 Hater. I recommend to just ignore him.
Thank you for sharing your experience with your Note(s) and your tablets with Windows 8! My experience with my Note 10.1 is pretty much the same as yours. I am really looking forward to trying out a Surface Pro or one of the other new W8 tablets that are coming out. Your post has just seriously reinforced that!
When you use One Note on a tablet, does it give you inking features for drawing pictures and hand writing notes similar to what S-Note does? I have W8 and One Note, but no Ink-enabled device to put them on to play with it myself.
tenderidol said:
With the exception of one person, we are all on the same page here.
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Who are "we?" I have no idea what everyone here's needs are. I also have no idea what the "cons" are going to be that will without doubt go along with the rosy PR blurb “pros” being thrown out. I'm in marketing so perhaps I'm less susceptible to spin than some of you guys because I create it. MS lost their way and have a bunch of simultaneous "Hail Mary's" launching concurrently (Cloud, W8 the OS, and W8 the tablet). I wish them nothing but the best. But I'd like to see some traction gained before drinking their Kool-Aid and declaring their success. And that will take months to realize. I'm a heavy productivity user and use OneNote, MS Office, and SharePoint so therefore a candidate for a W8 tablet. Only I'm not as eager to throw out my fairly evolved Android device to experience V1 of the h/w and s/w of an alternative. Months from now I may own a W8 tablet. Based on my personal needs and usage there's absolutely no rush. You guys can go first and if the world's not flat I'll follow you.
BarryH_GEG said:
Who are "we?" I have no idea what everyone here's needs are. I also have no idea what the "cons" are going to be that will without doubt go along with the rosy PR blurb “pros” being thrown out. I'm in marketing so perhaps I'm less susceptible to spin than some of you guys because I create it. MS lost their way and have a bunch of simultaneous "Hail Mary's" launching concurrently (Cloud, W8 the OS, and W8 the tablet). I wish them nothing but the best. But I'd like to see some traction gained before drinking their Kool-Aid and declaring their success. And that will take months to realize. I'm a heavy productivity user and use OneNote, MS Office, and SharePoint so therefore a candidate for a W8 tablet. Only I'm not as eager to throw out my fairly evolved Android device to experience V1 of the h/w and s/w of an alternative. Months from now I may own a W8 tablet. Based on my personal needs and usage there's absolutely no rush. You guys can go first and if the world's not flat I'll follow you.
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"We" as in "people who currently own the Note 10.1 and wanted to try and see the potential of upcoming Windows 8 tablets without forming any assumptions based on others' opinions". As you can see, nobody is saying that this will be a huge success, it's going to be "superior" or will definitely trump other tablets, etc. Let's see if the potential of the device is met by the hardware and the software first. As I stated, I have my reservations for the Atom-based CPU and 2 GB RAM in the Series 5. If it can't handle the load, I won't be moving over to the Series 7, because it's too heavy and pricey for me. I thought this was the original discussion.
tenderidol said:
see the potential
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Promise and potential are very different from practice and reality. And sometimes when they collide it isn’t pretty. Since this entire conversation is theoretical there can never be a decisive conclusion. I really don't have an opinion and won't until I can personally play with a W8 tablet and see how well it does the things I need it to do. Even then, my conclusion will only apply to me and my individual needs.
Think about this. Here's the iPad demographic.
iPad ownership is skewed toward young customers, with 27% of owners between 25 and 34. The average iPad owner is affluent, with a median income of $85,000 a year. Most importantly, they are much more likely to be buying things.
Don't you think that audience is using MS Office and OneNote professionally to earn the higher median income they do? Apple's sold 100MM iPads with no native access to MS Office. Taking a broader view I don't think it's the "killer app" many of you believe it will be. Especially if it comes at the price of a less refined h/w and s/w experience. There's also a certain cache that comes from owning an iPad. Android tablet owners tend to be classified as rugged individualists and technology enthusiasts. What will W8 tablet owners be? People that need access to MS apps? Pretty low on the "cool" scale, no? There’s more to a product’s success than just functionality.
Just food for thought while we're discussing the potential mass-market (in other words, not us) success of W8 tablets.
BarryH_GEG said:
Just food for thought while we're discussing the potential mass-market (in other words, not us) success of W8 tablets.
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Which we weren't until some folks hijacked the thread and went totally OT from the OP...
We have had a number of people coming into our Forum praising the upcoming Windows 8 tablets and putting down our beloved SGN10.1. Before any SGN10.1 owners fall for their hyperbole, please consider the following from PCWorld Magazine:
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscent..._8_tablets_have_what_it_takes_to_succeed.html
Potential Stumbling Blocks
There are a number of issues that could make Windows 8 tablets dead on arrival, or at least a very tough sell. Two of the biggest will be price, and confusion over differences between Windows on ARM (WOA) tablets, and x86/x64 architecture tablets.
ARM-based devices will probably be better tablets than their x86/x64 counterparts. WOA tablets will most likely be lighter, cooler, have longer battery life, and--most importantly--be cheaper. ARM-based tablets will be more on par with the competing tablets already in the market like the iPad, Motorola Xoom, Samsung Galaxy Tab, and others.
That all sounds great, but WOA tablets also come with significant handicaps that nullify most of what makes a Windows 8 tablet appealing. For example, WOA tablets can’t run traditional Windows software--they require apps written for the Metro UI.
Wes Miller from GetWired.com and Directions on Microsoft poses the question, “For enterprises who will have to rewrite their (non-Web) applications in Metro for WOA anyway, the question comes up, "why wouldn't I rewrite it for iOS instead?", since there is no way to run non-Microsoft Win32 apps on WOA.”
The bigger issue for WOA tablets is that Microsoft has revealed they are intended for “unmanaged environments”. What that translates to is that WOA tablets will not be able to connect to Windows domains and be managed like x86/x64 Windows 8 tablets, and other Windows systems.
Amobi says that there are arguments to be made for and against WOA tablets, and it’s still too early for a final verdict. But, he stresses, “If they cant join domains--game over.”
No worries. We still have x86/x64 Windows 8 tablets to fall back on, right? True, but there are some caveats.
An x86/x64 tablet is just squeezing a notebook or desktop into a touchscreen, flat-panel form factor. That has advantages, but we also know that running Windows takes a fair amount of processing horsepower and memory. While it may be possible to run Windows 8 with less RAM, 4GB is probably the minimum for acceptable performance. That is four times what most ARM tablets use.
When you build a tablet on x86/x64 architecture, and try to beef up the RAM to deliver adequate performance, the tablet starts to face other issues. As previously mentioned, users want tablets that are thin, light, and have endurance to last all day on a single charge. It is unlikely that x86/x64 tablets can truly compete with ARM-based rivals in these areas.
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As I have stated, W8 Tablets will be stuck in the middle. RT too underpowered to run true Windows software and Pro too small to run true Windows software properly.
DOA.
Hopefully these facts have taken some of the emotion out of this argument.
The SGN10.1 is and will be the most bang for your buck you can get in a pen based tablet for quite a while. If we get the Note 2 software, that will be even more true than it is now. No need for buyer's remorse. You made the right call.
Good thing most reviews are **** or we wouldn't have got the Note 10.1 based on reviews, amiright?
Quit white knighting the Note. It's a good tablet but there will come along better ones.
Every review of every tablet has a slant. There are no unbiased professional reviews. Or amateur reviews for that matter.
Nefariouss said:
Good thing most reviews are **** or we wouldn't have got the Note 10.1 based on reviews, amiright?
Quit white knighting the Note. It's a good tablet but there will come along better ones.
Every review of every tablet has a slant. There are no unbiased professional reviews. Or amateur reviews for that matter.
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So you are claiming this review is innacurate? Please point out what you specifically find to be false? Those are not opinions but just facts about how Windows 8 will work in a tablet environment. The reviewer is not discussing the merits or inadequacies of any particular tablet.
If you can debunk any of those claims now is your chance.
As far as "white knighting" the SGN10.1, this IS the SGN10.1 forum is it not? Maybe you got lost? The better question would be why are Windows 8 fanboys coming to our forum to disparage our device? I have drawn two conclusions regarding our visiting Windows 8 protagonists thus far. They are very enthusiastic and they are very thin skinned. Can you imagine someone coming to OUR forum to tell us the SGN10.1 is inadequate and then calling ME a troll when I dare disagree?
Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk 2
I can't believe you rose to the bait in [email protected]'s original thread. He's comparing old-school Windows tablets that he upgraded to W8 and declaring victory for the platform going forward. People have been posting screen-on times for the Note of over 10 hours. An earlier Windows tablet would be lucky to clear 4 and weigh easily twice as much to do it. Like the rest of you I made a substantial investment in the Note knowing W8 tablets were around the corner. The reason I did it is that every new platform that's launched goes through start-up issues, suffers from lack of refinement, and has a dearth of apps in the beginning. If I jump on the W8 tablet band wagon it’ll be months after their launched and I feel no urgency to dump the Note which will without doubt continue to be a better consumption device for the foreseeable future. If your use of a tablet is 75+% complex inking and MS Office apps maybe you should jump on W8 Pro faster than me and join [email protected]
The challenge with W8 is that you can't make a generalized comparison to Android. The RT tablets are going to be low-feature consumer versions and the Pro versions higher-end (and priced) productivity devices. It's too early to say but I doubt a $300 RT tablet will deliver the stellar Wacom-driven inking experience [email protected] is hoping for. Similarly the starting price for a Pro tablet is probably for a pretty barren model. By the time you upgrade the various h/w components I can see them easily reaching the $1K that you originally suggested for a “loaded” model.
Regardless, the fat lady won't sing for at least a couple of months until after they're in people's hands so it's way too early to get in to a discussion about "my tablet (or OS) can beat up yours.” Why [email protected] decided to come to an Android forum just to share his personal opinions of his old-school Windows hardware is beyond me.
I'm a bait-riser from way back :silly:
I just get tired of the breathless hyperbole from these W8 disciples. I wouldn't have minded if he had just talked about how well his old tablets were running on W8, but he put our tablet down as second best and I can't have that
Nefariouss said:
Good thing most reviews are **** or we wouldn't have got the Note 10.1 based on reviews, amiright?
Quit white knighting the Note. It's a good tablet but there will come along better ones.
Every review of every tablet has a slant. There are no unbiased professional reviews. Or amateur reviews for that matter.
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Excellent point! If you take a look at Verge's "professional review", you wouldn't touch the Note10.1 with a ten-foot pole. Then again, here we are talking about it happily. Note 5.4 was declared DOA by almost every "professional reviewer" and we know how that went.
Let's wait and see before moving into a cult-like behavior over a tablet.
Even on the arm tablets the windows 8 interface will be present. There will be full office 2013, OneNote, and all metro apps. Plus it seems to be really smooth and slick on the reviews.
And this without the biggest thing. In one move the windows ecosystem will be bigger than the Android ecosystem. Apps will not be the super stretched phone apps, and but rather full tablet apps (witness the xda app as on example).
Does this mean I regret buying the note? No not all. But it does mean that once the windows 8 tablets are out I will not be taking it in to work or on trips. It will become more consumption based then productivity.
Lets not pretend that windows will somehow disappear just because you think it will be doa. Even vista sold more than all android tablets combined.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using xda app-developers app
---------- Post added at 05:43 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:38 PM ----------
Without even reading the full article I know the claim about windows requiring beefy hardware is bull****. I I have run windows 8 on a touch smart tx2 with 2 gigs, and on a q6600 with 1 gig and an i7 with 16 gigs. And I am running the note right now. Even on the touch smart win8 was smoother and performed better. I sadly the ntrig drivers don't work and the thing weighs a ton, and but the Clover trail smart pc from Samsung willost likely have a better experience than the note.
Also multitasking. I real split screen for almost every app.
And the finishing blow? OneNote. Nothing compares with OneNote.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using xda app-developers app
---------- Post added at 05:46 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:43 PM ----------
I do not have any idea why people are ignoring the published price of the Samsung tablets. Samsung has already said that the smart pc with Clover trail will be 650 with 64gig storage. We know it won't cost significantly more than top of the line android tablets, and will have free OneNote mx, and have comparable weight and battery life (if I believe samsung) and will use the same spen.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using xda app-developers app
oh mitchellvii. Poor, poor, mitchellvii.
Owning both a Win8 tab [Asus Eee Slate] and (obviously) the GNote10, I can say that no matter how hard Samsung or Android try, Windows is the true multi-tasker. No way around it. Also, definitely more capable to do ANY task.
The GNote10 does have it's advantages. Prolly the same reasons I bought one is the same reasons y'all bought one. Battery life, weight, slim, no fan, s-pen, and I guess Android based.
Just because Windows is hands down better doesn't mean the GNote is inadequate.
Don't be mad that the GNote is second best to a Windows tablet, be mad that the GNote will always be second best to an iPad.
I have my N10.1 3G for 3 weeks now, it accompanied me to travels and never ever failed..Neither failed my wife' s N10.1 her (she is more the gaming fraction in my family )
I worked easily in the plane in plane mode with stylus having four apps open, read some kindle books, diagnosed HR X-Rays preloaded, drawed comments on them for my junior docs, prepared some drafts for lectures, in summary the time was highly productive, more than ever achievable with my Vaio Z 14 supernotebook.
Why ? Its almost impossible to decently work with a notebook on the plane, at least in eco class .......
With the N10.1 You can !
With a fair data roaming fee I read my newspapers and PC/Android mags at breakfast and dinner, follow my beloved Ida community, post, answer emails and so forth.
I could do last aactivities also with my SGS III, but I LOVE the big screen and multitasking, I can do everything I did not do with my Note, this was finally too small for me for serious work.
But why am I still curious of the Win8 Surface?
For my lectures worldwide I need a fully functional PowerPoint including the capability to play embedded vids (every third slide is a vid!) and edit every slide as a would do it on my PC. I did not find an Android app capable of THIS. And I need fully functional Word and Excel (not stripped versions)
Second: I need connectibility to standard beamers with the good old VGA-D-sub connector
All this my beloved N10.1 can't give me.
If Surface Win8 provides these features I will buy it and be happy working with it, but my N10.1 will always be Nr. 1 (until Note 10.1 / 2 arrives :angel:)
mitchellvii said:
I'm a bait-riser from way back :silly:
I just get tired of the breathless hyperbole from these W8 disciples. I wouldn't have minded if he had just talked about how well his old tablets were running on W8, but he put our tablet down as second best and I can't have that
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No one is providing breathless hyperbole, everyone I have seen here is cautiously optimistic at best about Windows 8 tablets. If you think that's fanboyism then perhaps you need to take a good hard look in the mirror. No one here, including [email protected], has bashed the Note 10.1 in any way. You need to separate praising another OS from praising a specific device, and both of those from bashing our device. I love my Note 10.1 but there are obviously things it can't do, and to deny that is stupid. I do agree with you overall that Windows 8 tablets appear to be stuck on two extremes with Pro and RT and not able to meet the middle ground that the Note 10.1 reaches, but I think with time and competition they will be at least competitive with Android tablets on at least 2 or 3 out of functionality, battery life, and form factor, and value.
Personally I don't think I need my tablet to be a full Windows PC and do full multitasking with floating windows and the like, but that's because I've got plenty of beefy systems for real work and my tablet is a great supplement to them. Also I use Linux primarily and Windows only for gaming but that's a separate point. For those that want or need to have one device that does everything, a Windows 8 Pro tablet may be that device. You'll compromise on battery life and weight but gain a lot of extra functionality. And you keep ignoring the possibility of Atom powered Windows 8 Pro tablets that could be competitive on battery life and weight too (not equal to ARM, but at least in the same ballpark) in addition to cost.
Honestly, I think everything that can be speculated about W8 at this point as been said and we should have a moratorium on further discussion here until the first devices are actually out.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
My "other" portable device next to the OG G-Tab in its BT keyboard case. It weighs the same as the Note, runs W7 Ultimate (for now), has all the MS Office apps including Access, packs a 256GB Samsung SSD, has a 1600x768 display, GPS, and a built in VZW card. The Android tablet's a better consumption device and the VAIO's a better productivity device. They both are adequate in reverse. Which I travel with depends on what I'll be doing. If I had to pick one I'd pick the Note because it's more versatile and can "fake" productivity better than the VAIO can "fake" consumption. Who knows? Maybe a W8 tablet will end up being the perfect blend.
mitchellvii said:
We have had a number of people coming into our Forum praising the upcoming Windows 8 tablets and putting down our beloved SGN10.1. Before any SGN10.1 owners fall for their hyperbole, please consider the following from PCWorld Magazine:
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The reason you are getting such a cross-comparison is because the SGN 10.1 is marketed as an alternative to Windows tablets. People buy the SGN 10.1 to do things that an IPad can't with handwriting functions. People want to know if the 10.1 really fills the gap between the IPad and Windows devices.
I think the general consensus is that for light note taking and sketching it does and for hardcore professionals (like lawyers) it doesn't.
I loved the Note 10.1... but I returned it as I'm in the latter category. I need seemless cloud and app integration.
FWIW, I went ahead and put the IPad 3 screen up against the Note. It really would be difficult for me to accept a lower resolution than the Note 10.1 provides. The new Slate 5 is going to have a worse PPI than the Note. I don't think I'll be purchasing that device.
crazeco said:
the SGN 10.1 is marketed as an alternative to Windows tablets.
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It's actually marketed as a creativity and consumption device.
“Our goal with the Samsung GALAXY Note 10.1 was simple – redefine the tablet experience,” said Tim Baxter, President, Samsung Electronics America. “The S Pen offers both active content creation as well as passive content consumption, while the Multiscreen capability finally enables true multitasking. For the user, the resulting experience is completely new and quite unexpected.”
http://www.samsung.com/us/news/20228
But you raise an interesting question. How will companies like Samsung, Asus, Acer, and Lenovo market and position their W8 tablets, especially RT, when they all offer similarly priced and featured Android tablets? The only one that can/will go balls out and say W8 is better than Android is MS. Maybe that's what they were afraid and what caused them to build the Surface on their own.
BarryH_GEG said:
It's actually marketed as a creativity and consumption device.
“Our goal with the Samsung GALAXY Note 10.1 was simple – redefine the tablet experience,” said Tim Baxter, President, Samsung Electronics America. “The S Pen offers both active content creation as well as passive content consumption, while the Multiscreen capability finally enables true multitasking. For the user, the resulting experience is completely new and quite unexpected.”
http://www.samsung.com/us/news/20228
But you raise an interesting question. How will companies like Samsung, Asus, Acer, and Lenovo market and position their W8 tablets, especially RT, when they all offer similarly priced and featured Android tablets? The only one that can/will go balls out and say W8 is better than Android is MS. Maybe that's what they were afraid and what caused them to build the Surface on their own.
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I stand by my statement that the SGN 10.1 is marketed as an alternative to the W8 tablets like the Surface because this is the (earlier) Microsoft press release:
"Surface is designed to seamlessly transition between consumption and creation, without compromise."
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/news/press/2012/jun12/06-18announce.aspx
crazeco said:
I stand by my statement that the SGN 10.1 is marketed as an alternative to the W8 tablets like the Surface because this is the (earlier) Microsoft press release:
"Surface is designed to seamlessly transition between consumption and creation, without compromise."
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/news/press/2012/jun12/06-18announce.aspx
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Don't you mean that you see the Note 10.1 as an alternative to W8 tablets? Because from what I read, the statements from Samsung don't really say that at all. You're using a statement from Microsoft (who, last I checked does not make nor market the Note 10.1) as the basis for how Samsung is marketing its device.
Uh, forgive me, but that makes no sense. How Samsung attempts to sell its device is how it is marketed, not how people and other companies respond to it. I think the point you're actually making is that the Note 10.1, competitively speaking, is seen as an alternative device to a W8 tablet, but that's not the same thing as saying that's how it's being marketed. Samsung hasn't said flat out that they want it to be an alternative to W8. They're aiming it at students and businesspeople for creative tasks, general multi-tasking, and note-taking. Somehow I think a W8 tablet should be able to do far more than that, productivity-wise.
Just my two cents, though...
wingzero2085 said:
How Samsung attempts to sell its device is how it is marketed
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To add to your post, PR's crafted months in advance. The words Samsung chose were with clear knowledge of the imminent announcement of the Ativ(s). It'll be interesting to see how competing Android and Windows tablets are marketed and positioned by the different OEM's. Kind of like a single dealership selling Honda's and Toyota's in the same showroom.
wingzero2085 said:
Don't you mean that you see the Note 10.1 as an alternative to W8 tablets? Because from what I read, the statements from Samsung don't really say that at all. You're using a statement from Microsoft (who, last I checked does not make nor market the Note 10.1) as the basis for how Samsung is marketing its device.
Uh, forgive me, but that makes no sense. How Samsung attempts to sell its device is how it is marketed, not how people and other companies respond to it. I think the point you're actually making is that the Note 10.1, competitively speaking, is seen as an alternative device to a W8 tablet, but that's not the same thing as saying that's how it's being marketed. Samsung hasn't said flat out that they want it to be an alternative to W8. They're aiming it at students and businesspeople for creative tasks, general multi-tasking, and note-taking. Somehow I think a W8 tablet should be able to do far more than that, productivity-wise.
Just my two cents, though...
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Microsoft's PR came first. Samsung responded by mirroring Microsoft's PR.
Microsoft on June 18, 2012: "Surface is designed to seamlessly transition between consumption and creation, without compromise."
Samsung on August 15, 2012: “Our goal with the Samsung GALAXY Note 10.1 was simple – redefine the tablet experience,” said Tim Baxter, President, Samsung Electronics America. “The S Pen offers both active content creation as well as passive content consumption..."
I'm happy to have a debate with you regarding which device will better achieve "consumption" and "creation" - but I'm not going to debate facts. It's a fact that Samsung is marketing this device to the same type of consumer that Microsoft is marketing a pen supported Surface tablet. That's why threads like this exist in the Samsung Note 10.1 forum, because the SGN 10.1 is an alternative to the forthcoming Windows 8 tablet.
My personal config will be:
Win8 Surface Pro to run full "Office" and special medical apps not available for android (CAT-Scan-Viewer etc.) + connect to beamers for lectures (since it has Miniport-Display plug)
+
Beloved SGN 10.1 on the go and during lectures remote control Win8 surface Pro :laugh::laugh::laugh:
Makes 1,6 kg to carry around ..........................
troed said:
My personal config will be:
Win8 Surface Pro to run full "Office" and special medical apps not available for android (CAT-Scan-Viewer etc.) + connect to beamers for lectures (since it has Miniport-Display plug)
+
Beloved SGN 10.1 on the go and during lectures remote control Win8 surface Pro :laugh::laugh::laugh:
Makes 1,6 kg to carry around ..........................
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Funny... I have the same plan for very similar reasons.
tenderidol said:
Funny... I have the same plan for very similar reasons.
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Honestly I don't see why you would want something other than the Surface Pro in that situation. Its going to have similar battery life, better pen support and will not weight a lot more. Not to mention higher res screen.
Personally I'll be getting the Ativ Smart PC (the atom one with the low res screen) to replace the note. I have a student I can gift the note 10.1 to if he does a good job with an upcoming conference. SmartPC will probably be my go to laptop/tablet hybrid device.
I would sell a right leg for a kindle paperwhite with an active digitizer and direct export to OneNote.
I absolutely love the new super long battery life of the Atom Z2760. By reading reviews of the Tablets I am finding out that all day battery life is absolutely no problem. Especially with the battery upgrade you can do with Dell on the Latitude 10 optional “60 WHR 4-Cell Battery”. People are getting like days of battery life.
I was really torn between the Microsoft Surface Pro which seems like a beast with all the loves and kisses of an amazing tablet but the battery life is horrid. I am currently going back to college and am looking for a note taking power house that will absolutely last all day, let’s say 8 hours. I know the Microsoft Surface Pro will be fast and the perfect size but will not last all day maybe 4 to 5 hours.
So battery life is my absolutely main objective. Even though I would love to have the Surface I prefer battery life. Other people might only need 4 hours of battery life and the Surface will be fine for them.
So back to my main question about the famous Haswell chip. I really want to pull the trigger on the Dell Latitude 10 because of the upgraded battery but I am reading about the Haswell chip and it seems to be everything tablets are not right now. I know you will always be in a 6 month loop with technology with something always better around the corner but this is something different. They say this is revolutionary and will increase performance and battery life by leaps and bounds. They are building the chip and tablet from the ground up with the Haswell.
What do I do? I mean will the Haswell actually be the amazing new Tablet revolution that everyone is talking about or is it just a bunch of hype? I mean how much more battery life can you pour into a Tablet over the Clovertrial.
I really do not need the performance upgrades of Haswell so much because I will be mainly using the tablet for note taking. I do not care about gaming, but same price and better performace is always nice in case you ever need it.
Please give me your thoughts or similar experiences. Will you be buying a Tablet now or waiting? Do you think it’s worth it to wait or just buy now? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
P.S. I only want a full blown windows 8 experience as well, not RT, Android, or anything else.
Best,
Needspractice
needspractice said:
I absolutely love the new super long battery life of the Atom Z2760. By reading reviews of the Tablets I am finding out that all day battery life is absolutely no problem. Especially with the battery upgrade you can do with Dell on the Latitude 10 optional “60 WHR 4-Cell Battery”. People are getting like days of battery life.
I was really torn between the Microsoft Surface Pro which seems like a beast with all the loves and kisses of an amazing tablet but the battery life is horrid. I am currently going back to college and am looking for a note taking power house that will absolutely last all day, let’s say 8 hours. I know the Microsoft Surface Pro will be fast and the perfect size but will not last all day maybe 4 to 5 hours.
So battery life is my absolutely main objective. Even though I would love to have the Surface I prefer battery life. Other people might only need 4 hours of battery life and the Surface will be fine for them.
So back to my main question about the famous Haswell chip. I really want to pull the trigger on the Dell Latitude 10 because of the upgraded battery but I am reading about the Haswell chip and it seems to be everything tablets are not right now. I know you will always be in a 6 month loop with technology with something always better around the corner but this is something different. They say this is revolutionary and will increase performance and battery life by leaps and bounds. They are building the chip and tablet from the ground up with the Haswell.
What do I do? I mean will the Haswell actually be the amazing new Tablet revolution that everyone is talking about or is it just a bunch of hype? I mean how much more battery life can you pour into a Tablet over the Clovertrial.
I really do not need the performance upgrades of Haswell so much because I will be mainly using the tablet for note taking. I do not care about gaming, but same price and better performace is always nice in case you ever need it.
Please give me your thoughts or similar experiences. Will you be buying a Tablet now or waiting? Do you think it’s worth it to wait or just buy now? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
P.S. I only want a full blown windows 8 experience as well, not RT, Android, or anything else.
Best,
Needspractice
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm like you and was stuck and didn't know what to do. After researching online it seems Haswell tablets wont be out until the end of this year, but I needed a tablet now. I went with the Lenovo Thinkpad Tablet 2. It's faster than my SurfaceRT was and I absolutely love the digitizer. I use the pen mainly as a mouse when in the full desktop. It makes a huge difference having the pen to use as a mouse. If they refresh the Thinkpad2, I plan to sell my current one to acquire the haswell version. You always have that choice if you don't mind ebay/craigslist.
I absolutely love the new super long battery life of the Atom Z2760. By reading reviews of the Tablets I am finding out that all day battery life is absolutely no problem. Especially with the battery upgrade you can do with Dell on the Latitude 10 optional “60 WHR 4-Cell Battery”. People are getting like days of battery life.
I was really torn between the Microsoft Surface Pro which seems like a beast with all the loves and kisses of an amazing tablet but the battery life is horrid. I am currently going back to college and am looking for a note taking power house that will absolutely last all day, let’s say 8 hours. I know the Microsoft Surface Pro will be fast and the perfect size but will not last all day maybe 4 to 5 hours.
So battery life is my absolutely main objective. Even though I would love to have the Surface I prefer battery life. Other people might only need 4 hours of battery life and the Surface will be fine for them.
So back to my main question about the famous Haswell chip. I really want to pull the trigger on the Dell Latitude 10 because of the upgraded battery but I am reading about the Haswell chip and it seems to be everything tablets are not right now. I know you will always be in a 6 month loop with technology with something always better around the corner but this is something different. They say this is revolutionary and will increase performance and battery life by leaps and bounds. They are building the chip and tablet from the ground up with the Haswell.
What do I do? I mean will the Haswell actually be the amazing new Tablet revolution that everyone is talking about or is it just a bunch of hype? I mean how much more battery life can you pour into a Tablet over the Clovertrial.
I really do not need the performance upgrades of Haswell so much because I will be mainly using the tablet for note taking. I do not care about gaming, but same price and better performace is always nice in case you ever need it.
Please give me your thoughts or similar experiences. Will you be buying a Tablet now or waiting? Do you think it’s worth it to wait or just buy now? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
P.S. I only want a full blown windows 8 experience as well, not RT, Android, or anything else.
Best,
Needspractice
me too.
customise 128GB SSD.
on dual booting 7 and 8:good:
too use separated.
I would definitely consider an iPad for educational use. They're excellent for note taking and reading textbooks. No, I'm not kidding.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD
But he wants Win 8.
veeman said:
I would definitely consider an iPad for educational use. They're excellent for note taking and reading textbooks. No, I'm not kidding.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, let's pay more than a Win8 tablet to get a fourth of the usability (and I'm being generous with the iPad's usefulness)
I am in the same boat. I want a windows 8 tablet sooooooo much. I want to trade my laptop which weighs 7lbs for a nice, light tablet and I want to build a cheap pc for home gaming. However I don't want the Atoms. Not enough performance. And I wouldn't mind paying 600-700 bucks for an i3/i5 tablet right now, but I would hate myself if the Haswells came out with almost double the battery life and more performance for the same price.
So I've decided to be patient and work through this school year using my laptop. All the while saving up for my upgrade. Then at the end of next summer the Haswells should be on sale or cheaper. Or if they weren't as much of an improvement as we expected I can get the current tablets for dirt cheap. Next summer the surface pro will probably be around $500 at some places.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda premium
Censura_Umbra said:
Yeah, let's pay more than a Win8 tablet to get a fourth of the usability (and I'm being generous with the iPad's usefulness)
I am in the same boat. I want a windows 8 tablet sooooooo much. I want to trade my laptop which weighs 7lbs for a nice, light tablet and I want to build a cheap pc for home gaming. However I don't want the Atoms. Not enough performance. And I wouldn't mind paying 600-700 bucks for an i3/i5 tablet right now, but I would hate myself if the Haswells came out with almost double the battery life and more performance for the same price.
So I've decided to be patient and work through this school year using my laptop. All the while saving up for my upgrade. Then at the end of next summer the Haswells should be on sale or cheaper. Or if they weren't as much of an improvement as we expected I can get the current tablets for dirt cheap. Next summer the surface pro will probably be around $500 at some places.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A fourth of the usability of a Windows RT tablet? Heck no. The iPad has way more stable, useful apps.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD
veeman said:
A fourth of the usability of a Windows RT tablet? Heck no. The iPad has way more stable, useful apps.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
shows how much attention you've been paying.
Educational use, the RT has a full blown office suite, printing and usb storage, all useful and unavailable on an iPad. Well, office suites there are some but none even nearly match Microsoft office. Printing on RT is no different from a normal PC, no specialised printers required (my old school would have had to spend £40000 on printers if they were to replace with an iPad compatible model, the RT tablet a classmate bought in worked fine already). Usb storage, hah, you don't even get a usable file system let alone mass storage.
But we aren't using RT. We're talking windows 8, you know, that OS on your laptop or desktop. Intel atom, ivy bridge and haswell tablets as discussed here are all full blown x86 tablets and will run your full PC software which I would love to see you do on your iPad. That and many have active digitiser pens which are even better for nite taking than a capacitive screen which has no way to palm block (and I cannot contort my hand in such a way to write with a stylus on a capacitive screen without wearing gloves as a palm blocker).
So, cheaper and more useful for productivity which seems to be what was desired.
veeman said:
A fourth of the usability of a Windows RT tablet? Heck no. The iPad has way more stable, useful apps.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hahahaha more useful apps than every single "app" I use on my PC everyday? Like gimp and Photoshop? Sony Vegas? Real games like DmC and Call of Duty? Wow. What are you even doing in this part of the forum?
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda premium
Censura_Umbra said:
Hahahaha more useful apps than every single "app" I use on my PC everyday? Like gimp and Photoshop? Sony Vegas? Real games like DmC and Call of Duty? Wow. What are you even doing in this part of the forum?
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You aren't going to be able to run any of those apps on Windows RT tablet. And if you do go up to the x86 windows 8 tablet, unless you're willing to spend $1000+, you won't get a tablet that runs Photoshop or Call of Duty well.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD
---------- Post added at 10:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:55 AM ----------
SixSixSevenSeven said:
shows how much attention you've been paying.
Educational use, the RT has a full blown office suite, printing and usb storage, all useful and unavailable on an iPad. Well, office suites there are some but none even nearly match Microsoft office. Printing on RT is no different from a normal PC, no specialised printers required (my old school would have had to spend £40000 on printers if they were to replace with an iPad compatible model, the RT tablet a classmate bought in worked fine already). Usb storage, hah, you don't even get a usable file system let alone mass storage.
But we aren't using RT. We're talking windows 8, you know, that OS on your laptop or desktop. Intel atom, ivy bridge and haswell tablets as discussed here are all full blown x86 tablets and will run your full PC software which I would love to see you do on your iPad. That and many have active digitiser pens which are even better for nite taking than a capacitive screen which has no way to palm block (and I cannot contort my hand in such a way to write with a stylus on a capacitive screen without wearing gloves as a palm blocker).
So, cheaper and more useful for productivity which seems to be what was desired.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. Apple has a very good Office Suite for iPads
2. Most universities will have printers that are compatible with wireless printing.
3. You seem to be misinformed as you can connect USB mass storage devices to iPads. (Though it does require jailbreak)
4. You said it's cheaper but for a tablet to have all the features you listed, the price point is close to $1000 or more.
5. Many medical fields write their software specifically for iPads. I know the hospital my mom works at does.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD
veeman said:
You aren't going to be able to run any of those apps on Windows RT tablet. And if you do go up to the x86 windows 8 tablet, unless you're willing to spend $1000+, you won't get a tablet that runs Photoshop or Call of Duty well.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD
---------- Post added at 10:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:55 AM ----------
1. Apple has a very good Office Suite for iPads
2. Most universities will have printers that are compatible with wireless printing.
3. You seem to be misinformed as you can connect USB mass storage devices to iPads. (Though it does require jailbreak)
4. You said it's cheaper but for a tablet to have all the features you listed, the price point is close to $1000 or more.
5. Many medical fields write their software specifically for iPads. I know the hospital my mom works at does.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did I say university anywhere? I'm not there until september. And besides, wireless printing does not mean an iPad will print to it, has to support some stupid apple protocol which although many do, most don't. And besides, in my old school the printing was not inherently wireless. The entire school was covered with a local network (a very large network which is also a rather convenient example of mixed topology within a network for computer science lessons), all printers were normal network printers. If you found a wireless access point then any windows device had no problem printing, if you had an ethernet connection then you could print fine from any normal computer too, a few of the printers in the school were even recognised by some android devices (although that was hit and miss), windows RT was able to print to them fine, iPads insisted that there was no printer present, even for the wireless one over in A11. There were only 2 iPad compatible printers in the building, 1 in the head masters office and one in my computer science room which my tutor bought himself.
The only office suites for iPads (pages is probably best and I presume the one you mean) are all far inferior to MS Office in terms of available functionality. Credit where credit is due, pages does work rather nicely as a basic office suite but leaves alot to be desired for things like .DOC support etc. Openoffice was able to open my 130 page coursework fine, MS Office was fine, Pages loaded a few pages, then gave up. The demo surface RT in john lewis, loaded it into MS office fine, no lag, nothing broken. Then on top of that, all RT tablets have office pre installed already, iPad its a seperate purchase. Same for windows 8 admittedly, but at least on windows 8 there are incredibly good free alternatives which are all fully fledged yet run fine on the atom processors of the CHEAPER tablets.
USB mass storage even on jailbroken iPads is buggy, its a native feature in Windows (for storage one can assume RT and 8 to be the same thing, as they do use the same feature set on this front). Windows supports more file systems, try using an NTFS drive on your iPad, or even on OSX for that matter, OSX has read only support, iPad apparently is hit and miss for that. You have to jailbreak which most users appear incompetent enough to not be able to do. Windows you get support for various forms of network storage too. Windows 8 you get FTP etc, with jailbreaks that is available on RT although not everyone wants to jailbreak (although those that need FTP are probably capable of jailbreaking). You get a normal file system presented on desktop, with apps in Start too, a proper file system, excellent, even android has that.
You will find that most establishments (including medical and educational, I know people from both backgrounds) who are migrating to iPads from existing windows solutions already have software for windows devices. Well, newsflash, a full windows 8 tablet will run these systems no porting required. But this is a hugely irrelevant point as we are not discussing the medical profession. In most cases these businesses are having to write their new shiny iPad apps from scratch, well if they are writing new software anyway they can just as easily write it for android or windows Start, so that further nullifies your point.
And no, a Asus vivotab smart costs less than an iPad. And does what needs to be done. Photoshop, devil may cry and call of duty were not on the criteria list, he said note taking and that he specifically is not gaming. Another newsflash, photoshop actually runs on the atom surprisingly well, sure your not going to be editing 500 megapixel images and applying 42 filters to it and having them done in 1 second, but quickly touching up the contrast on a 5mp phone photo is well within its abilities, more than that is but thats another null point as thats not a criteria so it doesnt matter.
I understand you want to defend your over-priced purchase but if your going to slate a windows tablet, use actual or relevant facts.
SixSixSevenSeven said:
Did I say university anywhere? I'm not there until september. And besides, wireless printing does not mean an iPad will print to it, has to support some stupid apple protocol which although many do, most don't. And besides, in my old school the printing was not inherently wireless. The entire school was covered with a local network (a very large network which is also a rather convenient example of mixed topology within a network for computer science lessons), all printers were normal network printers. If you found a wireless access point then any windows device had no problem printing, if you had an ethernet connection then you could print fine from any normal computer too, a few of the printers in the school were even recognised by some android devices (although that was hit and miss), windows RT was able to print to them fine, iPads insisted that there was no printer present, even for the wireless one over in A11. There were only 2 iPad compatible printers in the building, 1 in the head masters office and one in my computer science room which my tutor bought himself.
The only office suites for iPads (pages is probably best and I presume the one you mean) are all far inferior to MS Office in terms of available functionality. Credit where credit is due, pages does work rather nicely as a basic office suite but leaves alot to be desired for things like .DOC support etc. Openoffice was able to open my 130 page coursework fine, MS Office was fine, Pages loaded a few pages, then gave up. The demo surface RT in john lewis, loaded it into MS office fine, no lag, nothing broken. Then on top of that, all RT tablets have office pre installed already, iPad its a seperate purchase. Same for windows 8 admittedly, but at least on windows 8 there are incredibly good free alternatives which are all fully fledged yet run fine on the atom processors of the CHEAPER tablets.
USB mass storage even on jailbroken iPads is buggy, its a native feature in Windows (for storage one can assume RT and 8 to be the same thing, as they do use the same feature set on this front). Windows supports more file systems, try using an NTFS drive on your iPad, or even on OSX for that matter, OSX has read only support, iPad apparently is hit and miss for that. You have to jailbreak which most users appear incompetent enough to not be able to do. Windows you get support for various forms of network storage too. Windows 8 you get FTP etc, with jailbreaks that is available on RT although not everyone wants to jailbreak (although those that need FTP are probably capable of jailbreaking). You get a normal file system presented on desktop, with apps in Start too, a proper file system, excellent, even android has that.
You will find that most establishments (including medical and educational, I know people from both backgrounds) who are migrating to iPads from existing windows solutions already have software for windows devices. Well, newsflash, a full windows 8 tablet will run these systems no porting required. But this is a hugely irrelevant point as we are not discussing the medical profession. In most cases these businesses are having to write their new shiny iPad apps from scratch, well if they are writing new software anyway they can just as easily write it for android or windows Start, so that further nullifies your point.
And no, a Asus vivotab smart costs less than an iPad. And does what needs to be done. Photoshop, devil may cry and call of duty were not on the criteria list, he said note taking and that he specifically is not gaming. Another newsflash, photoshop actually runs on the atom surprisingly well, sure your not going to be editing 500 megapixel images and applying 42 filters to it and having them done in 1 second, but quickly touching up the contrast on a 5mp phone photo is well within its abilities, more than that is but thats another null point as thats not a criteria so it doesnt matter.
I understand you want to defend your over-priced purchase but if your going to slate a windows tablet, use actual or relevant facts.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I actually don't have an iPad. My mom, however does have an iPad that was given to her by her work.
The Asus vivopad does not have a digitizer (which you were saying is a big plus on Win8 tabs) And according to a review I just read, it lags once a few apps are open so I doubt a resource hungry application like Photoshop will even run on it. I believe the comment about gaming and Photoshop were in response to someone else.
But the problem is that the medical companies aren't moving to Android because of security issues, build quality, and reliability.
USB mass storage works fine on the iPad. My mom uses it to type her papers. (A lot of which are well over 130 pages) Also I was not talking about you when I mentioned university. I assumed that the person I originally asked to consider an iPad was moving on to higher education. There are printing apps that allow you to print to almost every printer as well as accessories for USB only printers.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD
So going back to the original question and ignoring iPads...
I would say that you should wait for Haswell. It's literally right around the corner and you will get much better performance than Atom currently offers with the same, if not better, battery life. Also keep in mind that Intel just announced that Atom will be released with the newest architecture AFTER Haswell, meaning that the current generation is already very obsolete.
needspractice said:
I was wondering if anyone knew of the latest or best phone that has the greatest ROM rooting following at the moment greater than the Galaxy Nexus?
I have a Galaxy Nexus right now and its great but I am just bored with it. I would like to upgrade. The only problem is that I use [GNEX TOOLKIT V11.1.0] Drivers, Backup, Unlock, Root, Recovery, Flash + MORE [SPRINT] which is the best tool around.
I was wondering if there are tools like this or better for other newer phones that I may upgrade to or should I just stay with my Nexus for while?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm wondering: WHY THE HELL ARE YOU ASKING IN THIS THREAD.
I have to start by saying I've been a long time Windows guy. I've had many tablet PC's and liked the ability to use a stylus for both ink notes and ink to text. However, tablet PC's were always too heavy for real portable use. I've never been a fan of Apple products and really have considered the iPad more of a toy than a business machine.
When I first saw the Galaxy Note 10.1 I figured this was what I had been waiting and for. I like many features of the Note. Particularly the ability to take ink notes with LectureNotes. However, after using Android for a full year, I realize there are many shortcomings if you are trying to use as your main portable computer. I use all the Microsoft Office products and Android just falls short on all of them. So I tried using Remote Desktop to simulate Windows. However, all the apps I found are glitchy.
I stopped in my local Windows Store and discovered Windows 8 has pretty much all the capabilities I need. I tried the Surface Pro but found it to be too heavy, runs hot and is loud. Then I discovered Samsung makes a series called ATIV Tab 5 or 500T. I bought one from a store that gives a 15 day return trial. This thing is really cool. It has built in USB and HDMI ports, has an 11.5" screen, is light, runs fast yet stays cool. I can do all my Office stuff plus load full programs, which is a huge plus. The HDMI port allows connection to a monitor and Windows 8 has the built in ability for dual screens. This ends up being a full blown computer when I need it to be!
I'm not sure that I understand the huge angst for Windows 8. So far I think it is fast and I just got the 8.1 update, which is supposed to make it faster.
Long story short - after trying the Android for a year I found it just isn't capable enough as a work computer. Try the Samsung 500T, I think you'll like it.
The 500T is excellent but Windows 8 lacks the integration with Android phones (Note II, and I have had a Windows phone and felt trapped) as well as many of the customization options that are available on Android. Plus I prefer native Google Maps and search to Bing.
But yeah I mean if you need a full OS it's a good way to go and Samsung has made it compatible with things like S-Note.
Sent from my SCH-I605 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
i to have been considering the switch. ..as really i need the desktop option for power point and you can also use bluestacks for Android apps on w8
recently been scouting the pro 2, but also lookef at some of asus offerings and Samsung as well including the ones yo mentioned
battery still concerns me so i may keep my note for those long plane rides, but the multi tasking on windows 8 i feel brings something great to the table
just waiting to se what option is best for me
Sent from my SGH-T889 using xda app-developers app
The surface pro 2 is looking good to me. Having a tablet and a laptop in one, 8gb of ram lots of storage, usb 3.0. Being able to use lightroom, photoshop and other full software would be great. This tablet is great and for the price I paid well worth it but I need more. I'm gonna sell this and probably go for the new surface or an ativ with my Christmas bonus.
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Mr. bird said:
The surface pro 2 is looking good to me. Having a tablet and a laptop in one, 8gb of ram lots of storage, usb 3.0. Being able to use lightroom, photoshop and other full software would be great. This tablet is great and for the price I paid well worth it but I need more. I'm gonna sell this and probably go for the new surface or an ativ with my Christmas bonus.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using xda app-developers app
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Click to collapse
You can even use usb 3.0 external hard drives on pro 2, they are sweet but very pricey also.
I picked up a Dell Latitude 10 from the outlet store for £250 iirc to do an experiment in Windows tablets (couldn't justify the cost of a Surface Pro) and I must say, having used it for a couple of months now I love having a fully fledged OS on a tablet. The version I got came with the 4 cell battery which gets me over 18 (YES I did say 18) hours of productive use. When used as a laptop/desktop replacement I get over two days between charges, if I use the productivity dock you can double that easily. In real world terms, one charge can last a week depending on what you are doing. Using the Note in the same way I'd need to charge it daily.
I still use the Note 10.1 but more as a secondary/backup/internet device. The weirdest thing I've found since going over to a Win 8 tablet is how it has sentenced my desktop AND laptop to the dust bowl with only the latter getting out for the odd gaming session.
As a predominately Linux user (mainly used windows for gaming) I think what Microsoft have done with Windows 8 is genius and I am one of those weirdos that actually love the simplicity of Metro for basic things and desktop mode for everything else. I would love to be able to switch between Linux and Win 8 like I'm used to, but tbh I have not missed using Linux too much since getting it.
whats a good priced win8 tablet with pen and good battery life
also keyboard would be nice that has a battery
Sent from my SGH-T889 using xda app-developers app
I like the 500T but do not like that you cannot use the pen to navigate around (webpages etc).
Touchwiz has alot of nice touches with the s-pen and mobile use.
Only thing need Win8 for is MS office. Android options are garbage. tied of professors getting mad about sloppy formating.
Once MS puts office out for Android(if ever) then no point.
But Samsung will soon have Dual boot with WinRT...though I was shocked the 500T has full Win 8.
I heard the Tab3 is garbage tho..
nymviper1126 said:
I like the 500T but do not like that you cannot use the pen to navigate around (webpages etc).
Touchwiz has alot of nice touches with the s-pen and mobile use.
Only thing need Win8 for is MS office. Android options are garbage. tied of professors getting mad about sloppy formating.
Once MS puts office out for Android(if ever) then no point.
But Samsung will soon have Dual boot with WinRT...though I was shocked the 500T has full Win 8.
I heard the Tab3 is garbage tho..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
agreed..really need ms office more importantly in the enterprise sector...still dont get why the dont offer the surface pro for 500
On the other hand I switch to Android from Windows 8 tablet!
Windows 8 tablets are:
Top slow, terribly slow on multitasking
Still don't have multiwindow
Touch response is just not as good as note 10
Battery life is just out of any discussion.! More powerful the tablet, less battery it has, means the worst usage, per to pocket. ?
No real mobile applications, keep on the browser alive and you will end up with even worst battery
Keyboard is just from primitive ages. ?, don't mention about the swipe...But you can be a dreamer. ?.
Pen calibration issue all the time forever. ?.
Gogogo ms soon will be really micro! Company...With overpriced products that just can't make it
And please stop that productivity thingies, w8 tablets are just in stage of touch enabled net books, and no you can not make anything on Netbook Eexcept editing office docs and being fun of ms office... Because others out there so the same thing, On THE GO
?.All those written by note 10.1, used for business purposes, by swyping, just on a cafe table. ..
you know i actually had this same reasins for not switching ...but the bluestacks came along and i have all the the tablet apps i need and google stuff plus a full desktop to book
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karaern said:
On the other hand I switch to Android from Windows 8 tablet!
Windows 8 tablets are:
Top slow, terribly slow on multitasking
Still don't have multiwindow
Touch response is just not as good as note 10
Battery life is just out of any discussion.! More powerful the tablet, less battery it has, means the worst usage, per to pocket. ?
No real mobile applications, keep on the browser alive and you will end up with even worst battery
Keyboard is just from primitive ages. ?, don't mention about the swipe...But you can be a dreamer. ?.
Pen calibration issue all the time forever. ?.
Gogogo ms soon will be really micro! Company...With overpriced products that just can't make it
And please stop that productivity thingies, w8 tablets are just in stage of touch enabled net books, and no you can not make anything on Netbook Eexcept editing office docs and being fun of ms office... Because others out there so the same thing, On THE GO
?.All those written by note 10.1, used for business purposes, by swyping, just on a cafe table. ..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Old windows 8 tablets are crap. New ones (depending on what) aren't bad at all. Im actually now looking at the lenovo yoga 2. 13in screen, i7 processor, 8gb ram amd 256gb ssd usb 3.0. Full windows 8 so I can use lightroom and photoshop. Battery life is decent. Good enough for me. I don't need all the android apps. I need full programs. I have my phome for the little android apps.
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I've been considering switching from my note tablet to a surface tablet. I really like Windows 8 and as someone who has been using computing devices since the mid 1980's , I just want one device to rule them all. I love my note, it is a great device. But it doesn't have one note. I really like the s-note program, but onenote is far superior.
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I'll tell you this, we still need windows 8 tablets. Unfortunately Microsoft having been to late to understand the mobile trend acted slowly. The 2 giants Microsoft and Intel dominated the world for 20 years, but both giants are now having difficulties in adapting.MS could have adapted its phone OS to a simple tablet, but waited to release the RT. I own a smartphone (Note2) which I use when I am on the road. At office I depend on my GN 10.1. Since I love technology I constantly change devices. Nevertheless last february I started with Vaio Duo 11 which I returned in a week, got a Samsung XE700T, which I sold to a friend in two months. I was a bit confused and about windows 8 and the tablets had not been matured... until Haswell. Now I am also a proud owner of a Vaio Duo 13 which I love. I am not using my GN 10.1. It just sits there on the table. After 8.1 update and the recent wifi driver update Duo 13 has been my first choice in mobility. With 8 gig RAM, 256 gig SSD and a i7 processor... I think we will see more windows tablets, hybrids in the future. I am an Android fan, but seriously they are just toys and gadgets.
peare said:
I'll tell you this, we still need windows 8 tablets. Unfortunately Microsoft having been to late to understand the mobile trend acted slowly. The 2 giants Microsoft and Intel dominated the world for 20 years, but both giants are now having difficulties in adapting.MS could have adapted its phone OS to a simple tablet, but waited to release the RT. I own a smartphone (Note2) which I use when I am on the road. At office I depend on my GN 10.1. Since I love technology I constantly change devices. Nevertheless last february I started with Vaio Duo 11 which I returned in a week, got a Samsung XE700T, which I sold to a friend in two months. I was a bit confused and about windows 8 and the tablets had not been matured... until Haswell. Now I am also a proud owner of a Vaio Duo 13 which I love. I am not using my GN 10.1. It just sits there on the table. After 8.1 update and the recent wifi driver update Duo 13 has been my first choice in mobility. With 8 gig RAM, 256 gig SSD and a i7 processor... I think we will see more windows tablets, hybrids in the future. I am an Android fan, but seriously they are just toys and gadgets.
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Probably will have just Several hours of real usage time and Soon I count the time that ms Will be a history as the term→ pre-pc era! Shall be said pre-mS era
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karaern said:
Probably will have just Several hours of real usage time and Soon I count the time that ms Will be a history as the term→ pre-pc era! Shall be said pre-mS era
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Not really. Standby time of Vaio Duo 13 is quite good, not as good as Ipad or GN 10.1, but 10+ hours of continuous usage, near 2 days standby getting e-mails or social media updates.
As for MS... Gates is only good at marketing. In mid 90's he said multimedia was not important, later he didnt care about Internet, but every time he made a comeback. We know that there is a huge decrease in desktop and laptop sales lately, but this is also a great danger for the future of technology, unless portable devices would be capable of doing whatever those machines are doing. If PC market dies who will financially backup the future supercomputers? Are we going to send men on Mars relying on Ipads?
Although I make my living developing/building Android devices, I hope the Windows Tablet market remains viable as without competition you get stagnation, which isn't good for anyone.
peare said:
If PC market dies who will financially backup the future supercomputers? Are we going to send men on Mars relying on Ipads?
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No, but I suspect they'll be using more ARM chips (i.e., Android/iDevice) chips than x86 chips (PC/Surface) to do so as time goes on- your question will likely be more reality than fiction.
Temetka said:
I've been considering switching from my note tablet to a surface tablet. I really like Windows 8 and as someone who has been using computing devices since the mid 1980's , I just want one device to rule them all. I love my note, it is a great device. But it doesn't have one note. I really like the s-note program, but onenote is far superior.
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Yes it does. I use One Note on all my devices. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.microsoft.office.onenote&hl=en :good:
Hi.
As a Note 3 users I've been thinking of getting the LTE version of the Note 10.1 2014 for some time now, but waited for a good deal. Next week MediaMarkt here in the Netherlands is having their anual 21% of everything. Here the Lte version costs about 720 euro. Now I've been thinking of the surface pro which is in the 800+ euro category. Especially since its faster, runs full desktop apps. On the other hand its thick and battery doesnt last long.
I also have a series 7 chronos laptop.
What do you guys recommend?
blue13x said:
Hi.
As a Note 3 users I've been thinking of getting the LTE version of the Note 10.1 2014 for some time now, but waited for a good deal. Next week MediaMarkt here in the Netherlands is having their anual 21% of everything. Here the Lte version costs about 720 euro. Now I've been thinking of the surface pro which is in the 800+ euro category. Especially since its faster, runs full desktop apps. On the other hand its thick and battery doesnt last long.
I also have a series 7 chronos laptop.
What do you guys recommend?
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Had the same problem as you currently got. I went for the Note 10.1.14 because I got the Note 3 and both are the perfect couple. However, I missing being able to run my desktop apps whilst on the road so now I have decided im going to purchase the SP2 & keep the note which will give me the best of both worlds.
The problem you got is what ever one you choose you will always find a reason why you should have chosen the other one.
Surface (and all their ilk) are pretty crappy entertainment devices compared to Android (and iOS). It also weighs 2 pounds without its paraphernalia. It's also as big as a house.
I have a 13" laptop which I tote around when I'm going to be on the road for a while or if I know I'm going to be doing a lot of productivity work like document creation; especially Excel and PPT. You can't do heavy productivity work on anything less than a 13" display IMHO (the Surface Pro 2 is 10.6") The N10.1-14's powerful enough that I can leave my laptop home quite a bit of the time and use RDP and faux-Office to meet my light productivity needs (editing and reviewing). It's also a fantastic entertainment and media device. Mine's 3G so it's always connected which is invaluable when traveling. The Surface(s) to me aren't great as laptop replacements and their entertainment capabilities are at best acceptable. I don't consider going in to the non-Modern interface and accessing entertainment via native IE a good media experience or a replacement for the simplicity of multiple dedicated media apps in Android. I have IE on my laptop. Maybe someday Windows tablets will evolve so that they're better all-round tablets and less biased toward the utilization of (captive) MS products like Office. Until then I'm fine with my two device (laptop/Android tablet) set-up and each fulfill their missions fine (at least for me).
P.S. - Samsung calling their high end tablets "Pro" and loading them up with productivity s/w isn't going to change the fact Android's as bad at productivity as Windows tablets are at entertainment.
Just my opinion, people should buy what makes them happy.
If you are going to be taking a lot of notes and pen offset bothers you then I would say go for the note. Every surface 2 pro that I've come across has had some offset on the stylus, and it gets pretty bad at the edges.
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I pondered this for awhile. I've been on android since mytouch3g and have a couple hundred dollars tied into premium software. Since I can use team viewer to access my laptop from my android device, I don't need a Windows tablet.
I also own an iPad. I bought it to help troubleshoot clients who couldn't figure out how to get "the only device that requires no manual" on a network. That quote was by Black Eyed Peas, fyi. I only used my Apple slab for magazine reading now. My note 10.1 2014 is much more user friendly and again I don't have to buy all my apps again.
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Note
For a tablet I'd rather have android. I have a thinkpad for when I want portable windows - and I'd much rather run Windows 7 than 8 on a tablet if I am trying to write. The Note is nice for reviewing and .pdf mark-up.
Me, as a developer who is living on "Microsoft World" I definetly prefere surface pro 2 because it is i5 intel laptop without a keyboard not tablet
Having note 3 and note 10.1 at the same time is like, eating two sizes of hamburgers on the same meal which both tastes same. If you are fanatic about hamburgers it's ok but for extending posibilities, I would recommend surface pro 2 or maybe just surface 2 or lumia 2520.
As a s4 user, I just bought note 10.1 for everyday use (I could not buy surface or lumia because they are not on market at my region) and planning to exchange my s4 with a Windows mobile now.
It is my opinion for nonuniformity...
Here's what I've arrived at, as a sort of a hiearchy of usage when mobile.
1. When I am just going to the shops etc - Note 2, phone only
2. When I expect to be doing little work if any but want to browse etc - Note 10.1-2014
3. When I expect to do some work but not a lot - Note 10.1-2014
4. When I expect to do a moderate amount of work - Note 10.1-2014 plus MS Wedge KB and Mouse
5. When I expect to do a ton of work - HP Envy 14.
I have Andropen Office and various other Office substitutes on the Note 10.1-2014. I also have RDP to a virtual machine on my server at home. This gives me a full Windows experience when that is crucial, for example creating a clean new .docx document in "real" MS Word. RDP works really well on this tablet. It is like using a windows machine, but with some slowness as it's remote.
I have to tell you that the MS Wedge KB and mouse, plus the Note 10.1-2014, is a fricking awesome looking combo. They look like they were made to go together. It is such a fine looking set-up to have on a desk, and it is also very pleasant to use and incredibly portable.
I considered a Surface Pro 2 but it's too expensive, not portable enough, and not, for me, necessary. And it is a Windows 8 device, which basically makes it a steaming pile of [email protected] no matter how you look at it. If I didn't also have an okay laptop maybe it would be a candidate. But honestly, the occasions when I will get out my laptop now are getting very infrequent. The 10.1 tablet is far nicer and just as practical 99% of the time.
Jason
Decided im going for the Note 10.1 2014. The Surface pro is superior, but its too large and battery life just isnt as good.
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On the other hand...the surface pro 2 is superior when it vomes to power and performance. basically full windows app. Its more for people that dont have a laptop. As a side device the note for me is better.
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This question has been in my head for a few months now. My Asus Transformer Prime (3G) just isn't as good as it used to be. I did wipe it and it's better but still sluggish. I have had many Samsung phones, currently the S4 Google Edition so I like Samsung products. As a business owner and software developer the surface Pro makes sense but the batter ife and bulk just don't make sens to me. The biggest hurdle either way is getting one in 3G or 4G for my ATT plan. Fortunately I have enough time to decide because my current tablet is still working.
Edit - Or I suppose I could be the geek that I am and use my phone as a hot spot when I need to......
It depends on the majority of how you are going to use it. The sp2 is more of a laptop replacement in a form of a tablet. It's not as comfortable to hold and easy to operate as an android tablet. If you just want to surf the Web on the couch and be able to entertain yourself on the go then get the note. If you are looking for a laptop replacement that you can do work on then the sp2 is a beast. It is actually a full functioning computer with windows. You can install any program on there that you can on your home
Pc. Few cons are the weight, thickness, and battery life. Also there aren't as many apps as Google play store. And using regular windows with your fingers is sometimes a hassle unless i connect a mouse because everything is small with the high resolution. I had the type cover keyboard but the mouse pad on there is too small. So lot of times I would just take out my phone and click on app instead of dealing with that.
I ended up returning the sp2 because I noticed I wasn't using it that much. Also because of the size and weight it was not that comfortable using it for simple things that I can comfortably do on my note 3. I exchanged the sp2 for a note 10.1 and I'm using the note 10.1 much more than I was the sp2. I just like to browse the Web on the couch and simple stuff. If I need to use a Pc I just hop on my desktop with much bigger monitor. The thing that bugs me most about the note 10.1 is the lag that everyone talks about. I'm still contemplating on whether I should return this and try something else. Either that or wait for note pro 12.2. Kind of disappointed that it's going to have the same specs though.
So I think it just depends on what, where and how you'll be using the tablet. I've read the sp2 is very useful for people that work in the IT industry. But if your just like me and use the tablet for mostly entertainment then note 10.1 would be a better choice.
Hope this helps and good luck on your decision. They are both good devices with different pros and cons.
Guys im going to purchase the SP2 and was wonder how it runs to the version with only 2GB of ram? I don't really need the 128GB drive version but if it runs better on 4GB of ram then I guess its worth spending that extra money
Thanks
fyew-jit-tiv said:
Guys im going to purchase the SP2 and was wonder how it runs to the version with only 2GB of ram? I don't really need the 128GB drive version but if it runs better on 4GB of ram then I guess its worth spending that extra money
Thanks
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You might get more perspective if you ask that in a SP2 forum.
I believe the 64 gb and 128 gb come with 4 gb of ram and the 256 gb and 512 gb version come with 8 gb of ram. Both are enough for most things. If you use lot of memory intensive apps then go with the 8 gb. How many gb of ram do you have on your desktop/laptop you are using now?
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sgvnut said:
It depends on the majority of how you are going to use it. The sp2 is more of a laptop replacement in a form of a tablet. It's not as comfortable to hold and easy to operate as an android tablet. If you just want to surf the Web on the couch and be able to entertain yourself on the go then get the note. If you are looking for a laptop replacement that you can do work on then the sp2 is a beast. It is actually a full functioning computer with windows. You can install any program on there that you can on your home
Pc. Few cons are the weight, thickness, and battery life. Also there aren't as many apps as Google play store. And using regular windows with your fingers is sometimes a hassle unless i connect a mouse because everything is small with the high resolution. I had the type cover keyboard but the mouse pad on there is too small. So lot of times I would just take out my phone and click on app instead of dealing with that.
I ended up returning the sp2 because I noticed I wasn't using it that much. Also because of the size and weight it was not that comfortable using it for simple things that I can comfortably do on my note 3. I exchanged the sp2 for a note 10.1 and I'm using the note 10.1 much more than I was the sp2. I just like to browse the Web on the couch and simple stuff. If I need to use a Pc I just hop on my desktop with much bigger monitor. The thing that bugs me most about the note 10.1 is the lag that everyone talks about. I'm still contemplating on whether I should return this and try something else. Either that or wait for note pro 12.2. Kind of disappointed that it's going to have the same specs though.
So I think it just depends on what, where and how you'll be using the tablet. I've read the sp2 is very useful for people that work in the IT industry. But if your just like me and use the tablet for mostly entertainment then note 10.1 would be a better choice.
Hope this helps and good luck on your decision. They are both good devices with different pros and cons.
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Good points and that is part of the problem I have yet to decide. I prefer to use my transformer any time I can vs my laptop which I am on now. I run a meeting at least once a month and while I like typing on the laptop, I hate lugging it around. If i get a SP2 I can connect to my sky drive. If I get a note then I have to email and convert or paste to a new doc.
The lag worries me. I have a horrible lag in my transformer and at best it's good for reading and some light games.
I'm still leaning towards the Sammy just because I know to many people that have returned them. I'm familiar enough with Win 8 and while I'm not a fan, I can run it without issue.
I'll keep reading and pondering but I'm afraid I'll miss my android if I go SP2. (I have had the iPads in the past and left for Android).
Pure power yeah and desktop apps are true. But you need to weight your actual use for them. I use word for my business. I don't have to send it to anyone else (well rarely) and polaris is really awesome. If i really need to set the format straight I can just rpd to my desktop and check the format there. If it all looks well I can print straight from my tablet. I honestly rarely see any issues with polaris format. I think 99% of the time it gets it right. The only way I see word being necessary is if for you work or school you need some of the extra formatting ability in it. But even then I don't see it as a big hurdle. Really other than that I rarely ever use my desktop. I go to it when I need odin or something similar.I live on my note 2014
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I currently use (daily):
Galaxy S4 (rooted, adblocked) + Galaxy Gear (stock); Primary mobile phone
Galaxy Note 3 (rooted, adblocked); Quick notes (using 'write' which saves the note in html, available on Google Play), email, occasional gaming
Microsoft Surface Pro 2 8GB/512GB; daily work (I get about 8 hours without trying to conserve battery power).
All are reliable. I do want an android tablet, and normally I don't mind bloatware (Microsoft is calling it JUNKWARE lol!) as long as the 'disable' function has not been locked out.
The KNOX function is an annoyance. I would never use it in any of my managed SMB environments. If you want real control and security, provide a device and don't let people use their own.
Samsung has been getting more and more into skeezy information gathering practices and not cooperating with regards to disclosure.
Example: On my S4, I can disable WatchON. On the Note 3, the disable function is locked out, and the latest update for WatchON wants to be able to send SMS text messages. Hundreds of people are asking why, yet Samsung's response is always "please register on our site, agree to the privacy terms, and submit a support request". I would like to know who the moron is at Samsung that actually signed off on this thief-like untrustworthy tactic thinking it was a good idea.
Every manufacturer that provides a locked down, modified version of Android should be FORCED into ALSO providing the option to have the OS in its unaltered form, based on the users' preference.
The Junkware lock-in is the only reason I won't be purchasing a Note 10.1 and also why corporate users I deal with will be offered only pure Android devices.
I apologize in advance if my blunt comments hurts any feelings, but come on... it's 2014. Get with the times already! (I know... pipe dreams...)
RDA3440 said:
Get with the times already! (I know... pipe dreams...)
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Your post is pretty naïve and a bit out of touch with the direction corporate IT is going toward both mobile security and BYOD. I take it you're a consultant of some type. Your position(s) wouldn't allow you to be taken seriously by the three Fortune 100 companies whose five highly managed networks I connect to (with my own devices). Three out of those five networks are now reading the KNOX flag to validate incoming network connection requests and one of the three companies has limited Android BYOD to "Samsung devices only" running 4.3 or higher (KNOX-equipped). Just some food for thought.
BarryH_GEG said:
Your post is pretty naïve and a bit out of touch with the direction corporate IT is going toward both mobile security and BYOD. I take it you're a consultant of some type. Your position(s) wouldn't allow you to be taken seriously by the three Fortune 100 companies whose five highly managed networks I connect to (with my own devices). Three out of those five networks are now reading the KNOX flag to validate incoming network connection requests and one of the three companies has limited Android BYOD to "Samsung devices only" running 4.3 or higher (KNOX-equipped). Just some food for thought.
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Possibly - but I'm thinking more along the lines of SMB's - 100's of users vs. 1000's. I should have clarified but thanks for that input - it's always good to hear alternative opinions.