From a Galaxy s user, I have been avoiding iphone for a very long time. However, one things worries me.:
with so many android's OS, different hardware specs and semi-chaotic andriod's app market (good apps, bad apps etc). Will applications and games on andriod ever going to be as good as the Iphone?
Yes, at the rate Android is growing the money/user base will be big enough to attract game makers.
Here is some news on it. http://www.androidguys.com/2010/07/08/android-gaming-boost-openfeint-solution/
No. Android is too fragmented and advances too quickly for it to be worthwhile for developers to make great games for it.
Now that's just nonsense.
There's exactly one processor platform which android runs on- ARM,
and two GPU platforms- Qualcomm adreno, and PowerVR SGX.
Other than that, it doesn't matter how different the devices are. The only "fragmantation" android has is two different gpu platforms.
Andoid already has some nice games from Gameloft, polarbit, hyperdevbox, and lately even EA is starting to drop in.
Given that serious and balanced android devices only exist for about a year or a year and a half (motorola droid mostly) and the iphone platform exists already 3 years...
I'd give it some more time before i reach any conclusions.
At the moment, Android (both the market and device distribution) is growing in an increasing rate, and reached an impressive pace.
As it becomes more and more popular, more developers will see potential profit in it, and we'll see more quality apps.
Pika007 said:
Now that's just nonsense.
There's exactly one processor platform which android runs on- ARM,
and two GPU platforms- Qualcomm adreno, and PowerVR SGX.
Other than that, it doesn't matter how different the devices are. The only "fragmantation" android has is two different gpu platforms.
Andoid already has some nice games from Gameloft, polarbit, hyperdevbox, and lately even EA is starting to drop in.
Given that serious and balanced android devices only exist for about a year or a year and a half (motorola droid mostly) and the iphone platform exists already 3 years...
I'd give it some more time before i reach any conclusions.
At the moment, Android (both the market and device distribution) is growing in an increasing rate, and reached an impressive pace.
As it becomes more and more popular, more developers will see potential profit in it, and we'll see more quality apps.
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+1
I agree completely. Going to take some time.
But why WOULDN'T a game developer want to release "multi-platform" mobile games. More of a market for consumers to purchase their game...plus with better and better screens/processors coming out for the Android phones, there's an obvious market there, just need for Android to build up a consumer base.
Pika007 said:
Now that's just nonsense.
There's exactly one processor platform which android runs on- ARM,
and two GPU platforms- Qualcomm adreno, and PowerVR SGX.
Other than that, it doesn't matter how different the devices are. The only "fragmantation" android has is two different gpu platforms.
Andoid already has some nice games from Gameloft, polarbit, hyperdevbox, and lately even EA is starting to drop in.
Given that serious and balanced android devices only exist for about a year or a year and a half (motorola droid mostly) and the iphone platform exists already 3 years...
I'd give it some more time before i reach any conclusions.
At the moment, Android (both the market and device distribution) is growing in an increasing rate, and reached an impressive pace.
As it becomes more and more popular, more developers will see potential profit in it, and we'll see more quality apps.
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Agreed. And in addition, Google has stated that after 2.2 there won't be drastic changes to the underlying OS on the next update. 3.0/Gingerbread will focus on the user experience/UI. This gives developers time to focus on a stable OS and not worry about OS changes coming down the road.
Related
Just a curiosity: Apple uses exactly the same processor as the Galaxy S in the newest iPhone!
Indeed. The processor was jointly developed by Samsung and Intrinsity (who was later acquired by Apple). So in some ways you get the power of an iPhone 4 with the freedom of Android. Sounds like a win to me.
Except we have a better GPU than the A4. SGX 540 compared to the SGX535.
Yes the samsung has the sgx540 which is twice as fast as the 53x series but the A4 has vxd375 piggybacked, so i dont know if that will have an impact, maybe on the video capabilities of the a4.
......and a bigger screen!
....and we have XDA Developers ^^
iPhone 4 Killer
We all most probably (being on xda) see the android OS as far superior to what is now called the iOS4, for many reasons such as;
- True multitasking
- FULL customization (after 3 years finally being able to change wallpapers is a joke)
- Wide variety of free + good quality apps
- MUCH greater out of the box functionality (they have to 'jailbreak' to do anything useful)
But the iPhone 3gs' spec has been ahead of all android phones so far, even with its slower proccessor it had the advantage of doing 1 proccess at a time to ease the work load, and a VERY high quality GPU compared to the adreno GPU's build into the qualcomm proccessor. However finally someone has developed a android phone with amazing hardware, although unfortunatly samsung, this is deffinitly the phone to show the iPhone users what android is capable of, and for that reason alone i will buy it .
bratfink said:
We all most probably (being on xda) see the android OS as far superior to what is now called the iOS4, for many reasons such as;
- True multitasking
- FULL customization (after 3 years finally being able to change wallpapers is a joke)
- Wide variety of free + good quality apps
- MUCH greater out of the box functionality (they have to 'jailbreak' to do anything useful)
But the iPhone 3gs' spec has been ahead of all android phones so far, even with its slower proccessor it had the advantage of doing 1 proccess at a time to ease the work load, and a VERY high quality GPU compared to the adreno GPU's build into the qualcomm proccessor. However finally someone has developed a android phone with amazing hardware, although unfortunatly samsung, this is deffinitly the phone to show the iPhone users what android is capable of, and for that reason alone i will buy it .
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Totally agree... THANKS!!!!
A4 is only copy of Samsung Hummingbird
release date of Hummingbird : jule 2009
release date of A4: january 2010
A4 have "only" PowerVR 535 gpu, Hummingbird have 2-3x better PowerVR 540
bratfink said:
We all most probably (being on xda) see the android OS as far superior to what is now called the iOS4, for many reasons such as;
- True multitasking
- FULL customization (after 3 years finally being able to change wallpapers is a joke)
- Wide variety of free + good quality apps
- MUCH greater out of the box functionality (they have to 'jailbreak' to do anything useful)
But the iPhone 3gs' spec has been ahead of all android phones so far, even with its slower proccessor it had the advantage of doing 1 proccess at a time to ease the work load, and a VERY high quality GPU compared to the adreno GPU's build into the qualcomm proccessor. However finally someone has developed a android phone with amazing hardware, although unfortunatly samsung, this is deffinitly the phone to show the iPhone users what android is capable of, and for that reason alone i will buy it .
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Amen to that
not that i'd want to, but i wonder if we'll see iOS hacked on the galaxy s at some point. android has already been hacked onto the iphone.
the A4 has a slightly smaller Level 2 Cache than our processor in the galaxy s...
A4: 512KB L2-Cache
Samsung: 640KB L2-Cache
Does it really matter? The iPhone 4 is going to be smoother to use no matter what.
Pre-ordered a Galaxy S today btw. Have grown tired of WM and my HD2. Still it won't be released before July here so there's still some waiting to be done.
Ben74 said:
not that i'd want to, but i wonder if we'll see iOS hacked on the galaxy s at some point. android has already been hacked onto the iphone.
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it´s impossible because iOS is closed system with driver for only narrow hardware
android is open source with many drivers for many hardware, it´s similar port it to any phone
According to Microsoft QSD8250 is the chipset. Now how bad is it? I see people are saying it'd be better than HD2 since it'll have the perfect drivers from MS, but still wonder how this compare with the phone I am planning to get, Captivate, or an iPhone 4.
What prompted MS to choose this over so many newer (and possibly better) options?
rexian said:
What prompted MS to choose this over so many newer (and possibly better) options?
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My guess: WP7 has been in development for quite some time, so at the start of development they choose the top processor that was available. But I think that this forum focuses to much on the processor and specifications, because in the end, the whole package must be convincing and that includes the operating system that has been optimized for this processor.
Furthermore, the current specifications will be the lowest common denominator for quiet some time (perhaps until WP8) and all apps will be optimized to run satisfactory on this specification (AFAIK the 20 second start-up rule for apps will be measured with the current specification). Newer processors may speed some things up, but the current hardware will be the target platform...
The development must have started before this chipset was launched, but you are right - this was most likely the target platform.
There are not many 3D games available though, the basic working will be fluid I know when I check at the store in few days. My worries are about the 3D games that will be launched later. If the experience with those is not as good as other platforms, MS will be in trouble. Better hardware will fix the issue in future but the reputation will be ruined and be stuck for a while.
Captivate is more powerful, mainly due to its GPU being about 4 times more powerful than the qsd8250s adreno200 gpu. Though, all WP7 devices will have better looking games since Captivate runs android... And everyone knows android games look crap, no matter how how powerful the hardware is (due to devs having to make their devices run on low end hardware to get more sales)
The IP4 is a better comparison because it's hardware and software have been fully engineered to run along each other, very much like WP7 devices. While it does have a more powerful GPU compared with the QSD, there wouldn't be much difference; the adreno 200 pushes about 22million triangles per sec, where as the sgx535 pushes about 28million triangles per sec. Whether developers even use all those polygons, I'm not sure I've seen.
Though epic citadel on iOS as well as this upcoming game called Aralon sure looks good.
Aralon link: http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2010/10/oh-man-aralon-for-ios-is-gonna-be-good/
Thanks Cruzer. Now it makes sense. 22 mil vs 28 mil is not a big difference. Were they running at the same clock-speed? I hear A4 processor in iPhone 4 runs at ~800MHz, so may be they both perform in a similar manner.
Not sure how much the GPU is affected by the CPU. I think it's more to do about the speed of the actual GPU, but don't take me on that quote lol.
I have a Captivate and an iPhone 4. Im getting rid of both of them to get a HD7 or Focus. The iphone works flawlessly and isnt buggy in the slightest bit, the captivate is very choppy and i couldnt take it after a while with the lagging even after i upgraded to froyo. I would go with wp7 to be different and because it looks fun even if it uses an older processor. The hummingbird and A4 are both top of the line and its going to be hard to compete especially with each having a different os.
Writing this from my iphone 4
Just wondering what would it take to run xbox 360 games or ps3 on future android devices more CPU ram or a fan? The way I see us going with high end devices even with quad core coming up, is this far away to achieve?
sent from my Motorola XOOM
Well, rumor is that the NGP can pretty much run PS3 games albeit at a lower resolution. I'm guessing that by 2012 Tegra 3 tablets and the iPad 3 will be on par with PS3/360 level graphics.
That processor in gaming consoles are much more powerful not to mention all they do is run the game.
It'll be years before the mobile processors catch up, mainly because of the power requirements
Sent from Motorola Atrix on TELUS.
mafiaboy01 said:
That processor in gaming consoles are much more powerful not to mention all they do is run the game.
It'll be years before the mobile processors catch up, mainly because of the power requirements
Sent from Motorola Atrix on TELUS.
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+1 check out games like crysis 2. This game basically requires the latest CPU/gpu for best graphics on a PC and the ps3/360 version of this game basically looks just as good. The components of these game consoles are very specialized and it would take many years before mobile hardware could emulate them with similar performance
Well I was expecting that I can wait 3 years for halo
sent from my Motorola XOOM
Vanhoud said:
+1 check out games like crysis 2. This game basically requires the latest CPU/gpu for best graphics on a PC and the ps3/360 version of this game basically looks just as good. The components of these game consoles are very specialized and it would take many years before mobile hardware could emulate them with similar performance
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I would have to disagree with it looking as good as the PC version with full settings.
Also, he wasn't talking about emulation.
TBH, in 2-4 years I could see a dedicated (RISC) mobile gaming device that can run things on par with XB360. Look at the original PSP, it looks better than PS1.
Like others have mentioned, we won't have to wait too long as technological advancements are made by leaps and bounds on a daily basis (not yearly or monthly). What we have in our consumer products are several generations behind what the government has, and there is a trickle down effect.
I just got a Galaxy S II and now Samsung is gearing up for the Galaxy III powered by Exynos 4412 @ 1.5Ghz.
Sources:
http://pinoydroid.net/samsung-galaxy-iii-quadcore-smartphone-samsung-exynox-4412
http://androidandme.com/2011/11/new...-exynos-4412-could-power-samsung-galaxy-s-iii
http://www.devicemag.com/2011/11/22...e-powered-by-quad-core-exynos-4412-processor/
Come at me bro
That would be very nice. A little sad I couldn't upgrade to the GS II but I think I can shell out for a new phone next year and a quad core Galaxy S would fit the bill.
I kinda want a galaxy Nexus, I missed out on the N1 so I do want a pure google device but samsung just gets it so right. Can't wait to see what they do with ICS.
Sent from my GT - I9000M running Tornado JVR Gold with Tornado kernel.
wtf do we need a quad core phone for when very little use dual core. Now quad core on a tablet i can somewhat understand
Gonna stick with the SGS2, unless of course the SGS3 has improved everything in which case I'll get it on launch day..
Seems pointless to me.... quad core will b battery hungry and bare use both cores on gs2 lol. Meeeeh
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium
Overkill...
I this going to be the future of Android, constant hardware updates that totally outdo the previous model in a matter of months, its already a fragmented nightmare, coders cant cope with dual core, let along quad, to be honest I am getting fed up with the constant changing and new models all the time, getting ridiculous
na its for tablets. a dual A15 with A7 more likely.
THUDUK said:
I this going to be the future of Android, constant hardware updates that totally outdo the previous model in a matter of months, its already a fragmented nightmare, coders cant cope with dual core, let along quad, to be honest I am getting fed up with the constant changing and new models all the time, getting ridiculous
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Then don't upgrade! you forget the other millions who didnt update this year and will be looking at 2012 for the latest and greatest. Where is the sense in wanting an Apple like crawl in progression. Android gives companies like Samsung the freedom to concentrate on the hardware. It can only be a good thing for the consumer. What I take from your post is "WWAaaAaa my fones not the bestest anymore!!11!!"
androidkid311 said:
Seems pointless to me.... quad core will b battery hungry and bare use both cores on gs2 lol. Meeeeh
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium
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While I do agree that it is somewhat pointless at this point in time, it's a common misconception that newer CPUs = more power usage. By that logic, a Core i7 will consume more power than the Core 2 Quad, which it does not.
CPU manufacturers control power consumption in a number of ways. The most common is a die shrink, manufacturing the CPU at a smaller level. The Exynos is a 45nm chip, and the next generation is supposed to be 28nm. Thus, we can expect power consumption to stay the same, or even decrease.
The other way is through the use of core gating. The OS simply shuts off the cores that are not in use, and wakes them up when they are needed.
Hopefully this helps to clear up some of the misunderstandings regarding CPUs and power consumption.
quad core has already been stated to be more battery friendly and the tegra3 chips is very clever only using more cores when needed and even having a stealth 5th core for mega low idle speeds
obvously the exynos is not a tegra3 but i am sure samsung will do some clever stuff too
quad core will be awesome , i am happy with my dual core sgs2 so wont upgrade for a while ive also bought extras etc so its not worth upgrading for me , however that doesnt stop quad core from being gooooooooooood
have you seen the gfx power it will bring , the extra camera capabillities it allows the manufactuers to use , the speed that the browser will work , how smooth the ui transisitions and scrolling will be even when multi tasking , it also brings support for up to 2gb of ram which alone is great stuff everyone knows the only thing better then ram is more ram
i think if we want our mobile to be proper mobile computers connected to bluetooth keyboards and usb hardrives then linked up to hdmi or dlna while doing back ground tasks , followed by some high end intensive 3d gaming with a bluetooth pad over hdmi while still doing background tasks , encoding high quality media on the fly and editing it without having to wait an age for it to finalise then qua core is a great thing as is the way that tech is moving so fast
the only problem i can see is fragmentation as things move so quick
its got to make it hard for devs etc which in the long turn could damage the platform a bit , however i am sure it will come to the point it will smooth out and tech wont accelerate so fast , maybe? lol
nvidia have a road map and it shows that they will be releasing a new cpu/gpu combo each year for at least the next 3-4 years before they think we will be at mobile maximum potenial , so get ready for this tradition to carry on for a while yet
Sadly I think this fragmentation might become a very big problem in the future, and is one area where Apple is unfortunately right.
Look at PC Gaming. A lot of people buy PCs not knowing exactly what the PC they bought at capable of. When it fails to run Battlefield 3 at an acceptable framerate they are not going to be happy.
For us techies, it's easy to know that you need at least a GTX 560Ti or something, but for Joe Sixpack out there they obviously don't know these things.
I think perhaps Google should enforce some sort of system requirement rating system. Give it a number scale to make it simple. So maybe the SGS2 scores 9/10, and Contract Killer requires a phone with at least 7 to run smoothly. So Joe Sixpack who bought a Galaxy 3 GT-i5800 that scores a 3 doesn't get all pissed off.
Hope I'm making sense here.
Nah fragmentation will be fine. Pc is still the choice for gamers over Apple mac, not including consoles. Transfer that to mobile phones, and as long as the android mobiles become popular enough, games will be great for them. Everyone will just know they have to have a good mobile just like their pc.
I read somewhere it would feature the AMD's new 8 core bulldozer CPU with nVidias GTX 590 in SLI.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App
i dont really understand people complaining about fragmentation. Android isnt a phone, it isnt a manufacturer, its an operating system. Do people complain the laptop market is fragmented because some computers are on xp, vista or 7? Some are on faster processors than others? Did people ever complain that symbian updated on some phones but not others?
I just dont get it, Id rather new phones/tech come out than only one release every 18 months.
Who cares? My upgrade isn't due until 2013... When I will get the top of the line handset again. I'm sure that model will be usurped within 4-6 months too.
Maybe we should all keep our phones in their original packaging like toy collectors, so they can't contribute to the disastrous fragmentation issue.
The actual effect of this media-inspired phenomena on consumers is negligible.
LOL sorry - had to point out the galaxy s III still has an 8mp camera. =p
Almost sounded like the Samsung Nexus with the 5mp camera... ahaha.
Just kidding. The phone should be solid. =)
Samsung g3 will be have 1.8 ghz processor not 1.5 ghz and will be dual core
Sent from my GT-I9100
biffsmash said:
Pc is still the choice for gamers over Apple mac, not including consoles
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Android phones vs iPhone is basically like PC vs console since PC has a billion different hardware and software configs where as a console as 1 (There are a few iPhones but you generally only support the latest 2-3 versions).
I don't really use the N7 for gaming as I already own a high-end gaming computer, besides I find tablets kind of uncomfortable for serious gaming, but I keep finding games that don't run as smooth as they should because of the same reason: This game is not optimized for tegra 3. I can't help but wonder: Will they ever optimize games for tegra 3? And I mean generally, not just a couple of games.
As you ask for "generally" i.e. ALL future games, the answer will (with a probabilty of 87.4%) be: No, they won't.
I don't think you can ever have "serious gaming" on a touch screen. You need real controllers or a keyboard + mouse for that. I also don't think you're going to get your serious gaming on a device that has 1GB of ram and runs everything in a virtual machine. You've got the whole android OS running along side the game, so the game is having to share that piddly 1GB of ram.
Look at the minimum requirements for big PC games and then look at the resources available to games on this tablet. The nexus doesnt even have half the specs for the lowest recommended settings in far cry 3, dishonored, dark souls, most of the other games that showed up on the list when I googled for "popular PC games".
http://www.game-debate.com/games/index.php?g_id=3410&game=Dark Souls
http://www.game-debate.com/games/index.php?g_id=2186&game=Dishonored
http://www.game-debate.com/games/index.php?g_id=883&game=Far Cry 3
In most cases, I'd say developers won't take the time to optimize a game for a specific CPU. SoCs change about as often as you change your underwear. What is hot today will be obsolete next quarter and a handfull of newer chips will be out. If game makers had to optimize every game for every possible SoC, they'd never get nything released.
gianptune said:
I don't think you can ever have "serious gaming" on a touch screen. You need real controllers or a keyboard + mouse for that. I also don't think you're going to get your serious gaming on a device that has 1GB of ram and runs everything in a virtual machine. You've got the whole android OS running along side the game, so the game is having to share that piddly 1GB of ram.
Look at the minimum requirements for big PC games and then look at the resources available to games on this tablet. The nexus doesnt even have half the specs for the lowest recommended settings in far cry 3, dishonored, dark souls, most of the other games that showed up on the list when I googled for "popular PC games".
http://www.game-debate.com/games/index.php?g_id=3410&game=Dark Souls
http://www.game-debate.com/games/index.php?g_id=2186&game=Dishonored
http://www.game-debate.com/games/index.php?g_id=883&game=Far Cry 3
In most cases, I'd say developers won't take the time to optimize a game for a specific CPU. SoCs change about as often as you change your underwear. What is hot today will be obsolete next quarter and a handfull of newer chips will be out. If game makers had to optimize every game for every possible SoC, they'd never get nything released.
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And where did I say I wanted to use it for serious gaming? Read the first post again because it seems you didn't understand it quite well. I'm just wondering if tegra 3 will be of any use in the future, nothing else.
It is not in game makers' interest to optimize games for specific chipsets. They make more money by cranking out 1 version of a game that runs on as many devices as possible. If they spend 3 months optimizing it for our chip, and then 3 months optimizing it for the snapdragon s4, the game is already released 6 months later and costs much more to make.
They will only optimize a game for the tegra3 if they are sure they can get their money back out of that extra effort. Will they sell enough "tegra optimized" versions to make up for all the copies they didn't sell in their 3 months of delay? Will they sell enough copies to pay the people that worked to do the optimizing? Do they even want to pay somebody to sit and figure out the math on that?
My point of view
gianptune said:
I don't think you can ever have "serious gaming" on a touch screen. You need real controllers or a keyboard + mouse for that. I also don't think you're going to get your serious gaming on a device that has 1GB of ram and runs everything in a virtual machine. You've got the whole android OS running along side the game, so the game is having to share that piddly 1GB of ram.
Look at the minimum requirements for big PC games and then look at the resources available to games on this tablet. The nexus doesnt even have half the specs for the lowest recommended settings in far cry 3, dishonored, dark souls, most of the other games that showed up on the list when I googled for "popular PC games".
...cut...
In most cases, I'd say developers won't take the time to optimize a game for a specific CPU. SoCs change about as often as you change your underwear. What is hot today will be obsolete next quarter and a handfull of newer chips will be out. If game makers had to optimize every game for every possible SoC, they'd never get nything released.
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If you compare the situation with PC gaming, it's also a matter about different CPU architectures (x86 vs ARM), CISC vs RISC etc., it's not only a matter of plain comparison of MHz or RAM.
However Tegra 3 IMHO sadly gave results below expectations in gaming due its limited memory bandwidth that's an issue for high resolution screens. So even if it's an overall good SoC, I think we won't see many optimized games for it, mainly because the market leader (yeah, it's the bitten apple in the gaming department), focuses on different specs and recode a game to fit the requirements costs too much compared to the revenue they could achieve with a tailored version.
The saddest thing (and I hope to be proved wrong), is that with the release of Tegra 4, we'll be forgot like the devices with Tegra 2...
There are a couple of nice games to get, I wished there where free ones though which where tegra optimised so I could see the difference.
But with all the different chipsets they would never do it, and if they where going to do it id say they would optimse the chipset what samsung uses because there are so many more of those sold.
N732 said:
I'm just wondering if tegra 3 will be of any use in the future, nothing else.
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Tegra 3's future started about a year ago, and will be over some time next year. 'tis the nature of SoC's.
Loved the underwear comment above (c: and there is a fair amount of truth in it. While seeing the Tegra optimized stuff was cool, it is a sales tool with a limited window.
N732 said:
I don't really use the N7 for gaming as I already own a high-end gaming computer, besides I find tablets kind of uncomfortable for serious gaming, but I keep finding games that don't run as smooth as they should because of the same reason: This game is not optimized for tegra 3. I can't help but wonder: Will they ever optimize games for tegra 3? And I mean generally, not just a couple of games.
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Download the Tegrazone app. There's a good many optimized games and some great free ones like shadowgun: Deadzone