I was lamenting on my lack of foresight, getting a HD2 without researching the different bands that AT&T and T-Mobile use for 3G coverage, when just the other day...
NOTE: This was on a call to AT&T Support and the tech tells me:
a) Once unlocked from TMOUS, I should do a search on "AT&T APN's" and that if I search diligently, I will find APNs on AT&T's network that support HD2 3G Bands
b) AT&T techs, right in his data center have this working.
So I research a bit, and, apart form everyone and his brother professing to be 3G Band experts, and saying all I will see is Edge if I put the HD2 on AT&T. (Which is troublesome, since Wikipedia claims Edge is being dropped to facilitate more 3G bandwidth, so potentially I would lose even THAT).
Here is what official information I could find on the two:
The U.S. T-Mobile network predominately uses the GSM/GPRS/EDGE 1900 MHz frequency-band. T-Mobile's UMTS (3G) service is now active in over 30 major US cities
Further all official documentation states that AT&T uses:
* 850 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G
* 1900 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G
Finally look at my screenshot, taken from the GSM 3G toggle on the "Settings Tab" of Manila. I am running a NRG ROM (see signature) and I KNOW this is wishful thinking. This screen in particular is no doubt a function of the many devices NRG cooks for, but really, can anyone explain to me why this technically would NOT WORK (other than "just because", LOL)?
AT&T's CEO recently gave an interview and stated that the company's 3G service is being migrated to the 850MHz band with a target date of 2010:
http://www.intomobile.com/2009/02/24/att-3g-network-going-850mhz-nationwide-by-2010.html
For what it's worth, I think the Australian version of the HD2 might have a band that overlaps with US AT&T bands.
Whos gonna buy me one?
Mase_Mase said:
AT&T's CEO recently gave an interview and stated that the company's 3G service is being migrated to the 850MHz band with a target date of 2010:
http://www.intomobile.com/2009/02/24/att-3g-network-going-850mhz-nationwide-by-2010.html
For what it's worth, I think the Australian version of the HD2 might have a band that overlaps with US AT&T bands.
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Yes, I have been hearing the same. Problem is, I am not likely to fork out $$ for ANOTHER HD2. I just wanted to get the most out of the one I have. Thx!
if something like this WAS possible, it would have to be through something like a rogue apn setup on non-standard frequencies on ATT's network...but good luck finding anything like that, it wouldn't be able to remain a secret if it existed. also, if the hd2 had the ability to use those native frequencies, it would have had to have been certified as such by the FCC (which of course it wasn't).
To summarize, the only way to make it happen is if ATT did indeed somehow sneak in alternative-frequency apn's across it's entire network. Let us know how the search for those turns out
SmartAs$Phone said:
The U.S. T-Mobile network predominately uses the GSM/GPRS/EDGE 1900 MHz frequency-band. T-Mobile's UMTS (3G) service is now active in over 30 major US cities
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Sorry.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-Mobile_USA
3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+) service by T-Mobile exclusively uses the AWS 1700/2100 MHz frequency-band, making it incompatible with other existing 3G UMTS/HSPA networks already established in the United States.
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Its not physically possible. The hardware would have to be changed. They don't make radio chips with all the bands in it. I see this all the time, some random csr from whatever company says it can be done, but its just not true. Cell phones are designed and made for a specific company. They don't make universal radios and just turn off some bands. They don't exist, though I did read a few months back that Motorala was working on making one.
Although I understand the reason for your wishful thinking (and you did do some research which is always great), unfortunately it is just that and I'll gladly (though not happily) tell you why.
As you stated "U.S. T-Mobile network predominately uses the GSM/GPRS/EDGE 1900 MHz frequency-band" which is correct (and it also uses the 850 band for edge as well....though this is usually more 'roaming' aka you're using another companies cell tower because tmobile made a contract with them to allow you). You were also correct in stating that "Further all official documentation states that AT&T uses:
* 850 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G
* 1900 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G"
Also, ironcroth was also correct in quoting that "3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+) service by T-Mobile exclusively uses the AWS 1700/2100 MHz frequency-band" which alone might not answer your question.
So where is the problem if both use 1900 and 850 bands? Well, the problem is that in the hardware, there is a difference between GSM/GPRS/EDGE and 3G/UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+. In other words, you can't use 1900 and 850 Edge frequency of the HD2's radio chip to get 3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+); they are incompatible. This is why phone spects always list both seperatly and not just all the frequencies that it supports.
The above reason alone will make the TmoUSA HD2 incompatible with AT&T's 3G, but there's even more. When Tmobile says that it uses the (for example) 1900 frequency band for Edge, it doesn't actually mean that it uses 1900-1999 frequencies; instead it only uses a part of that spectrum (buying the full 100 frequency range would be expensive so they only buy what they need). Instead they only use maybe something like 1943-1978. And this range will likely not overlap with the frequncies that AT&T uses for their 3G (you can look up the exact values on the internet if you'd like). This second reason is why a european phone which supports 2100 band for 3g will not work on Tmobile's 3G 2100 frequncy (because they don't actually overlap).
Lastly (and I almost forgot to mention this), the screen shot you posted from your ROM can indeed be changed by a cook to whatever they want (though it won't actually make any difference since it all depends on the hardware). However, in this case, it's likely because htc actually made the error and never updated that screen and just used it from their previous builds from previous phones (this was stated on the forums before and I'm sure you'd be able to find it given some searching).
Hope this helps.
sirphunkee said:
To summarize, the only way to make it happen is if ATT did indeed somehow sneak in alternative-frequency apn's across it's entire network. Let us know how the search for those turns out
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Quite unlikely, the AWS bands are licensed to TMO, im sure TMO would notice real quick if there were unlicensed cell towers on the AWS band and the FCC would be slapping ATT with fines pretty quick. quite alot of work goes into setting up cell towers and the frequencies each cell segment runs on, If a rouge cell tower went up overlapping TMO's frequencies, all hell would likely break loose as far as customers being able to get usable service in the area.
also as far as the terminology APN's don't operate on a "frequency" an APN is more or less and authentication/proxy server on the data network after the data has transferred over the air interface.
Maybe the best way to think of it is similar to a cell tower being like a wifi access point, and the APN being like an authenticating router/firewall on a standard tcp/ip network. yeah i know its not quite the same, but that might be a simple way to visualize it for those familiar with networking
d0ug said:
Quite unlikely, the AWS bands are licensed to TMO, im sure TMO would notice real quick if there were unlicensed cell towers on the AWS band and the FCC would be slapping ATT with fines pretty quick. quite alot of work goes into setting up cell towers and the frequencies each cell segment runs on, If a rouge cell tower went up overlapping TMO's frequencies, all hell would likely break loose as far as customers being able to get usable service in the area.
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Click to collapse
Exactly
d0ug said:
also as far as the terminology APN's don't operate on a "frequency" an APN is more or less and authentication/proxy server on the data network after the data has transferred over the air interface.
Maybe the best way to think of it is similar to a cell tower being like a wifi access point, and the APN being like an authenticating router/firewall on a standard tcp/ip network. yeah i know its not quite the same, but that might be a simple way to visualize it for those familiar with networking
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Right, very true...I should have said "apn's attached to alternative-frequency radios" Are you a Ham d0ug?
sirphunkee said:
Exactly
Right, very true...I should have said "apn's attached to alternative-frequency radios" Are you a Ham d0ug?
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Haha no, though i do have scanners and listen in on HAMs sometimes and have read up on the stuff somewhat. never gotten myself licensed.
On the subject of scanners, there isnt all that much interesting to listen too anymore. Here in tampa the police and sheriff are on analog trunked now, so its impossible to follow anything without a trunking scanner, and about the only other things you can listen to are cabbies, tow truck drivers, aircraft, and hams. I don't even know why scanners still have the 800mhz blocks anymore, analog amps cellular has been dead a few years now. you find lots of digital noise scanning around though, just about everything is transmitted digitally now. i've got an icom R20 that goes from 150khz all the way upto 3ghz
So why don't you put in an AT&T sim card with a 3G data plan and let us know if you get 3G on your HD2?
Svegetto said:
Although I understand the reason for your wishful thinking (and you did do some research which is always great), unfortunately it is just that and I'll gladly (though not happily) tell you why.
As you stated "U.S. T-Mobile network predominately uses the GSM/GPRS/EDGE 1900 MHz frequency-band" which is correct (and it also uses the 850 band for edge as well....though this is usually more 'roaming' aka you're using another companies cell tower because tmobile made a contract with them to allow you). You were also correct in stating that "Further all official documentation states that AT&T uses:
* 850 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G
* 1900 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G"
Also, ironcroth was also correct in quoting that "3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+) service by T-Mobile exclusively uses the AWS 1700/2100 MHz frequency-band" which alone might not answer your question.
So where is the problem if both use 1900 and 850 bands? Well, the problem is that in the hardware, there is a difference between GSM/GPRS/EDGE and 3G/UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+. In other words, you can't use 1900 and 850 Edge frequency of the HD2's radio chip to get 3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+); they are incompatible. This is why phone spects always list both seperatly and not just all the frequencies that it supports.
The above reason alone will make the TmoUSA HD2 incompatible with AT&T's 3G, but there's even more. When Tmobile says that it uses the (for example) 1900 frequency band for Edge, it doesn't actually mean that it uses 1900-1999 frequencies; instead it only uses a part of that spectrum (buying the full 100 frequency range would be expensive so they only buy what they need). Instead they only use maybe something like 1943-1978. And this range will likely not overlap with the frequncies that AT&T uses for their 3G (you can look up the exact values on the internet if you'd like). This second reason is why a european phone which supports 2100 band for 3g will not work on Tmobile's 3G 2100 frequncy (because they don't actually overlap).
Lastly (and I almost forgot to mention this), the screen shot you posted from your ROM can indeed be changed by a cook to whatever they want (though it won't actually make any difference since it all depends on the hardware). However, in this case, it's likely because htc actually made the error and never updated that screen and just used it from their previous builds from previous phones (this was stated on the forums before and I'm sure you'd be able to find it given some searching).
Hope this helps.
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Click to collapse
Thank you very much. I myself had been wondering why I couldn't get an HTC Desire (honestly, pretty much the only phone I'd change my HD2 for unless a GSM version of the Supersonic becomes available) and have it work in the US at the 2100 frequency.
When I asked before, people would tell me that a phone would have to support both bands (1700/2100) to actually run on T-Mobile because one did HSDPA and the other did HSUPA, but that didn't make sense to me since all you need is a single band frequency to handle both D and U data streams.
Your explanation makes a lot more sense. It's a sad thing, though.
I remember reading somewhere that a chip manufacturer (motorola?) was working on a all frequency chip. I also read that the inherent problem with that would be the antenna.
It would be awesome to have an all band phone that world travelers could utilize. I love the HD2, I had upgraded from a long time use of a Treo 750. That phone was pretty close (quad GSM, triple umts). However when Tmo rolled out it's 3G on 1700 I was still stuck on edge with the 750.
Finally bit the bullet for an HD2, really like this phone. The 750 seems antique now heheh
moonchaser said:
I remember reading somewhere that a chip manufacturer (motorola?) was working on a all frequency chip. I also read that the inherent problem with that would be the antenna.
It would be awesome to have an all band phone that world travelers could utilize. I love the HD2, I had upgraded from a long time use of a Treo 750. That phone was pretty close (quad GSM, triple umts). However when Tmo rolled out it's 3G on 1700 I was still stuck on edge with the 750.
Finally bit the bullet for an HD2, really like this phone. The 750 seems antique now heheh
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Building a multi frequency chip isnt all that hard. software defined radios have existed for quite some time. basically a simple reprogramming allows it to xmit/rec on a different frequency. the trouble comes in the antenna design. antennas must be designed to work at specific frequencies to be the most efficient at transmitting and the most sensitive at receiving. trying to make a single antenna capable of xmit and rec anywhere in a bandwidth ranging from 700mhz upto say the 2500mhz that wimax uses, is going to make for quite a ****ty antenna at any frequency. When you see the piece of foil antennas in todays phones, they may just look like a simple piece of foil, but a lot of design goes into them to make them work well at the frequencies they need to work with.
I guarantee if you compared the internal antenna of the Euro, AUS and USA HD2 there are slight differences. Ill bet the radio chip in them is for the most part identical, there may be something modified on them to keep people from interchanging the radio roms between them though since that would invalidate any FCC or other country equivalent certification for that phone to operate
Its one thing to run a hacked rom, its something completely different to use an uncertified radio rom. Could cause all kinds of havoc with the cellular network, and get slapped with FCC fines if they could track down your trouble causing phone
d0ug said:
Building a multi frequency chip isnt all that hard. software defined radios have existed for quite some time. basically a simple reprogramming allows it to xmit/rec on a different frequency. the trouble comes in the antenna design. antennas must be designed to work at specific frequencies to be the most efficient at transmitting and the most sensitive at receiving. trying to make a single antenna capable of xmit and rec anywhere in a bandwidth ranging from 700mhz upto say the 2500mhz that wimax uses, is going to make for quite a ****ty antenna at any frequency. When you see the piece of foil antennas in todays phones, they may just look like a simple piece of foil, but a lot of design goes into them to make them work well at the frequencies they need to work with.
I guarantee if you compared the internal antenna of the Euro, AUS and USA HD2 there are slight differences. Ill bet the radio chip in them is for the most part identical, there may be something modified on them to keep people from interchanging the radio roms between them though since that would invalidate any FCC or other country equivalent certification for that phone to operate
Its one thing to run a hacked rom, its something completely different to use an uncertified radio rom. Could cause all kinds of havoc with the cellular network, and get slapped with FCC fines if they could track down your trouble causing phone
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Click to collapse
Yeah that's on par with what I had read, you do well at explaining it.
Maybe some futuristic worldphone designer would opt for interchangeable external antenna's... I could live with that or maybe multiple builtin foils with a software driven switch between them and the radio... that would be neat. Not holding my breath though...
Interesting on the FCC, hadn't thought of that.
moonchaser said:
Yeah that's on par with what I had read, you do well at explaining it.
Maybe some futuristic worldphone designer would opt for interchangeable external antenna's... I could live with that or maybe multiple builtin foils with a software driven switch between them and the radio... that would be neat. Not holding my breath though...
Interesting on the FCC, hadn't thought of that.
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Thanks, I was just again looking at the spec differences between the euro and TMO HD2s and i really don't know why HTC did not also give the TMO HD2 850/900mhz HSPA/WCDMA to truly make it a world 3G phone. According to the tech specs over at HTC.com, TMO HD2 can already use 850/900mhz for GSM/GPRS/EDGE so the antenna is obviously quite capable of both. The only other frequency the TMO HD2 has to handle that the euro doesn't is 1700mhz
Part of me thinks it was probably done so the HD2 couldn't be used over on AT&T
d0ug said:
Thanks, I was just again looking at the spec differences between the euro and TMO HD2s and i really don't know why HTC did not also give the TMO HD2 850/900mhz HSPA/WCDMA to truly make it a world 3G phone. According to the tech specs over at HTC.com, TMO HD2 can already use 850/900mhz for GSM/GPRS/EDGE so the antenna is obviously quite capable of both. The only other frequency the TMO HD2 has to handle that the euro doesn't is 1700mhz
Part of me thinks it was probably done so the HD2 couldn't be used over on AT&T
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Click to collapse
It had nothing to do with AT&T, it's because there's a difference between Edge and 3g radio frequency. More than that, there is no phone radio chip that supports all those frequencies and even more so, htc doesn't manufacture radio chips, they purchase them and put them in their phones....just like the majority of the hardware
Srs wow hd
How do you get SRS WOW HD downloaded onto the HTC HD2?
Svegetto said:
a european phone which supports 2100 band for 3g will not work on Tmobile's 3G 2100 frequncy
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Click to collapse
I think this is incorrect -- the 2100 band support on the HD2 is in fact expressly intended for 3G compatibility in Europe/Asia, and people have reported being able to get 3G in Europe with their US HD2.
1700 == US-only 3G
2100 == Europe, Asia 3G
What's missing, I believe, might be 3G support in certain areas of places like Latin America which may follow US frequencies but don't have T-Mobile USA there to provide 1700 service... e.g., no 2100 and no 1700 either.
T-Mobile U.S. uses both AWS 1700mhz and 2100mhz for 3G. The 2100mhz band is used for transmit and 1700mhz is used for receive. Hence the incompatibility with other carriers phones that only operate in one spectrum.
Cheers.
~Jasecloud4
Related
anybody in new york or been to new york with your athena to see if it works with the new upcomming t mobile 3g network? they say its running on 1700 freq.
anybody have luck or an answer for this one?
cuba3377 said:
anybody in new york or been to new york with your athena to see if it works with the new upcomming t mobile 3g network? they say its running on 1700 freq.
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that would be a no then, 2100Mhz is what the athena is capable of AFAIK
I have used the Athena on both T-Mobile and AT&T Networks in the US without issues.
I also have had no problems with T-mo in my area (central NJ) using 3g. I'm using an x7501...TJ
TrekkerJmm said:
I also have had no problems with T-mo in my area (central NJ) using 3g. I'm using an x7501...TJ
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Click to collapse
that seems odd, Current roms do not have the T-Mobile US band included, nor is the current radio capable of running the t-mobile 1700 band in the USA. ATT band is 3g/UTMS 850/1900 and Europe is 3g/UTMS 800/2100
T-Mobile Edge would work fine though
Hi, sometimes the 3g pop's up on my x7501 its not all the time but next time it does I will take a screen shot of it. Maybe its an error I have no idea...TJ
some roms incorrectly show that instead of edge !
Ok thanks...TJ
So is it possible to get T-mo 3g on athena?
T-mo finally rooled out 3g in my area, I thought my athena was 3g capable and could fly through the internet and never deal with slate Flinstone tablets and EDGE again! Sadly we do?
Their 3g is rolled out on 1700/2100 band only, so to exit the EDGE stone age, we must buy the G1 (not even close to x7501) or ask a crazy question to those in the know. Is the frequency band offered on a phone limited and fixed by the ROM / hardware, or is it software driven where a patch / upgrade could expand it's operantional band to include 1700/2100 UMTS alongside the voice 850/1900 band?
I can connect easily to TMobile. I get the "E" sign showing on the antennae.
anx7501 said:
T-mo finally rooled out 3g in my area, I thought my athena was 3g capable and could fly through the internet and never deal with slate Flinstone tablets and EDGE again! Sadly we do?
Their 3g is rolled out on 1700/2100 band only, so to exit the EDGE stone age, we must buy the G1 (not even close to x7501) or ask a crazy question to those in the know. Is the frequency band offered on a phone limited and fixed by the ROM / hardware, or is it software driven where a patch / upgrade could expand it's operantional band to include 1700/2100 UMTS alongside the voice 850/1900 band?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is hardware driven. Unfortunately this is why I'm going to switch over to AT & T because of the downgrade to get 3g service from a phone that NO OTHER Networks in the world uses is pointless IMHO. I don't know what T Mo was drinking or smoking, and when I asked the level 1 techs they said no future talks or expectations of using the NORMAL 1900/2100 Frequency like other 3g networks. Sux if you ask me.
Thanks for the note on hardware capability
I got similar responses from the techs at T-mo except I also got a moment of false hope when one incorrectly told me that their 3g is on 1900, I went nuts trying, then called back & someone else told me that it was in fact on 1700/2100. As I've been reading, their reason (though a huge pain in the ass for us) was to separate voice and data so one wouldn't steal bandwith from the other. Makes sense, though it would be easier to deal with if I had some REAL options other than G1 and crappy kids phones.
Since T-Mo has the best price for some pretty decent service (except EDGE that is), I've heard of some T-Mo users getting just an AT&T data plan alongside T-Mo voice, I'm not sure how it's done, do you need 1/2 simms, or what. If you find yourself doing this, I would like to hear your feedback.
Otherwise, I'll keep my fingers crossed that HTC will use some common sense, and use 1700/2100 in future US versions.
Hi Everyone,
I got my X1i on Tuesday. It's obviously a UK import, but so was my TyTN II and it worked great. When I got everything set up, I couldn't get more than 200kbps on dslreports. I put the sim card back in my TyTN II and retested, and got 1.2Mbps.
If I turn off HSDPA/HSUPA the data rate drops to 30kbps. I've played with every combination of data and voice bands and can't get the same performance as the TyTN. I do notice that my X1 never shows the H icon in the status bar like my other phone to indicate high speed (HSDPA).
The bands are exactly the same with a minor addition.
GSM: 900+1800 UMTS: 2100 + 800
GSM: 1900 + 850 UMTS: 1900 + 850
UMTS: 2100 + 800
AT&T seems to run on the middle one.
Does anyone have any thoughts on what could be holding my back? Same SIM, same data plan, etc.
Thanks very much in advance!!!
Hi,
Where do you live? Could be you only have UMTS 850 coverage... But, could also be something else..
dbond45 said:
Hi,
Where do you live? Could be you only have UMTS 850 coverage... But, could also be something else..
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I live near Reno, NV. The wierd thing is I literally power down, move the sim to my TyTN II and bingo! I get incredible speeds. Short of getting into the registry I have gone through and confirmed all the GPRS and HSDPA settings are exactly the same.
I think what dbond45 was saying is that you might be in an area that uses 850 band which isn't actually on the x1i. The tytn II on the other hand has the 850 band from what i understand so that might be why ur getting great speeds with ur tytn II.
Bxsteez said:
I think what dbond45 was saying is that you might be in an area that uses 850 band which isn't actually on the x1i. The tytn II on the other hand has the 850 band from what i understand so that might be why ur getting great speeds with ur tytn II.
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Click to collapse
Ah, so you're thinking that even though it says it supports 1900+850 in the control panel, the 850 band may be disabled in the radio? I'm pretty technical, but would have no idea how to test that. Any ideas?
By the way, thanks for talking this through with me. I hope it's benefitting others too.
Yes from what i've read all over the place that the 850 radio is disabled. I know that even though the software says u can enable those bands it doesn't actually mean u can. I have the touch pro and it has all of the different bands in the settings and we all know no one can get 3G in the US. So it looks like that is what ur running into. I've read on howard forums at some point a way to test to see if u are working on the 850 band but i don't remember how they did it.
Bxsteez,
The program is fieldtest.exe, and you can find it under windows in your file explorer on the X1, once in WIndows, scroll down to fieldtest.exe and run, although I'm not sure what all the values me..
There is a dispute as to whether the X1i has UMTS 850 (see pocketnow.com post, but, IMHO, I don't think it does, although I wished it did)
Lemme do some research and see if I can find what band Reno is running on. It's very likely it's 850 3G since a) it's a newer market, and b) it's a rural area compared to large cities which use 1900 mhz UMTS...
From what i was reading on howard forums Canada only uses UMTS 850 and the people who have the x1i are reporting only edge speeds.
Indeed you all were right about the discussions on Howard Forums. Read through a lot of them. Thanks for the pointer to fieldtest.exe. I'm digging through it now. I'm hopeful that S/E just threw a software switch in their stack for 850Mhz so the X1i wouldn't carp any of Cingular's sales on the upcoming X1a. Hopeful and maybe a little naive.
X1 on AT&T
I had a similar instance yesterday, sent the X1 back. The same 3 choices for UMTS in WM Phone settings, I selected the 850/1900 bands. I got the H but it was slow. Moved my SIM back to the BlackJack II and worked just fine.
I think the ROM or WM6.1 Stamp they are using is incorrect.
The Xperia Box, on the white label shows UMTS EU1 US3 EU4 I believe which to me would mean 900/1900/2100 I am not positive about the last EU being 3 or 4 since I have mailed the phone already. There are a lot of listings on ebay which show UMTS 850/1900/2100 which I truly believe is incorrect and are being used from a Feb 08 page on gsm arena. Expansys USA told me they had both flavors, then the next day all you see on the US site is the 900/1900/2100.
The US ver is not released ( X1a) from what I read here and everywhere else.
dbond45 said:
Bxsteez,
There is a dispute as to whether the X1i has UMTS 850 (see pocketnow.com post, but, IMHO, I don't think it does, although I wished it did)
Lemme do some research and see if I can find what band Reno is running on. It's very likely it's 850 3G since a) it's a newer market, and b) it's a rural area compared to large cities which use 1900 mhz UMTS...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. There is no dispute. Only dumb people. the X1i DOES NOT have 850mhz UMTS band, the hardware isn't even in the phone. It falsely displayed 850+1900MHZ because it does 1900MHZ and WM assumes that if it has 1900 it must have 850. It doesn't..
2. Reno does in fact run a predominately 850mhz 3G networking using At&t (not cingular, its been over a year since they got bought out) Your speed is likely because of this. Oddly if your phone is set to auto negotiate networks it should pick up EDGE service and show a "G" does it display a G rather than an H? You said the H doesn't display when you force 850+1900 UMTS right? The question is what does come up? Signal strength etc.?
If you import a phone from the UK you need to be prepared to be disappointed with speeds, simple fact, most UK phones don't even support 1900mhz, its there for roaming purposes on the X1. Same reason the X1a will have 850/1900/2100 UMTS. 1900mhz band is the weaker of the 2 used by At&t... 1900mhz was the first frequency they used, they used it so save costs and setup a marginally OK 3G network on a larger area. 1900mhz being a higher frequency means it can travel further than 850, this results in slower speeds and poor reception depending on your location from the nearest tower. 850 is lower frequency and there for more dense, this translates into faster speeds and better reception. Most new areas of at&ts 3G network are spread around with 850mhz. Older markets are a combination of 850mhz/1900mhz and some just 1900mhz.
The point is, if you are blissfully unaware of all this then your best bet is to send the phone back and wait for the US release.
mlinz said:
...
1900mhz band is the weaker of the 2 used by At&t... 1900mhz was the first frequency they used, they used it so save costs and setup a marginally OK 3G network on a larger area. 1900mhz being a higher frequency means it can travel further than 850, this results in slower speeds and poor reception depending on your location from the nearest tower. 850 is lower frequency and there for more dense, this translates into faster speeds and better reception. Most new areas of at&ts 3G network are spread around with 850mhz. Older markets are a combination of 850mhz/1900mhz and some just 1900mhz.
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FYI: The data transmission speed doesn't depend on frequency. Both 850 and 1900 bands are capable to provide the same speed.
mlinz said:
1. There is no dispute. Only dumb people. the X1i DOES NOT have 850mhz UMTS band, the hardware isn't even in the phone. It falsely displayed 850+1900MHZ because it does 1900MHZ and WM assumes that if it has 1900 it must have 850. It doesn't..QUOTE]
Actually, I along with many others are fully aware the X1i does not have 850 UMTS listed on the box, in the specs, etc. I even made a post about it. HOWEVER, there is a VERY SLIGHT chance it does, and SE never mentioned it in the specs for some unknown reason. If you go to pocketnow.com, Brandon CONFIRMS he spoke to 3 SE reps from the X1 support line who said the X1i had 850 UMTS support. Only 1 said it only had 900/1900/2100 UMTS as listed on the box. 3/4 reps saying it has 850 UMTS, along with the fact he supposedly only gets 850 UMTS where he lives, and is getting HSDPA on the X1i leaves a glimmer of hope for everyone out there, even if it is dismally small.
As far as the "false display" 850/1900 mhz option it is not so much a false display as a software option on most HTC phones, including the euro touch pro...
Anyways, I'm getting decent HSDPA coverage in Chicago...
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Click to collapse
joedoe said:
FYI: The data transmission speed doesn't depend on frequency. Both 850 and 1900 bands are capable to provide the same speed.
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Click to collapse
They may output the same speed initially, but 1900 you usually get less bars depending on your location to the tower and less bars means slower speeds.
mlinz said:
...
1900mhz being a higher frequency means it can travel further than 850
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You got this backwards. Think AM and FM. AM can be picked up much farther away.
veloaudio said:
You got this backwards. Think AM and FM. AM can be picked up much farther away.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My bad, I do that a lot
This broke my heart... and I work for T-Mobile. Why on earth would HTC/SE make a phone that practically every company in the world can use with 3G, but not T-Mobile!? Frustrated.
gregnm369 said:
This broke my heart... and I work for T-Mobile. Why on earth would HTC/SE make a phone that practically every company in the world can use with 3G, but not T-Mobile!? Frustrated.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then why don't you blame T-mobile for building their 3G network on 2100mzh while there others are using 850/900/1900 for YEARS?
jackleung said:
Then why don't you blame T-mobile for building their 3G network on 2100mzh while there others are using 850/900/1900 for YEARS?
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Click to collapse
AT&T is 2100mhz... T-Mobile USA is 1700mhz
Uh...ATT is 850/1900, FYI. Tmobile is 1700/2100 both, not either or.
jvs60 said:
Uh...ATT is 850/1900, FYI. Tmobile is 1700/2100 both, not either or.
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That's strange. A G1 is unlockable to ATT, but only supports UMTS 1700/2100. The G1's in our store access 3G just fine. My X1i won't access anything but EDGE (not 3G). Since the G1 supports 1700 and X1i does not, this is the logical deduction that the X1i doesn't support the same standard that the G1 does which is T-Mobile USA 3G
gregnm369 said:
Why on earth would HTC/SE make a phone that practically every company in the world can use with 3G, but not T-Mobile!?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hmmm... let me state it upside down:
"Why on earth would T-MOBILE chose a band NOT USED BY ANY OTHER COMPANY IN THE WORLD ??"
Sounds better this way
Or... you can say it like this:
"Why on earth would HTC/SE or ANY other phone maker include in all their phones a band that is ONLY USED by T-MOBILE ??"
This one is even worst
PS: It's true, T-Mobile is the ONLY operator using the 1700+2100 martian band don't blame phone makers
And beware: it is NOT "1700 & 2100" but "1700 PLUS 2100" (one band for uplink and the other band for downlink)
SUCH A FREAK !!
gregnm369 said:
AT&T is 2100mhz... T-Mobile USA is 1700mhz
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you kidding me that you are working for a carrier and you don't even know what bands your company (or your competitor) is using? I am starting to understand why you would blame the phone manufacture now ....
Why would HTC/SE make a phone that practically every company in the world can use with 3G, but not T-Mobile?
Why would T-mobile chose a 3G band (1700+2100mhz) not used by any other company in the world?
It's really quite complicated, so I'll keep it simple (although the details won't be very clear).
It's neither HTC/SE nor T-mobile's fault. Unlike in Europe, the American government (FCC) does not define or reserve specific bands (1900mhz, 2100mhz, etc) for specific technologies (GSM, UMTS, CDMA, etc). The US government also does not want to reallocate bands that are already being used, even if it's for older technology. Since VoiceStream (Tmo before Deutsche Telekom bought it) didn't have any money to buy spectrum in advance for 3G, that pretty much means that T-mobile has had to settle for whatever bands are leftover.
T-mobile wanted to keep their US 3G bands the same as in Europe, but the lower half (uplink) is already occupied by another technology (which the FCC cannot or will not vacate). So the only choice was to launch 3G on the 1700+2100mhz "AWS" band, or have no 3G at all. And without 3G, AT&T would have a monopoly on UMTS, Tmo would lose business with only 2G, and we as customers would suffer in the long run (especially since without competition, AT&T could keep its prices artificially high).
For the other points, contrary to popular belief, Tmo is not the only carrier in the world that runs a UMTS network in the 1700mhz range. Carrier e-Mobile in Japan runs a UMTS 1700 network. It is slightly different than Tmo's AWS because e-Mobile uses 1700-uplink/1800-downlink (UMTS Band IX) while Tmo uses 1700-uplink/2100-downlink (UMTS Band IV) and is therefore still incompatible. However, as with the G1, it is fully possible to build a radio that can switch between "overlapping" modes (eg: 1700+2100 and 1900+2100* on the G1), it just isn't very cost-effective to make those radios at the moment.
*1900+2100 does not mean AT&T's UMTS 1900mhz network. It's 1900mhz uplink and 2100mhz downlink, and you can see the specific frequency differences here (UMTS Bands I and II).
Keep in mind (and this is a more general point): GSM started off with most phones being only dual-mode (900/1800mhz or 850/1900mhz), but after the technology matured tri- and quad-band radios became commonplace, and now quad-GSM phones are found everywhere. In time we might see a penta-band (850/900/1700/1900/2100) "global" UMTS radio become standard on all phones -- just not with the X1. Then again, by the time we see penta-radios, we will move on to 4G, and with the current split between WiMAX and LTE, we will probably have these same headaches all over again.
So if you want someone to blame, blame the FCC for being unable or unwilling to harmonize the US wireless spectrum with other global standards. Tmo, HTC, and SE are merely just trying to play the cards dealt to them.
--
You might also stop to consider: it is still possible for SE to release a Tmo-capable X1 (let's call it the X1t), but the only advantage is that it would work with Tmo, and thus only Tmo customers would buy it (unlike the X1a which can work with any 850/1900/2100mhz carrier, not just AT&T). That makes it cost-prohibitive at the moment. Furthermore, since it would be sold in the American market, the Qualcomm patent restrictions would still apply, and you would end up with the MSM7201A processor which many X1a users have been complaining about. There is just no perfect answer.
Thank you for clarifying. I learned something from that.
Anyone who understands this "spectrum" 3g AT&T Tmob issue more than I.... I have a ?
Okay so here it goes....
WTF!!!!!!!!!!!???
So I've been reading all day to understand this and I do get how we ended up screwed on 3g from the rest of the world
Tmob is on "aws" which is sort of a halfway between 2100/1900 of Europe at 2100/1700
AT&T is on 1900/850 or 850... I couldn't find a straight answer on that.
Now everyone says this is "hardware" in the phone that dictates this issue. I've been researching (this is where I could use your help) and I'm missing something. Nexus one is using Qualcomm Snapdragon™ 3G QSD8250.... This AMAZING chip is not only the processor but the 3g chipset as well... (correct?) Yet this same chip is in the LG expo and the LG expo has 850/1900/2100 for it's 3g.
It would seem to me... (a simple man) that Qualcomm would NOT produce separate chips but would use some firmware/software to let the chip determine which frequencies to use. Otherwise they would have to stamp out more than one chip instead of just having one factory.
The other major issue I see is antenna length is a physical characteristic based on the radio wave you are trying to receive/send. So that may have to change too but that's more about being optimum than impossible.
Not that anyone has the cash for this but what would stop someone with REALLY amazing soldering skills from switching the two supposedly identical chipsets? Would that extremely silly idea work?
Just a thought that I thought a few people on this forum may understand more than I do.
First, the radio ROM should be the one to dictate what frequencies are supported if the radio chip can support multiple frequencies, which it does. There is a soft radio chip from Samsung (I think it's Samsung) that can be reprogrammed to change which carrier it's supporting, but I haven't read of it being used yet. I believe that's the future, but currently you get a chip that almost universally supports European 3G and quad-band GSM w/EDGE out of the box, and then *one* set of US/Canadian frequencies. That's it.
WIND (new Canadian carrier) is using the same AWS spectrum as T-Mobile US is, so that should give more "pull" for more AWS support in future handsets, but with T-Mobile moving toward a "dumb pipe" arrangement (no annoying a la carte options, no music services, no stupid "extras" to pay for, just voice/data/text plans) the hope is more devices will be available in the open market that will just work on T-Mobile and support whatever you're paying for. Since your ISP is just "there" and "supports" (ish) whatever you're using, the hope is T-Mobile US will set the trend for that behavior here, and WIND might be going the same way in Canada, and FINALLY bring this mentality to North America.
If that works out, expect to see more soft radio chips and ROMs to come out with these handsets so they can be "flipped" from network to network and still support all the data and voice options. If it doesn't (I think it will to some degree), then expect the long and annoying tradition of vertically integrated handset and carrier support where the handset has to be "made" to support whatever options the carrier chooses (for compatibility and being as cheap as possible to make) and not have full, cross network support for devices.
Softchips aren't common and won't be. You could probably swap the chips directly, but it's going to cause issues.
T-Mobile uses AWS, which is 1700/2100 for down/up stream. It's considered GSM band 4, which is different from Europe, who uses a 900 band and a 2100 band, both of those are full up/downloads on close bands, so some places use 900, some use 2100, some offer both. It's a bit different. The Nexus One supposed 900/AWS/2100, meaning it's 100% Europe and T-Mobile compatible. We're seeing more and more of these chips since it's significantly simpler than making Euro + AT&T chips.
Motorola is developing a chip with AWS + 850/1900, meaning sometime next year, we should be seeing truly "USA" model cell phones, which will support any US GSM carrier. Euro+USA full could come eventually, but the addition of AWS means it'd take a 5-band chip instead of Quad band like EDGE.
T-Mobile 3G Upgrade
FCC cleared radio frequencies about 3 years ago, T-Mobile bid on the majority of them and used it to upgrade its network.
Much lulz were had.
Here is a List of UMTS Networks. Pretty much all of Europe uses 2100.
I'll do more research as to WHY, but most carriers opt for certain frequencies because of hardware compatibility and cost effectiveness for when they were upgrading.
That link makes it appear that AT&T is worthless outside of NA, but that's untrue (AT&T has, for the most part coverage worldwide, or so I think...) so I'll do some more research on my lunch break.
Renarudo said:
T-Mobile 3G Upgrade
FCC cleared radio frequencies about 3 years ago, T-Mobile bid on the majority of them and used it to upgrade its network.
Much lulz were had.
Here is a List of UMTS Networks. Pretty much all of Europe uses 2100.
I'll do more research as to WHY, but most carriers opt for certain frequencies because of hardware compatibility and cost effectiveness for when they were upgrading.
That link makes it appear that AT&T is worthless outside of NA, but that's untrue (AT&T has, for the most part coverage worldwide, or so I think...) so I'll do some more research on my lunch break.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ATT has some coverage (edge once again) everywhere, some places in canada and australia have 1900, but ATT for the most part is using a freq that's not very universal
The issue is the amplifier module.
I have the Rogers G1 running on AT&T 3G. The radio firmware/software is identicle to the T-Mobile/ADP1 phone.
They did a tear down of the G1's and they both use physically different amplifier part numbers. It's not a part from Qualcomm and has nothing to do with their chipsets. Their chipsets do indeed support AT&T's 3G frequencies, if paired with a compatible amplifier.
Now if someone tears down the Nexus One, and gets the part number for the amplifier, and that amplifier can do AT&T frequencies, it may just be an issue of hacking the radio somehow to enable it.
It's quite possible the amplifier on the Nexus One can handle AT&T 3G, but they didn't bother to "certify" it with the FCC because T-Mobile is te launch parter and AT&T is sucking Apples teet.
One can only wait and see. I'm betting it simple doesn't have the correct amplifier for AT&T.
There are amplifiers that work on all frequencies. Why they don't spend the extra dollar or whatever is beyond me. They are literally THAT cheap.
-James
jmacdonald801 said:
The issue is the amplifier module.
I have the Rogers G1 running on AT&T 3G. The radio firmware/software is identicle to the T-Mobile/ADP1 phone.
They did a tear down of the G1's and they both use physically different amplifier part numbers. It's not a part from Qualcomm and has nothing to do with their chipsets. Their chipsets do indeed support AT&T's 3G frequencies, if paired with a compatible amplifier.
Now if someone tears down the Nexus One, and gets the part number for the amplifier, and that amplifier can do AT&T frequencies, it may just be an issue of hacking the radio somehow to enable it.
It's quite possible the amplifier on the Nexus One can handle AT&T 3G, but they didn't bother to "certify" it with the FCC because T-Mobile is te launch parter and AT&T is sucking Apples teet.
One can only wait and see. I'm betting it simple doesn't have the correct amplifier for AT&T.
There are amplifiers that work on all frequencies. Why they don't spend the extra dollar or whatever is beyond me. They are literally THAT cheap.
-James
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Or sell two (or more) versions of the phone?
850/1900/2100
900/1900/2100
1700/2100
I would guess ... idiocy.
Even more idiotic ... phone manufacturers building phones with NAM 3G frequencies ... but not selling them.
It seems the Nexus One at least has the hardware to support AT&T 3G, see my post here.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=612950
-James
Will Samsung Galaxy S work on 3G fido/Rogers
Hello,
I live in Toronto, Canada and I have phone with Fido. The 3G frequency for fido/rogers are 850/1900. I have found the phone on ebay unlocked that supports HSDPA 900 / 1900 / 2100.
I heard many posts here about that. I just want to confirm If rogers/fido support 850/1900, however the phone only supports HSDPA 900 / 1900 / 2100.
Will I still get 3G network or not?
No 850 MHZ available yet. You'd get 2g, but not 3g. I'm sure the 850 Mhz version will be popping up soon.
Yes, but The phone support 1900 and rogers list 1900 as one of the two band frequencies for 3G, so it's should get 3G using 1900 frequency in some areas, right?
Re: Will Samsung Galaxy S work on 3G fido/Rogers
It should work on the 1900 band. You just need to make sure that you have strong 1900 band coverage for 3g in your area. Check gsmworld. Com for the maps.
Sent from my Nexus One
1900 is the secondary band. you'll only get it in certain areas.
and by certain, i mean very few.
even then, would you want a phone that can't connect when you're in one part of town to another
Okay so I was just reading this older article on IntoMobile: http://www.intomobile.com/2009/02/24/att-3g-network-going-850mhz-nationwide-by-2010.html
Here is an excerpt:
The news that AT&T is aiming to complete their 3G network migration to the more capable 850Mhz GSM ban came straight from de la Vega, so it’s a fairly reliable goal-line to look towards. Unfortunately for folks with 2G-limited (EDGE) devices, AT&T’s decision to co-opt the higher-frequency band for 3G services will means that 2G services will now rely on the more finicky and shorter-range 1900Mhz band. In fact, you may have already started noticing a drop in 2G performance in your area. Still, the push to migrate 3G services to the 850Mhz band highlights AT&T’s ongoing effort to improve their 3G network.
So basically by getting a phone that works on the less reliable portion of at&ts network we are definitely asking for trouble. So as much as I hate hate hate waiting. I think that I will have to wait for an official us version.
doctajay said:
Okay so I was just reading this older article on IntoMobile: http://www.intomobile.com/2009/02/24/att-3g-network-going-850mhz-nationwide-by-2010.html
Here is an excerpt:
The news that AT&T is aiming to complete their 3G network migration to the more capable 850Mhz GSM ban came straight from de la Vega, so it’s a fairly reliable goal-line to look towards. Unfortunately for folks with 2G-limited (EDGE) devices, AT&T’s decision to co-opt the higher-frequency band for 3G services will means that 2G services will now rely on the more finicky and shorter-range 1900Mhz band. In fact, you may have already started noticing a drop in 2G performance in your area. Still, the push to migrate 3G services to the 850Mhz band highlights AT&T’s ongoing effort to improve their 3G network.
So basically by getting a phone that works on the less reliable portion of at&ts network we are definitely asking for trouble. So as much as I hate hate hate waiting. I think that I will have to wait for an official us version.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good call.
I think that if we don't get an 850 mhz US one right away they'll probably get one in australia or somewhere else where 850 is used. Same deal with people who want the HD2 on AT&T.
850 Mhz version "Not likely" imo...
paulthepwner said:
Good call.
I think that if we don't get an 850 mhz US one right away they'll probably get one in australia or somewhere else where 850 is used. Same deal with people who want the HD2 on AT&T.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can comment from personal experience here.. I'm going to hedge a bet that there will not be an 850Mhz Galaxy S... If there were going to be, it would have been submitted to FCC by now, but I could be wrong.
I bought an OmniaHD last June, which is also 900/1900/2100 and it's never hooked up to 3G in Canada.
I can scan UMTS (using service menus) but cannot connect. I always get an unauthorized access message.
The real issue is that Canadian Carriers are making THE CORRECT business decision by using UMTS on 850Mhz.
850 gives you a larger coverage area, with the trade off of less subscribers per radio. this fits Canada's geographic demographic to the tee.. vast area, not many people.
It could be argued that 1900 should be enabled in metro areas, but Rogers is reserving the 1900 for additional voice capacity (is what I've come to learn).
I guess 1900 would be enabled if 850 became flooded.. so here's to iPad causing conjestion on the 850... iPad being pure data.. Hopefully this will be the case and 1900 will be enabled.
FYI there is an approved 'Tmobile' version of the Galaxy S. Tmobile uses 1700/2100.. and so does WIND
engadget.com/2010/04/11/samsung-galaxy-s-hits-the-fcc-with-atandt-bands-onboard/
at&t will be calling it the Captivate and its coming in late July.
kirbo20 said:
engadget.com/2010/04/11/samsung-galaxy-s-hits-the-fcc-with-atandt-bands-onboard/
at&t will be calling it the Captivate and its coming in late July.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the link...
From Engadget, you can click on the fcc image to get the the fcc application. This link: (rf exposure info)
fjallfoss.fcc.gov/prod/oet/forms/blobs/retrieve.cgi?attachment_id=1263518&native_or_pdf=pdf
page 4 indicates that the application is for WCDMA 1900Mhz.. GSM will operate both 850 and 1900, however 3G is 1900. (also 2.4Ghz application for BT and WIFI..
So you're out of luck if your carrier has enabled 3G on 850 only....
Hope Rogers enables 1900, because I WANT THIS PHONE!
ps. Page 12 is neat-it looks like they radiate Brain and Muscle tissue equivalents to see the effects of rf The details on test configurations and results are there as well.. I wonder if they'll come out with a corded version....
giz02 said:
The real issue is that Canadian Carriers are making THE CORRECT business decision by using UMTS on 850Mhz.
850 gives you a larger coverage area, with the trade off of less subscribers per radio. this fits Canada's geographic demographic to the tee.. vast area, not many people.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why is it that they're not using 900 instead of 850? How much of an "incorrect" business decision would that be?
Aqua1ung said:
Why is it that they're not using 900 instead of 850? How much of an "incorrect" business decision would that be?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That... is a mystery unsolved ...
Prayers Answered
Samsung Captivate is the phone.. Now What about that Galaxy S Pro.. will we be seeing a flash for the camera???
I just received my Samsung Galaxy S and it's working on Rogers 3G. No problems all day.
bigbuffalo said:
I just received my Samsung Galaxy S and it's working on Rogers 3G. No problems all day.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you in a strong 1900 Mhz area? Where did you buy your Galaxy S from?
trinikartel said:
Are you in a strong 1900 Mhz area? Where did you buy your Galaxy S from?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I live in Richmond Hill. I have been all over including downtown, and it seems to be working so far. I bought it off a seller on eBay that is located in Markham.
Samsung Galaxy S 3g working in the (Greater Toronto Area) with Rogers on 1900 MHz
bigbuffalo said:
I live in Richmond Hill. I have been all over including downtown, and it seems to be working so far. I bought it off a seller on eBay that is located in Markham.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@bigbuffalo, thanks for the tip about the guy in Markham, I met up with him yesterday and bought the Samsung Galaxy S. Man What a device!!! I replaced my Motorola Milestone as I had enough of the Motorola BS. Don't get me wrong, I still think its one of the best 2.1 devices in Canada but if you read the Motorola forums you can see what my frustrations have been all about.
I can confirm that the Galaxy S does indeed have 3G coverage all over the GTA (South Eastern Ontario, Canada) including Milton on the 1900 MHz band but if you drive 5 minutes west of Milton it goes down to EDGE. Oh forgot to mention that the 3G is 3.5G as I see an H (HSDPA, HSUPA) more often then I see 3G. I hope this helps.
The device is a work of art, smooth,thin, light, sexy and packs a punch. I would recommend this device to anyone over the Nexus One, Milestone and the Sony X10. The Samsung blows them out of the water in every way.
Also if anyone is interested here is the company I bought the Samsung Galaxy S from:
NCI Sales Support Team
Neway Communication International
newayci.com
1-888-839-5639
Now if I can only find some accessories..
Thanks again guys..
Regards,
oscicluna
@oscicluna
Glad you were able to get one. It is one superb piece of software. Not sure if your device has the Singtel firmware on it (Asia), but mine did and I found it to lag quite a bit. When I did my research, apparently that firmware really slows down the device. I since updated to JF2 firmware, and rooted, and now it runs fantastic. I would highly recommend to get rid of the Singtel firmware. Enjoy your device.
bigbuffalo said:
@oscicluna
Glad you were able to get one. It is one superb piece of software. Not sure if your device has the Singtel firmware on it (Asia), but mine did and I found it to lag quite a bit. When I did my research, apparently that firmware really slows down the device. I since updated to JF2 firmware, and rooted, and now it runs fantastic. I would highly recommend to get rid of the Singtel firmware. Enjoy your device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hmm...i'm pretty much sold on this phone. Just gonna wait until Tuesday to see what they officially unveil in terms of US carriers (AT&T in particular). The (possible) removal of the front facing camera on the Captivate really ticked me off..but apparently they added a 6 axis sensor for gaming etc. Hoping they root the Captivate soonish after launch in the event I opt to go that route and save some $$. Decisions...decisions.....
Any one use this phone in CANADA with Rogers / Fido...
i'm use with Rogers...some time show at 3G mode or HSPA mode...but seem this phone is not support Rogers 3G network...can someone explain it.......also when i use Fido i can in roaming mode...the date is not working until i check the roaming date box........