Hi,
I need to read CellID and RxLev by my program. I have no idea how to do this. Could anyone to help me? Thanks
Unfortunately it's not been implemented by HTC, so the simple answer is no. You could try and use the SMS system directly through RIL, although because Cell based positioning is quite a hot topic and nobody has yet done it, I'd guess it't not possible.
Anybody know if XDAII has a working API for this?
Just use tracelogger, pwd is htc, choose MMI + Event then run the tracelogviewer provided by the XDA developers site you'll get your CID and rx Level
andyclap said:
Unfortunately it's not been implemented by HTC, so the simple answer is no.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is I would guess why RIL_GetCellTowerInfo always returns 0x80004001, which I belive means not implemented. (XDA I) But I might be using the wrong call... ??
If this information is available on the XDA II, then there must be programmatically a way through RIL, so either I am using the wrong call, or RIL has been fixed, or something else I haven't thought of... Any ideas?
Ben.
Yeah, it would be great if the XDAII supported this (Cell based min-GPS!), so does anybody know for definite the scope of the new RIL on the XDAII?
andyclap said:
Cell based min-GPS
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You read my mind!
I think this might be why this information is so hard to find. This data, once calibrated (which using, say, TomTom, would not be hard) is a considerable asset, to which the various phone companies are trying to protect. Which sounds like a challange to me...
Ben
Yeah - O2 at least are marketing this info as a developer program, with a lookup charge "from 5p per lookup". What a bargain, considering the device already has the information (though it really applies to mobile phones that don't have SDK access).
Don't they realise that if they helped us create an app for them to do this and, say, link to multimap.com, it'd be a killer app and they'd sell hundreds more XDAs.
Good idea. They would get the GPRS service charge for the multimap lookup as well. Although I think the cell id is too course. But some part of the phone knows far more accuratelly where it is, so that it knows when to change cell. Although this is not yet an area I know much about.
I belive, if you jump through enough hoops, O2 gives grants for programms which enhance the XDA, there's a project for somebody.... If anybody can work out how to get the s***ding cell id out of the XDA
ben
Yeah - O2 at least are marketing this info as a developer program, with a lookup charge "from 5p per lookup". What a bargain, considering the device already has the information (though it really applies to mobile phones that don't have SDK access).
Don't they realise that if they helped us create an app for them to do this and, say, link to multimap.com, it'd be a killer app and they'd sell hundreds more XDAs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The idea of the Location APi is not as good as what we want. The idea is that an office queries O2 servers for the cell location of the target unit, for which they charge the office (end-user). O2 are looking for software solutions that draw on this to provide added content so that some poor sap carries on paying 5p a hit to get back the rough cell based location of a unit. Bloody expensive as a tracker or SatNav. Might as well just stick a GPS unit on the back & send that data back via GPRS - cheaper!
O2 actually have a website with the info on their cell sites on it BUT they have 8500 of them at least, so getting all that info out is a hard task.
Site is Here
We need to crack getting Cell ID, Signal Strength, Nearest Other Towers, Nearest OT Signal Strength + I daresay a few more before applying that to a database, after which we could probably have a device that told us our position to within 100m, which we could then send back via GPRS, thus not allowing the network to charge 5p a hit.
That's why the Cell Location database is not available - they stand to make/lose too much revenue.
Wonder how much the database is worth?
It wouldn't be too difficult to scrape the site - while it gives no true positional information, it can return a list of cell towers within a radius (upto 5km ish) of a known tower, with their distance: we could triangulate three sets of this information to get the real locations of towers. Once these locations are known, we can recursively triangulate from them to eventually get all the data for the UK at least.
But, the main thing to do, as you say, is to find a programmatic way of getting the current cellId, signal strength, and preferably as much information about other local towers too to further refine the result.
Hmmm, just thought - as the XDA developers here are "jolly nice and clever people", they have supplied the source to tracelogview. It wouldn't be too difficult to modify this to scan for tower information messages and do the appropriate things. It just means that the users have to enable tracelog manually, though perhaps we could send some keyboard messages to start it up and enter the password. It's hacky, but it just might work!
Might have a go at this tomorrow!
Overview of Location APi as offered by O2 - taken from Source02 website
The first of our APIs to be delivered is the Location API which has been developed by our partner Redknee.
The service enables you to create and sell innovative new applications and services based on a mobile phone user's location.
The O2 service is charged from 5p a lookup and provides the longitude and latitude co-ordinates of the centre of the cell site sector the phone is located within. Cell sites are typically split into three sectors and range in size from several hundred metres in urban areas up to 15 kilometres in more remote regions.
Third parties are able to develop location-enabled applications utilising real time location data from the O2 UK network. Application owners will have the opportunity to validate their applications in a test environment prior to connecting to the live O2 UK network. Location information will only be passed to third parties who have a contract with O2 and have the consent of the end user to determine his/her location.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I may be wrong, but...
I belive the telco and the phone have a different idea of where the device is, as they plot the position of the device using different mechanisms and for different uses. They use this when they have to contact a phone to send an incomming call. This application is making use of the telco's permanent database of the location of all their devices. This is easy money for the telco.
We do not have access to this data, and the positional information we can get will be in a different format, accept for the Cell ID. We will have to infer the position of the XDA from RIL, TAPI, AT, using the data listed in previous postings. As was suggested, getting an idea of the strength of local transmitters, and calculating a position. Which in it's self may be a real challange, as there is not likelly to be a linear relationship between the strength of the transmitter and the distance to it.
It may be likelly that the cell size (~200m, -> ~15km) is the nearest we'll ever get. I note that people in Dover very often get routed through transmitters in France due to the cliffs on the coast of England. In this case, any meaningful positional data is getting more unlikelly.
PS, can any kind person with an XDAII tell me whether the RILL call:
HRESULT RIL_GetCellTowerInfo(HRIL hRil);
Returns something other than 80004001?
Ben
PS, can any kind person with an XDAII tell me whether the RILL call:
HRESULT RIL_GetCellTowerInfo(HRIL hRil);
Returns something other than 80004001?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unfortunatelly this still returns '80004001 Unsupported' on XDA II.
But the RIL_GetSignalQuality does return valid data when connected to GPRS, unlike XDA I, so some things are getting better...
Ben
Hi all,
i just saw a programm that uses the cell ID and convert this one °, but it just works with received data from any handy via Irda or cable.
So if u want to take a look visit (german site):
http://www.wolfgang-back.com/navigauss.php
That works but it would be the first way, to use the XDA cellID instead of external data...perhaps any idea on this?
With greetings from germany
Harry
Cell ID
Guys u can get the cell id using java.
The cell ID is memorized in the sim card and the mobile phone compares always whether the CID he is receiving from the signal, is the same one memorized in the sim card.
If yes the mobile does nothing. If not the mobile phone updates the CID in the sim card. this is done almost every 5 seconds.
Now we need the API !!! and maybe the AID of the sim applet. :roll:
Once more,
could the following be a walkable way?:
1. cell-Id could be shown (tracelog and traceview says how)
2. If that is fact, then it is with calculating gauss-to- longitude/latidude (visit www.nobbi.com) makable to view the actually position.
3. The last step it would be, to bring Information like longitude/latidude in ° to the standard gps-format (it is known or free i think) and send it via comm1 to all navigation-software.
4. So if this all is nonsens tell me because i am not really a programmer ( my code would be as fine as my english is :-((
bye Harry
Hiwi said:
1. cell-Id could be shown (tracelog and traceview says how)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's right, but cell id says nothing about position.
2. If that is fact, then it is with calculating gauss-to- longitude/latidude (visit www.nobbi.com) makable to view the actually position.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
see comment 1. Only O2 Germany transmits GK/coordinates over Cell Broadcast....
3. The last step it would be, to bring Information like longitude/latidude in ° to the standard gps-format (it is known or free i think) and send it via comm1 to all navigation-software.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If 1. and 2. would be possible this is still a problem since most (all) GPS-Software only accept input from COM-Port (you have to emulate a COM-Port ... not trivial)
4. So if this all is nonsens tell me because i am not really a programmer ( my code would be as fine as my english is :-((
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
:wink:
John
Having written a DLL to get the CellID from the XDA, and then comparing the result with the O2 cell tower map info as described by 'Puff the Magic Wagon' on Nov 4, I find there is a discrepancy of 10000
e.g. in a clients office in Blackburn
Cell ID returned = 3AAF( Hex) = 15023 (Dec)
From www.webmap.o2.co.uk Higher Audley Cell = 5023
This seems to be the case for all cells I have tried.
There also seems to be some Cell ID's which I cannot reconcile with the o2 map results.
mjgermain
The problem you've encountered arrises from the fact that there are more than 9999 CSR (Cell Site References) that are registered with the RA.
O2 identify cells in the following way.
AXXXX
Where A = the direction the transmitter is facing (directional transmitters)
(roughly)
1=North
2=South East
3=West
then 4, 5, 6 & sometimes 7, 8, 9 depending on how many transmitters on the aerial - always in 3s
So in your example 1XXXX, the transmitter is facing north (so should be to the south of you) but depending on that aerial (yours only has 3)
We then get to the XXXX
I believe that CSRs are allocated by the government and are a 5 figure number. Therefore CSRs upto 9999 are able to be placed quite simply.
15023 is correct.
However, what happens when transmitter number 10001 comes along? According to O2 numbering system, that 0001 number is already allocated. So they have to use another method of identifying cells.
Somewhere else in the country there might be transmitter that IDs as 15023 :shock: :?
So having a database of CellIDs and transmitter numbers is not all that is needed, the additional "identifier" is required and together that gives the CSR which has a lat/long applied to it.
The identifier is the LAC or Local Area Code
So AXXXX + LAC = CSR
There are still a few anomolies in this as well it would seem. Fill-in transmitters and "private" or "mini" transmitters the likely cause.
I had access to the O2 CellID db when I was last working & we were able to create a basic Cell tracking system, but the company went titsup.com before we were able to factor in LAC and signal strength etc.
Does your program work on XDA2?
Related
For all those who are mildly paranoid about being monitored how much do we really know about the following: The XDA2 changes hands, is the original owner's info still linked to it; the XDA2 is barred, when using it as a PDA does it still send out signals? if so, can these signals be located? can the XDA2 be used to surf without a sim card, if so, are the signals posted to anyone? Can the XDA2 be unbarred? If it can be, is it hardwired to retain its original ID? Does all this sound like the Matrix ... well it may well be! :roll:
sounds like u got sum good dope
email me
LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
...but seriously...
Dead Ringer said:
For all those who are mildly paranoid about being monitored how much do we really know about the following: The XDA2 changes hands, is the original owner's info still linked to it; the XDA2 is barred, when using it as a PDA does it still send out signals? if so, can these signals be located? can the XDA2 be used to surf without a sim card, if so, are the signals posted to anyone? Can the XDA2 be unbarred? If it can be, is it hardwired to retain its original ID? Does all this sound like the Matrix ... well it may well be! :roll:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When the radio is switched on the xda sends the imei whether a sim is in place or not, the information of a previous owner is lost once a hard reset is carried out, however some people think that by unclicking permanant save, that the data is lost, well that isnt true because if the next owner switches it back on and you were using the feature before, he will have access to all your data, the only way I found was to delete all contacts, check permanent save, reboot then uncheck it. There is no way known at the moment that is public knowledge that allows you to manipulate imei on xda2. I understand that there are calls from the uk government to have all imei numbers in hardware rather than firmware/software to make it almost impossible to change identity. Just because you are paranoid doesnt mean they arent out to get you. :shock:
Thank you you seem to be THE authority on XDA! You say ""When the radio is switched on the xda sends the imei whether a sim is in place or not"" I am not sure I understand the concept of 'radio' in the xda2. can the radio be switched off/disabled? what signals are sent and how are these managed, by whom? because there is now billing requirement why should this radio signal be monitored? It has been also said that "Paranoia is the belief in a hidden order behind the visible." anon (why do u think he chose to remain anon?)
:arrow: All cellular phones are beacons :!:
If you suspect they are listening, well, they are and all you can do is to make a little harder, thus:
http://www.cryptophone.de/html/products_en.html
It is not paranoia when they are really after you 8)
I want whatever you are smoking man!
Wish I was smoking something man! Maybe some food poisoning from bad lumpia :?
I was in a security presentation and saw how a secuirty engineer from Motorola was able to pinpoint and triangulate 17 different phones in an auditorium and then go down to each unit and "clone" it for surveillance purposes with a GUI application in his laptop. ( With the users permission for the purpose of the demo!)
If they are showcasing this technology, then I guarantee Big Brother
( NSA and NRO specifically) have the capability in a more advanced form and blend it with Exchelon, key word analysis and the like....
have a look at www.followus.co.uk its excellent we use it to track the kids, ( the more cell sites close by the better the fix) its show us they are at near by to where ever they say they are
Yes, I am aware of that service.
It is a good thing for parents and businesses and is not infringing on privacy because it is consentual and voluntary.
It amazes me to see how many peope think cell phones are not easy to trace or tap because they are mobile!
Having started this thread, I was begining to think no-one cared!
Is it worth pulling together all the intelligence on remote monitoring in one place? The benefit of this will be to know what currently done and if it is at all possible tweak the systems to ensure a modicum of privacy.
There is all sorts of legislation protecting privacy and some ensuring civil liberties. What are the implications of mobile phone contracts, for instance? Do they have a duty of care to protect our privacy is there anything in the contracts that limit their liability in this regard, and if so, why?
oh ... and I don't smoke but I'm told that I don't need to!
I like how cell phones are able to display the cell they are currently working in.
Are the XDAII's able to do this? All I have seen displayed is the carrier.
I did notice a program in the forums, but that didn't display the cell names only a code. Plus this program had a lot of features I don't need, all I want is the cell/tower name.
This information can't be coded into the phones as new towers are poping up here in oz all the time, so the towers must be sending this info out.
Blaze_au said:
I like how cell phones are able to display the cell they are currently working in.
Are the XDAII's able to do this? All I have seen displayed is the carrier.
I did notice a program in the forums, but that didn't display the cell names only a code. Plus this program had a lot of features I don't need, all I want is the cell/tower name.
This information can't be coded into the phones as new towers are poping up here in oz all the time, so the towers must be sending this info out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Many phones can display even more! Nokia NetMonitor can display TimeAdvance (it means DISTANCE) from seven closest cells (BTS). In a smart device (such as XDA) it could be used for navigation. All you need is a database of cells with they coordinates. Then, if you know your distance to at least 3 of them, you can calculate your position. It is the same principle as GPS. One could create a "GPS driver" which will provide coordinate information to standard GPS map software so you'll have GPS without the need of GPS card - but less accurate.
So the only question is: if Nokia (and other GSM phones) is able to retrieve and display the distance from 7 closest cells, is XDA able to do so?
I was watching the idiot box the other day and it indicated that due to the 911 phone issue and requirement, all mobile phones were required to be able to be located to an address when calling 911, and thus all phones were required to have GPS unit installed, is this correct?
If that is so, are these phones illegal in the US as they dont have one, or do they have one and we dont know about it?
In the UK it is possible to track a mobile phone, and is done with 999 call in certain circumstances a number of ways. But I don't believe they use GPS in any of them yet. the main way is to tri-anglated (spelt sommit like that!) where the signal came from, which pin-points it to a faily small, but not perfect, radius.
The US are normally slightly more advanced with that sort of thing, but probably use a similar system.
Sorry, I just read your post again, the located to an address might be what we in UK do as a Subscriber Check, which is how we locate the owners of mobile phones in the police in UK. It can only be done in certain circumstances again, due to human rights, data protections, etc etc. But does not locate where the phone is when the signal was made, instead informs us who owns and registered the phone, and to what address.
Great if the phone is a contract phone.... But with PAYG it's not always that simple... you can pick these up anywhere now, and some people don't bother registering them...
When you use your mobile phone it can usually communicate with more than 1 base station & pick the nearest, it will also identify which transmitter on the base station has the strongest signal. You may also move between base stations as signal strength varies.
This information along with the amount of time to send & receive a signal can be used to identify the location of the mobile.
If the mobile can only see 1 base station it can be used to identify the location of the mobile in relation to the base station along with the distance.
If it can see 2 or more base stations it can be used to triangulate location.
Hope this helps.
Mike
Operators are required to upgrade their networks to support E911 service and have (I seem to remember) until November 2006 to complete said upgrade. There is presently no provision requiring individual handsets to provide GPS coordinates - or any other location-indicating function. There are several initiatives being explored that, if they come to fruition, would require location-reporting functions to be an integral part of new handsets.
Many of the dumb phones (Motorola etc) do already have some kind of GPS receiver, mostly AGPS (Assisted GPS) where the mobile network provides time, ephemeris and almanach, and the receiver only needs to listen to the sat time.
But only the HP iPAQ 6515 and 6915 have a similar chip at the moment, other smartphones or Pocket PC phones (like the Universal) don't have it. With all the hype around LBS it won't take long, maybe two or three generations of devices, until this is standard anyhow.
The E911 compliance has been delayed over and over again, and will be delayed through november. To cite the late Douglas Adams "I like deadlines, especially the swooshing sound they make when they pass by."
I was told by my friend who works at Sprint today that they will be unlocking the GPS in Quarter 4 of this year.
She said that originally they did not unlock it as they were having issues with the hardware and software, but are prepping to unlock it soon to us.
Sorry if this has been put out there already, but thought I would share what I heard. hopeful anyway, huh?
Is this guy a reliable source of info? Or is he a rep who hears stuff through the grapevine like the rest of us? (I've heard some crazy misunderstood info coming from people who "work for sprint")
Over at ppcgeeks.com someone dissasembled their Mogul and the general conclusion was that the GPS had been disabled via hardware, although they admit they're not sure.
The rumor also was that it would be available to us with the Rev A update due to come out soon. Although no one knew for sure where this info came from. Could be someone made it up, wishful thinking.
So, yes, this rumor has been around, but we're still waiting for someone to actually confirm it.
Honestly, I'll beleive it when I see it.
Dishe said:
Is this guy a reliable source of info? Or is he a rep who hears stuff through the grapevine like the rest of us? (I've heard some crazy misunderstood info coming from people who "work for sprint")
Over at ppcgeeks.com someone dissasembled their Mogul and the general conclusion was that the GPS had been disabled via hardware, although they admit they're not sure.
The rumor also was that it would be available to us with the Rev A update due to come out soon. Although no one knew for sure where this info came from. Could be someone made it up, wishful thinking.
So, yes, this rumor has been around, but we're still waiting for someone to actually confirm it.
Honestly, I'll beleive it when I see it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This person is a software engineer at Sprint, and she said that the reason they didn't have it unlocked in the beginning was due to a hardware/software conflict, but that it will be unlocked in an upcoming ROM update. She said that Sprint had announced it somewhere internally.
I have a few contacts in sprint, I'll try verifying this tommorow
From what I understand, the Mogul has A-GPS. This is the same GPS that allows them to find you if you make an emergency call. It does not work off sattelites but rather from cell towers.
On the bright side, it shares the same Qualcomm 7200 chip that the Kaiser will use.
Some maintain that the Kaiser has built in GPS, others claim it has no satellite antenna and requires an external antenna.
Sprint originally advertised the phone as having GPS. Now that has been removed from their advertisement.
It will be ineresting to see what will happen with the evdo rev. a upgrade later this year.
rambo6 said:
From what I understand, the Mogul has A-GPS. This is the same GPS that allows them to find you if you make an emergency call. It does not work off sattelites but rather from cell towers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly. The bottom line from what I understand is that the Mogul does not have the built-in hardware to do full GPS that will work with independent mapping software (Google, etc).
[RANT]This is getting a bit old - people claiming that A-GPS does not work off satellites.
Please do some research before posting this type of mis-information.
A-GPS is Assisted GPS. It uses information from the cellular network to ASSIST the GPS for faster TTFF.
And the Mogul uses a different chipset than the Kaiser. One uses the 7200, while the other 7500.[/RANT]
Ok... so now that you ranted... is it your opinion that the Mogul will or will not be able to do full GPS?
And actually.... A-GPS doesn't directly work off of the satellites. Since it takes a long time for a cell phone device to download the positioning data from the GPS satellites, what the A-GPS system does is let the A-GPS servers at the cell towers download and accumulate the data, the cell phones then talk to the A-GPS servers to get the data (which happens within seconds).
When A-GPS is enabled, would it have the possibility to work with Mobile GMaps ? Or is the Java still restricted?
Don't we have A-GPS already enabled? Isn't that the little GPS icon in the phone dialer? I know I have the option to turn it off/on in the phone settings just like all other agps handsets.
If something is going to be "enabled" with a new update, that means it will most likely be real standalone GPS.
TC1, no one knows that for sure. It was speculated.
I AM POSTING THIS FOR THE LAST TIME
The Mogul has the Qualcomm msm7500 as its cpu. BUILT INTO the cpu is the gpsone chipset. This is able to achieve AGPS as well as GPS. It runs in 4 different modes. To have the serial link to work with applications the chipset must be run in standalone mode.
It is on the damn phone as it is part of the cpu! It is currently not in standalone mode so there is no way to access the chip. The only true thing up in the air is whether or not the phone can obtain a satellite lock in standalone mode.
Dishe said:
Don't we have A-GPS already enabled? Isn't that the little GPS icon in the phone dialer? I know I have the option to turn it off/on in the phone settings just like all other agps handsets.
If something is going to be "enabled" with a new update, that means it will most likely be real standalone GPS.
TC1, no one knows that for sure. It was speculated.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Correct, like almost every modern cell phone, A-GPS is enabled. There is no debate there.
I agree with you regarding speculation on the "stand-alone GPS" aspect. I've never seen definitive info from HTC that says yes or no on this subject. If there is real info regarding this, some links would be nice.
HTC's site says:
It is widely rumored that this phone has a GPS chip that has been disabled. Will there be a hack or workaround to enable GPS capabilities?
Answer: Not likely, it is AGPS which requires a connected call to get data location.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sonix6 said:
HTC's site says:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thats from their wiki site, so its not necessarily true
/me keeps fingers crossed
This would be good news. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed for this.
gpsone (in most all msm chipsets including kaiser and mogul):
How gpsOne Works:
The gpsOne technology functions in four different modes of operation. Chosen automatically or specified by software, the
four modes are Standalone GPS, Mobile Station (MS)-based, MS-assisted and MS-assisted/Hybrid. In the A-GPS modes,
gpsOne technology utilizes assistance data from a location server in the wireless network in combination with A-GPS circuitry
and software in the wireless device.
Note: The common term used by standards bodies for the handset/terminal device in CDMA2000 is "Mobile Station" (MS) and in WCDMA (UMTS)/GPRS/GSM/HSDPA/EDGE is
“User Equipment” (UE). For simplicity in this document, references to the handset/terminal will be "MS," but this use implies both MS and UE.
Standalone GPS: The GPS receiver calculates a position without using any assistance data and without a connection to
the wireless network.
MS-Based: The GPS receiver calculates the position using assistance data from a location server to increase cold-start
sensitivity and reduce the start time for an initial position calculation.
MS-Assisted: The GPS receiver uses assistance data from a location server to make measurements related to its distance
from the GPS satellites, then sends this information to the location server where the position is calculated. This mode also
increases cold start sensitivity and reduces the start time for an initial position calculation.
MS-Assisted/Hybrid: Wireless network information is added to GPS measurements as part of the position calculation by
the location server, integrating the relative strengths of GPS information and available wireless network location information
for increased positioning reliability in difficult GPS environments.
In assisted operation, a gpsOne-enabled handset receives
a small “assistance data” message from a network location
server using standardized protocols
• The handset then reads information from GPS satellites to
measure its distance from all the satellites it can see (called
“ranging” information).
• The handset then uses this ranging information to create a
position “fix,” or sends the ranging information back to the
server where it can be combined with network information
to produce an even better fix.
• gpsOne also operates in Standalone mode, without requiring
any assistance data from the network
straight from the gpsOne document.
interesting indeed... question is, will Sprint release firmware that allows it to run in standalone mode?
I suppose the truth is, even if it doesn't, someone can figure out how to enable it with some sort of hack eventually since its just software controlled according to this document.
has anyone played with this reg key?
\HKCU\ControlPanel\PhoneExtendFunction\CDMA\GPSOneSetting = 0
Edit: the value does not contain a space between "GPSOne" and "Setting", but vbulletin modifies my text when i post....
I don't know if this info helps or not... I spoke to a HTC TS and they told me the 6800 has GPS but is sprint decision to enable it or not. He also told me that it can be unlock but sprint is the only one with the code and he can not provide me with that info.
New poster old reader, may be found some info.
I found Many info that may me can help somebodies about the msm 7500 (gpsOne technologie)...It is hard to know what to believe 'cause half/half
people say that this is impossible, and the other half say that gonna happen soon. I think that we should make our own idea by our own knowledge . I found many topic on many forum (htc, gpsunderground,here...ask me if interressed) One Qualcomm offical site i've got pdf about msm chips, and gpsOne tech... (Snap track location service for gpsOne may be a good start point to invest)
Interessing link's:
FCC test repport for tita100 (titan) (That include plane mode settings):
https://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas...lledFromFrame=N&application_id=391628&fcc_id=
Here it seem to be codes:
http://www.wlt.net.cn/index0/FD-800/pdf/CNI FD-800 gpsOne Menual ver1 0_0117.pdf
Similar:
http://www.wlt.net.cn/index0/FD-800/pdf/FD-800_Application_Guide ver1 0(1).pdf
And found other about SDK from Qualcomm API's seem to be aivalaible to third party dev. Also seem to be hard to be registred as dev. But hope...
And if internal budies have code it is just a time question before a solution.
So i wish that i'm not making more mistake or false info...if tell me.
And for gps freak who will tell that different anthenna needed, diffrent frequencies for GPS...see the end of the document FD-800 manual (2nd link).
So thank for this helpfull forum, forgive my poor english expression, and lack of programming knoledge , my is disignig pcb, and electrical pannels, but not to programme them's( not enough )...
I'm trying to develope an application for my Trinity, and I'm currently thinking of implementing a GPS function to track down my current position.
But: I've heard there also are other metods to find out your position, by triangling the GSM-bases, using GPRS-position(???) and also, I've seen a service that uses SMS(??? It says you can send a SMS to a server, and it will find out where you are...=)
Now, which one of these are pure misunderstandings, and which one does work?
I've heard of a application that that uses GSM-bases to triangling the position, and it actually works...
So my second part is, anyone knows how to implement this is C# ?
It can be done...
neofix said:
I've heard there also are other metods to find out your position, by triangling the GSM-bases, using GPRS-position(???)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't help you on how to do it, but I know an app that does. Google Maps works this way. It finds my location within about 1Km using GPRS. I don't have GSP on my phone. It only works is some locations. For example, at my house (in a rural area) it doesn't work. I am guessing this is either because I have only one base providing service, or that base is missing certain features.
Good luck on finding a solution to implement this. It can be done somehow.
PhilD41 said:
I can't help you on how to do it, but I know an app that does. Google Maps works this way. It finds my location within about 1Km using GPRS. I don't have GSP on my phone. It only works is some locations. For example, at my house (in a rural area) it doesn't work. I am guessing this is either because I have only one base providing service, or that base is missing certain features.
Good luck on finding a solution to implement this. It can be done somehow.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great, that means that there is actually something called GPRS-positioning, now the 10 billion dollar question is how to implement this
Yes, the Google Maps "location" feature works well for me in USA. It locates the nearest cel towers to my device...good luck with your project.
i don't know about GPRS-positioning, but i do know for sure that Google Maps doesn't use it like PhilD41 said, Google Maps tries to figure out your location using cell phone towers around you. Cell Tower Triangulation, i think is the term. you can search that term and see how to implement it
Azimuth21 said:
i don't know about GPRS-positioning, but i do know for sure that Google Maps doesn't use it like PhilD41 said, Google Maps tries to figure out your location using cell phone towers around you. Cell Tower Triangulation, i think is the term. you can search that term and see how to implement it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh right then - Been trying to search bit for Cell Tower Triangulation, and found some interesting threads- unfortunatly for me, nonen that describes how to actually triangulate though But so far, I'm very thankfull for all the replies here
here is how it works:
http://www.cim.mcgill.ca/~simra/publications/Thesis/node12.html
and Iphone has already similar software... so if you want to back engineer it: http://technology.slashgeo.org/technology/08/01/03/0440258.shtml
mahsoud said:
here is how it works:
http://www.cim.mcgill.ca/~simra/publications/Thesis/node12.html
and Iphone has already similar software... so if you want to back engineer it: http://technology.slashgeo.org/technology/08/01/03/0440258.shtml
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hehe! Now, just to find a way to implement this... Still haven't managed to get any closer to a soultion... :|
Navizon Virtual GPS
Check this out, this program already does what you want:
http://www.navizon.com/navizon_v-gps.asp
It has tracking by gps and virtual gps (gsm bases, wifi)
Hope this helps!
Greetz Bas
neofix said:
I've heard there also are other metods to find out your position, by triangling the GSM-bases
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you're thinking of Assisted GPS. You operator and cell towers' equipement needs to support this for it to work.
rev3nant said:
I think you're thinking of Assisted GPS. You operator and cell towers' equipement needs to support this for it to work.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi! Thanks for the reply, I belive this is something else then assisted GPS... Since the A-GPS, as you said needs a A-GPS server on the operator-side, while triangulation only needs three cell towers.... (Less accuracy, but still)
bas.bootsveld said:
Check this out, this program already does what you want:
http://www.navizon.com/navizon_v-gps.asp
It has tracking by gps and virtual gps (gsm bases, wifi)
Hope this helps!
Greetz Bas
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the reply!
This is the kind of feature I want to implement, but I need to find out how to do this in coding...
Hi,
some interesting for you i hope.
As far as I can work out GoogleMaps uses the navizon database to triangulate your position. Navizon uses freely donates gps+wifi data.
Here's my slightly informed opinion, from best to worst
connected/Inbuilt GPS: most accurate u will get
Navizon: probably as good as AGPS but i think better as it triangulates on phone mast details and (if u have wifi built in) wifi router details (see website for this cool feature)
A-GPS: next most accurate you will get.
No such thing as SMS/GPRS location. This is in fact a service provided by companies who use a mobile phone operators databases to triangulate your position (API licenses cost between £500 and £2000 in UK PER operator!!!) . So not much better than AGPS but a method (with a cost).
Can you do this in c#? yes. download Visual Studio 2008 90-day trial edition and you'll find a GPS application ready and waiting. Its a bit buggy but a g8 starting point.
If you simply want to get gps position for an app without having to code anything, you might want to wait a little and download my next GPSSpot application. It will save the current GPS position to a registry key for other apps to use.
seanpu1 said:
Hi,
some interesting for you i hope.
As far as I can work out GoogleMaps uses the navizon database to triangulate your position. Navizon uses freely donates gps+wifi data.
Here's my slightly informed opinion, from best to worst
connected/Inbuilt GPS: most accurate u will get
Navizon: probably as good as AGPS but i think better as it triangulates on phone mast details and (if u have wifi built in) wifi router details (see website for this cool feature)
A-GPS: next most accurate you will get.
No such thing as SMS/GPRS location. This is in fact a service provided by companies who use a mobile phone operators databases to triangulate your position (API licenses cost between £500 and £2000 in UK PER operator!!!) . So not much better than AGPS but a method (with a cost).
Can you do this in c#? yes. download Visual Studio 2008 90-day trial edition and you'll find a GPS application ready and waiting. Its a bit buggy but a g8 starting point.
If you simply want to get gps position for an app without having to code anything, you might want to wait a little and download my next GPSSpot application. It will save the current GPS position to a registry key for other apps to use.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow! Nice reply sir!
But this really starts to stirr around my noodles - since I have a Iphone here, without a GPS, and it can give me a +- 100/200 m accuracy on where I'm using cell tower triangulation...
When it comes to the GPS-part, I've coded it finished, so I'm just so curious on how the author has done it... Is it using some sort of cell-tower location database? Hmm... I've tried to mail the developer, but without luck
But, when it comes to my app, I think NaviZone is the way to go...
if iPhone has wifi (which i believe it does) Navizone is the way forward. It will consume more power as your wifi has to be on. But it will only work in areas that have been "surveyed" by donating users.
(btw its also good to find local free hot-spots/unblocked wifi routers)
btw, cell-tower location databases have a VERY wide range in accuracy. Firstly its dependent on the accuracy of the cell knowing its own GPS position (big discussion came to my mind on how interesting that is, but I'll leave this out for now). Then dependent on the number of cells used in the calculation (the more cells the better.) So, inner city regions get fair to good accuracy, but out in the country accuracy drops to >1000m radius.
I'd be interested to know what the iPhone is like for accuracy out in the sticks, and whether they use NaviZone or a similar service.