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I'll try to make it as simple as I can.
Here is what I want:
CyanogenMod with root privileges
Full control over which app, service or system component can access my data and the Internet.
(at the moment for instance I can't alter the "network access" privileges of my apps)
Safe to use speech recognition software
Safe to use, sophisticated navigation software
My questions:
Is that even achievable without a ton of work?
Is there a simple way to flash CyanogenMod without pre-installed bloatware? (e.g. Google apps, Skype, Cortana, ...)
Which tools should I use to make sure that apps can only access what I want them to?
Is there speech recognition software for Android that doesn't require Internet access?
Is there a navigation app that is capable of using the offline maps of Google Maps without requiring an Internet connection?
(e.g. Google Maps makes itself useless if you don't update from their servers every 30 days)
From your experience, do apps refuse to work when you deny certain privileges?
ferivon said:
I'll try to make it as simple as I can.
Here is what I want:
CyanogenMod with root privileges
Full control over which app, service or system component can access my data and the Internet.
(at the moment for instance I can't alter the "network access" privileges of my apps)
Safe to use speech recognition software
Safe to use, sophisticated navigation software
My questions:
Is that even achievable without a ton of work?
Is there a simple way to flash CyanogenMod without pre-installed bloatware? (e.g. Google apps, Skype, Cortana, ...)
Which tools should I use to make sure that apps can only access what I want them to?
Is there speech recognition software for Android that doesn't require Internet access?
Is there a navigation app that is capable of using the offline maps of Google Maps without requiring an Internet connection?
(e.g. Google Maps makes itself useless if you don't update from their servers every 30 days)
From your experience, do apps refuse to work when you deny certain privileges?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dude- You should start developing your own rom in this case.
But consfused here and at this point i think you dont know.
CyanogenMod & Cyanogen OS
Assuming- when you said, cortana etc etc--- i think you are on cyanogen OS.. Which is the original OS for 1+1.
1- To achieve, you need to work.
2- Some optimized COS builds in XDA one android dev section- try a search. but not latest 13.1.2-ZNH2KAS3P0. Root using SuperSU. and use system app uninstaller to remove apps you dont need. Some debloater zips also lurking around in XDA. If you install CyanogenMod, then no need of gapps flashing if you dont use google account.
3. you can stop background data for the apps you dont want. Settings in most roms.
4. Speech recognition can be used offline after u download all languages of your choice. Not 100% and dont use it.
5. Try Maps.me. i didnt know google map needed to be force updated every 30 days unless some one restructures the entire landscape and routes.
6. Certain apps refuse to work if you dont grant permission. yes. its like telling some 1 without hands to eat from hand,.
:good:
Thank you so much for your reply. I indeed did not know that there is a difference between Cyanogen OS and CyanogenMod. But if I understood you correctly, CyanogenMod comes without gapps. (I hope it also comes without Google Play Services?)
The offline speech recognition you linked to seems to be from Google. I bet it will require Google Play Services and an Internet connection after some time, just like Google Maps does and I'm really afraid of that.
I might give Maps.me a try, but I think Google Maps still has by far the best most detailed and correct maps especially when it comes to POIs.
I would consider using official Google Maps, if there was a 100% safe way to wipe all the data the app collects before I allow it to update the maps. Alternatively, maybe I could download the apps from a second device and just copy the map data over to my main device every once in a while.
An even more crazy approach might be to spoof the time/date data for Google Maps so that it thinks the 30 days haven't been reached yet.
But I would still be very concerned about Google Play Services. Would microG be sufficient for my purposes to replace Google Play Services?
edit:
Okay, I have a rooted CyanogenMod without gapps now on my OPO.
edit2:
I have Xposed with modules "Xprivacy" and "Per App Hacking" installed now.
Xprivacy is an app permission manager and "Per App Hacking" can be used to spoof the system time an app will see. Hopefully I'll be able to fool Google Maps with it.
edit3:
I have microG installed now. Hopefully this will be enough to run Google Maps.
I really need to make sure I understand Xprivacy before that though.
My recommendations:
1. I recommend full device encryption with long and secure boot password and easy to use pin lock screen password. Here's more info: http://forum.xda-developers.com/general/security/guide-separate-passwords-encrypted-t3048072
2. Get an email address from a provider that respects user privacy i.e. Riseup. https://riseup.net/
This is one the most important things to do if you don't want google / yahoo / microsoft scanning your email for surveillance / marketing purposes.
3. Use apps from F-Droid. It's an app "store" for open source apps.
4. Always use Afwall+ to have control over which apps have access to internet. Even better if you use Afwall with combination of Orbot. This way you can route some apps through tor (need a custom script though). Orwall does the same thing more easily.
5. Instead of closed source Supersu, use open source superuser http://forum.xda-developers.com/android/software-hacking/wip-selinux-capable-superuser-t3216394
6. For maps I recommend openstreetmap. Download Osmand from F-Droid. It has navigation too.
7. For cellbased location provider, use unified location provider found from F-droid. It's connected to microg projects.
8. For encrypted SMS use Silence from F-droid (recipient needs the same app if you use encryption).
9. For encrypted instant messaging use Conversations (XMPP client) from F-DROID. Or Riot (which will soon have strong encryption).
Hey tofu thanks for your answer, I appreciate it!
I'm only really concerned about my phones software spying on me.
About the email thing: I'm running my own email server for that.
But I'm still looking for a way to anonymously creating a google account without providing my phone number.
I'm using F-Droid already and it's great.
I'll never go back to the play store that's for sure.
And for anyone else reading this, please don't touch the amazon app store, it's pure poison.
I'm also using AFWall+ already, but I'm not satisfied at all. The creator doesn't really seem to care about ensuring that no data gets leaked ever. I read a lot of reports that data was being leaked every once in a while, especially during system boots.
This is really scary to me... I'd really like to have a safer firewall.
Blocking Internet/networking permissions directly just causes apps and the system to become extremely unstable. I soft-bricked my phone like 5 times while playing around with it the last few days.
I was not aware supersu was closed source. I'll switch to the open source alternative soon.
I just installed OsmAnd~ and I'm not very satisfied. Navigation was ok, the tts voice was absolutely terrible and I wasn't able to find a single POI, I wouldn't even be surprised if it would fail to find the next McDonald's to my place. Google Maps just seems completely unmatched to me.
And about that: I was actually able to get Google Maps running without Google Play Services installed and I was able to successfully use it offline, spoofing the system time for that app, so that my maps would never become outdated. I notices a few downsides though, for example it only works for car navigation (bicycle mode etc are not available). After completing the installation of all the microG components I wasn't able to get it to work anymore though (I couldn't download the offline maps, because I couldn't enter my google account data anymore...).
But I'll figure out how I did it and go with Google Maps then.
To complete the microG installation I installed unifiedNlp with GSMLocationNlpBackend.
For encrypted messaging I'll probably be forced to stay with WhatsApp, as I can't possibly convince all of my friends to switch. But hey at least WhatsApp claims that your messages are end-to-end encrypted.
But obviously WhatsApp will always know who I know... that problem seems pretty much unfixable to me though...
I have btw also tried to get Google Now (speech recognition) to work offline. But I was unsuccessful. I have read reports of others getting it to work for literal voice to text applications... it won't take voice commands though. So that's not very useful... unless there was a way to define your own voice commands somehow.
But my biggest worry at the moment really is the firewall. I feel like there is nothing that you can really trust to work reliably.
And also the fact that Xprivacy can't restrict file access to certain folders... it's either all or nothing.
The worst of all might actually be IPC though (inter process communication) which a lot of apps require permissions for. And from what I understand any app with that permission could use another app as a sort of proxy to access the Internet.
I'm using a Google-free device with maximum privacy, so maybe I can not answer all your questions but I can give you an idea. First of all - disclaimer: I'm here because my girlfriend has an Oneplus One (OPO), but I do not have one. I use her old Nexus 5 (N5), but you will get the general idea. You already noticed there is a difference between CyanogenOS (COS) and CyanogenMod (CM). It also took me a while to figure out that difference. If you still have a stock Android in your OPO, it should be a COS 13.1 which is based on Android 6.0.1 and comes with alot of bloatware from Google and Microsoft.
1. First step is to find a suitable ROM for your needs. If you are used to COS and have not much experience in chosing custom ROMs, you should give CM a try. Here is the official wiki which includes Download links and installation instructions: https://wiki.cyanogenmod.org/w/Bacon_Info
2. The 2nd step after installing CM is the full device encryption, can be found in Settings > Security. If you do it on a clean phone without any apps and data it only takes a couple of minutes and chances of breaking stuff are low at this step.
3. Now I usually root it (with SuperSU) and install some magic which is called XPOSED framework. It's something which allows you to install modules on your phone on system level, not like an Appstore, but rather like a Tweakstore. There are a lot if chances you break stuff and most of the modules do not work with CM, however, one module to beat them all is the XPRIVACY module. It gives you back full control on everything. You can manage App permissions, you can fake permissions or if apps do not want to run with your set of permissions, you can even feed fake data (like wrong GPS signals, etc.). Read more here. http://repo.xposed.info/module/biz.bokhorst.xprivacy
4. F-Droid, yeah, the one open-source repository for your new apps. I'll install it at this point.
5. Now, that the device is flashed with CM, probably rooted and with a custom recovery, you have to flash a stock recovery again and lock the bootloader. Stock recovery because it does not allow any malicious party (hacker with physical access, police, intelligence services, etc.) to deploy any code to your phone which compromises your privacy. Locked bootloader is important to disallow any malicious party to boot anything they want which also compromises your privacy.
And this is pretty much what you need to get started, a rock solid environment free from Google. Make sure you have a strong PIN, I also use randomized screen locker, so people can not "observe" the way you enter your PIN.
For encrypted calls and SMS there is Signal, but that does not work without Google services and LibreSignal, the Websockets version, was discontinued just recently. For encrypted IM use ChatSecure rather than Conversations. Both are XMPP clients, but Conversations does not allow you to import or export OTR keys, which is very annoying for an Jabber client. For not so sensitive chats, I use telegram.
Finally, not having Google Play and Google Services available, makes the experience a totally different for the android device. Apps like Snapchat which do not require Google, but still do for some unknown reasons checks for Google, wont run. Also, a lot of apps work without Google, but you can't install them without downloading suspicious APKs from dubious websites. Be very carefull from where you download and install software if you can not find what you need in F-Droid.
I hope that helps you for your considerations.
---
Edit, one more final note. I also use OsmAnd and have to say it never let me down on any occasion (except when I forgot to download the maps before going somewhere remote without internet). The geodata quality is excellent in most urban areas, but the interace and usability are a mess. If you find your way around in the interface, the navigation works out pretty well. I sometimes have issues calculating very long routes, but you start to live with that.
Thanks for your input 5chdn! Most of the stuff you mentioned it already on my phone.
I made some progress yesterday and I'd like to share my current configuration:
All the apps I mention in this post are (at the time of writing) available in F-Droid, unless stated otherwise.
Everything I mention in this post is free and open source, unless stated otherwise.
Recovery Image: TWRP
ROM: CyanogenMod
'Apps' that have to be flashed:
SuperUser (this roots your phone which means you can grant root access to apps)
Xposed (provides a lot of important privacy tools)
Apps:
F-Droid (app store that provides free open source apps)
AFWall+ (manage which app can access the Internet)
Autostarts (manage triggers that apps can use to start themselves)
AdAway (can remove ads from apps)
Xposed Modules:
BootManager (manage which apps can start on boot)
Xprivacy (manage/spoof app permissions for privacy)
Safely using Google Maps offline permanently:
Please note: Google Maps is not open source.
Install microG (open source alternative to Google Play Services)
The installation complete installation consists of:
'microG Services Core' (aka 'GsmCore') (app)
At the time of writing this app is NOT available in F-Droid. This app also automatically installs 'µg unifiedNlp (NO GAPPS)' for you.
'microG Services Framework Proxy' (aka 'GsfProxy') (app)
'FakeGapps' (Xposed module)
'FakeStore' (app)
'XposedGmsCoreUnifiedNlp' (Xposed module)
'LocalGsmNlpBackend' (app)
'NominatimNlpBackend' (app)
'µg unifiedNlp (NO GAPPS)' (app) (will be installed automatically!)
Install 'Per App Hacking' (Xposed module)
Use this module to spoof the system time/date that Google Maps sees e.g. to '2016-10-14 10:00' so that offline maps don't become outdated. The feature to spoof the time is called 'time machine'.
I would really like to improve what I got so far and share it with the community.
If you know of anything that could help improve privacy please tell me.
I do not mention things like device encryption, passwords, lock screens etc, as these are a separate issue.
All features, full flexibility, no bloat -- one simple solution!
On the one hand, it is frequently being suggested to build into Lineage various apps and features. Most of these suggestions are required by some users only, would bloat the core ROM, or have other downsides. On the other hand, these apps and features are usually already implemented somewhere, most users want incremental updates and many would prefer a fully-featured ROM without GApps installed.
To satisfy those wishes and yet avoid the downsides, I suggest simply supporting F-Droid and microG instead:
Idea outline:
Provide API for and build in F-Droid Privileged Extension
Thus have a Store, with automatic updates, and all bells and whistles
Ship with (rebranded fork of) F-Droid pre-installed and a custom LineageOS repository pre-configured (like Guardian Project in F-Droid)
Add AOSP apps, Lineage apps and Lineage-specific versions / branches of apps to LineageOS repository
Use "unstable update" marker in F-Droid to beta test new versions, e.g. of launcher, locker, ...
For additional, bloating apps and features, have users install what's already there (for instance, Location Services: UnifiedNLP with LocalWifiNlpBackend)
Add to Lineage Wiki a curated list of well-tested app suggestions for basic tasks (for instance, WebDAV: DAVdroid, Tasker, Etar, ...).
Key Advantages:
Developer effort most efficiently used
Faster time to market, because much is already implemented
Higher quality, less bloat, more features by referring users to existing apps and joining efforts
Easier innovation, because versions of pre-installed / system apps are publishable like regular apps
Developers happy, because LineageOS is clean at its core
Enthusiasts happy, because they can built on a minimal ROM
End Users happy, because they can easily use ROM, using curated list of apps
Regular, normal app updates for all system apps and pre-installed apps through Lineage repository
Does not prevent using GApps, but improves life without
Major step towards fully featured ROM, and yet without any proprietary apps or services
For good reasons, it's what Google does, it's what GNU/Linux distributions do.
One framework will solve most problems, provide most features ever suggested.
This will make everybody happy.
tldr
Bump!!!!
1, 2, 3 - Fully agree. If I had a proper Play Store alternative I wouldn't need Gapps at all.
4 - Essential in what way? I'd say its best to have only AOSP apps and to let every user download the apps he uses.
There would be practically no bloatware available and the ROM would truly give users the best choices.
8 - Additional preinstalled apps? Rather not.
9 - Rather AOSP mail. Someone might not want to use K-9, but for those who do they can always download it.
10 - Same as 9, avoid preinstalling apps that are already provided by AOSP.
11 - Eleven is OK for me, but still I find it somehow way underpowered. I really miss Apollo from early CM days...
14, 15 - I agree on ROM type. Allow users to select nightly, weekly or stable update channel through settings. Regarding basic preloaded apps, it would be OK only by means of AROMA installer where you could choose which ones you actually want/need.
Cheers!
In this thread it is being suggested to build into Lineage various Launchers, Themes, Widgets, Apps, WebDAV support, et cetera. As a contrasting response to that, I suggest simply supporting F-Droid and microG instead. A Lineage repository for F-Droid could include all AOSP apps; F-Droids own repository would supplement this.
It appears to me, almost everything which has been popularly requested would thereby be solved.
dj_chapz said:
4 - Essential in what way? I'd say its best to have only AOSP apps and to let every user download the apps he uses.
There would be practically no bloatware available and the ROM would truly give users the best choices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Here, "essential" refers to, more or less, what's needed to install other apps (launcher, browser, file manager),
but could be thought of as to include functions, which were typical for feature phones, too (basic messenger, dailer, calendar).
dj_chapz said:
8 - Additional preinstalled apps? Rather not.
9 - Rather AOSP mail. Someone might not want to use K-9, but for those who do they can always download it.
10 - Same as 9, avoid preinstalling apps that are already provided by AOSP.
11 - Eleven is OK for me, but still I find it somehow way underpowered. I really miss Apollo from early CM days...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
These were just written-out to illustrate what would be possible.
I'll adjust the original post for clarity.
Anybody can fork it and add their ideas. Some people do not want to support fdroid. Keep it clean + gapps.
goorek said:
Anybody can fork it and add their ideas. Some people do not want to support fdroid. Keep it clean + gapps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Even if F-droid wasn't preinstalled, could be a Lineage repo for it?
LineageOS IMHO should really seek to become the ROM for professional PIM, self-employed, small-business or even big-business device users which seek to avoid GApps and rely on a clean slim ROM. So I like many of grefnab's ideas but currently have no clear idea what the stakeholders of LineageOS have as main goals for the midterm.
Having everything App based in an "FOSS App Package" (as GApps and commercial/device App replacement) with advanced support by LineageOS and/or other main CustomROMs would be geat. See my post in What features would you like to see in Lineage that CM didn't have?
support 1-3
I really hope that this thread will get recognition. I really like the idea of having priviliged F-Droid build into the ROM.
That would make everything much easier.
I fully support the three first points
Provide API for and build in F-Droid Privileged Extensio
Thus have a Store, with automatic updates, and all bells and whistles
Ship with F-Droid pre-installed and a custom LineageOS repository (like Guardian Project) pre-configured
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The rest is nice but I would put emphasis on the first three points. They seem like a real advantage to have.
Rephrased some sentences to clarify
This seems like a very good idea to me :good:
I mean it is basically the same procedure Google has in place to keep its apps up-to-date without people having to update their firmwares. Being able to update the apps independently from the rom would be a huge benefit in my opinion. While I don't use gapps on my phone at all, I understand, that some people find it essential. Therefore it would be a bad idea if this interfered with installing gapps in any way.
herrritschwumm said:
While I don't use gapps on my phone at all, I understand, that some people find it essential. Therefore it would be a bad idea if this interfered with installing gapps in any way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This would not prevent installing GApps, it would simplify and improve usage without them, though.
+1 for having LOS F-droid repo and bundling F-droid and having fewer other preinstalled apps.
I think this thread is a very good idea!
Just a clarification on technicalities:
microG kinda requires signature spoofing. More specifically MicroG effectively has two principal frameworks inside -- location services and GCM. Location services would work regardless, but iirc for GCM to work properly the ROM itself would need a signature spoofing support. All other ways to enable spoofing employing needlepatch or whatever are ridiculously impractical and one cannot expect normal users to bother with them.
I have two phones (OP1 and OP3) and for both the choice is of exactly ONE custom rom only (based on LineageOS14.1) with a spoofing patch. Therefore applying spoofing patch into the main code base would be great. However the caveat here is that any app or framework like SafetyNET would most likely stop working. Since the developers decided to push for compatibility, I seriously doubt that they would implement signature spoofing.
They could try to implement the patch in a flashable zip like with root but I don't know if it is possible.
fully agree for spoofing support since we are out ot cm
Sent from my Nexus 5 CAF using Tapatalk
I would like to see signature spoofing built into lineageOS or an optional flashible zip, too. But right now a flashible zip could take a long time to flash. See: https://github.com/microg/android_packages_apps_GmsCore/issues/196
Sounds great.
dj_chapz said:
If I had a proper Play Store alternative I wouldn't need Gapps at all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You could try Yalp Store, it's there in the F-Droid repository.
@grefnab: My flashable zip help those that want to automatically without any effort: remove GApps, install microG and F-Droid Privileged Extension.
1plus said:
Just a clarification on technicalities:
microG kinda requires signature spoofing. More specifically MicroG effectively has two principal frameworks inside -- location services and GCM. Location services would work regardless, but iirc for GCM to work properly the ROM itself would need a signature spoofing support. All other ways to enable spoofing employing needlepatch or whatever are ridiculously impractical and one cannot expect normal users to bother with them.
However the caveat here is that any app or framework like SafetyNET would most likely stop working. Since the developers decided to push for compatibility, I seriously doubt that they would implement signature spoofing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tingle is very easy to use, if you find something impratical just tell me.
SafetyNet do pass for me.
Hi, I am looking to move away from Google and Gapps and trying to work out what is the best way to do it on a Redmi Note 7.
I have already install OrangeFox recovery and have been reading about LineageOS+MicroG for this purpose. Would like to hear comments/suggestions from anyone who has gone down this path.
Many thanks.
Even I am also looking forward on doing the same, just did in my galaxy note 3 where I installed lineage OS 16 and MicroG for the essential google services required by apps to run properly, I use only web applications except for WhatsApp, shifted to signal as my primary messenger application, F-Droid is my source of open-source apps. I guess privacy is your concern, right? Developers kindly assist on the same
SunilNair2020 said:
I installed lineage OS 16 and MicroG for the essential google services required by apps to run properly
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did a bit a research on this and found that installing MicroG requires signature spoofing be enabled on the ROM which I understand is a major security issue - this is supposed to be the reason why LineageOS do not include MicroG in their builds.
I'm using an old Zenfone 2 Laser (snapdragon 410 version) with an old LAOS MicroG 14.1 (Android 7), without those massive Google Services the phone seems to be faster than my Redmi Note 7 (no joke, it's incredible), it has f-droid preinstalled as main store and MicroG Manager, all apps works fine, the only problem is Gmail (need to use the browser version, i don't know how to set the stock email app), i really need a Google free rom on this Note 7 too
N1ck474 said:
I'm using an old Zenfone 2 Laser (snapdragon 410 version) with an old LAOS MicroG 14.1 (Android 7), without those massive Google Services the phone seems to be faster than my Redmi Note 7 (no joke, it's incredible), it has f-droid preinstalled as main store and MicroG Manager, all apps works fine, the only problem is Gmail (need to use the browser version, i don't know how to set the stock email app), i really need a Google free rom on this Note 7 too
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
According to the previous comment, upon doing some research app signatures are important for apps to work safely and without malicious code being embedded, so is there any option for using lineage OS without neither Gapps nor MicroG? Also is there any option to backup contacts in the absence of google services? Thanks again !
SunilNair2020 said:
According to the previous comment, upon doing some research app signatures are important for apps to work safely and without malicious code being embedded, so is there any option for using lineage OS without neither Gapps nor MicroG? Also is there any option to backup contacts in the absence of google services? Thanks again !
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know about contacts, with MicroG they syncs normally like a Google enabled phone, i don't actually know what this problem with signatures is (i use the Zefone as secodary phone without a SIM or important personal data), i think you need to upload all of your contacts on a Cloud (OneDrive, Drive etc) then redownload them as ICS or Calendar data on your Google-Free ROM, if you have less than 200 contacts and a modern SIM you save all of them on the SIM Card without problems.
N1ck474 said:
I don't know about contacts, with MicroG they syncs normally like a Google enabled phone, i don't actually know what this problem with signatures is (i use the Zefone as secodary phone without a SIM or important personal data), i think you need to upload all of your contacts on a Cloud (OneDrive, Drive etc) then redownload them as ICS or Calendar data on your Google-Free ROM, if you have less than 200 contacts and a modern SIM you save all of them on the SIM Card without problems.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't prefer using cloud storage as it involves storing data somewhere we don't have access to...any other alternatives? Thanks again ?
SunilNair2020 said:
I don't prefer using cloud storage as it involves storing data somewhere we don't have access to...any other alternatives? Thanks again ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know, you can actually export your contacts locally as ICS/Calendar file on an SD Card or locally (on a PC or Hard Disk), at least, i think so, never done that
SunilNair2020 said:
According to the previous comment, upon doing some research app signatures are important for apps to work safely and without malicious code being embedded, so is there any option for using lineage OS without neither Gapps nor MicroG? Also is there any option to backup contacts in the absence of google services? Thanks again !
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am not 100% sure about this but I feel if the app is widely used and no security issues have been uncovered then using it via MicroG might not be a major issue. Perhaps, someone with more experience can comment on this?
I once went on a full on no google mission.
- Lineage, no gapps, not even micro g
- apps were mostly, if not all, from fdroid
- colud (storage, backup, notes) I used nextcloud, also used mega
- davx for contacts
- search engine - startpage or sometimes DDG
- email from proton
- youtube, which unfortunately doesn't have any alternative, I used newpipe.
I'm pretty sure here I forgot a thing or two, but this was mostly it.
I was happy with my privacy though, peace of mind you know. But the experience was horrible for me, a lot of time needs to be invested for maintenance, you'll see. I was still okay with it, because I had the time for all that. But I had to sacrifice, due to lack of time to handle and keeping track of every single thing, wheather it was working or not as per my needs!!
If you have that much time, and a will to do a thing or two manually than you should go for it.
Well, imho the best way to keep your privacy AND to be able to receive push notifications and download apps from google app store (via aurora store) without the need of a google account is to install an rom which supports signature spoofing (for example crDroid, AICP, ...) or a rom that already has microg included (https://download.lineage.microg.org/lavender/ )
LOS for microg purely supports signature spoofing for the MicroG components/apps (gmscore, fakestore, ..), so imho there isn't any security issue
ssaikia3 said:
I once went on a full on no google mission.
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks very much for sharing your experience - this is exactly the sort of information I was after.
Currently, I use NoRootFirewall to block all traffic generated by Playstore Services which helps me stop Playstore Services updates. The downside is it affects apps reliant on Playstore Services such as Gmail etc. This is not a problem as I switched to my phones native email client which handles mail without any issues. Skype complained and wanted me to update Playstore Services but I continued on and was able to make a call without obvious problems. If I have to install an app, obviously I need to enable Playstore Services but once I install the app I could block Playstore Services once again. In a sense, this gives me the option of continuing on like this but was thinking of LineageOS for MicroG may be a better alternative. Would like to hear your views on this.
Many thanks
2faraway2 said:
Well, imho the best way to keep your privacy AND to be able to receive push notifications and download apps from google app store (via aurora store) without the need of a google account is to install an rom which supports signature spoofing (for example crDroid, AICP, ...) or a rom that already has microg included (https://download.lineage.microg.org/lavender/ )
LOS for microg purely supports signature spoofing for the MicroG components/apps (gmscore, fakestore, ..), so imho there isn't any security issue
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did more reading about LOS for MicroG last night, in particular this one https://blogs.fsfe.org/larma/2016/microg-signature-spoofing-security/ - while I still haven't got my head around all the security issues, I feel a lot more comfortable about them now.
Many thanks for your comment.
Hallo!
I've recently heard about ROMS,degoogling your Phone etc. and I bought this S10+ Phone. Is there a safe was to delete all bloatware,google Software and so on?
I've heard about GrapheneOS but unfortunately it's only for google devices so I was wondering what kind of solutions exist for this case. There are also phones with hardware kill switches but I'm a little bit skeptical about them.
Please tell me everything you know about this or the best pages to get an idea how to do so. I will be forever grateful
Science
This might help you:
Galaxy S10/S10+ Debloat / bloatware removal list
Please see my original post from the Galaxy S8 to see the XDA article on how to do this. https://forum.xda-developers.com/galaxy-s8/how-to/s8-debloat-bloatware-thread-t3669009 New phone, new list! I've compiled a list of most of the bloatware...
forum.xda-developers.com
I feel you. The only google crap I (want to) use is Gmail and occasionally gmaps.
Unfortunately all of Android is created to serve its master... how can you separate the two?
Lol, Apple?
Proof that unlimited power corrupts ultimately.
Thanks for your replys. I will try it out
I've been using this for 3 years.
Home - Package Disabler
The only NON-root solution that let’s you disable any unwanted packages that come pre-installed / installed with your phone / tablet.
www.packagedisabler.com
Karma Firewall (Playstore) stops the leaks and reduces battery drain by shutting Google, Samsung, etc up.
sciencebitches said:
Hallo!
I've recently heard about ROMS,degoogling your Phone etc. and I bought this S10+ Phone. Is there a safe was to delete all bloatware,google Software and so on?
I've heard about GrapheneOS but unfortunately it's only for google devices so I was wondering what kind of solutions exist for this case. There are also phones with hardware kill switches but I'm a little bit skeptical about them.
Please tell me everything you know about this or the best pages to get an idea how to do so. I will be forever grateful
Science
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Click to collapse
If your s10+ is using an exynos cpu you can install lineage os. Lineage won't work on the snapdragon variants
sciencebitches said:
Hallo!
I've recently heard about ROMS,degoogling your Phone etc. and I bought this S10+ Phone. Is there a safe was to delete all bloatware,google Software and so on?
I've heard about GrapheneOS but unfortunately it's only for google devices so I was wondering what kind of solutions exist for this case. There are also phones with hardware kill switches but I'm a little bit skeptical about them.
Please tell me everything you know about this or the best pages to get an idea how to do so. I will be forever grateful
Science
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi there sciencebitches,
I realize your original post was from 2020 and its now March 2023 so maybe this is not something your interested in anymore... maybe you have a new phone, etc. But....
The Samsung phones that are sold in North America (either Canada or US) have locked bootloaders that cannot be unlocked. So you are stuck flashing Samsung firmware that is digitaly signed by Samsung.
However, if you get an international model then you can unlock the bootloader and load custom firmware. You have a couple of choices.
LineageOSWhen loading LineageOS, you can choose to load it with or without GApps. Loading it with GApps gives you all the same Google stuff, a library known as Google Play Services, as on normal Android. Loading LineageOS without GApps gives you no Google stuff whatsoever. This is what I am running on my SM-G975F – LineageOS without GApps.
LineageOS for microGThis gives you LineageOS with a substitute library called MicroG. The MicroG library is a reimplementation of the Google Play Services that some (a lot?) of Android apps require. So, if you need to use some apps that require Google Play Services but don’t want to be overrun with Google again, then MicroG is recommended. With “pure LineageOS” (sans GApps) you get no Google Play Services whatsoever.
/e/OSThis is another implementation of LineageOS with MicroG. It is fairly polished but tries to look like iOS and so feels somewhat un-Android like. I have no first-hand experience with /e/OS.
GrapheneOS and Calyx OSThere is also GrapheneOS and Calyx OS but I have no experience with those either. My understanding is they are along the same lines. I think that GrapheneOS comes with no Google Play Services and no MicroG (i.e. like “pure” LineageOS) but gives you the option of installing real Google Play Services (not MicroG) as a normal app as opposed to as a system app.
If you live in Canada I can help you get an international phone that you can install LineageOS or one of the others listed here.
Best regards,
The Fish
Hi everyone. I am getting an SM-G975F with the Exynos chipset. I was planning on flashing LineageOS on it but now I have stumbled upon MicroG for LineageOS and been doing a little reading up on it. Now I am not clear what the best choice would be from a privacy perspective.
My intention with LineageOS was to *not* install GApps and see how much I can make do with the default apps (i.e. the stock mail app, etc.). If that is my intention, then am I better off with LineageOS? or MicroG?
I don't really care about Google Apps. The only thing I can see myself struggling without is without some kind of semi-decent mapping application like Google Maps. Is there a decent alternative? Do I need MicroG for that? If I do cave and find I need Google Maps, then would I be better off with MicroG or LineageOS?
Also, is there a way to get Office apps (Word, Excel, etc.) on LineageOS? Or is that undesirable from a privacy perspective?
Lastly, is there a way to enable LTE bands 29, 30, and 46 on the SM-G975F model? These are enabled on the SM-G975W (Canadian) model, and I will be using the phone in Canada on Bell Mobility.
If these questions have been asked/answered elsewhere, can you please just drop a link?
Thanks,
The Fish
Your post does not qualify for Development. Please read the stickies before posting!
Moved to Questions and Answers.
Hi XDA’ers
I thought I would provide an update on my experience thus far with LineageOS 19.1 on my Exynos SM-G975F and answer some of my own questions which I asked above. Maybe some of this is obvious stuff or maybe not. Maybe it will be helpful for others in the future.
The operating systemI installed LineageOS from the official lineageos.org website. I did not install GApps so I am operating without the Google Play Services.
While Android itself is open source, the “Google Play Services” are not. They are a proprietary library from Google that are included with most (all?) Android devices and provide a number of services, APIs, etc. to apps running on Android. It's not part of the operating system per se, but lots of apps require it. So, I am operating with LineageOS only without the Google Play Services.
As a side note, there is an open-source re-implementation of Google Play Services called microG. MicroG cannot be installed as an app but needs to be installed as part of the OS. There are basically two flavors of LineageOS that include microG. They are “LineageOS for microG” and /e/OS. Both of these include microG. Pure LineageOS on its own however includes neither Google Play Services (unless you install GApps bundle) nor microG.
I was surprised how small the download file was for LineageOS. It weighs in at just 777 MB. I am used to Samsung firmware that weighs in at about 6 GB. So, this seemed really small to me.
Upon first boot up I was impressed with how clean the operating system was. Not only is there no bloatware but there is basically almost nothing at all. There is a dialer app, an SMS app, a camera app, a calculator, and a mini browser. There is also a local-only address book (no link to cloud services) and a local calendar app. The browser is fairly limited but gets the job done. Notably there isn’t a mail app (although I understand that there used to be one on previous versions of LineageOS). So, I set about seeing what I could do.
AppsI installed the F-Droid app store but there are not any mainstream apps in there. Some of the apps in there might be good (I still need to explore it more) but I needed a solid email app. My company is on Office 365 so Outlook would be my first choice.
I stumbled upon APKPure and APKMirror. Both are very ad-filled spammy looking website that seems to be a web-based front end to the Google Play Store. Using these sites website, you can download official APKs for mainstream apps like Outlook, Word, Excel, etc. Be very careful where you click. Lots of the ads on the site include "Download Now" type buttons that you can click on thinking you are downloading an APK but instead are clicking on a spammy ad. So, navigate carefully on these sites.
I was able to install Word, Excel, OneDrive and Outlook. This was huge because I needed a decent mail app. Being able to install OneDrive meant I could now sync my camera with OneDrive. All the Microsoft apps worked flawlessly on LineageOS even without Google Play Services. The one thing I noticed however is that Outlook does not give me notifications when I get a new email. I have to go into Outlook and swipe down to refresh. I believe this is due to the lack of Google Play Services. Maybe using microG would eliminate this problem (not sure). I can live with this for now but would obviously like a way to resolve it.
Installing Outlook synced the local Calendar and Contacts apps with my Outlook contacts and calendar so that worked great.
Bible AppsBoth the Olive Tree Bible Reader app and the ESV Bible app installed no problem from APKPure. Both of these are offline Bible apps (they download the whole Bible and can be used offline). I like Olive Tree because I have several translations (including the SBLGNT) and Olive Tree lets me switch between them. The ESV app is great because they have recordings and so you can hear Kristyn Getty or David Cochran Heath read the Bible to you in natural non-synthetic voices.
SignalI installed Signal directly from their website (they offer the APK directly on their website). Signal detects that it is being installed on a device without Google Play Services and so registers itself as a service and consequently I do get notifications for new Signal messages (unlike Outlook). I wonder if there is some way to make Outlook run the same way. I tried installing Microsoft Teams which we use at work but don't get any notifications when people send me messages. So that makes Teams pretty useless.
BrowserThe build-in default browser renders HTML/CSS just fine but is very limited in terms of features. When you install a progressive web app as an app on the home screen it works but launches in the full browser with the address bar visible which breaks the app-like experiance which is really the whole point of a PWA. So I set about trying to fix this. To my surprise I was able to install Microsoft Edge without ANY issues whatsoever. It works great and web apps pin to the home screen the way they should (and open as apps). So I made Edge my default browser.
KeyboardsThe default keyboard in LineageOS does not have stickers or GIFs. That is as it should be I think for a default built-in keyboard. But it does not support swipe typing either. This surprised me. It seemed like a huge step backwards to have to tap out every letter with my thumbs. Do people still type like that on their phones?!?! Oh, the humanity!
There is a microphone icon at the top of the keyboard for speech-to-text transcription. I used this all the time before on my Samsung S8+. But tapping it did nothing. Apparently I am missing a speech-to-text engine. This surprised be because Outlook has dictation built-in using Microsoft's engines and works well. But it only works in Outlook and not universally throughout the phone as it would if it was built-in on the keyboard.
I installed the Microsoft SwiftKey keyboard and that gave me stickers, GIFs and... swipe typing! Woo Hoo! But I was really hoping it would give me speech-to-text since I dictate almost all of my text messages. I figured it would use Microsoft's engine like Outlook does since it was a Microsoft app. But tapping the microphone on the SwiftKey keyboard promptly tells me that I need to download "Google Voice Search".
Microsoft AuthenticatorI installed the Microsoft Authenticator app for 2FA and it installed just fine. But it was impossible to add any accounts by scanning the QR codes. I think this is due to notifications not working properly, probably also due to the lack of Google Play Services or microG.
Outstanding IssuesSo, the outstanding issues I have right now are:
Microsoft Authenticator is non-usable. This is a huge issue for me
No speech-to-text transcription from keyboard
No notifications in Microsoft Teams
No notifications in Microsoft Outlook (this I can live with).
What I LikeWhat I like about LineageOS is the clean, minimalistic design of the operating system. I am not pushed into any particular "ecosystem" be it Google, Samsung, Microsoft or Apple. I can decide which ecosystem I want to participate in and to which extent. For example, I could download Outlook without downloading Edge and I don't need to backup my photos to OneDrive unless I want to. You can do this, to some extent, with OEM versions of Android, but it requires ignoring and disabling things. Come to think of it, that is really what an operating system should be - a platform for running apps, not an on-ramp into an ecosystem.
What irritates me is that not all apps work as they should. It seems like Google Play Services is an important part of the mix and many apps fail to function properly without it. Signal seems like one exception. It detects that you are not using Google Play Services and adapts the functioning the app accordingly.
Just a minor update. I tried several diffrent TTS engines (Pico TTS, Flite TTS, RHVoice) and none of these gave me text typing.
I ended up installing Speech Services by Google and it worked. I was surprised that it worked considering I do not have GApps (and thus no Google Play Services) and no microG on my phone.
So, I guess I can live with a little Google on my phone, but I would have preferred to find an open-source alternative or, barring that, a Microsoft alternative.