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I was thinking of cloning my sim, either requesting it from my service provider (O2) or getting a device to do it for me.
After some research, it seems the network operators don't like this kind of practice, and also it's just not that simple. Newer 3G sim cards have been reported to be difficult to clone due to the Ki number being well hidden. Apparently, the user/software only has a few attempts to find the correct Ki number, after which, if the attempts are unsuccessful, the sim card becomes unusable.
Can anyone shed any light on this? I've been having trouble finding any up to-date information contrary to what I have read, which seems to have been written a while ago, and could well be (I'm hoping) out-of-date.
I saw this on the net and wondered if it would do the job
http://www.ebest24.co.uk/12in1-sim-cardusb-card-readerwriter-gsm-copier-cloner-1740.html
I've read in a few posts by some people over the past few weeks that they have multiple cards with the same phone number, or multiple numbers on one card, which is potentially what this device/software offers.
Any info will be much appreciated. I'm sure there's somebody who is more clued up than me on this subject and has hopefully been successful.
Thanks in advance!
Sorry you wont get information of the people knowing about such !
Cause this is TOTALY illegal !!!
If you try / do such stuff as geting the info from your SIM you break several Laws. AFAIK IN NEARLY ALL Countrys !
In some countries, the telco will happily provide you with multiple sim cards for the same number, but not in the UK. It's a fraud prevention policy.
Older sim cards are easily cloned if you have the correct kit, but the newer 3g sims are notoriously difficult to clone, with built in protection that kills the card if you attempt to clone it.
Thanks for the info. I suspected that maybe there could be some lawful impediment but didn't realise it was actually illegal, so apologies for requesting the info. At least now I'm in the picture, and maybe others have benefitted too.
Although if a mod would like to delete the thread on grounds of discussing illegalities, (although unbeknown at the time of starting the thread) then please free. I wouldn't have a problem with that.
Thanks again.
Neutron83 said:
Sorry you wont get information of the people knowing about such !
Cause this is TOTALY illegal !!!
If you try / do such stuff as geting the info from your SIM you break several Laws. AFAIK IN NEARLY ALL Countrys !
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Click to collapse
Cloning a card isn't illegal. It's your SIM card and you can burn it if you want.
Using a cloned card to get two phones on the same account, however, is clearly a fraud (except if you are the owner of the cell phone company, of course)
Just like you can clone your own house's key.
me, I want a cloned card so I can have it in two phones so I don't have to keep switching the sim, which is a pain in the backside with some phones.
I can see why they wouldn't like it, but personally I'd only ever have one of the two phones switched on anyway, so it wouldn't be an issue.
Don't particular want to get banned from my network for breaking their EULA or anything so I'll leave it alone, shame though.
Yeah that is your biggest worry. If your provider see's two IMEI's registered with the same SIM serial number online at the same time, thats when the legalality of it all comes into play. They will more than likely default your contract for breach of their EULA. Just play it safe and use one SIM and swap it out.
As a Cell phone provider for multiple services i thought i would put my two cents in. I have had this brought up in my store SEVERAL times. The Official standpoint of SPRINT, Verizon, and AT&T as per their Service Reps is while it is not illegal it is HIGHLY frowned upon. If they discover you using multiple phones at the same time they will call you and ask why this is being done. If you DO NOT have a valid reason they will deactivate your account until you go to one of their locations and resolve the issue which usually results in them Locking the clone and rendering it invalid until you bull**** your way around enough to convince them that you absolutley need two sim cards.
Yes, it is illegal.
zorxd said:
Cloning a card isn't illegal. It's your SIM card and you can burn it if you want.
Using a cloned card to get two phones on the same account, however, is clearly a fraud (except if you are the owner of the cell phone company, of course)
Just like you can clone your own house's key.
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Click to collapse
It is clearly written in your contract, that the SIM card isn't your property. Of course you buy it, can burn and crash it, but it is the provider's property.
---------- Post added at 03:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:00 AM ----------
ashasaur said:
Yeah that is your biggest worry. If your provider see's two IMEI's registered with the same SIM serial number online at the same time, thats when the legalality of it all comes into play. They will more than likely default your contract for breach of their EULA. Just play it safe and use one SIM and swap it out.
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Click to collapse
To track a phone through antennas, the provider uses 3 antennas. If you clone your IMEI on multiple phones, the triangulation becomes much more difficult for the operator. I have 3 HTC Diamond with the same IMEI. But now, with GPS activated, no need of this antennas to find where you are.
ashasaur said:
Yeah that is your biggest worry. If your provider see's two IMEI's registered with the same SIM serial number online at the same time, thats when the legalality of it all comes into play. They will more than likely default your contract for breach of their EULA. Just play it safe and use one SIM and swap it out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You could change the imei of one of the phones but that is also illegal I believe
Pantaloonie said:
but the newer 3g sims are notoriously difficult to clone, with built in protection that kills the card if you attempt to clone it.
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Click to collapse
Lmao. This isn't a spy movie.
Sim cards don't self destruct (even at the software level) if you try to read / write to them. A sim card is just data sitting in memory banks. Newer sim cards have hashed data (which means all it takes is TIME to break the encryption, but it can easy be done if left running for a few days)
A sim card has no way of "killing" itself if you read or write to it. It's just like any other piece of memory.
Hey guys im a newb and was wondering if i can flash my bad esn x play to metro pcs? I cant afford Verizon anymore so they gave me a bad esn and metro has the 40$ unlimited everything
So if you guys can help me out this is much appreciated i love this phone and don't want to give it away yet.
Just get your sim unlocked and change the APN settings
Edit: unsure if a bad esn can be fixed by unlocking.. You'll have to ask someone who deals with sim unlocks
Sent from my R800
rawrrzombie12 said:
Hey guys im a newb and was wondering if i can flash my bad esn x play to metro pcs? I cant afford Verizon anymore so they gave me a bad esn and metro has the 40$ unlimited everything
So if you guys can help me out this is much appreciated i love this phone and don't want to give it away yet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The only reason your phone will have a bad ESN is if either it's stolen or you haven't paid your bill, either way the phone is not yours. Thats why your carrier has blacklisted the ESN. Basically you are asking people to help you steal the phone.
you would have to change ESN which is... well, quite impossible...
Send frm my Play with coustum kernals
AndroHero said:
The only reason your phone will have a bad ESN is if either it's stolen or you haven't paid your bill, either way the phone is not yours. Thats why your carrier has blacklisted the ESN. Basically you are asking people to help you steal the phone.
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i didn't steal the phone i couldn't afford the plan i was one so they cut my phone off that's what i meant. i guess ill just take it and see if it will work
rawrrzombie12 said:
i didn't steal the phone i couldn't afford the plan i was one so they cut my phone off that's what i meant. i guess ill just take it and see if it will work
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Click to collapse
The problem is you said in your post twice, they gave you a bad ESN. Well what did you mean by that, because the only reason they would do that is if you owe them money. Or were you just mistaken? If you go elsewhere with a "bad" or blocked ESN its not going to work.
Rogue Leader said:
The problem is you said in your post twice, they gave you a bad ESN. Well what did you mean by that, because the only reason they would do that is if you owe them money. Or were you just mistaken? If you go elsewhere with a "bad" or blocked ESN its not going to work.
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Click to collapse
Doesn't mean he stole it. Could have been locked into a bad contract
Some people like myself buy them off ebay with bad esn
What happens is all these reneged accounts are lying around eligible for upgrades
some one will come in and get all the brand new phones unopened and sell them online for big profit.
It's 100% your property if you buy it from a 3rd party.
The bad ESN part is bad because then all the towers will block your phone
so you cant use 40$ pre-pay service because they are leasing the towers from big company like verizon and such
Rogue Leader said:
The problem is you said in your post twice, they gave you a bad ESN. Well what did you mean by that, because the only reason they would do that is if you owe them money. Or were you just mistaken? If you go elsewhere with a "bad" or blocked ESN its not going to work.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can flash any phone with a bad esn to another provider, if you have the proper software.
captain67 said:
Just get your sim unlocked and change the APN settings
Edit: unsure if a bad esn can be fixed by unlocking.. You'll have to ask someone who deals with sim unlocks
Sent from my R800
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Click to collapse
AndroHero said:
The only reason your phone will have a bad ESN is if either it's stolen or you haven't paid your bill, either way the phone is not yours. Thats why your carrier has blacklisted the ESN. Basically you are asking people to help you steal the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Blagus said:
you would have to change ESN which is... well, quite impossible...
Send frm my Play with coustum kernals
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Ugh. Ugh. Ugh. READ people. SIM card on CDMA? Why list the reason when he told you the reason out-right (can't afford it; obviously under contract)? "Impossible" to do something which is done every day? Jeeze. If you don't know the answer or what you are talking about WHY do you feel compelled to answer the man?
CZroe said:
Ugh. Ugh. Ugh. READ people. SIM card on CDMA? Why list the reason when he told you the reason out-right (can't afford it; obviously under contract)? "Impossible" to do something which is done every day? Jeeze. If you don't know the answer or what you are talking about WHY do you feel compelled to answer the man?
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Exactly "can't afford verizon" that means he didnt pay the bill, so the phone was cut off, he does not own the phone because he invalidated his contract, and thus the phone is stolen.
Sent from my R800i using Tapatalk
AndroHero said:
Exactly "can't afford verizon" that means he didnt pay the bill, so the phone was cut off, he does not own the phone because he invalidated his contract, and thus the phone is stolen.
Sent from my R800i using Tapatalk
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Click to collapse
I don't know how things are done there, but actually that's technically and legally wrong here in the USA. The phone is rebated and paid for at the time the contract is signed. The SERVICE CONTRACT is the only remaining obligation. The contract comes with terms and stipulations stating that they will require payment of an ETF (Early Termination Fee) if he does not carry the contract to full term and that they will ban the ESN if he does not pay that. It does not state that the phone remains or reverts to being their property.
For consumer protections reasons, there are other "outs" in the contract and you are not required to send the phone back because it is YOURS nor are you required to pay ETFs. For example, the FCC does not want local monopolies to keep you living in an area they serve just because you have a contract with a provider there that doesn't exist elsewhere. For example, if I wanted to move to North Dakota and there was no Sprint coverage in the town I was moving to, I can move there and keep my phone and end my contract and legally dodge the ETF. If I ever activate it with that provider again, they can require me to resume my contract.
Simple.
CZroe said:
I don't know how things are done there, but actually that's technically and legally wrong here in the USA. The phone is rebated at the time the contract is signed. The SERVICE CONTRACT is the only remaining obligation. The contract comes with terms and stipulations stating that they will require payment of an ETF (Early Termination Fee) if he does not carry the contract to full term and that they will ban the ESN if he does not pay that. It does not state that the phone remains or reverts to being their property.
For consumer protections reasons, there are other "outs" in the contract and you are not required to send the phone back because it is YOURS. For example, the FCC does not want local monopolies to keep you living in an area they server just because you have a contract with a provider there that doesn't exist elsewhere. For example, if I wanted to move to North Dakota and there was no Sprint coverage in the town I was moving to, I can move there and keep my phone and end my contract and legally dodge the ETF. If I ever activate it with that provider again, they can require me to resume my contract.
Simple.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hooray America! (another example of an it is you can suspend/cancel your contact without an ETF if you getting deployed overseas (military))
Sent from my R800x using Tapatalk
Flipping through the thread and damn some people are f ing unbelievable. Your really going to call the guys phone stolen because he couldnt pay the bill? Are you kidding me? Pretty sure the 250 dollar early termination fee that will be tacked on to a final bill will pretty much cover the cost of the phone.. Its amazing how people can be so argumentative for no reason. The guy had a simple question, he didnt ask for a moral judgement. The answer to your question is YES you can have it flashed to metro.
AndroHero said:
Exactly "can't afford verizon" that means he didnt pay the bill, so the phone was cut off, he does not own the phone because he invalidated his contract, and thus the phone is stolen.
Sent from my R800i using Tapatalk
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Click to collapse
Why did you even waste energy and burn a single calorie to type on this thread if you weren't going to contribute to the question asked. I'm sick of arse holes that want to play phone police on an internet forum. You don't know if he paid his termination fee or made conditions with Verizon. Personally I think its none of your business or any body else. So the point of the matter is Metro hooks up a lot of phones from other carriers such as Verizon legally in the US. Trust me America being the forefront of lawsuits would have sued the breaks off of Metro PCS if it wasn't. Do not post if you don't have anything intelectual or contributing please.
R800x Carrier Pigeon - Got any change?
Before I get into the nitty gritty, yes, ive seached the forum. yes ive seached the google. yes, afaik im using the right software (cdma-w, qpst, QXDM, even that dfs cdma tool).
The Xperia Play (R800x - Verizon) is an amazing phone first of all. If only it could make calls...
Here is the problem im having: I can write min, nam, PRL, etc, most NV items to the phone just fine. but when i try to repair the esn/meid i get back an error which, though slightly different depending on the software, amounts to a statement that the value is read-only or failed to write. I have some past success with this sort of thing on other platforms (Moto Razr for ex.)but im at a loss here, and ready to accept any help offered. I read somewhere that an unlocked BL is req. but that doesnt make sense to me.
Also ive noticed that the older version of cdmaw (2.7) doesn't seem to read or write meid values, only esn, from what ive read, its like frank sinatra said, you cant have one without the other.
So my questions: has anyone else run into this problem? Is it related to the bootloader or ROM in any way? Suggestions etc Please and Thank you
Yes im a n00b. yes im ok with that. there is always some1 who knows more about something than I do. Teach me to fish so i can share my fish
freddycheeba said:
Before I get into the nitty gritty, yes, ive seached the forum. yes ive seached the google. (btw, the flash-to-MetroPCS page seems to have vanished from the internets..)yes, afaik im using the right software (cdma-w, qpst, QXDM, even that dfs cdma tool).
The Xperia Play (R800x - V3r1$0N) is an amazing phone first of all. If only it could make calls...
With every intention of avoiding starting a legal debate, here is the problem im having: I can write min, nam, PRL, etc, most NV items to the phone just fine. but when i try to .repair. the 3$n or M31D i get back an error which, though slightly different depending on the software, amounts to a statement that the value is read-only or failed to write. i may have some past success with this sort of thing on other platforms (Moto Razr for ex.)-allegedly, and im by no means stumped or ready to give up, but im ready to accept any help offered. I read somewhere that an unlocked BL is req. but that doesnt make sense to me.
Also ive noticed that the older version of cdmaw (2.7) which may or may not be available from the common sources, doesn't seem to read or write m31d values, only 3$n, from what ive read, its like frank sinatra said, you cant have one without the other.
So my questions: has anyone else run into this problem? Is it related to the bootloader or ROM in any way? Suggestions etc Please and Thank you
Yes im a n00b. yes im ok with that. there is always some1 who knows more about something than I do. Teach me to fish
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Couple things:
1. "hacker speak" like saying 3$n and m31D is tremendously annoying. I have no idea why you felt the need to do that. Actual intelligent humans like you will find here think you sound like an idiot when you type like that. Speak English, its what we speak.
2. I don't believe anyone has successfully done with this phone what you're trying to do AFAIK. There are people who can unlock the bootloader for you, but I agree I doubt that would help, but hey who knows.
3. That said, you threw gas on the fire even mentioning legal issues. I'm not gonna make any assumptions about why you have a bad ESN phone a I don't know where you got it, but as you can see its a touchy subject here. Mainly because carriers don't just blacklist ESNs for no reason or on a whim.
Anyway whatever your reasons, good luck, I don't know that you will find an answer here, but maybe someone who does know can help you.
Touchy subject
My Esn is clear, but i already have service with another cdma provider- one who has very limited choices as far as phones go. I have no intention of trying to rip off my carrier for my data use or anything like that, i just want to make calls on my current network, using my R800x.
I wrote 3$n because some places will delete your post or even ban you just for mentioning the word, which is silly since all we're trying to do is exchange some theoretical knowledge.
Anyway thanks for your response RogueLeader.
freddycheeba said:
My Esn is clear, but i already have service with another cdma provider- one who has very limited choices as far as phones go. I have no intention of trying to rip off my carrier for my data use or anything like that, i just want to make calls on my current network, using my R800x.
I wrote 3$n because some places will delete your post or even ban you just for mentioning the word, which is silly since all we're trying to do is exchange some theoretical knowledge.
Anyway thanks for your response RogueLeader.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So your carrier just plain won't accept your Xperia Play's ESN, so you're trying to swap on one from another phone? Good plan, but like I said it seems like something thats not likely possible (or hey maybe it is and just no one's done it yet). I'd be interested to hear if this works out. Also pretty ridiculous if its true that they just won't take it, but then again Verizon won't accept non Verizon cdma phones as far as I know, but we expect them to suck.
As for this place its pretty heavily monitored, so if your post goes somewhere they don't want, it doesn't matter what words you use they will delete it for you ..
Waka Flocka FLAME!
Sent from my R800x using xda premium
Bad esn for whatever reason, it's still a bad esn. Metro does have the power and tools to flash SOME phones to their network. BUT a lot of these phones will not be fully functional, whether it's the internet or mms, etc. but here's the thing, we here are not metro pcs, we are consumers, ask metro, if they don't have an answer we will more than likely not have one either.
you will just piss some people off with your poor search and investigative skills.
Sent from my R800x using xda premium
I didn't see a thread on this so I thought I'd warn anyone who doesn't know.
AT&T now blacklisting stolen phones.
AT&T is now blacklisting all reported stolen phones, or devices they say were "Improperly scanned" out of inventory and major retailers such as Best Buy or Wal-Mart. What this means is that sometime after inserting your SIM card into one of these phones, AT&T will lock your SIM card and you will either get a message stating the device is blocked from the network, or the phone will only call AT&T's security division. Even if you put it back in another phone.
This lock is supposed to occur within minutes according to AT&T, however we have seen it take up to weeks for the lock to occur. This also applies to any pre-paid service such as Straight Talk and Red Pocket who use AT&T phones. If you are on one of these plans, you must call your carrier, not AT&T and request the account be unlocked.
Sounds like a good plan right? The only problem with this is, at this time, unlike Verizon, Sprint, and other carriers, there is no way to call in and check the IMEI before you purchase a used or refurb phone. Thus, if you buy a phone from Craigslist, Ebay, or a local used phone store, its imposable to check the esn like you would a CDMA phone to determine if it has been reported lost or stolen.
The best you can do is put your SIM in the phone and try it out before you buy it and, more importantly, make sure there is a return policy at the store you buy it from. At this time there seems to be no sure fire way to determine if a phone you buy from an individual or online has been reported lost or stolen, and AT&T will not unblock any phone reported stolen except by the person who reported it.
The only exception is if you have purchased a phone from a major retailer. In that case AT&T security division reports that if you take the phone back with the receipt, they will unblock it.
Just reading this reminds me about insurance scams where someone would sell their old phone on some site and then call in the phone as stolen. To me: this is just another risk for buying used phones now. Then again: I recall reading a very recent article about a iphone theft ring in San Francisco. Maybe it's better off this way.
Puts ATT in hard spot. They can either let the thieves sell the units and then the end customer's are unknowingly screwed or let the units work. I suppose their rationale is that if the unit stops working they can report who sold them the phone?
I think they very well should blacklist phones reported as stolen. They've been doing it in Europe for years. My problem is, unlike every other major carrier, you cannot verify if a phone is stolen or not before you buy it. This doesn't punish the thieves so much as the person who unknowingly buys it.
killgorian said:
I think they very well should blacklist phones reported as stolen. They've been doing it in Europe for years. My problem is, unlike every other major carrier, you cannot verify if a phone is stolen or not before you buy it. This doesn't punish the thieves so much as the person who unknowingly buys it.
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Click to collapse
If it's reported stolen that's one thing - but what about the phones that somebody hasn't paid their bill to on the major carriers - the money owed goes on that person's SS# anyways for life until they settle up - I see bad esn's being sold on ebay all the time. I don't feel bad flashing a phone to cricket with a bad esn since it's tied to somebody's social. If it's stolen by thieves of course - lock em down. I'm just sayin'
mook_ said:
the money owed goes on that person's SS# anyways for life...
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Click to collapse
No. 7 years max.
killgorian said:
My problem is, unlike every other major carrier, you cannot verify if a phone is stolen or not before you buy it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes. This service should have been offered FIRST and then a couple of years later they should have introduced the banning practice. As it is I can see a lot of people making honest mistakes.
You can call into att and have them check the numbers on the phone ...I just did this a week ago with my one x after getting.burnt on one
Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2
Some online stores have a very efficient and reliable pre-purchase customer care.
I bought my AT&T phone from europe from negrielectronics.com and I clearly asked to know the IMEI of the device before placing the ordere since we have some specific IMEI issues here n Europe.
They could immediately email me the code.
So just ask if you want to purchase on the internet; maybe you'll be lucky.
We can actually deactivate stolen / lost phones,
I`m not sure about blacklisting, savedesk knows that,
After we make reports on lost/stolen phones we just send them to savedesk
It has always been a long before practise to ask the customer to rescan again to where you have bought the phone in cases of phones tagged as warehouse are not deactivated
this post is approved by the national potato safety regulation
hey guys - so i just got taken. bought a phone on CL and turns out it's blacklisted. do you know if there's anyway for ATT to check who this phone belonged to based on IMEI? my long shot is maybe contacting original owner (i know ATT doesn't give out information) but could THEY possibly contact original owner and tell him someone found his device?
i figure this is better than me tossing the device?? any thoughts?
piotrus22 said:
hey guys - so i just got taken. bought a phone on CL and turns out it's blacklisted. do you know if there's anyway for ATT to check who this phone belonged to based on IMEI? my long shot is maybe contacting original owner (i know ATT doesn't give out information) but could THEY possibly contact original owner and tell him someone found his device?
i figure this is better than me tossing the device?? any thoughts?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you have any of the seller's info you can report it to authorities.
The only info i have is a cell phone number. Which was a pay as you go number. So i dont think they can do anything if sim card has been tossed right?
What will they authorities do? Dont they have more important things? Ill they confiscate the phone? I just realized i could sell it for use in Europe potentially?
piotrus22 said:
The only info i have is a cell phone number. Which was a pay as you go number. So i dont think they can do anything if sim card has been tossed right?
What will they authorities do? Dont they have more important things? Ill they confiscate the phone? I just realized i could sell it for use in Europe potentially?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it's IMEI programmed.
so no matter what SIM you'll use it will still be blacklisted,
as long as a stolen phone can receive a signal and passes through AT&T's database it will automatically send out a code to lock out the phone,
it is n "as-is" basis though,
depends entirely on the phone
deathnotice01 said:
it's IMEI programmed.
so no matter what SIM you'll use it will still be blacklisted,
as long as a stolen phone can receive a signal and passes through AT&T's database it will automatically send out a code to lock out the phone,
it is n "as-is" basis though,
depends entirely on the phone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, my first post here.
I have a customer (I do computer repair, not cell phones) who unknowingly bought a "blacklisted" att phone an HTC one x from craigslist. Is there anything he can do? I told him I would look into it to try and help him out. But I know nothing of cell phones. The guy's like 60 trying to make a few bucks while in retirement buying and selling cell phones.
He used it for a day or so then it just stopped working. when his att sim was deactivated he went to att as he knows the folks who work in the local store. They cleared his sim card, but not the phone. They weren't interested in taking the phone from him either. They said it could be blacklisted for several reasons from non-payment, to stolen or some other reason, but they couldn't tell him the reason. Some advice or a point in the right direction would be greatly appreciated. Would unlocking the phone make any difference (to use on another carrier) or is he just basically screwed with this one?
Thanks,
Chris
SIM unlock it and have it on T-Mobile.
Lil Chris said:
Hi, my first post here.
I have a customer (I do computer repair, not cell phones) who unknowingly bought a "blacklisted" att phone an HTC one x from craigslist. Is there anything he can do? I told him I would look into it to try and help him out. But I know nothing of cell phones. The guy's like 60 trying to make a few bucks while in retirement buying and selling cell phones.
He used it for a day or so then it just stopped working. when his att sim was deactivated he went to att as he knows the folks who work in the local store. They cleared his sim card, but not the phone. They weren't interested in taking the phone from him either. They said it could be blacklisted for several reasons from non-payment, to stolen or some other reason, but they couldn't tell him the reason. Some advice or a point in the right direction would be greatly appreciated. Would unlocking the phone make any difference (to use on another carrier) or is he just basically screwed with this one?
Thanks,
Chris
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
AT&T is very strict with matters pertaining to blacklisted phones,
reactivation of a valid sim card is possible but not the phone,
i never had actual experience with AT&T phones since i'm not in the US and we only had experience navigating them during our training at AT&T tech support,
but you can try flashing the stock generic firmware from a AT&T HTC one X and using a T-mo sim instead of a AT&T sim to prevent execution and authentication of IMEI protocols which are nessesarry to deactivate the blacklisted phone,
Welcome to the bad ESN world
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app
cell128 said:
Welcome to the bad ESN world
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And corporate controlled america
--------------------------------------------------------------
By staring at this post you have waived your right to privacy
Complaints will be trolled accordingly
Im a bit confused. Maybe someone could shed some light. Can a at&t iphone that is not in good standing with at&t be used on straight talk. If so must it be a ST Tmobile sim?
Im buying my mom an at&t iphone 4s off CL and want to make sure it can be activated. Thanks!!
themow said:
Im a bit confused. Maybe someone could shed some light. Can a at&t iphone that is not in good standing with at&t be used on straight talk. If so must it be a ST Tmobile sim?
Im buying my mom an at&t iphone 4s off CL and want to make sure it can be activated. Thanks!!
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As long as it is not reported lost or stolen it can. If it has been blacklisted, no it cannot.
I didn't know where else to post this question...
I'm about to buy a NEW Galaxy S4 Active from a guy on Craigslist that's going to get one new from the ATT store today. The selling price to me? $400.
That's a great price, so I'm wondering...
Is there anything that I need to be aware of? Can I lose out on this deal? I'm assuming that he's going to get an upgrade and extend his contract, because that's the only way he can make money on this deal. But what if he cancels his contract or doesn't pay his bill, won't the phone get blacklisted and I'll end up with a brick in a few months?
No blacklisting on att phones. The only way you can lose out is if the guy has insurance on his phone, sell it to you, then calls att reports it stolen. Then the phone becomes a glorified paperweight.
Alot of people run this Craigslist scam, because the insurance deductible is cheap, and they make a large profit selling it, then reporting stolen and get a brand new device, meanwhile you get scammed.
To prevent that from happening you can meet the guy at an att store and let them know you are purchasing the phone from him, and they will transfer ownership to you and he can't file a stolen device.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using xda premium
I would be very careful when buying an expensive phone from Craigslist. Tell him you only want to meet at an at&t store so they can make a note on his account that he sold you the phone. Then I would have them activate the phone there and then for you. If it's legit then he'll have no issue doing what you suggest. $400 is a good price for an active. But sometimes if it seems too good to be true, well you get the point.
Great advice you guys! That's what I'll do is meet him at the store and make sure I'm notated and the ownership is transferred to me. I didn't realize ATT would do that for me!
That is two good pieces of advice. Benefit of Craigslist over EBay is one-on-one contact. I would add, and you probably already decided, is if he doesn't want to meet with some excuse--don't buy it--
I just bought an iPhone for a family member. I met the seller at the AT&T store and I went in and had AT&t run the IMEI. they said it was not reported stolen but that is all they could do. According to the sales person there is no way to transfer an IMEI and that an original purchaser could theoretically still report the phone stolen.
I am not sure if I believe the second part but it could be. I can't see att trying to track every IMEI as phones change hands.
alphadog00 said:
I just bought an iPhone for a family member. I met the seller at the AT&T store and I went in and had AT&t run the IMEI. they said it was not reported stolen but that is all they could do. According to the sales person there is no way to transfer an IMEI and that an original purchaser could theoretically still report the phone stolen.
I am not sure if I believe the second part but it could be. I can't see att trying to track every IMEI as phones change hands.
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Yeah that's wrong. Basically an imei cannot be on two accounts at the same time. So going in to a store with the seller they could remove it from their account and it would be put on yours. With ATT however, there is very little ways for them to "blacklist" a phone. Sure it may not be able to be placed on your account but a sim will still work just fine in it. Verizon is different due to the way their activations work.
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imitenotbecrazy said:
Yeah that's wrong. Basically an imei cannot be on two accounts at the same time. So going in to a store with the seller they could remove it from their account and it would be put on yours. With ATT however, there is very little ways for them to "blacklist" a phone. Sure it may not be able to be placed on your account but a sim will still work just fine in it. Verizon is different due to the way their activations work.
sent from just the tip
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Click to collapse
I am not sure why you say they can't blacklist. They can and are now doing so. EU has done it for years. No one in the USA did it in the past but the carriers are doing it now, and they are working on a shared database. So once a phone is blacklisted it will be unusable on any carrier.
Today a blocked AT&T phone could still be used on t-mobile.
The phone sends its IMEI when it connects to the network and AT&T can easily block it if it is reported stolen. There are other threads about people buying notes and s4 that are blocked.
alphadog00 said:
I am not sure why you say they can't blacklist. They can and are now doing so. EU has done it for years. No one in the USA did it in the past but the carriers are doing it now, and they are working on a shared database. So once a phone is blacklisted it will be unusable on any carrier.
Today a blocked AT&T phone could still be used on t-mobile.
The phone sends its IMEI when it connects to the network and AT&T can easily block it if it is reported stolen. There are other threads about people buying notes and s4 that are blocked.
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Click to collapse
Weird. I've never seen a phone not connect to the network like that. I haven't told ATT I've switched phones since my OG Note a year and a half ago. That phone has long since been gone. The only thing that seems to be reporting to ATT is the sim. What happens when you use an imei from outside their database? How does it access their network then?
sent from just the tip
imitenotbecrazy said:
Weird. I've never seen a phone not connect to the network like that. I haven't told ATT I've switched phones since my OG Note a year and a half ago. That phone has long since been gone. The only thing that seems to be reporting to ATT is the sim. What happens when you use an imei from outside their database? How does it access their network then?
sent from just the tip
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Click to collapse
I switch phones all the time and I don't "tell" AT&T - this works fine without issue, but they do see the IMEI - this is easy to verify. Log into your AT&T account and look at your devices - it shows the actual phone that is being used on that number. I am not sure how often they update this, but it shows the system automatically sees the IMEI.
They only keep a database of Blocked or blacklisted IMEI. It is impossible for them to keep a database of approved phones, it just wouldn't work and it would piss people off. It is easier to keep a short block list.
On my account, I have 2 other family lines for dumb phones and they have data blocks. But these lines are using other smart phones, and they listed by brand and model when i log into my account. The IMEI can be used to detect brand and model. I still don't know why the CSRs ask for IMEI when this info shows up automatically, but i never give it to them.
And like I said, when i bought the last phone, I walked in the store and the guy knew what i wanted and looked it up to see if it was reported stolen. When it was not, he said everything was good. A few years ago, they would not have cared either way.
alphadog00 said:
I switch phones all the time and I don't "tell" AT&T - this works fine without issue, but they do see the IMEI - this is easy to verify. Log into your AT&T account and look at your devices - it shows the actual phone that is being used on that number. I am not sure how often they update this, but it shows the system automatically sees the IMEI.
They only keep a database of Blocked or blacklisted IMEI. It is impossible for them to keep a database of approved phones, it just wouldn't work and it would piss people off. It is easier to keep a short block list.
On my account, I have 2 other family lines for dumb phones and they have data blocks. But these lines are using other smart phones, and they listed by brand and model when i log into my account. The IMEI can be used to detect brand and model. I still don't know why the CSRs ask for IMEI when this info shows up automatically, but i never give it to them.
And like I said, when i bought the last phone, I walked in the store and the guy knew what i wanted and looked it up to see if it was reported stolen. When it was not, he said everything was good. A few years ago, they would not have cared either way.
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See that's where I'm having this issue. I log into my ATT dealer site and it still shows me on the OG Note. When I log into my account it shows OG Note. My account doesn't update with what phone I'm using currently. Not sure if mine is an anomoly or not. AFAIK though ATT told us there was nothing that could be done when one of our ATT display phones was stolen. That's part of where my assumption that blacklisting was not a real thing with ATT.
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imitenotbecrazy said:
See that's where I'm having this issue. I log into my ATT dealer site and it still shows me on the OG Note. When I log into my account it shows OG Note. My account doesn't update with what phone I'm using currently. Not sure if mine is an anomoly or not. AFAIK though ATT told us there was nothing that could be done when one of our ATT display phones was stolen. That's part of where my assumption that blacklisting was not a real thing with ATT.
sent from just the tip
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Click to collapse
I admit I never blocked a phone. But there is thread that has lots of details of a few users experience:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2315935
According to AT&T only the original owner can report a phone stolen - so maybe only new activations get treated this way. The AT&T rep said i could not add the IMEI of the used phone to my account to prevent someone from reporting it stolen, so their system has lots of limits.
I wish I knew more, but AT&T is not the most forthcoming with how things work.
alphadog00 said:
Today a blocked AT&T phone could still be used on t-mobile.
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I read just the other day that Tmo and ATT are sharing their blacklists. And once a phone has been blacklisted on one carrier, the other will follow suit.
Gonna try and make this short and try and not get attacked or flamed.
I've done retail and sales, managed many big retail stores and even been a district manager.
In my business, you buy something, you own it, it's yours to do whatever you want. Also, there is a return policy and depending on the issue policy can be bent in a put out the fire situation.
The phone business is not like this and I don't understand. If I buy a phone, it is mine, I own therefore why couldn't I do what I wanted. I should be able to wipe my butt with it if I wanted to.
So why do carriers treat it differently. They have the policy about rooting, so why not let the buyer do it, take the risk, and just enforce the policy.
Especially considering we buy it, it's ours and we should be able to do what we want with things we own. Just my opinion because it is retail sales which I know like the back of my hand, but the mobile side of it baffles me.
Anybody an employee or former employee who can explain why mobile phones is one of the only things you can buy but never feel like you completely own it.
Just seems not right coming from years in retail with many many companies.
The problem lies in the warranty and being able to take advantages of services without paying.
Instance 1: A noob roots their phone, bricks it, and doesn't know how to get it back to normal. They call Verizon and say their phone just died. Verizon has to spend time and money sending a replacement.
Instance 2: We have unlimited. We root and unlock free tethering. They lose on "potential" revenues. (Although we do have foxfi on the play store, but its still slow as it goes through a vpn.
I do agree that we should have full control of our devices though. Unfortunately, we can only make changes with out dollars.
Yeah I can see that but as far as warranty they will check for root so that shouldn't be a factor. I'm sure at this point that is the first thing they check.
They have to know that tethering can be exploited either way.
And my understanding is they don't care and don't make money on the phones but their service charges.
I would encourage people to root if I were them because if they did it right they would make more profit because they wouldn't have to spend money to fix it forcing buyers to have no choice but buy another.
I know it will not change but as a person familiar with making money in retail they could increase revenu .
Not counting with them having for the most part the best service and networks thousands of people would flock there to get an unlocked verizon phone.
Busines wise, if done properly they would make a killing changing their stance
sprintuser1977 said:
Yeah I can see that but as far as warranty they will check for root so that shouldn't be a factor. I'm sure at this point that is the first thing they check.
They have to know that tethering can be exploited either way.
And my understanding is they don't care and don't make money on the phones but their service charges.
I would encourage people to root if I were them because if they did it right they would make more profit because they wouldn't have to spend money to fix it forcing buyers to have no choice but buy another.
I know it will not change but as a person familiar with making money in retail they could increase revenu .
Not counting with them having for the most part the best service and networks thousands of people would flock there to get an unlocked verizon phone.
Busines wise, if done properly they would make a killing changing their stance
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Click to collapse
Although i agree with everything that was said by you, the people calling the shots are probably way too old to understand that there's always a way through everything (for example root in order to get free hot spot working). The other problem is i would assume is that they can't always prove a phone was rooted. Let's say someone was trying to flash a custom rom and accidentally flashed the system leaving only the boot recovery present with no OS and they didn't know how to Odin back to stock, Verizon can't prove that the phone was rooted. For all they know maybe the user was performing an update and something happened.
Whatever the case... I wish we had full access over our devices :crying:
sprintuser1977 said:
Gonna try and make this short and try and not get attacked or flamed.
I've done retail and sales, managed many big retail stores and even been a district manager.
In my business, you buy something, you own it, it's yours to do whatever you want. Also, there is a return policy and depending on the issue policy can be bent in a put out the fire situation.
The phone business is not like this and I don't understand. If I buy a phone, it is mine, I own therefore why couldn't I do what I wanted. I should be able to wipe my butt with it if I wanted to.
So why do carriers treat it differently. They have the policy about rooting, so why not let the buyer do it, take the risk, and just enforce the policy.
Especially considering we buy it, it's ours and we should be able to do what we want with things we own. Just my opinion because it is retail sales which I know like the back of my hand, but the mobile side of it baffles me.
Anybody an employee or former employee who can explain why mobile phones is one of the only things you can buy but never feel like you completely own it.
Just seems not right coming from years in retail with many many companies.
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Click to collapse
You can do what you want with it...but you bought a device that is locked down to increase sales to the Enterprise and Military community. You have the option of buying a developer's edition. You can certainly wipe your butt with it as you mentioned. As for your inability to root it...that is not the carrier telling you what you can't do with it...that comes in voiding the warranty...but look at it as buying a television and not being able to make a transmitter out of it. Of course you could...but it would require a lot of work and knowledge and also void the warranty. Bootloaders have been broken before and root obtained...again...with a lot of work and knowledge. The device works as advertised when sold. If you choose to purchase a device from a carrier with a history of locking them down (S4, Note 3, S5 and now the S3 with it's updates) then you are choosing to support what they are selling. Now as it is a communications device and you are in the US, there are things you cannot do with it per Federal law as stated by the FCC. But that is a whole other can of worms.
dapimpinj said:
The problem lies in the warranty and being able to take advantages of services without paying.
Instance 1: A noob roots their phone, bricks it, and doesn't know how to get it back to normal. They call Verizon and say their phone just died. Verizon has to spend time and money sending a replacement.
Instance 2: We have unlimited. We root and unlock free tethering. They lose on "potential" revenues. (Although we do have foxfi on the play store, but its still slow as it goes through a vpn.
I do agree that we should have full control of our devices though. Unfortunately, we can only make changes with out dollars.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Foxfi works pretty good for me. Going thru a vpn doesn't slow it down for me
my_handle said:
Foxfi works pretty good for me. Going thru a vpn doesn't slow it down for me
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Good to hear! It must have been my location. I get 5 bars of LTE at home. I'll try it there.
KennyG123 said:
You can do what you want with it...but you bought a device that is locked down to increase sales to the Enterprise and Military community. You have the option of buying a developer's edition. You can certainly wipe your butt with it as you mentioned. As for your inability to root it...that is not the carrier telling you what you can't do with it...that comes in voiding the warranty...but look at it as buying a television and not being able to make a transmitter out of it. Of course you could...but it would require a lot of work and knowledge and also void the warranty. Bootloaders have been broken before and root obtained...again...with a lot of work and knowledge. The device works as advertised when sold. If you choose to purchase a device from a carrier with a history of locking them down (S4, Note 3, S5 and now the S3 with it's updates) then you are choosing to support what they are selling. Now as it is a communications device and you are in the US, there are things you cannot do with it per Federal law as stated by the FCC. But that is a whole other can of worms.
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Click to collapse
Please look up the Verizon Note 4 on Verizon, and show me where in describing the product it states the phone is locked and you can not edit certain things.
I may have missed it but I saw no where on the specifications or feature list where it says that? Only a person who is familiar with rooting or bootloaders and such would know.
As far as warranty, as I said, it's a policy and if I choose to break it that is my choice.
sprintuser1977 said:
Please look up the Verizon Note 4 on Verizon, and show me where in describing the product it states the phone is locked and you can not edit certain things.
I may have missed it but I saw no where on the specifications or feature list where it says that? Only a person who is familiar with rooting or bootloaders and such would know.
As far as warranty, as I said, it's a policy and if I choose to break it that is my choice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not to sound obnoxious but please look up ANY phone and show me where it says that you can root it and it has an unlocked bootloader and you are welcome to change anything you want? You are not brand new...you know what Verizon has been doing for years. There is nothing stopping you from using the phone exactly as advertised in the manual and specifications. Rooting is not an approved use of the phone and offers an extreme security breach of the software..so why would any carrier endorse it or even need to mention if you could or couldn't. Anyone that has been around for more than a year, knows that is what the developer edition is for and should be grateful that Verizon even offers that option. Also knowing you are not brand new, you would know that less than 1% of Verizon customers even know what rooting is. You see the trend, you have choices yet you still chose to support Verizon.
The original point is being ignored.
Simply put if we buy something we should be able to do whatever we want with it.
All retail is like this except phones.
All the details and other miscellaneous stuff is besides the point.
I'm just saying if we own it, we should own it
sprintuser1977 said:
The original point is being ignored.
Simply put if we buy something we should be able to do whatever we want with it.
All retail is like this except phones.
All the details and other miscellaneous stuff is besides the point.
I'm just saying if we own it, we should own it
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Click to collapse
Sorry, but I guess I am missing the point. What is it that you wish to do with this phone that you can do with say...a television, that is listed in the specifications and features of the product you purchased?
To think that executives of Verizon are oblivious to Rooting or custom roms, you are mistaken. Just because they are older does not mean they are dumb. Phones are locked down for one reason: reduce liability on Verizon.
---------- Post added at 07:49 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:46 PM ----------
KennyG123 said:
Sorry, but I guess I am missing the point. What is it that you wish to do with this phone that you can do with say...a television, that is listed in the specifications and features of the product you purchased?
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Click to collapse
I like this. Phones are locked down to reduce liability and cost of fixing it. This is why companies like HTC will unlock your bootloader while voiding your warranty.
I can't explain it anymore simply, sorry. Here is how it could simply be done:
-I buy the phone
-I want to root the phone
-I call Verizon, tell them I want to root
-They inform me If I do, it voids the warranty and I'm out $700 if I break it
-Ok, i will take that risk
- Verizon notes the account of this, therefore no tricks on cheating the warranty policy and they unlock it
Obviously over simplified, but general idea is they should have a way For us to request it, Note it, and allow us to do it.
Anyway, regardless of how they do it I don't care, it's the fact you buy a 800 dollar phone, if I want to risk breaking it and losing $800, that should be OK as its my property.
Anyway, not going to try and get into a back and forth. I got people's take on it and that's good enough for me.
Thanks everyone for your input.
chriskader said:
To think that executives of Verizon are oblivious to Rooting or custom roms, you are mistaken. Just because they are older does not mean they are dumb. Phones are locked down for one reason: reduce liability on Verizon.
---------- Post added at 07:49 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:46 PM ----------
I like this. Phones are locked down to reduce liability and cost of fixing it. This is why companies like HTC will unlock your bootloader while voiding your warranty.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, Verizon chose to lock down the phones to get huge corporate and military contracts by showing their version of the phone is the most secure. Of course AT&T is also doing the same fighting for those contracts.
sprintuser1977 said:
I can't explain it anymore simply, sorry. Here is how it could simply be done:
-I buy the phone
-I want to root the phone
-I call Verizon, tell them I want to root
-They inform me If I do, it voids the warranty and I'm out $700 if I break it
-Ok, i will take that risk
- Verizon notes the account of this, therefore no tricks on cheating the warranty policy and they unlock it
Obviously over simplified, but general idea is they should have a way For us to request it, Note it, and allow us to do it.
Anyway, regardless of how they do it I don't care, it's the fact you buy a 800 dollar phone, if I want to risk breaking it and losing $800, that should be OK as its my property.
Anyway, not going to try and get into a back and forth. I got people's take on it and that's good enough for me.
Thanks everyone for your input.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand and there is a thread in one of the Verizon Sammy phones...Note 3 I think...where a member actually discussed with Verizon executive services the possibility of the same thing HTC did (on other carriers since Verizon locked that door too). I believe the thread is "How much would you pay for unlocking the bootloader" or something like that. He was going to get an idea of how much people would pay for this code direct from Verizon. I think the majority was $25 atm. At least he was pitching the idea to Verizon and they were hearing him out. Perhaps more can do the same?
I was just trying to say that I did not understand how the inability to root would make you feel like the phone was not yours. The PS3 systems if you play online are locked down exactly the same...you jailbreak it and you cannot get on the Playstation network to play online. So it is not just cell phones that do not allow you to do more than the manufacturer promised. I also was stating that you can certainly root and unlock it...if you had the knowledge to do so. I think we just misunderstood each other.
No biggie. I can understand all points of view and in no way was I trying to disregard or disrespect yours.
If it came across that way I apologize.
This is my first verizon phone (it was my only option due to several reasons) and I am amazed at how adamantly opposed to unlocking phones they are.
I've rooted over a dozen phones and this is the first one that I would like to root but it's good enough that if I can't I still love it
sprintuser1977 said:
I can't explain it anymore simply, sorry. Here is how it could simply be done:
-I buy the phone
-I want to root the phone
-I call Verizon, tell them I want to root
-They inform me If I do, it voids the warranty and I'm out $700 if I break it
-Ok, i will take that risk
- Verizon notes the account of this, therefore no tricks on cheating the warranty policy and they unlock it
Obviously over simplified, but general idea is they should have a way For us to request it, Note it, and allow us to do it.
Anyway, regardless of how they do it I don't care, it's the fact you buy a 800 dollar phone, if I want to risk breaking it and losing $800, that should be OK as its my property.
Anyway, not going to try and get into a back and forth. I got people's take on it and that's good enough for me.
Thanks everyone for your input.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I could understand if you pay 800 but seriously of your gonna do that get dev edition as well most ppl get the phone subsidised for less then half of what the phone is woth off of contract so technically you don't own the phone as well you are right there is no where in the vzw policy that says rooting voids your warranty if you read all the rules but it is one of thoes unwritten policy's all companys go buy
jolly_roger_hook said:
I could understand if you pay 800 but seriously of your gonna do that get dev edition as well most ppl get the phone subsidised for less then half of what the phone is woth off of contract so technically you don't own the phone as well you are right there is no where in the vzw policy that says rooting voids your warranty if you read all the rules but it is one of thoes unwritten policy's all companys go buy
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is one of the reasons also, the fact that many phones are subsidized through a carrier, and you really don't own them 100% unless you see the contract out to the end, or pay the ETF. I still agree that the customer should be able to buy out the contract, or void their warranty and accept liability themselves for the express purpose of obtaining an unlock code to root/ROM, etc... I think that Verizon may actually go this route some day, just not any time soon.
If I had the ability to not support Verizon and their tight locking policies, I would. But, like many other people, I'm in a region where the only reliable 4G LTE connection is Verizon and Verizon Alone. I had the unlocked Tmobile Note 3 on both Tmobile AND AT&T and my signal was horrible so I was basically forced into getting a Verizon phone for the stability.
I'd like to see the government step in and loosen the grip that carriers have on consumers, though that would mean the end of subsidized phone sales, and maybe the new edge, next programs as well. Tmobile has the right idea, but once they are the size of Verizon, I bet they tighten their rules too...
KennyG123 said:
No, Verizon chose to lock down the phones to get huge corporate and military contracts by showing their version of the phone is the most secure. Of course AT&T is also doing the same fighting for those contracts.
I understand and there is a thread in one of the Verizon Sammy phones...Note 3 I think...where a member actually discussed with Verizon executive services the possibility of the same thing HTC did (on other carriers since Verizon locked that door too). I believe the thread is "How much would you pay for unlocking the bootloader" or something like that. He was going to get an idea of how much people would pay for this code direct from Verizon. I think the majority was $25 atm. At least he was pitching the idea to Verizon and they were hearing him out. Perhaps more can do the same?
I was just trying to say that I did not understand how the inability to root would make you feel like the phone was not yours. The PS3 systems if you play online are locked down exactly the same...you jailbreak it and you cannot get on the Playstation network to play online. So it is not just cell phones that do not allow you to do more than the manufacturer promised. I also was stating that you can certainly root and unlock it...if you had the knowledge to do so. I think we just misunderstood each other.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do not agree about contracts. Phones can be sold to the government that are locked down, KNOX EMM helps with this substantially.
The ability to unlock my bootloader, however, can be sold or marketed along side that. Phones can be wiped when the BL is unlocked officially (fastbootx, etc). Instead, the dev community is forced to find exploits, thus weakening the phones "secure market value". Official unlock that wipes phone or an unofficial exploit that puts all phones at risk? I would rather have the option to officially unlock and void my warranty. However, I understand the stance of some carriers and manufactures for locking it down. Reduce liability for busted phones.
Government agencies also encrypt phones and discipline unauthorized usage.
chriskader said:
I do not agree about contracts. Phones can be sold to the government that are locked down, KNOX EMM helps with this substantially.
The ability to unlock my bootloader, however, can be sold or marketed along side that. Phones can be wiped when the BL is unlocked officially (fastbootx, etc). Instead, the dev community is forced to find exploits, thus weakening the phones "secure market value". Official unlock that wipes phone or an unofficial exploit that puts all phones at risk? I would rather have the option to officially unlock and void my warranty. However, I understand the stance of some carriers and manufactures for locking it down. Reduce liability for busted phones.
Government agencies also encrypt phones and discipline unauthorized usage.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Since the community that roots their phones and actually breaks them and returns for warranty is probably in the neighborhood of 0.1% I doubt that has much impact on the decision of Verizon and AT&T to lock down the bootloader....if that was successfully the idea Sprint and T-Mobile would have done the same. I agree that for you Verizon users an alternative of paying to unlock your bootloader and listing the warranty as void would be a great offering...petition Verizon to consider that.
KennyG123 said:
Since the community that roots their phones and actually breaks them and returns for warranty is probably in the neighborhood of 0.1% I doubt that has much impact on the decision of Verizon and AT&T to lock down the bootloader....if that was successfully the idea Sprint and T-Mobile would have done the same. I agree that for you Verizon users an alternative of paying to unlock your bootloader and listing the warranty as void would be a great offering...petition Verizon to consider that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The petition thing is a great idea , and as I also said they could easily implement a way to offer it and track it.
The biggest problem with this whole issue is education as you are right, most people are not aware of exactly the reasons of rooting, what it even means, what they are giving up with bloated and locked down phones, or anything related to just how much privacy they do not have. I have thrown out information to people on my Facebook page and they had no clue.
As far as starting a petition, that is something I have never done before.
Does anyone have a suggestion for starting one, where to start it, or any info at all?
I would definitely do it if someone will head me in the right direction