Database Users

XDA really sucks as a phone

Well my sage continues with this XDA (SX56). This $400 Paper weight has finally pushed me back to using a PALM device. Very disappointing since I love the functionality of my Pocket PC. After Upgrading and downgrading ROM and Radio Stacks the device just never truly gets to be a phone. So I have to go back to carrying my Toshiba PDA and my Palm Tungsten W in order to get anything done.
I am so sorry for even buying the dam thing it has been a serious dampener to my business and I would never recommend another PDA/Phone like this again, to anyone.
So if your are on this website looking for a fix...there isn't one. Accept the fact that the device is just a pretty PDA that can be a phone once and a while.

I am very happy with my xda and xda 2, I have never had a problem with the phone side and I think the xda is the best featured value for money pda/phone on the market. Maybe you should address the problem in the hope of fixing it, messing with radio stacks is not to be taken lightly. If you supply all the details such as original radio stack, current radio stack, original and current rom, the nature of your problem etc. you may find a solution, if you just want to moan then moan to the suppliers. If you have been experimenting with non official upgrades etc then it is not the fault of the supplier or the hardware.

Great device
I used my xda as a pda, to access emails, to surf the net, as a library, as a directory, as a newspaper and even as a phone now and again (have I missed anything out? oh yes its a big kids toy as well.). Now and again I get a hitch ... usually due to my own meddling, but most of the time it all works fine. I finally talked myself into an XDA II a couple of weeks ago and now I can add media messaging, video camera and wifi to the list.
As for the phone, I guess your network and local signal strength will dictate how well it works ... perhaps I have just been lucky.

cruisin-thru said:
I am very happy with my xda and xda 2, I have never had a problem with the phone side and I think the xda is the best featured value for money pda/phone on the market. Maybe you should address the problem in the hope of fixing it, messing with radio stacks is not to be taken lightly. If you supply all the details such as original radio stack, current radio stack, original and current rom, the nature of your problem etc. you may find a solution, if you just want to moan then moan to the suppliers. If you have been experimenting with non official upgrades etc then it is not the fault of the supplier or the hardware.
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Agreed, I am very happy with the phone and pad portions, as well as the ability to hack and test like mad.

Plenty of people seem happy. Me included. Seems that you fixed what wasn't broke. Jolly bad luck, old chap.
I'm trying to work out what was the purpose of your post. Sounds like an admission that you screwed it up.
In my experience, company directors shouldn't ever be allowed near technology...

mmm 7 posts
6 from last two days
all just complaining
How do you treat employees that only complain?

Phew, it's getting a bit warm in here!
I agree with the general consensus, it's a great device, and i think you just have to accept that any device that can be a phone, pda, internet browser, satnav, mp3/video player etc etc all in one handy little box is going to have a few problems every now and again! Stop moaning!

Perhaps I'm biased because I have been a PPC fan for a long time and so really utilize my XDA II's PPC functions a lot. But to me the phone aspect works pretty well too.
I must admit it is a bit disappointing that we need to buy 3rd party applications like RingtoneX and PocketZenPhone to profide functions which are standard in most other phones but apart from that I am happy with the phone functionality too.
Combined with my in car kit and Destinator GPS the XDA II becomes even more functional. The clarity of calls made and received in the car is fine and the GPS is fantastic.
For a mobile hands free I have opted to use the Logitec BT headset. Yeah I look a bit weird with it stuck on my ear but it certainly does the trick.
I'm sorry you are disappointed with your choice Director4u2c, but I am very happy with mine.
Ed

Yep, I've had a few problems with my Xda1, but after finding this site and being very patient and persistent I now have 2003 and it works really well as a phone, I'm a youth worker and need a reliable phone - this fits the bill. I've got all my contacts can browse the internet for housing vacancies etc. I suggest you ask rudegar to send you some basic instructions (as he did for myself) and then play a bit. At first I found the instructions very confusing, but by going step by step I upgraded the software and it all works fantastically! Give it a go mate, and hopefully you'll have better luck

The biggest Universal problem

Microsoft behind the thing! Operating system and applications in one dish and no big boy can eat in it. No competition. No killer apps coming from who knows where. No unskeduled innovations. No hurry to cover, bugs created, market holes.

And now in English? :shock:

S'funny I seem to have quite a few third party apps on my Universal, some of which I use more than any pre-installed ones from MS.
Also if you don't want to use MS products why not buy a nice Symbian based pda phone? The Motorola a1000 is nice and the SE P range.

IMHO
The biggest problem is not any one thing in particular...
Yesterday I used an old, disregarded & completely discarded Sony Ericsson T610 - which is about 3 years old.
So T610 Vs. Universal?
Of course one is a bluetooth mobile phone the other is clearly much more... but when you look at the fact that surely the primary function for a Universal has to be voice communication it made me think...
The T610 paired with my Motorola H500 BT headset immediately, it dialled, redialled and held calls with perfect clarity & reception. For being an old phone.. I was actually amazed at how speedy it responded making calls, accepting calls, switching from BT to phone, etc etc
all this was achieved with absolute effortless stability....
That made me think how 'awkward' my M5000 is in similar operations... the dropped calls, the dropped BT connections & so on... you know, all the issues we simplly just 'put up with'
Sifting through this forum again & reminding myself of these many different issues we've all at one time or another experienced with our Universals such as stability, responsiveness, performance & the like are the biggest problems
Shame really.. as on paper the Universal is indeed a very fine unit - in operation however it leaves a lot to be desired...

philtech44 said:
IMHO
.. but when you look at the fact that surely the primary function for a Universal has to be voice communication it made me think....
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Fact? Get real. No one in their right mind (not even MS or O2) would claim that the primary function of the Universal is voice communication. Even your own sig makes that obvious

Ineedtoys said:
philtech44 said:
IMHO
.. but when you look at the fact that surely the primary function for a Universal has to be voice communication it made me think....
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Fact? Get real. No one in their right mind (not even MS or O2) would claim that the primary function of the Universal is voice communication. Even your own sig makes that obvious
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What? not a phone?
Then why is it provided by mobile phone companies?
... as a flagship model!!!

philtech44 said:
What? not a phone?
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You claimed that voice was the PRIMARY function. If that's the case, why did you pay all that money for the VGA display, large keyboard, 3G, and Pocket PC / Windows Mobile OS, for something that doesn't even have a caller display on the cover? But since you've got the M5000, let's look at Orange's own buy-line:-
"The Orange SPV M5000 is a 3G PDA that can be used to make and receive voice calls"
There you go. 3G PDA first, voice last. No attempt to call it a "phone", like Sony make no attempt to call the T610 a "PDA".
Then why is it provided by mobile phone companies?
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Err... Now you are being silly. Who gets the revenue from 3G and GPRS usage?
... as a flagship model!!!
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It might be flagship model, but it's a DATA centric device for business users, which is why the whole design is geared to using as it as a mini-laptop replacement.
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Indeed. There are plenty of other devices more suited if you need something more "Phone" like. Sounds to me like you just bought it because it was the most expensive, instead of what was right for your needs. That's hardly HTC's fault. :roll:

I kind of agree. I think alot of the phone has been spoiled by ONLY using Windows. (i dont think windows is crap and are not trying to slate it)
There are a few features that other phones have that make them well trick, wee lights that change colour, torches - a bunch of stuff that, lets be hounest you do not need but, makes the phone cool and helps to justify the massive brick in your pocket.
like why was VGA not supported properly? why dont the external buttons light up? why not a torch with the flash?
just my tuppance worth
JAmes

I think one of the major issues here is that the PDA operating system is trying very hard to fit in with its parent, Windows XP. So, just as Outlook, MS Access etc struggle to work with vCard formats, so does the PDA. In this day and age, when even kids tend to have two mobiles (or two cell phone numbers), how can your Contacts database be limited to one mobile number but umpteen fields for landline voice/fax numbers.
Soon, at least in the UK, mobiles are going to overtake landlines (it may already have done so for private/residential users, I don't know).
As a Mac user, I can easily transfer numbers between the Mac, SE P910i and Nokia 9500, and all the mobile numbers for each contact come across (on the N9500 you have to just change the field def, which isn't a prob) but having transferred 600+ vCards to the M5000, I lost all primary mobile numbers and only got the second or third preference mobile across.
At the very least, you should be able to add/redefine fields in the Contacts database -- I've looked and can't find any info or facility for this. That is just one of the deficiencies of WinCE/WM5.
Actually, I'm hoping that now Apple has adopted Intel chips, one of these days they're going to announce a Mobie version of OS X -- now that would be something. I'm sure a lot of users would at least try it, and many of those would even migrate (I can dream, can't I?)

Ineedtoys said:
philtech44 said:
What? not a phone?
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You claimed that voice was the PRIMARY function. If that's the case, why did you pay all that money for the VGA display, large keyboard, 3G, and Pocket PC / Windows Mobile OS, for something that doesn't even have a caller display on the cover? But since you've got the M5000, let's look at Orange's own buy-line:-
"The Orange SPV M5000 is a 3G PDA that can be used to make and receive voice calls"
There you go. 3G PDA first, voice last. No attempt to call it a "phone", like Sony make no attempt to call the T610 a "PDA".
Then why is it provided by mobile phone companies?
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Err... Now you are being silly. Who gets the revenue from 3G and GPRS usage?
... as a flagship model!!!
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It might be flagship model, but it's a DATA centric device for business users, which is why the whole design is geared to using as it as a mini-laptop replacement.
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Indeed. There are plenty of other devices more suited if you need something more "Phone" like. Sounds to me like you just bought it because it was the most expensive, instead of what was right for your needs. That's hardly HTC's fault. :roll:
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ineedtoys - has the cheek to say I bought the most expensive toy with a username like that?!
javascript:emoticon(':?')
I'm not going to argue whether the primary function is a phone or mini-laptop/pda, etc etc
or whether a T610 is PDA or indeed a bacon sandwich or something...
As with any MULTI-FUNCTION device - they are simply different things to different people dont you think?
ineed, the title of this thread is "the biggest problem..."
I believe the fact that the phone function of the Universal is not what it should be makes it the biggest problem for me & I suspect quite a few others...
It's quite clear you don't agree with that.. I never made that statement to p*** you or anyone off... or feel the need to argue my case... it's my opinion... and essentially what I'm saying I suspect many would agree with.. However, you haven't yet joined in with the thread and offered your OWN view on what you believe is the biggest problem...??
So, in your view, what is the biggest problem with the Universal ??

@philtech44
I'm wth you - the Universal should do the basic functions of a cell/mobile phone at least as good as the T610 or a K750. A SIM free Universal is between $900 - $1000. For this kind of money you should be getting the best communications device. My daughter's free Moto v3X shows the gap in communication capability of the Universal - you see these are both 3G phones and the extra capacity of 3G improves voice calls, but not on the Universal!

jah said:
@philtech44
I'm wth you - the Universal should do the basic functions of a cell/mobile phone at least as good as the T610 or a K750. A SIM free Universal is between $900 - $1000. For this kind of money you should be getting the best communications device. My daughter's free Moto v3X shows the gap in communication capability of the Universal - you see these are both 3G phones and the extra capacity of 3G improves voice calls, but not on the Universal!
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My point exactly.. my crappy old T610's phone functions including bluetooth worked effortlessy well... my M5000 felt like a Nokia Cityman in comparison and this is wrong...
and yes - for a flagship 3G device.... well... I will say that out of the Universal and two baked bean cans connected via a piece of string... yes, the Universal wins... :lol:

sipat said:
I think one of the major issues here is that the PDA operating system is trying very hard to fit in with its parent, Windows XP. So, just as Outlook, MS Access etc struggle to work with vCard formats, so does the PDA. In this day and age, when even kids tend to have two mobiles (or two cell phone numbers), how can your Contacts database be limited to one mobile number but umpteen fields for landline voice/fax numbers.
Soon, at least in the UK, mobiles are going to overtake landlines (it may already have done so for private/residential users, I don't know).
As a Mac user, I can easily transfer numbers between the Mac, SE P910i and Nokia 9500, and all the mobile numbers for each contact come across (on the N9500 you have to just change the field def, which isn't a prob) but having transferred 600+ vCards to the M5000, I lost all primary mobile numbers and only got the second or third preference mobile across.
At the very least, you should be able to add/redefine fields in the Contacts database -- I've looked and can't find any info or facility for this. That is just one of the deficiencies of WinCE/WM5.
Actually, I'm hoping that now Apple has adopted Intel chips, one of these days they're going to announce a Mobie version of OS X -- now that would be something. I'm sure a lot of users would at least try it, and many of those would even migrate (I can dream, can't I?)
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yes sipat.. that is definitely another big problem
As far as Apple is concerned & being a Mac specialist myself, you could only imagine a OSX Mobile OS... simple, effective, robust and as far as connectivity & compatibility is concerned.. well we live to dream eh?

I'm sorry I don't agree. At the current point that technology stands you will not get an open OS multi-function device operating as well and as effeciently as a closed OS phone. Granted that Symbian may be more stable, but then it is the much older more experienced OS too.
The T610 has basically one job, it operates as a phone, using it's own software, which has all been written to work together at the expense of ignoring other possibilities.
The universal has an open OS which has to allow third parties to add software, that dosn't even exist yet. This open software is bound to be slower, it has to be, it has too many possibilities it has to consider.
Comparing the speed of a T610 and a universal is like comparing the Fuel economy of a Bicycle and a Jeep. They are 2 entirely different things.
I do know what the biggest problem for the universal is. It's the end user, the majority of which are completely outside of the intended trarget audience, and missuse a little knowledge badly.
Funny how my Universal never drops call, bluetooth works perfectly for handsfree and GPS. I can't remember the last time I soft reset, and when I did it was only part of the installation of new software. It dosn't crash, freeze or run any slower then I'd expect. Why is this? Am I just incredibly lucky?
However I have been using PDA's for a long time, and have come at this device as a PDA with a phone built in, rather than the other way round. If people think a T610 is better, (and yes I did have one once). Then you have bought the completely wrong device with a Universal, because while your T610 may be faster, my Universal is providing so many more functions.
(EDIT): lol Wow, that wasn't intended to come out as such a rant.

Gajet said:
I'm sorry I don't agree. At the current point that technology stands you will not get an open OS multi-function device operating as well and as effeciently as a closed OS phone. Granted that Symbian may be more stable, but then it is the much older more experienced OS too.
The T610 has basically one job, it operates as a phone, using it's own software, which has all been written to work together at the expense of ignoring other possibilities.
The universal has an open OS which has to allow third parties to add software, that dosn't even exist yet. This open software is bound to be slower, it has to be, it has too many possibilities it has to consider.
Comparing the speed of a T610 and a universal is like comparing the Fuel economy of a Bicycle and a Jeep. They are 2 entirely different things.
I do know what the biggest problem for the universal is. It's the end user, the majority of which are completely outside of the intended trarget audience, and missuse a little knowledge badly.
Funny how my Universal never drops call, bluetooth works perfectly for handsfree and GPS. I can't remember the last time I soft reset, and when I did it was only part of the installation of new software. It dosn't crash, freeze or run any slower then I'd expect. Why is this? Am I just incredibly lucky?
However I have been using PDA's for a long time, and have come at this device as a PDA with a phone built in, rather than the other way round. If people think a T610 is better, (and yes I did have one once). Then you have bought the completely wrong device with a Universal, because while your T610 may be faster, my Universal is providing so many more functions.
(EDIT): lol Wow, that wasn't intended to come out as such a rant.
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Firstly, nothing to be sorry about... BUT gajet do stop it!
Do yourself a big favour & dont try to turn my simple statement into a silly
HTC Universal Vs. Sony Ericsson T610 contest... that is not what I said!!
you've foolishly twisted my very SIMPLE point into something utterly ridiculous my friend!
Your comparison between bicycles, Jeeps and the like is also junk pal!!
Kindly go back to my original post and take it at FACE VALUE...
A phone is a phone. A PDA is a PDA.
A PDA with a phone is what it is and so is a Phone with a PDA...
the point is anything that calls itself a phone, whether or not integrated with a toaster or a kettle, PDA or surgically inserted somewhere interesting, should therefore function both properly and effectively, and with some degree of quality as a bleedin' phone!!!
Do you agree with that statement or not?
It's quite clear... the Universals performance as a phone is somewhat cr*ppy for todays technology - its a let down, no question about it. Could be & should be better!
I've compared only that function, to a phone that was designed 5 years ago, manufactured 4 years ago and released to the public thereafter.. and that FACT is my only point here in this thread...
Now as for your own personal experience of Universals, well might I suggest searching the forum for threads which cover the FACT that the Universal - for some of us - does drop calls, Bluetooth is temperamental, are forced to soft & hard reset, and so on... I mean why is the Universal forum so huge with 100's of 1000's of views in its history, with issues AND fixes abound?
But again I must stress, my personal view is the Universals phone function is cr*ppy compared to what it really should be... This is 2006... not 2001... if you dont agree lets see what phone performance will be like in HTC's next generation & equivalent of the Universal...
Do you think they will upgrade all the other functions and leave the phone as it is then?!
get me now??

philtech44 said:
IMHO
So T610 Vs. Universal?
...
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Actually it is exactly what you said.
And my points which you completely missed are if you are going to compare the Universal to other devices, it should be compared to it's peers, not to a completely different device. Compare the Universal to the other similar PDA/phone combos by HTC, a HP Ipaq phone edition, it would even be fair to compare against a Moto a1000, SE P910 etc
Of course these devices improve over time, my Universal is considerable better than my Blue Angel, which appears in turn to have been better than the original XDA range. So yes the next device will probably be better still, but then where on earth did you get the impression I ever thought otherwise.

Gajet said:
philtech44 said:
IMHO
So T610 Vs. Universal?
...
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Actually it is exactly what you said.
And my points which you completely missed are if you are going to compare the Universal to other devices, it should be compared to it's peers, not to a completely different device. Compare the Universal to the other similar PDA/phone combos by HTC, a HP Ipaq phone edition, it would even be fair to compare against a Moto a1000, SE P910 etc
Of course these devices improve over time, my Universal is considerable better than my Blue Angel, which appears in turn to have been better than the original XDA range. So yes the next device will probably be better still, but then where on earth did you get the impression I ever thought otherwise.
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So I did!! errr... whoops!
But still it should still operate as a phone mate & do so well.. it is sold by mobile phone companies isn't it?

No I agree with you 100% there. However when I compare the Universal to other devices of similar functionality on the current market, then it comes out very well.
In fact where I hang out usually at 3g.co.uk, they compare the Universal against other 3g phones, (Which I do realise goes completely against my main point :roll: ), but the Universal still comes out very well.
Yes the universal could be better, (mainly speed wise), but at this current point in time it does very well.
I wish I could clone mine to pass around to all those having troubles, but my suspicion is that most troubles are generated when some tweaking, or installation of third party apps are involved, or more commonly when the damn phone companies insist on using their own versions of HTC's software, (O2 Active and the damn Orange homescreen for example).
Anyway all the above is purely my oppinion, I had no intention of getting into any personal arguements and hopefully we have come to an understanding here

Gajet said:
I do know what the biggest problem for the universal is. It's the end user, the majority of which are completely outside of the intended trarget audience, and missuse a little knowledge badly.
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Hi. I don't want to crank this up to another level, especially after the last post about coming to some understanding. Us Mac guys know that you can get quite emotionally attached to your gadjets, Gajet, but that statement above is so condescending!
I don't think you give people enough credit -- some may have bought their phone because it was the most expensive and is had good "showing-off/one-upmanship" value, but most of have acquired to manage our work and life. When you pay a premium price, you expect a premium product. Using your analogy, you wouldn't expect to have handle-bars instead of a steering wheel in your Jeep, eh?
In my opinion, it is fairer to compare the functionality of a PDA with similar functions on a desktop machine. and, my gripe is still about the Contacts database -- I want editable fields and true vCard compatibility. I don't think I'm expecting too much from what is supposedly a mature product (the Contacts bit is based on Windows for PC tech after all). As this is my first Win based mobile OS I'm still trying to sort out certain issues, but I understand that even moving data from/between supposedly similar or compatible PDAs is not straight forward.
Aaahh! Maybe Mac users are just spoiled silly, hey.

Everybody keeps talking about what the thing is and what should be, but this is not the reason i started this topic for. So i must repeat myself. Who can fix bluetooth problems? Microsoft. Who can fix radio problems? Microsoft. Who can fix performance problems? Microsoft. Who can fix basic applications problems? Microsoft. Who can fix data sync problems? Microsoft. So we totally depend on Microsoft and she can take all the time she wants.

Becoming very disillusioned with this phone

Hi All,
This phone seems to be developing more problems every day! Perhaps it is because I have loaded Voice Command 1.6 but it now randomly (or so it seems) shuts down bluetooth without a warning so that I can't receive calls on my headset.
Add the screen alignment issue which I tried to fix unsuccessfully with the business card, still no bluetooth for voice dialing with VC 1.6 and the following and I wonder is it worth it at all?
Only some names are displayed when calls come in. Many callers only have number displayed even though they are in the phone book.
Phone is often very slow although I don't have a lot of programs loaded. Soft reset seems to help but I haven't tested it extensively. Most annoying is dialing as a 1 second lag while dialing numbers becomes very irritating after a while.
I can't get it to synchronise with my laptop even though both are enabled and it goes some way towards it.
I had my first handheld nearly ten years ago. They really haven't moved on enough in that time I think. Is it acceptable for a company to put out a product that costs megabucks but still requires one to be a geek and spend hours on the net finding solutions to all the problems on it?

broadband155 said:
Hi All,
This phone seems to be developing more problems every day! Perhaps it is because I have loaded Voice Command 1.6 but it now randomly (or so it seems) shuts down bluetooth without a warning so that I can't receive calls on my headset.
Add the screen alignment issue which I tried to fix unsuccessfully with the business card, still no bluetooth for voice dialing with VC 1.6 and the following and I wonder is it worth it at all?
Only some names are displayed when calls come in. Many callers only have number displayed even though they are in the phone book.
Phone is often very slow although I don't have a lot of programs loaded. Soft reset seems to help but I haven't tested it extensively. Most annoying is dialing as a 1 second lag while dialing numbers becomes very irritating after a while.
I can't get it to synchronise with my laptop even though both are enabled and it goes some way towards it.
I had my first handheld nearly ten years ago. They really haven't moved on enough in that time I think. Is it acceptable for a company to put out a product that costs megabucks but still requires one to be a geek and spend hours on the net finding solutions to all the problems on it?
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Neil
Whilst there are elements of truth in what you say, I think the lesson here is - if you want stability and reliability and don't have the time for patience or the "developers" instinct, then steer clear of cutting edge technology or the latest gasgets combining a variety of technologies.
I could certainly say I'd be guaranteed a more reliable simple and straightforward phone if I used my old nokia 3100. I would probably say a paper notebook would be quicker on occasion than whipping out the old PDA. If I want to do something on Excel, I'd be better advised to wait 'til I get to the office and so on. BUT for a mix of entertainment and a range of features to help me out from time to time, along with the enjoyment of trying out new things, I'd go for Hermes. In 6 months things will have moved on again, many things will have been sorted out for Hermes but some new gadget will be out next season along with a whole new set of issues. You either enjoy this and don't expect things to ever achieve perfection, or you opt out of the technology race. Change it seems to me is now so rapid, many will question whether it's worth buying the latest technolgy cos before it's even on the shelves it'll have been superceded by the next pre-release models. I can see the rate of customer disatisfaction with new technology rising and rising as companies are forced to release things far too early in order not to loose the superfast moving market. Sky digital being a case in point in the UK with thousands of digital boxes being returned as not functioning. Some folks now being on their 5th or 6th digibox already in the space of a couple of months.
Nuf said
Mike

Hi Mike,
Thanks for your reply. I hear you and I do agree to an extent. The problem I have with it is that it isn't only guys like me who buy these devices. I am somewhere in the middle, between an early adopter and a neophyte. I know lots of guys who are neophytes and have bought these things over the years. They don't come with a geek warning nor do they offer any sort of solution in many cases to the operational problems. The guy who buys a device like this does so because he thinks it will work. It is enough of a challenge to figure out how to use the basic functions. He isn't interested in becoming a technology guru in order to solve the problems.
As I said before, I bought my first handheld a long time ago. (HP 620LX) While the market moves on very quickly, I believe there is still a place for mature technology. The 620 was buggy then and the TyTN is buggy now. What about a device that does the fundamental things well? Perhaps they are all over the place and I bought the wrong one. I still think the screen alignment issue is unforgiveable though.

I agree with what Mike said about staying out of the firing line or the cutting edge as he put it. I believe I am more neophyte than most people here, yet I buy into these things for the enjoyment of having to find solutions to the now expected problems with cutting edge all-singing all-dancing devices...or maybe I'm just a masochist?

broadband155 said:
Hi Mike,
Thanks for your reply. I hear you and I do agree to an extent. The problem I have with it is that it isn't only guys like me who buy these devices. I am somewhere in the middle, between an early adopter and a neophyte. I know lots of guys who are neophytes and have bought these things over the years. They don't come with a geek warning nor do they offer any sort of solution in many cases to the operational problems. The guy who buys a device like this does so because he thinks it will work. It is enough of a challenge to figure out how to use the basic functions. He isn't interested in becoming a technology guru in order to solve the problems.
As I said before, I bought my first handheld a long time ago. (HP 620LX) While the market moves on very quickly, I believe there is still a place for mature technology. The 620 was buggy then and the TyTN is buggy now. What about a device that does the fundamental things well? Perhaps they are all over the place and I bought the wrong one. I still think the screen alignment issue is unforgiveable though.
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I certainly agree with you regarding screen alignment problem, that's unforgivably poor design as is the loose stylus and loose keyboard.
Mike

mikechannon said:
Neil
Whilst there are elements of truth in what you say, I think the lesson here is - if you want stability and reliability and don't have the time for patience or the "developers" instinct, then steer clear of cutting edge technology or the latest gasgets combining a variety of technologies.
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Uh, no. No, no, no!
Sorry, that's not how it works. Nope! No siree!
You sell a device on the open market, and it had better be reliable, bug free, and within a certain reliability matrix. A lot of devices are falling outside that range, and the manufacturers are finding themselves in court as a result.
For example, Palm is currently in the middle of a class action lawsuit, over the poor build quality of their Treo 600 and 650s.
Caveat emptor? Sure, but only to a point. Every single democracy in the world has some form of judicially established, and in many cases legislatively established, understanding of quality as a requirement.

BRad Barnett said:
Uh, no. No, no, no!
Sorry, that's not how it works. Nope! No siree!
You sell a device on the open market, and it had better be reliable, bug free, and within a certain reliability matrix. A lot of devices are falling outside that range, and the manufacturers are finding themselves in court as a result.
For example, Palm is currently in the middle of a class action lawsuit, over the poor build quality of their Treo 600 and 650s.
Caveat emptor? Sure, but only to a point. Every single democracy in the world has some form of judicially established, and in many cases legislatively established, understanding of quality as a requirement.
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I know what you are saying but it IS what is happening as you acknowledge (despite the "Sorry, that's not how it works. Nope! No siree!") and indeed there may be quite a few legal cases brought as a result - but note it still carries on so it is the way it works. In fact, I believe things will get worse with the exponentially increasing speed of technological development.
I stand by my advice stay away from the leading edge devices if it's stability you want and I don't think any amount of cases brought in the courts will change this. I wholeheartedly agree with you as regards any hardware issues - Screen alignment, loose this and loose that, but software has always started out buggy and developed and to some extent, at least ,for those here that's part of the challenge - even if I don't say enjoyment!!
Mike

I've seen the bluetooth stack shutdown issue on my TyTN too. I'm currently testing the 1.35 TyTN ROM to see if it fixes this problem. In my case it was related to using the bluetooth stack for other purposes (bt keyboard, A2DP). It seemed to me that my car handsfree would work just fine until I used bt for one of the above then I'd see the random bt radio off issue. Sometimes this would even happen while driving after a successful pairing with my car.

HTC "video driver" bug causing issues for many users?

Anyone know what this about?
http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2008/...-angry-mobile-owners-rush-castle-htc-with-bu/
link to the xda thread about it?

This is about a group of litigation-crazed people who want to file a class-action suit against a device manufacturer (HTC) because the manufacturer did not include a functionality that would be technologically possible to include in a device. Since class-action suits are overwhelmingly just scams where the lawyers literally make millions for a few hours work, and the companies sued get to give you a coupon for a future purchase thereby increasing the chance you will, in fact, make a future purchase from them, I make no prediction as to whether a suit will be filed or settled in the customary way. However, in a "real" law suit, there is no way the courts would require a company to include all technologically possible features in a product, regardless of how "easy" it might allegedly be to include them. Note that in this case, neither HTC nor the carriers (as far as I have heard) ever stated that this functionality was included in the device.

Yeah, I don't know where that is coming from... of all the issues with the phone.. video is the least. BT still sucks as well as the phone turning on and off at will. Not checking email when it is supposed to... etc etc.

yakky said:
Yeah, I don't know where that is coming from... of all the issues with the phone.. video is the least. BT still sucks as well as the phone turning on and off at will. Not checking email when it is supposed to... etc etc.
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Maybe you should file a class-action suit against the video driver class-action people for taking HTC's time and attention away from fixing real problems...

Actually the mogul does have video playback issues with constant stutering and pausing. From what I've heard from 6700 users video playback is much much smoother (the way it should be). I don't know if it calls for a law suit but hey at least they got htc's attention and now their releasing new drivers that will supposedly fix the video playback issues.

bakntyme said:
This is about a group of litigation-crazed people who want to file a class-action suit against a device manufacturer (HTC) because the manufacturer did not include a functionality that would be technologically possible to include in a device. Since class-action suits are overwhelmingly just scams where the lawyers literally make millions for a few hours work, and the companies sued get to give you a coupon for a future purchase thereby increasing the chance you will, in fact, make a future purchase from them, I make no prediction as to whether a suit will be filed or settled in the customary way. However, in a "real" law suit, there is no way the courts would require a company to include all technologically possible features in a product, regardless of how "easy" it might allegedly be to include them. Note that in this case, neither HTC nor the carriers (as far as I have heard) ever stated that this functionality was included in the device.
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Keep your feces to yourself. if you have nothing better to do but flame a valid issue on HTC phones then i suggest to go jump off a hill.

SINNN said:
Keep your feces to yourself. if you have nothing better to do but flame a valid issue on HTC phones then i suggest to go jump off a hill.
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Why are you afraid for someone to post a valid, opposing viewpoint to yours? Can you not accept that someone who disagrees with you may still have a valid point? My post was not flaming at all, your post however seems to utilize nothing but flame to express your thoughts. Now, please post again with a well-thought-out response to my points as opposed to a simple flame, as I am interested in an intelligent response and will read it with an open mind.
While you are at it, maybe you can explain why, if all that is needed is a simple driver and all graphics problems will be solved with no detrimental side-effects, no one here on xda-developers, where I truly believe there is at least as much talent as at HTC, has done the allegedly simple task of writing or finding that driver and distributing it.

bakntyme said:
Why are you afraid for someone to post a valid, opposing viewpoint to yours? Can you not accept that someone who disagrees with you may still have a valid point? My post was not flaming at all, your post however seems to utilize nothing but flame to express your thoughts. Now, please post again with a well-thought-out response to my points as opposed to a simple flame, as I am interested in an intelligent response and will read it with an open mind.
While you are at it, maybe you can explain why, if all that is needed is a simple driver and all graphics problems will be solved with no detrimental side-effects, no one here on xda-developers, where I truly believe there is at least as much talent as at HTC, has done the allegedly simple task of writing or finding that driver and distributing it.
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I feel the need to address this... despite not having been in the original exchange. I can accept that you have a differing viewpoint from us. I refuse to be called a "litigation-crazed" person. I also think you need to get your facts straight before you pass judgment.
The simple fact is - we want the functionality that our devices were advertised with. Many of us did our research and realized that the MSM7500 is a POWERFUL chip. The video acceleration is top-tier, and everything else seemed good too. Then HTC decided to not include a driver for video acceleration. Also, before someone mentions that HTC has claimed(but never in an official press release) that the MSM7500 might NOT include the video acceleration... When have you known a huge manufacturer(nVidia, AMD, Intel, ATi, Qualcomm, etc) to name two differing devices the same name? They don't. they generally qualify them(e.g. 8800 series nVidia cards can be 8800 GT, GTX, GTS, etc.) What HTC did is akin to Dell selling you an Inspiron notebook with an nVidia 8800GTS card inside, then telling you that they didn't include drivers. Oh, and don't forget that nVidia won't support the card, since it's up to the manufacturer(Dell) to supply the drivers. Microsoft won't do it since it's Dell's problem. Dell won't do it because it isn't cost effective. (Suspend the reality of the situation for the analogy, though, please) Now you're left with a $300 piece of video hardware that can't be used because nobody wanted to provide a driver. Go software acceleration! That's the issue we're having. The phones WERE advertised as having the MSM7500(or 7200) which according to everything I've seen both have video acceleration. HTC just dropped the ball.
Now, about us writing our own drivers... That would be difficult without getting a bunch of information from Microsoft, HTC and Qualcomm, which they won't release. If you don't know why, look up open source video drivers for Linux, and you'll understand the pain. It's not a baseless suit - however I don't think that class action is the way to go. I think we need to work WITH MS, HTC, and Qualcomm to come up with a driver. Period. Don't let up the pressure until we have that.

I am sorry, but when your advocacy group starts out with a name like "HTCClassAction", and names its website "htcclassaction.org", it shows itself as not interested in getting the claimed result, but instead, despite any protestations from the group, interested in filing a class-action lawsuit from the beginning. That is "litigation-crazed". Was "htcvideodrivers.org" not available? I am sure that, if you wanted to, given a few minutes you could come up with several non-litigation-oriented group and website names. If you were the product manager for the 6800 at HTC, and you heard of the issues raised by the group HTCClassAction, would you think, "Here is a group of users that wants to work with us to resolve what they see as a legitimate issue?"
Speaking of facts...have you actually seen an advertisement that stated that the devices came with this functionality, or did you just assume that because it was advertised as having this chipset, and the chipset has this capability, that the functionality would be included? I would bet that HTC never stated that the 6800 would include every feature technologically possible with the chipset. It has the capability of supporting an 8MP camera, but they didn't include that either. Another lawsuit? I am sure there are other things the chipset would be CAPABLE of that were not included. If you actually researched the chipset so thoroughly for this issue prior to purchasing the device, why did you not notice in the first 30 days that it was not included, and return the device?
Realize that modern class-action lawsuits are almost always settled for lots of money to the attorneys and a pittance to the class. Remember the Verizon Moto 710 Bluetooth class action? It was settled as usual...the attorneys got somewhere around $6 million; users got $25 if they wanted to keep the 710 and stay with Verizon, a waived ETF and a refund if they wanted to leave Verizon, and a credit toward another device if they wanted to stay with Verizon but not keep the 710. They did not get additional Bluetooth profiles. And if this goes to trial, the courts will never order a manufacturer to provide technology, and support for it, that the manufacturer does not want to provide. IF you could prove false advertising, and I do not think that you could, you might get a small refund or credit toward another phone. If that is what you want, just sell the device on an internet auction site and buy something else...you will probably get more that way.

sucks too that our phones dont even have the ati chip in them. my htc wizard (old school) had better video and gameplay

I don't play games much on my ppc so this problem hasn't affected me as much. However I did notice that PIE was sluggish and freaked when video playback sucked on WM and TCPMP. Most of that was avoided by using GDI on TCPMP.
The real issue here is why can't they add the driver? If it was a simple fix it probably wouldn't have been left out in the first place. Sounds to me like they ran into technical issues trying to make it work.

I just got the mogul last week. I have 30 days to evaluate it. Do you think that I should have gotten something else? I think that I've had at least 10 different Smartphones & PPC's in the past 5 or 6 years. They all have something I dislike about them. This one is the best one I've had yet, but would you recommend something else? THANKS

johnannie said:
I just got the mogul last week. I have 30 days to evaluate it. Do you think that I should have gotten something else? I think that I've had at least 10 different Smartphones & PPC's in the past 5 or 6 years. They all have something I dislike about them. This one is the best one I've had yet, but would you recommend something else? THANKS
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you hit the nail on the head. EVERY PPC is going to have SOMETHING you dont like about it.
with that said. it only matters what you think. dont go taking advice from a forum where 50 percent of its members cant even tie their shoes.
For the record, i agree with what the person said way up at the beginnning of the thread. "Why are you *****ing now when you had 30 days in which to evaluate and return it if you felt the need?!""
I would imagine the courts will say the same. everyone who thinks this is a legit complaint needs to get a hobby. you all had 30 days in which to make your decision, so DEAL with it.
sound like a buncha kids to me
I guess we should sue them for not having a 'tv out' jack on the mogul too, since thats also possible. and oh yeah, where's my 8 megapixel camera on the mogul?? it supports that as well.
ah screw it, im going to cry to mommy

watson540 said:
you hit the nail on the head. EVERY PPC is going to have SOMETHING you dont like about it.
with that said. it only matters what you think. dont go taking advice from a forum where 50 percent of its members cant even tie their shoes.
For the record, i agree with what the person said way up at the beginnning of the thread. "Why are you *****ing now when you had 30 days in which to evaluate and return it if you felt the need?!""
I would imagine the courts will say the same. everyone who thinks this is a legit complaint needs to get a hobby. you all had 30 days in which to make your decision, so DEAL with it.
sound like a buncha kids to me
I guess we should sue them for not having a 'tv out' jack on the mogul too, since thats also possible. and oh yeah, where's my 8 megapixel camera on the mogul?? it supports that as well.
ah screw it, im going to cry to mommy
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Hahahahaha. Yes, we're children. Little babies, the lot of us. Anyway......
No, we shouldn't sue them for not including a tv-out jack or an 8 megapixel camera. What we are trying to achieve is driver support FOR THE INCLUDED HARDWARE. This is what most people who argue against our position fail to realize. We aren't asking them to do something crazy, like give us a better camera or a tv-out jack, or even more memory. We're asking them to SUPPORT THE HARDWARE THEY SOLD US. Gasp.
Now... I'll use an analogy for those among us who are a bit retarded. If you were to buy a car that was advertised with a special computer chip in it that can control a supercharger, the electronic stability control system, up to 6 airbags, and the radio (all of which are included in your car, albeit only 4 airbags) - and it came with a 30-day money-back guarantee... and you drove it for 30 days and thought to yourself, "Wow, this is clearly better than last years' model" - would you return it? Probably not... That's what happened here.
We bought our phones, tried them and went, "Wow, they kicked the crap out of the <insert old PDA phone here>" and kept them. Now, back to our example. Now imagine you go to a car-meet-up with your new fancy car, and everyone there is talking about how <insert another fast car here> is wayyyy faster than their car, in the same conditions. You and the other owners do some research and find out that the car manufacturer didn't include software to make your supercharger work. It's just inert, sitting there looking pretty. Wouldn't you be pretty pissed that the chip in your car wasn't actually using the supercharger? Wouldn't you expect that if it was advertised as having this chip and a supercharger, that the supercharger would actually work?
Anyway - that's where I'm coming from at least - I don't presume to speak for anyone else though. I will say this though, watson540, you need to calm down. You're running around these forums beating on people's opinions and posts. Frankly, yours aren't much more productive. At least try to post something relevant or meaningful... or at the very least something other than "you moron, rtft" or "you moron, stop crying".

it's not really a bug its more
like a pc with the generic vga driver installed
even if the pc have a geforce
problems is that one cant get hold of the
spc driver to replace the generic

ponicg said:
We bought our phones, tried them and went, "Wow, they kicked the crap out of the <insert old PDA phone here>" and kept them.
...
Wouldn't you expect that if it was advertised as having this chip and a supercharger, that the supercharger would actually work?
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OK, so you admit that you were very satisfied with the performance until someone said "Hey, I think they OWE US something MORE than what we got, let's SUE THEM for it?" If the device met your needs when you tested it, then you have no complaint. If it did not, you should have returned it in the 30 day return period.
As I asked you way back in this thread, but you have not yet addressed, (nor any of the other points in my previous post), "have you actually seen an advertisement that stated that the devices came with this functionality, or did you just assume that because it was advertised as having this chipset, and the chipset has this capability, that the functionality would be included?...If you actually researched the chipset so thoroughly for this issue prior to purchasing the device, why did you not notice in the first 30 days that it was not included, and return the device?"
None of these analogies is perfect...one big flaw in yours is that you hypothesized "If you were to buy a car that was advertised with a special computer chip in it that can control a supercharger," then switched to the car actually having a supercharger advertised: "Wouldn't you expect that if it was advertised as having this chip and a supercharger". Another is that the supercharger's existence is open and apparent to someone who looks under the hood, without requiring any research or disassembly of the vehicle. Another is that in chip manufacturing, it is usually more efficient to produce a batch of chips with all the capabilities, then use the ones you want in each device, as opposed to redesigning the chip package and retooling the production run for each combination of features desired in each application. No one could reasonably say that it was more efficient to produce a factory run of cars with all possible mechanical features (such as the supercharger in your example) included, and then only connect and use the ones desired for that model. However, auto manufacturers also sometimes utilize parts and sub-assemblies in a particular model without enabling or utilizing all of that component's capabilities, when doing so is more efficient.
Since you like automotive analogies, I will use one without resorting to calling anyone "a bit retarded": suppose that Ford announced that all 2010 Mustangs would use the new computer chip from Super Tuner Corporation, "because of its wonderful and powerful new capabilities," with no details as to what particular features would be made available. Your research into the chip on Super Tuner's website revealed that it supported superchargers, turbochargers, four-wheel drive, four-wheel steering, and nitrous fuel systems. You went in to a Ford dealer and test-drove the top-of-the-line 2010 Mustang, were impressed by its performance, and bought it. Six months later, someone pointed out that you had received none of those performance items listed above. You did not know why, but it was because Ford had internally determined pre-production that the suspension and frame would not be sufficient to provide those performance items in any model Mustang, and they did not want to re-engineer the support structure. They made no announcement about these features not being available, as they had never made any announcement about including those features. Would you join the MustangClassAction.org group? Now suppose that you had done no research prior to the purchase, and six months later discovered the information on Super Tuner's website after someone pointed out the lack to you...even less valid a complaint then, isn't it?
And further suppose that at the same time, someone else says, "I took the interior of my Mustang apart, and it has mounts for 8 speakers, and they only provided it with 4 speakers. Ford has to install 4 more speakers in every Mustang, because it has the capability of holding them!"
And another owner pulls out his factory radio, notices the output jack on the back for a subwoofer..."Where is my subwoofer? It obviously was supposed to come with my car, or they would not have included a radio that could support one and put a jack on the back of the radio to plug one in!!"
Meanwhile, another owner says "I was testing the electronic trip computer included in my Mustang, the same one included in all 2010 Mustangs, and it has the ability to calculate and display up to 55 MPG, but my Mustang only gets 23 MPG. Obviously, Ford was advertising a Mustang that would get 55 MPG and must give us that!"
Enough analogies? Would you get angrier, and call Ford arrogant, when they say, "Thank you for your business, customers, but we never said the Mustang had those capabilities, and we have no intention of retrofitting them, but we will take your opinions into account in designing our next vehicle?"
Analogies by their nature will never replicate the Titan/Mogul/6800 situation. However, we can discuss the 6800 situation itself, and I am waiting for your answer about the HTC advertisement and your not discovering the lack in the first 30 days of your device ownership.

its just bull**** when the the video playback on the 6700 is alot better than the titan. makes no sense at all and yes i feel ripped off.

im no expert..but from over here it looks like bakntyme just put all of you crybabies in your place
very well said bakntyme. perfect.
p.s. yeah im an asshole. but this asshole can read and troubleshoot and operate electronics all by my big self.
read these forums enough and you will start to think everyone in the world collectively never got out of elementary school
apologies where they are due. but some people are incredible helpless (this last comment has nothing to do with this thread im responding to the guy above who "called me out" for being an (admitted) asshole)

unless you guys can come up with some previous claim by HTC that the mogul was supposed to support this specific capability of the chip, i dont see how you guys can try to force anything out of them. I'm with bakntyme on this one.
Sure its pretty crappy that they put the hardware in there and didnt support it, and im no lawyer, but it doesnt seem like they would be under any legal obligation to support the video drivers.

watson540 said:
im no expert..but from over here it looks like bakntyme just put all of you crybabies in your place
very well said bakntyme. perfect.
p.s. yeah im an asshole. but this asshole can read and troubleshoot and operate electronics all by my big self.
read these forums enough and you will start to think everyone in the world collectively never got out of elementary school
apologies where they are due. but some people are incredible helpless (this last comment has nothing to do with this thread im responding to the guy above who "called me out" for being an (admitted) asshole)
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Although I appreciate the support, a more professional wording of it might help to keep from increasing the level of emotions and inflammation on this issue.

Summarization of complaints regarding the XOOM.

Why are people complaining that their Motorola Xoom isn't a phone? I get a real laugh out of the "I'm so pissed because I can't call someone from this device" threads. Texting is another laughable point? Really you aren't carrying a phone around with you at the same time as your Xoom that you can't pull it out for 3 seconds and fire off that txt? One guy wants to know why he can't use his Xoom as a GPS while he's FLYING.
Here is a short list of features that I *love* about the Xoom so far:
- Holy **** the screen is sexy. Playing around with some of these apps on a 10" widescreen is awesome.
- Battery Life - I am charing the thing overnight, picking it up in the morning at 100% and then typically ending the day at 70+% remaining. This is fantastic to me.
- Portability and ease of access - Using my acer netbook was a pain in the ass because I had to wait for windows to load, the desktop to show up... the workspace to be ready. This is instant on and ready.
- RDP works well - I can get into my books from anywhere, generate invoices and e-mail them to a customer right there on the spot. It's impressive and when you're a technology company it just looks good.
- Email support - The exchange support is awesome. The stock mail client could be a little stronger but I am very happy that it supports HTML as the android 2.2 / 2.3 mail client on my Nexus One does not/did not.
- Available storage space - Not having the SD slot isn't bothering me one bit. I would go as far as saying I may not ever even need it. Shipping the product with 32GB of internal storage was the way to go.
- App support - Out of the box, like 90% of my apps worked fine (granted I only use heavily maybe 5 out of the 40 that i have installed). The one or two apps that were missing at launch I've already gotten word from the developers that tablet ready versions or updates are on the way.
- Connectivity - Being a first time Verizon subscriber I am very impressed with the radio and/or 3G network behind it. When my AT&T phone has a **** signal or no signal at all, this Xoom tablet still picks up signal. That's cool to me and is a point that I would like to make separately about the need for the 3G version. Sure, I can tether through my AT&T phone but then I've got two points of failure to worry about.
My thoughts and comments regarding media consumption on this device:
- Music - I haven't had any issues at all. I use Windows Media Player 12 as a part of Windows 7 to manage my music library and it works wonderfully with the Xoom. I sync music to it just like any other generic MP3/music player. I susbcribe to the Zune Pass so actually obtaining music for me is a function I do on my PC, and then just transfer the music as I want or need it. To say that I must be able to download or purchase XYZ song on the road isn't necessary... isn't that what Pandora is for? Use Pandora to listen to what you want until you are in a position to purchase music, then do that. That's how I approach it.
- Videos/Movies - I'm not really a big "watch videos/movies on your portable" guy to begin with. That said, I do like to use youtube to show off certain things like video game trailers or movie trailers or something... but you tube isn't the issue on the Xoom and I don't think ever has been or ever will be. Some people have complained that the Xoom doesn't play the same H.264 videos that they can play on their Droid. To them I say that I'm sorry but your droid isn't running a Tegra 2 chipset. I do agree that the Tegra 2 should be able to handle a lot but I didn't design it.. shrug, what do I know. Seemingly however... the thing plays H.264 just fine if its encoded properly and it looks damn good. I ripped Kill Bill Volume 1 to H.264 with a 2k bitrate and it looked fantastic on the Xoom screen. I will admit that I'm not the best guy to take advice from in this area.
My thoughts / comments on whiners:
- Flash / SD Card Support - I really don't have anything to say about this. Flash 10.2 will be out soon enough and as far as the SD card is concerned I don't even need it. I only have a 4GB Class 6 micro SD card what's that going to do for me? It's laughable in size compared to whats in the unit.. I would only want to put a matching 32GB sd card in and that's gonna be another $100 minimum. Now your $799 device is an $899 device... where's the complaint for that?
- Can't make phone calls / TXT - Jesus christ, go buy a phone.

Nice review, particularly liked, "- Can't make phone calls / TXT - Jesus christ, go buy a phone."
Couldn't agree more!

Just ordered myself a Xoom and you've made me feel even better about my purchase. I'm a little worried about the video codecs thing but I'm sure Rockplayer or some such will sort that out. Thanks for a great review.

Thanks for the comments. If anyone has particular questions about the device or advice on how to best use the device for their situation fire away.

agreed up to one point
i agree man, def however
google voice must be used on this. not because of texting as a cellphone but because it does much more and can be so amazingly baked with all other google products.
that my friend, is inarguable.
please help that at least here
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=978779

You'll have to expand on your thought process for me. What do you want to use google voice for? Will it help you avoid scratching your Xoom up so you don't have to return a second one?

cwizardtx said:
You'll have to expand on your thought process for me. What do you want to use google voice for? Will it help you avoid scratching your Xoom up so you don't have to return a second one?
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Google Voice gives you a platform independent texting and voicemail interface. It does help to have it handy.

Why shouldn't your android tablet and phone be linked in some way so that you could receive notifications on either device and respond to them exactly like how webos works? Who could act like this is a ridiculous request??
Also, don't get your hopes up with regards to media playback. Tegra 2 is awful in that regard and has been proven on here in a different thread to be incapable of 720p high profile, which all galaxy s phones can do flawlessly.
Also, asking got certain features or if something is possible is not complaining.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

my second one is much more protected now thanks for the sad comment.
anyways, i am baffled at how one wouldnt want this, clearly people havent FOUND the use of it, to which i understand.
the customizations on notifications; be it text or voicemail is amazing and so useful, having this on your tablet WILL be a big plus trust me.
controlling voice mail set ups for particular people, having transcribed vm being able to foward that/ download that, controll recorded phone conversations, archiving, starring emails/texts

cwizardtx said:
- Can't make phone calls / TXT - Jesus christ, go buy a phone.
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Couldnt you use an app to hand those stuff over your 3g/4g services?

I don't necessarily expect the tablet to act as an independent texting device, but I would prefer to not have to pull my phone out of my pocket while I've got my Xoom in my hands already. I know I'll almost 99% of the time have my phone and tablet on me at the same time, but its more of a convenience thing.
The way that WebOS pulls your notifications to your tablet via bluetooth from your phone is perfect. I'm already tethering my Xoom for internet off my phone, why not just have text messages pop over too?

martonikaj said:
I don't necessarily expect the tablet to act as an independent texting device, but I would prefer to not have to pull my phone out of my pocket while I've got my Xoom in my hands already. I know I'll almost 99% of the time have my phone and tablet on me at the same time, but its more of a convenience thing.
The way that WebOS pulls your notifications to your tablet via bluetooth from your phone is perfect. I'm already tethering my Xoom for internet off my phone, why not just have text messages pop over too?
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The way Palm... or well, HP, made the WebOS phones and WebOS tablets work together is very impressive. Implementing that text idea would be perfect.

Eclair~ said:
The way Palm... or well, HP, made the WebOS phones and WebOS tablets work together is very impressive. Implementing that text idea would be perfect.
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I agree. And its something that iOS and Android aren't even close to implementing. I see no reason why Google couldn't figure this out. I'm assuming that it will come later, probably with 2.4 for phones which will apparently implement what Google learned about 3.0 back into phones.

Automatically archiving your incoming text messages to an email address linked to your Xoom would at least be a step in the right direction. Granted it's only 50% of the issue, but it's better than nothing. At least you know whether or not to check your phone with a glance at your inbox notification.

theahlenius said:
Automatically archiving your incoming text messages to an email address linked to your Xoom would at least be a step in the right direction. Granted it's only 50% of the issue, but it's better than nothing. At least you know whether or not to check your phone with a glance at your inbox notification.
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I use SMS Backup for this very reason and just put gmail label shortcuts on my tablet. If my phone is upstairs or in my bag, I can just check the email to see if I got any texts.
But it would be cool if I could automatically notify on my tablet.
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cwizardtx said:
Why are people complaining that their Motorola Xoom isn't a phone? I get a real laugh out of the "I'm so pissed because I can't call someone from this device" threads. Texting is another laughable point? Really you aren't carrying a phone around with you at the same time as your Xoom that you can't pull it out for 3 seconds and fire off that txt? One guy wants to know why he can't use his Xoom as a GPS while he's FLYING.
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I am so sick and tired of this pompous ass attitude. Maybe I keep my Xoom with me everywhere, maybe I use a bluetooth and never "pull out" my phone... MAYBE I dont want to pay to keep several devices active that do the exact same ****. What myself and many others have been after does not degrade the tablet devices that are out one bit, and in fact has been simply DISABLED on some devices.
Long story short, I do not appreciate you calling my desires for this device laughable, especially considering there are quite a few people with the same wants/needs.
/rant off

Morkai Almandragon said:
I am so sick and tired of this pompous ass attitude. Maybe I keep my Xoom with me everywhere, maybe I use a bluetooth and never "pull out" my phone... MAYBE I dont want to pay to keep several devices active that do the exact same ****. What myself and many others have been after does not degrade the tablet devices that are out one bit, and in fact has been simply DISABLED on some devices.
Long story short, I do not appreciate you calling my desires for this device laughable, especially considering there are quite a few people with the same wants/needs.
/rant off
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I agree. People that make an argument like this are no better than apple in telling them what limits their device has.
And the guy wasn't complaining about airplane GPS, he was just wondering about it. There's a lot of people that do recreational flying and only do daylight clear weather trips. A GPS is great to tell you where you are, its not like they'd be using it to get from point A to point B or landing on a runway in fog or flying a commercial airliner.
Just because someone wants something better (for them) doesn't mean its a complaint, its merely a wish. Ideas and hopes make these devices better and inspire devs to create things we all love.
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