Porting N developer preview - Wileyfox Storm

Is there any hopes, that someone can build N dev preview rom for storm?

If you want it done you can learn to build one.
This isn't meant to be sarcastic. It's very rewarding to make your own working build. I'd be tempted myself, but I know that staring at chunks of C and Java makes me a little... outre in short order.

it's the best way to learn ;D

Related

[Q] How to port or improve hero roms ??

Hi,
Right now i am learning programming, I am interested joining hero ROM development. Are there any short tutorials that I could use or something that would help me to start with.
Thank you
There's quite a lot of foundations to build before you will start to see anything above ground level
Cyanogenmod is the foundation of most ROMs. Their Wiki is a good place to start. They have a lot of tutorials on setting up. For example, look for:
Overview_of_Modding
Howto Install_the_Android_SDK
Building_from_source
Howto Install_Kernels
These pages will give you an overview.
In terms of the programming side, this requires a lot of experience. It will take some time for you to be able to make major contributions.
But having said that, once you have a decent knowledge of C and some understanding of kernel source structure, you can read the source. Look at what others have done and try to understand what is going on.
Get hold of a recent book on kernel programming, such as
Linux Kernel in a Nutshell (Greg Kroah-Hartman - O'Reilly)
Linux Kernel Development (Robert Love)
These are not beginners books, but they do get into the subject at a reasonable pace once you have enough knowledge to start. I think anyone serious about doing kernel work is going to have to learn this sort of stuff to really understand what they're tinkering with.
I don't want to discourage you. Just don't underestimate the size of the task. As a beginner, the best contribution you can make is as a tester. Learn the issue tracker system, make a name submitting clear bug reports. This is not glamorous, but essential for a ROM project.
I found this book very interesting:
Linux Device Drivers
http://lwn.net/Kernel/LDD3/
And thanks codeazure, I'll check those two out as well
codeazure said:
There's quite a lot of foundations to build before you will start to see anything above ground level
Cyanogenmod is the foundation of most ROMs. Their Wiki is a good place to start. They have a lot of tutorials on setting up. For example, look for:
Overview_of_Modding
Howto Install_the_Android_SDK
Building_from_source
Howto Install_Kernels
These pages will give you an overview.
In terms of the programming side, this requires a lot of experience. It will take some time for you to be able to make major contributions.
But having said that, once you have a decent knowledge of C and some understanding of kernel source structure, you can read the source. Look at what others have done and try to understand what is going on.
Get hold of a recent book on kernel programming, such as
Linux Kernel in a Nutshell (Greg Kroah-Hartman - O'Reilly)
Linux Kernel Development (Robert Love)
These are not beginners books, but they do get into the subject at a reasonable pace once you have enough knowledge to start. I think anyone serious about doing kernel work is going to have to learn this sort of stuff to really understand what they're tinkering with.
I don't want to discourage you. Just don't underestimate the size of the task. As a beginner, the best contribution you can make is as a tester. Learn the issue tracker system, make a name submitting clear bug reports. This is not glamorous, but essential for a ROM project.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for good explanation Yap I know it's hard to start since I am beginner. But because I have lot of time and Have "HTC Hero" I think I'll go for it...
Thanks again.

[Q] developing roms, where to start?

With the newly deodexed honeycomb I have gotten the itch to start looking into how to create/develop my own rom.
What is the best way to start learning, is there a good starting point, I have been doing some reading but it just seems so overwhelming.
I do have basic Linux knowledge and can whip up a linux VM in no time to get crackin. I have been modding my EVO for the last year so i know how to be a "user" and have tinkered with the xoom but have only scratched the surface.
So my question is just this, Where to start??
any input would be helpful.
+1!
need a little walkthrough too :S!!
and someone can say what files NEVER EDIT to not brick the xoom!!
i too would be highly interested in learning what steps to take.
bossjeeves said:
With the newly deodexed honeycomb I have gotten the itch to start looking into how to create/develop my own rom.
What is the best way to start learning, is there a good starting point, I have been doing some reading but it just seems so overwhelming.
I do have basic Linux knowledge and can whip up a linux VM in no time to get crackin. I have been modding my EVO for the last year so i know how to be a "user" and have tinkered with the xoom but have only scratched the surface.
So my question is just this, Where to start??
any input would be helpful.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Get that VM set up, and get your environment set up so you can build AOSP.
Look through the source so you know what parts of Android are found where in the tree.
Learn a little about the platform, what does what...
Basically, just get your hands dirty.
ydaraishy said:
Get that VM set up, and get your environment set up so you can build AOSP.
Look through the source so you know what parts of Android are found where in the tree.
Learn a little about the platform, what does what...
Basically, just get your hands dirty.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so this is kind of what I expected for an answer but I would like a little more if you dont mind.
Like maybe a couple of links pointing in the right direction, like what does the environment need for tools etc.
ydaraishy said:
Get that VM set up, and get your environment set up so you can build AOSP.
Look through the source so you know what parts of Android are found where in the tree.
Learn a little about the platform, what does what...
Basically, just get your hands dirty.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's like saying jump in a lions den and see what ticks him off. Can we get more details please? I want to get into theming and want to know the ideal OS to do it on. I was hoping on doing it in Linux but want advice from themers.
IV been playing hippie for a couple of weeks so I don't know if I missed something but, unless the full AOSP source has been released, a deodex rom will help with nothing but theming.
You can't do much to customise a ready built rom, and you would be wasting your time to try anything but the simplest of mods.
That being said, if you're happy to play with smali you might achieve a little more.
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk
alias_neo said:
IV been playing hippie for a couple of weeks so I don't know if I missed something but, unless the full AOSP source has been released, a deodex rom will help with nothing but theming.
You can't do much to customise a ready built rom, and you would be wasting your time to try anything but the simplest of mods.
That being said, if you're happy to play with smali you might achieve a little more.
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this is exactly what I am talking about here, This is kind of why I brought it up in the xoom forum, since we dont have source and we do have a deodexed rom wouldnt playing with that be a great place to start? if so like what would be the best place to start, you say play with smali, now I know I can google and get tons of answers but I am asking to explain a little more because I trust the feedback from here and I think others might benefit also
bossjeeves said:
this is exactly what I am talking about here, This is kind of why I brought it up in the xoom forum, since we dont have source and we do have a deodexed rom wouldnt playing with that be a great place to start? if so like what would be the best place to start, you say play with smali, now I know I can google and get tons of answers but I am asking to explain a little more because I trust the feedback from here and I think others might benefit also
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Smali is a tool that will reverse engineer (baksmali) dalvik byte code into (barely) human readable code. If you can learn to understand this you can reverse and modify stuff with it. If i remember right, brut.all is the guy responsible, have a read around, but i warn you, its not for the feint of heart.
Macbots drool as I XOOM through the Galaxy to my hearts Desire.
bossjeeves said:
this is exactly what I am talking about here, This is kind of why I brought it up in the xoom forum, since we dont have source and we do have a deodexed rom wouldnt playing with that be a great place to start? if so like what would be the best place to start, you say play with smali, now I know I can google and get tons of answers but I am asking to explain a little more because I trust the feedback from here and I think others might benefit also
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Here is one of the best sources I've found....... made by cyanogen himself, tonnes of info here.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=667298
I did come across this link http://simply-android.wikia.com/wiki/ROM_Development
looks like something that would be a helpful start. thoughts?
ps thanks for the replys
I think the best way to learn anything is just to read a lot, and to search for any questions you have. There are a thousand ways to learn to hack, but they all require the initiative to find answers on your own.
Sorry if this sounds patronizing. I always hated it when I get on a board and ask for something, and some curmudgeon geek tells me "Google is your friend". But it's true. You get better answers faster, as you can avail from the entire Internet, as opposed to the small number of people who reply to your query.
Thanks to the dude who linked to the Cyan advice post. My takeaway is this one line:
"There is a *ton* of information out there but any kind of "step-by-step rom cooking guide" is going to be a complete fail- it's too broad of a subject."
IMO if you are serious about ROM hacking, you need a dedicated linux environment. Cygwin is OK for run-time stuff, but too limited for anything else. If you only want to run basic bash commands, a simpler solution is win-bash (http://win-bash.sourceforge.net).
I'm kinda in the same shoes you are. Android interests me, although I don't have a Xoom or an Android tablet for that matter. Was gonna get a HC tab to tinker, but HC is still too green, so decided on a Nook Color for educational purposes. It's been out a while, and has many hacks already done that I can peruse. That, and it'll be useful for my "read a lot" mantra above.

[DEV HELP][?]Looking to Build a ROM!

well i thought i'd get this up before source for JB (4.1) drops... I'm looking for a dev willing to let me watch them as they build a ROM and make changes to that ROM... no i don't need to come over your house to do this... I was thinking of a live video stream of your screen as you do the work... if you're willing to allow me to watch and maybe answer a few questions in between, i'm willing to learn!!
i learn really fast if i'm watching someone do it which is why i'm taking this approach rather than trying to read through a bunch of threads on this topic... that stuff basically looks like a foreign language to me... especially when they talk linux stuff lol... i can catch on quickly but i need to SEE IT BEING DONE... not reading and having my brain decode what i just read...
so please pass this thread along... the site i'm looking to use is join.me and it can be viewed by more than one person... so if someone else is willing to jump in on the fun and the dev is cool with it... we all can watch as they work their magic...
preferably someone that's gonna be building on crespo/crespo4g... but i'll take whoever is willing to teach!!
disclaimer: i'm not even looking for a real "expert" on the subject... just someone to do the basic work so i can take notes and then do the stuff myself!!
PM me if you're a dev and willing to help out!! what do you have to lose? nothing really... you're just gonna load the program and let it stream as you do the stuff you normall would do...
sn: it doesn't have to be Jelly Bean... but seeing as source is coming out soon... i figured someone will want to start fresh and build from aosp... that's really where i'd like to start from!!
I'd love to watch too
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Click here for custom mods for your E4GT
umm. the best way to do it is to just follow the step by step guides online. doesnt get much easier than that. you watching isn't going to help when they already have all the software installed
derekwilkinson said:
umm. the best way to do it is to just follow the step by step guides online. doesnt get much easier than that. you watching isn't going to help when they already have all the software installed
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thanks but i have everything i need to build a ROM installed and have already built one from CM9 source... i'm talking about all the other edits and things they do... ie: adding in or removing features of a ROM...
and if you re-read my OP... i said reading this stuff is like learning another language... i'm a visual learner... i need to SEE these things then do them... not read them and try to decode whatever i just read...
the1dynasty said:
thanks but i have everything i need to build a ROM installed and have already built one from CM9 source... i'm talking about all the other edits and things they do... ie: adding in or removing features of a ROM...
and if you re-read my OP... i said reading this stuff is like learning another language... i'm a visual learner... i need to SEE these things then do them... not read them and try to decode whatever i just read...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just happen to work for a company the makes tools to help visual learners.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
Yea I'm willing too. I got a few things going here. Along with ubuntu, sdk, java6, android kitchen. I'm more of a visual learner. I've been constantly researching to point where my brain hurts to think android. I need a break. But I'm willing as well. Some devs out there no even respond to help needed. I would love to watch Fergie716 at work tho.
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using Tapatalk 2
My video will be up tomorrow (today) in my MIUI thread. I have everything ready for it. I just had a bit too much to drink tonight (its 450am)
Tomorrow afternoon it'll be up
Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
I also like to watch.
Sent from my SPH-D710
I agree with the OP, one thing I think is missing (or at least in my experience hard to find) in the Android ROM community is a set of guides on how to properly do things (branch with repo to make a mod, apply patches from other trees, add prebuilt apks, add source provided apps, integrate su, busybox, creating your own vendor, device, adding your kernel, etc)
It's all scattered all over the net, sure you can figure some of it out but if you lower the barrier of entry people will be able to focus their energy on doing better work somewhere else.
gparent said:
I agree with the OP, one thing I think is missing (or at least in my experience hard to find) in the Android ROM community is a set of guides on how to properly do things (branch with repo to make a mod, apply patches from other trees, add prebuilt apks, add source provided apps, integrate su, busybox, creating your own vendor, device, adding your kernel, etc)
It's all scattered all over the net, sure you can figure some of it out but if you lower the barrier of entry people will be able to focus their energy on doing better work somewhere else.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i really couldn't have said it any better!!
i know Fergie usually puts out some great tutorials... i used his stuff when i was learning to theme... so hopefully he delivers on this as well... i would still like to do a live "webinar-type" of training tho if any dev is up for that!!
we can get a time going so that everyone can login at the same time and see what's being done...
I'd also like to see how its done, I would love to be able to cook up some things and then release a ROM to the public. I'm sure it's not easy but I'm willing to take a wack at it
Btw are you guys using pretty powerful computers for building ROMS? Or would you say they're average spec?
stellar said:
I'd also like to see how its done, I would love to be able to cook up some things and then release a ROM to the public. I'm sure it's not easy but I'm willing to take a wack at it
Btw are you guys using pretty powerful computers for building ROMS? Or would you say they're average spec?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
mine isn't that great tbh... but it manages to put out something... once your setup is correct and you do your first build... the second build of that ROM is usually a lot faster...
i think average would be around quad core with 8GB RAM... that's my guess based on a few devs i've heard from...
the1dynasty said:
mine isn't that great tbh... but it manages to put out something... once your setup is correct and you do your first build... the second build of that ROM is usually a lot faster...
i think average would be around quad core with 8GB RAM... that's my guess based on a few devs i've heard from...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I like to learn too. But my pc is just dual core 3.0ghz 4gig ram what do you think?
Sent from my Nexus S™
mixtapes08 said:
I like to learn too. But my pc is just dual core 3.0ghz 4gig ram what do you think?
Sent from my Nexus S™
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it will take longer than some other PC's... but that will still work... i'd guess a few hrs to build a ROM... mine is around those specs and it takes a few hrs on the initial build lol
There should also be a thread for porting, kinda like "chef central" where users could get support on certain issues with their ports.. Over there in chef central the people seem to only help people that are building from source.. there's not too much support for people doing ports which is unfortunate because not everyone is skilled enough to build from source and having ports is what keeps some devices alive... In this thread there would be threads where you could post your logcat if your not getting boot and some of the more experienced porters (like fergie for example) could take a look and point you in the right direction. Also there could be guides and tutorials as how to get certain aspects of the ROM working like HWA, WiMax, MMS/SMS so on and so forth... I think that it would really bring a lot of new life to some devices that don't get the support that they should..
Anyone else agree on that or is just me?
evol4g said:
there's not too much support for people doing ports which is unfortunate because not everyone is skilled enough to build from source and having ports is what keeps some devices alive...
Anyone else agree on that or is just me?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with the whole sentiment "more people should build things", but not with "aosp is too hard so we should help people do ports". Unless a port is the only way to get a device working, we definitely should focus on making aosp easier to learn if that's part of a problem the porting people are having.
Anyway, I started my own ROM yesterday and might end up making a wiki to document a bunch of things I'm doing. It's a very stock-ish ROM though, so I won't spend much time writing about adding mods other than a few basic ones.
-IF- I do get around to making the wiki, I will post here about it.
As for the computer, I am using a i7 930 (2.8GHz) with 24GB of RAM.
gparent said:
I agree with the whole sentiment "more people should build things", but not with "aosp is too hard so we should help people do ports". Unless a port is the only way to get a device working, we definitely should focus on making aosp easier to learn if that's part of a problem the porting people are having.
Anyway, I started my own ROM yesterday and might end up making a wiki to document a bunch of things I'm doing. It's a very stock-ish ROM though, so I won't spend much time writing about adding mods other than a few basic ones.
-IF- I do get around to making the wiki, I will post here about it.
As for the computer, I am using a i7 930 (2.8GHz) with 24GB of RAM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
id like to ask.. is making a rom really difficult.. how much java language knowledge would a person need to have to build from source...?
ferozfero said:
id like to ask.. is making a rom really difficult.. how much java language knowledge would a person need to have to build from source...?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, one of the fun things about being a maintainer rather than a developer is that you really don't -need- much knowledge at all.
Everything helps, though. Yesterday I fixed a gcc compilation issue from knowledge of C++ that I acquired over a number of years. It wasn't a hard bug to fix and I could've asked a friend about it instead, but being a programmer lets me get away with fixing mistakes I see in AOSP when it's necessary (it rarely is).
Later, in my kernel compile, I turned on a compilation flag because I knew that a warning (that failed the build due to -Werror) was completely inaccurate. Good luck doing this if you don't know what's a compilation flag, and good luck doing it safely if you're not sure what the warning means and if it is really safe to override it (it often isn't).
If you want to make a ROM and be efficient about it, I think the two most important skills (in order of importance) are the ability to use git and to solve problems. Without a minimum of source control ease, it will be a pain in the ass to add features to your mods or to keep track of changes efficiently (especially when it comes the time to branch off releases and what not). Problem solving is what you do whenever stuff that should work doesn't work. And it's always hard because if it wasn't hard it would be documented already so you wouldn't have the problem.
If you want to build FEATURES for a mod (that is, not repack what others have written), then yes you will need programming knowledge. Java, C and probably C++. Mostly Java for user facing stuff.
great post gparent... that was a wonderful breakdown of how ROM making works... if it's all true (which it sounds like it), then this might be a bit more than i can chew lol... i'm still willing to see someone in action do these things so i have a better understanding of how to put things together and maybe one day i'll take a stab at building my own ROM!!
gparent said:
24GB of RAM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
:what: wow, lol
If any other devs come by I'd love to know what setups you guys use for developing too.
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How can I become a Developer for the Galaxy S3?

I have done some basic programming in the past, but what knowledge is needed to jump into custom developing, I am not interested in developing apps per say, I am more interested in developing like Cyanogen Group and many of the awesome Devs on here making Kernals, and Custom Roms, etc. I tend to have some free time on my hands lately, and I figure, instead of waiting for everyone else to do the work, maybe I can do some work and contribute.
If you have any information, please point me in the right direction, with tips, advice, videos, and warnings.
Thank you in advance. :good:
Hey man, i too am interested in developing i use eclipse and can do quite a bit of java and im ok with debugging, if you ever have a project you want to start i would be interested in helping. watch videos on steve kondik. cm has quite a few urls. but from what ive been told is get a rom and import it into eclipse and make some changes and put your own stuff up on xda.
check out this screen shot, has the cm urls on it and the video of steve kondik who talks through tips of building cm and how to start and what it takes hope it helps
twayneo said:
Hey man, i too am interested in developing i use eclipse and can do quite a bit of java and im ok with debugging, if you ever have a project you want to start i would be interested in helping. watch videos on steve kondik. cm has quite a few urls. but from what ive been told is get a rom and import it into eclipse and make some changes and put your own stuff up on xda.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
twayneo said:
check out this screen shot, has the cm urls on it and the video of steve kondik who talks through tips of building cm and how to start and what it takes hope it helps
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you, I will check those out. I realize this maybe way over my head, and by the time I can actually program something worthwhile on Android, there will be a Samsung S8 ... lol, but you have to start somewhere, I would like tips by those who have progressed.
I like the idea of simply editing a already made rom, this would be more like tweaking, but at least I could see some action.
maybe you can try to gather a group of 8 more developers, or people who want to learn, and you guys can all create a "circle" on google plus, and do a Google hangout where you can verbally talk with each other, ask questions, and share your desktop so others can see you working/creating a rom, so that way, all 9 of you future devs will have a visual and audio learning experience. that's the fastest/best way to learn and progress. so if you're interested, post your google plus profiles and people who are interested can post their profiles and everyone who is interested in doing this can add each other and make it happen. i personally have no interest in developing/creating roms. just throwing this great tool out there for those who are interested. Maybe a new pioneering team, will form out of this? maybe a cyanogenmod equivalent, or a team kang equivalent.
My suggestion is to learn to theme first. Theme something that isn't dependant on 9.pngs cause those are a bit more complicated. Building custom Roms is fun, but very detailed and time consuming. After you get the theming down, cut a stock Rom up a bit and theme it and presto, custom Rom. I learned from a thread by theimpaler. I think it was called, "so you want to learn to theme".
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[Q] Is the Android studio a good place to start for new developers?

Hey everyone.
I'm a new developer, and I'll start with the mandatory apologetic prelude to my question, which is, I hope I'm in the right forum. Also, I've searched through the forums for an answer to my query, admittedly not too much, but the information seemed to be scarce.
Anyway, I'm a new aspiring Android developer, and I'm making my baby steps into coding for my favorite mobile OS.
Since I'm just starting right after the latest I/O, my attention is leaning toward the welcoming Android studio. The problems that arise are:
A. No tutorials for this new environment.
B. It's surly buggy.
So my question really, is the Android studio the right place to start in? Or am I better off starting with the ADT Bundle, which includes (I assume) all the stuff I need to get started with.
Thanks a bunch!
p.s
I'm sorry for any typos etc, English is not my main language. :cyclops:
You should not
This is a 0.1 release and you'll loose more time trying to find why things don't work than learning android.
Depending on what you want to do with Android (little apps for you or bigger project later) I'd recommend either to go with eclipse since it will still be maintained and you'll have most tutorial on it.
If you want to think about future I'd go with real IntelliJ to learn using it and be ready for future Android studio and all the gradle things that will come.
Tolriq said:
You should not
This is a 0.1 release and you'll loose more time trying to find why things don't work than learning android.
Depending on what you want to do with Android (little apps for you or bigger project later) I'd recommend either to go with eclipse since it will still be maintained and you'll have most tutorial on it.
If you want to think about future I'd go with real IntelliJ to learn using it and be ready for future Android studio and all the gradle things that will come.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree. :good:
Tolriq said:
You should not
This is a 0.1 release and you'll loose more time trying to find why things don't work than learning android.
Depending on what you want to do with Android (little apps for you or bigger project later) I'd recommend either to go with eclipse since it will still be maintained and you'll have most tutorial on it.
If you want to think about future I'd go with real IntelliJ to learn using it and be ready for future Android studio and all the gradle things that will come.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the reply.
IntelliJ it is.
Is there a specific course you might recommend?
Thanks again.
shermenz said:
Thanks for the reply.
IntelliJ it is.
Is there a specific course you might recommend?
Thanks again.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Go with eclipse, even IntelliJ is same as Android Studio... Rest is upto you.
Happy programming, Good luck!!
shermenz said:
Hey everyone.
I'm a new developer, and I'll start with the mandatory apologetic prelude to my question, which is, I hope I'm in the right forum. Also, I've searched through the forums for an answer to my query, admittedly not too much, but the information seemed to be scarce.
Anyway, I'm a new aspiring Android developer, and I'm making my baby steps into coding for my favorite mobile OS.
Since I'm just starting right after the latest I/O, my attention is leaning toward the welcoming Android studio. The problems that arise are:
A. No tutorials for this new environment.
B. It's surly buggy.
So my question really, is the Android studio the right place to start in? Or am I better off starting with the ADT Bundle, which includes (I assume) all the stuff I need to get started with.
Thanks a bunch!
p.s
I'm sorry for any typos etc, English is not my main language. :cyclops:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i think u must try develop on eclipse first.. because alot of tutorial android with eclipse IDE
I suppose i agree with the other people somewhat, but i've just started following tutorials and using android studio. I haven't really ran into any major issues, and i think going through and trying to find something myself really helps me learn. I guess it depends on how adventurous and patient you are. I haven't really found any bugs, but you could wait till an update that fixes major bugs if you want. Oh and it looks nicer, and is a bit more handy than eclipse. good luck
atishpatel2012 said:
I suppose i agree with the other people somewhat, but i've just started following tutorials and using android studio. I haven't really ran into any major issues, and i think going through and trying to find something myself really helps me learn. I guess it depends on how adventurous and patient you are. I haven't really found any bugs, but you could wait till an update that fixes major bugs if you want. Oh and it looks nicer, and is a bit more handy than eclipse. good luck
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, I find it better for coding. However, I have already experienced some bugs. But they are just related to the layout preview thing. So nothing serious.
I still think that for new developers it is better to start with Eclipse due to the amount of tutorials for it, but I agree that it is a great learning experience. :good:
Hope I'm Not Too Late!
I Hope I'm not too late, I learned Java first. What I'd suggest you to do is go to Google, look up "Learn Java MyBringBack." Click on the first Youtube Video. The videos are made by Sir Travis Cornelius. I love that guy, he's awesome! He teaches Java to beginners in a way everybody will love.
After getting past the 5th or 6th tutorial. If you can, then buy a "Beginning Java for Dummies" book. There are a lot of things about Java which can't be explained in a video.
Please Do Check it Out
P. S: I'm not trying to gain views for that video, I'm just telling you this because of personal experience!

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