Just before anyone makes any misjudged conclusion:
I love this Forum for the vast amount of information
I love Android because it is so versatile and highly customizable.
I love all the developers who're spending lots of hours making custom ROM's
The one thing that is frustrating the hell out me is finding the right information in Forum
Particular in this Android Auto subject dedicated to these Chinese branded car system.
I have spend day's if not weeks finding the right way to boot my devices into recovery, just to find that no method does work.
And all that information was hidden among dozens of threads that go hundreds of pages on and on.
Why isn't there a proper central Wiki with all the information with links to the right device id's and available files for updates or tooling ?
I have noticed a start of some Wiki: https://forum.xda-developers.com/wiki/Hui_Fei_Type but it seams hardly finished or maintained at all
Totally agree
Firstly, the devices arent Android Auto - requesting move this thread to Android Head units
If you had an Android Auto unit, you probably wouldnt be posting because they are almost just screen mirroring devices
Consider that there are a small handful of people that contribute.
My experience has been that new members join, get the information to fix a problem and are never to be seen again - unless there's another problem. Then there's the commercial members - those that have created paid custom ROMs and rarely contribute to the 'community' with technical information that might help others, other than getting users onboard with paying for their kanged roms.
Wiki - the wiki was created going back to MTCB devices and the people have moved on. The Wiki is editable by all members as in WIKI style has no owner.
The de facto assumption is that members will update it, giving back to the community. Consider that when new users abuse treat the forums like a user-support forum, that is to get the info and move on, there's no real community. Community is bandied about when people ask for help a lot though!
Consider too that only a small number of regular members have bothered to taken the time to update the WIKI, such as @typos1 and are often criticised for pointing out info that's available in the Wiki. Given these comments; why would the same people who regularly contribute want to consume more effort in the Wiki for the benefit of a large number of one-time users that dont contribute. I'd suggest issues be supported by the sellers, but we all know how utterly useless that process is expecting the sellers of these buggy low quality units is - another reason people dump on these forums.
You might be the person to take up the task of reading the info and updating the Wiki?
Another MAJOR factor is that there are literally 100s of different Android head unit platforms around. And there are very few experts documenting all the different head unit types from all the different manufacturers as there are in the phone world.
It took about 3 years for MTCB/C and then MTCD/E units to get their own specific forums, before then there was one massive MTCB/C megathread (one reason why the HuiFei wiki was created - to make it easier to get info without cluttering the thread). There was no Android Auto forum back then either. Anyone who doesnt have an MTC unit is in the same position as we were 6 years ago with MTCB/C units - one massive thread and thats it, unless theyve got a rarer unit in which case therell probably be a lot less info than a megathread. Myself and @marchnz are knowledgable about MTC units and after we got proper forums the need for a wiki was less and no MTCD/E wiki was created, I guess because we had a series of forums for all the info. Unlike users of other units.
There are now many other best selling Android head unit platforms other than the (discontinued) MTCB/C and (still current) MTCD/E units none of those has managed to get their own forum, let alone the less popular platforms. Hell, things are so bad that even basic info like adding the "/C" and "/E" onto the titles of the MTCB and MTCD forums so people with MTCC and MTCE units actually know that theyre in the correct place, has ben overlooked by the powers that be at XDA.
So youre better off directing your criticisms at XDA staff @mkaaden, none of whom have any idea about the Android head unit market or its complexities, as is illustrated by the fact that for the last 3 or 4 years no new forums have been created for ANY Android head unit platform, even ones that sell as well as the MTCD/E ones. And the fact that basic update info hasnt been added to MTC forum titles as I said above. You need a small team of Android head unit specific people that have knowledge related to the way the market is and how many platforms there are collating info, maintaining threads and opening new forums when necessary, as they do for phones. But there is no one with that knowledge in charge of the Android head units section (theres not even a head unit section, its hidden in the unrelated Android Auto section), so its a mess and no one at XDA seems to show any interest in sorting it out, too busy playing with their phones or over zealously moderating threads I guess, strange really, youd have thought thered be a fair few moderators with cars (theyre hardly a niche product) as well as an interest in Android.
marchnz said:
You might be the person to take up the task of reading the info and updating the Wiki?
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What for ALL the available units, not just his own type ?
It seems to me from reading his post and noting that he posted in the General forum, that he doesnt have an MTC unit, so hed have to create a new Wiki for his unit.
Good info Guys. I never realised.
I assumed complete opposite and that everything was here, just 'burried' and lost under a ton of different sections & posts.
cleverdicky said:
Good info Guys. I never realised.
I assumed complete opposite and that everything was here, just 'burried' and lost under a ton of different sections & posts.
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I m sure a lot of the info needed IS there, dont think "everything" is though.
And it may be buried in different sections and posts if you have a MTC unit (theres no other way of doing it, although a mod does need to keep stuff tidy, merge some threads etc).
If you have a non MTC unit then its likely in one massive thread, or spread out in random threads throughout the general forum.
This has to be indeed one of the worst forums on XDA...been here for almost 10 years now and I struggle every time I need to look for something in it.
The folks offering real help are few and far between, most posts are "halp me apgrade to andriod 10" or at best "I can't be bothered to read the first post, can you make a video for me"
That kind of post is not conducive to a helpful reply.
Plus the same individuals pollute ANY thread with the same requests, without even checking if the topic is related. This makes useful information or user experiences very hard to find.
If it's any comfort, the alternative is the Russian forum over at 4pda.ru where besides the "attitude" you get recommendations to read the 1800 pages and deal with Google translate (which caused me to brick my unit...).
It doable for the determined individual to put the pieces together, but my God, what a time consuming activity.
This is why I always thank those posting tutorials (or even just their own success or failure stories), at least they contribute somehow. To the extent of my abilities and understanding, I try the same.
I doubt that anyone can sort this mess at this point, so we're stuck between lack of information, the butchered Chinese translated menus and a device that attempts to do for 100$ the same job as the 500$ ones.
/rant...I have no suggestions as to who would be crazy enough to try to sort out this sh!t :laugh:
Ipse_Tase said:
This has to be indeed one of the worst threads on XDA...been here for almost 10 years now and I struggle every time I need to look for something in it.
The folks offering real help are few and far between, most posts are "halp me apgrade to andriod 10" or at best "I can't be bothered to read the first post, can you make a video for me"
That kind of post is not conducive to a helpful reply.
Plus the same individuals pollute ANY thread with the same requests, without even checking if the topic is related. This makes useful information or user experiences very hard to find.
If it's any comfort, the alternative is the Russian forum over at 4pda.ru where besides the "attitude" you get recommendations to read the 1800 pages and deal with Google translate (which caused me to brick my unit...).
It doable for the determined individual to put the pieces together, but my God, what a time consuming activity.
This is why I always thank those posting tutorials (or even just their own success or failure stories), at least they contribute somehow. To the extent of my abilities and understanding, I try the same.
I doubt that anyone can sort this mess at this point, so we're stuck between lack of information, the butchered Chinese translated menus and a device that attempts to do for 100$ the same job as the 500$ ones.
/rant...I have no suggestions as to who would be crazy enough to try to sort out this sh!t :laugh:
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By "The worst thread" I think you mean "The worst forum" ? You cant mean this little thread ?
4pda.ru is much, much better organised when it comes to threads on android head units.
As for sorting the mess out here, it IS doable, but as I said it would take a team of devoted, knowledgable individuals with the correct authority to do so and no one at the XDA powers that be seem to have any interest either in doing so or, as I ve said, the subject of the forums (Android head units).
typos1 said:
By "The worst thread" I think you mean "The worst forum" ? You cant mean this little thread ?
.
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Fixed now...
As for 4pda.ru, yes, it's my goto place for lot of things - as people have maintained the curiosity to pick things apart, fix or improve them and then put them back together. The things I've seen replacing the MCU amplifier, capacitors and LED are nothing short of amazing. At least for me.
But like I said, getting an account there (if you don't speak Russian to decipher the handwriting used for captcha) is a PITA and asking a question because your English search didn't yield Russian results is frowned upon :laugh:
I do hope that this is temporary...I can't see why car manufacturers can't incorporate fully fledged Android units (instead of the castrated versions of today) then maybe there will be less guesswork and more streamlined code..same as for the phones.
In the meantime, I hang onto my last backup really tight as somehow I managed to get (almost) everything working to my liking and I have NO desire to "apgrade to andriod 10" for ****s and giggles.
I guess most of the folks that went through this excruciating pain are in the same boat and no one wants to go back to experimenting and documenting things.
As much as I hope for a nice Wiki that would allow others to avoid the mistakes I made...I doubt it will ever happen.
Great discussion, good to know there are other seniors lurking here too
Ipse_Tase said:
Fixed now...
As for 4pda.ru, yes, it's my goto place for lot of things - as people have maintained the curiosity to pick things apart, fix or improve them and then put them back together. The things I've seen replacing the MCU amplifier, capacitors and LED are nothing short of amazing. At least for me.
But like I said, getting an account there (if you don't speak Russian to decipher the handwriting used for captcha) is a PITA and asking a question because your English search didn't yield Russian results is frowned upon :laugh:
I do hope that this is temporary...I can't see why car manufacturers can't incorporate fully fledged Android units (instead of the castrated versions of today) then maybe there will be less guesswork and more streamlined code..same as for the phones.
In the meantime, I hang onto my last backup really tight as somehow I managed to get (almost) everything working to my liking and I have NO desire to "apgrade to andriod 10" for ****s and giggles.
I guess most of the folks that went through this excruciating pain are in the same boat and no one wants to go back to experimenting and documenting things.
As much as I hope for a nice Wiki that would allow others to avoid the mistakes I made...I doubt it will ever happen.
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Yes, those Russians are a very clever bunch, it seems that there are less on here too than there used to be, sadly. I have an account on 4pda too, there was a knack to joining which I did manage years back but after a while it asked me to sign in by responding to an email, which I never got and I tried multiple times. When I posted I used to post an English version in a spoiler as well as a Russian translation, they were always very helpful.
You dont say what head unit you have - for MTCD/E users there isnt really any "excruciating pain" to go through any more, theyve been out for so long most things are known.
If you have a non MTC unit, theres noting stopping you from documenting your experience for others by starting a wiki yourself.
Wow, never expected serious and hilarious responses in my little rant
Thanks guys, good to know how things work around here and good to see I'm not the only one having a hard time finding the right stuff.
Well I guess it would be a day job to setup and maintain a proper Wiki with all the information already there in the forum.
So sorry @marchnz, but I already have a day job keeping me quit busy
@typos1
I have a MTCE unit for a MB GLK since 2017, still running Android 6.0
The unit was bought at Witson via Aliexpress.
At least I found a lot of information here on 'why' this unit does things quirky, since help from the seller always ends with no useful reply at all !
That's why I was anxiously finding a way to boot it into recovery and whack one of the custom ROM's fit for this unit to solve the quirky things.
IMHO: The products those Chinese guy's ship around the world is just a briljant alternative for those very pricey OEM in-car entertainment systems.
It is just a pity their technical support is way below standards.
If they just would collaborate with some partners in different countries, improving the product with proper feedback, they would sell a lot more units !
If I would have similar functionality fit by MB in my car it would certainly cost 10 times more than one of those Chinese units.
Well, at least you get 'premium' support, as long as you pay the bill off course.
Has anyone ever tried contacting one of those manufacturers directly to establish some sort of relation to deliver local support and feedback in return for proper technical information ?
mkaaden said:
@typos1
I have a MTCE unit for a MB GLK since 2017, still running Android 6.0
The unit was bought at Witson via Aliexpress.
At least I found a lot of information here on 'why' this unit does things quirky, since help from the seller always ends with no useful reply at all !
That's why I was anxiously finding a way to boot it into recovery and whack one of the custom ROM's fit for this unit to solve the quirky things.
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I see, well youve actually got it pretty easy if you have an MTCE unit, spare a thought for the people who dont have them who really do have it hard.
The letters before "MTCE" will tell you what unit you have (as it says in the MTCB/C wiki) Witson are just a seller.
Can I ask why you posted in the General forum and not the MTCD forum then ? Had you, um, not found it ?
Cos if youre running 6 the info on how to upgrade to 8, 9 and 10 is relatively easy to find in one of the threads about the later versions and the threads pertaining to each custom ROM (bootable sdcard to boot into relevant recovery, another sdard or usb stick with the update on). Unless you mean Intel Sofia 6, in which case 6 is all you can have.
typos1 said:
I see, well youve actually got it pretty easy if you have an MTCE unit, spare a thought for the people who dont have them who really do have it hard.
The letters before "MTCE" will tell you what unit you have (as it says in the MTCB/C wiki) Witson are just a seller.
Can I ask why you posted in the General forum and not the MTCD forum then ? Had you, um, not found it ?
Cos if youre running 6 the info on how to upgrade to 8, 9 and 10 is relatively easy to find in one of the threads about the later versions and the threads pertaining to each custom ROM (bootable sdcard to boot into relevant recovery, another sdard or usb stick with the update on). Unless you mean Intel Sofia 6, in which case 6 is all you can have.
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The unit was provided with the MTCE MX firmware.
I have already updated the MCU several times
It came from a v2.xx and is now on v3.41 which is, assumingly, the latest and greatest out there .... (wouldn't know, because there is no central page to browse them)
I know there are good rom's out there and the first thing one needs to establish is to be able to boot recovery with the stock rom.
But that is the point, none of the provided methods I could find in this forum was able to boot my unit in recovery.
It is even at a point that the power button worn out and I had to remove it from the pcb because it made the unit stuck in a bootloop.
(funny thing is that I once noticed it booting recovery, just to realize I could not operate it because the power button was stuck !!!)
Now my only option would be paying for the mod_installer or finding a (working) method to access with ADB.
The point is: I have successfully flashed tablets and phones in the past, just using the appropriate thread from this forum, but with these units ....
So hence my frustration on why it so hard to find the right information and that's why I posted it in General and apparently I triggered something ...
Nevertheless, I would love to help and supply feedback in this forum about my experience but I would like to do that in some structured form.
mkaaden said:
The unit was provided with the MTCE MX firmware.
I have already updated the MCU several times
It came from a v2.xx and is now on v3.41 which is, assumingly, the latest and greatest out there .... (wouldn't know, because there is no central page to browse them)
I know there are good rom's out there and the first thing one needs to establish is to be able to boot recovery with the stock rom.
But that is the point, none of the provided methods I could find in this forum was able to boot my unit in recovery.
It is even at a point that the power button worn out and I had to remove it from the pcb because it made the unit stuck in a bootloop.
(funny thing is that I once noticed it booting recovery, just to realize I could not operate it because the power button was stuck !!!)
Now my only option would be paying for the mod_installer or finding a (working) method to access with ADB.
The point is: I have successfully flashed tablets and phones in the past, just using the appropriate thread from this forum, but with these units ....
So hence my frustration on why it so hard to find the right information and that's why I posted it in General and apparently I triggered something ...
Nevertheless, I would love to help and supply feedback in this forum about my experience but I would like to do that in some structured form.
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Click to collapse
There is a specific thread for MCUs entitled "Comprehensive Updated MCU Thread". So stating "there is no central page to browse them" is incorrect. There are also two links to repositories with MCUs in, in my signature and some in @marchnz's.
The two most popular ROMS (@Malaysk's and @Hal9k_'s) have instructions on how to boot into recovery and flash them in the first posts. If you have one of the rare units without an sdcard slot this may be slightly more difficult than usual, but you dont say. This requires either dismantling the unit and adding one (the slot is there on the mobo) or using a specific app written by @Hal9k_. Using a bootable sdcard requires a specific technique - ie ejecting the sdcard AS SOON as words appear on the screen. All this info IS available in the forum, sure some of it may take a bit of searching, but thats internet forums for you. If even all that did not work then either you are the first in 100,000s of thousands of posters to find a unit where none of the known methods works or (as it actually appears) you have a faulty unit, yet are are berating the forum for not knowing something that you were the first to find out or have a unit that is faulty. No one on the forum is psychic.
@marchnz has SEVERAL threads that tell you how to get into ADB and also how to flash via USB, there are also other threads about this too.
The fact that you posted a thread about MTCD/E units in the General forum and not in one of the (FOUR!) MTCD/E specific forums is quite bizarre, why would you not post in the specific forum for your device ? Doesnt make any sense. You were lucky that @marchnz found your post and that he mentioned me in it, otherwise no senior members would have replied. Why would you post in the general forum where there are no threads related to your device and ignore the forum dedicated to the device you require help with ? And the more you post, the more it appears that you either didnt look in the MTCD forums and/or you didnt look hard enough, so, ironically, whilst you did raise some relevant points regarding how XDA runs its Android Head Unit forums in your first post, they dont seem to actually apply to you, your situation or your unit. It seems that you simply should have started a new thread in the MTCD forum explaining your problem.
typos1 said:
There is a specific thread for MCUs entitled "Comprehensive Updated MCU Thread". So stating "there is no central page to browse them" is incorrect. There are also two links to repositories with MCUs in, in my signature and some in @marchnz's.
The two most popular ROMS (@Malaysk's and @Hal9k_'s) have instructions on how to boot into recovery and flash them in the first posts. If you have one of the rare units without an sdcard slot this may be slightly more difficult than usual, but you dont say. This requires either dismantling the unit and adding one (the slot is there on the mobo) or using a specific app written by @Hal9k_. Using a bootable sdcard requires a specific technique - ie ejecting the sdcard AS SOON as words appear on the screen. All this info IS available in the forum, sure some of it may take a bit of searching, but thats internet forums for you. If even all that did not work then either you are the first in 100,000s of thousands of posters to find a unit where none of the known methods works or (as it actually appears) you have a faulty unit, yet are are berating the forum for not knowing something that you were the first to find out or have a unit that is faulty. No one on the forum is psychic.
@marchnz has SEVERAL threads that tell you how to get into ADB and also how to flash via USB, there are also other threads about this too.
The fact that you posted a thread about MTCD/E units in the General forum and not in one of the (FOUR!) MTCD/E specific forums is quite bizarre, why would you not post in the specific forum for your device ? Doesnt make any sense. You were lucky that @marchnz found your post and that he mentioned me in it, otherwise no senior members would have replied. Why would you post in the general forum where there are no threads related to your device and ignore the forum dedicated to the device you require help with ? And the more you post, the more it appears that you either didnt look in the MTCD forums and/or you didnt look hard enough, so, ironically, whilst you did raise some relevant points regarding how XDA runs its Android Head Unit forums in your first post, they dont seem to actually apply to you, your situation or your unit. It seems that you simply should have started a new thread in the MTCD forum explaining your problem.
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I started the thread not to seek support for my specific unit, but to raise a question about how the forum is organized and I just wondered why there are no wiki pages.
As you guys already explained how things work around here, I generally got my question answered.
But since you also asked what unit I own, I just supplied the information.
I did search the forum and read the threads from Malaysk and Hal9k.
And I tried the recovery boot options in those threads, even to the point that my power button broke.
I also read the ADB recovery threads, however I'm not fond of making hardware mods so I mostly stuck to threads that described software only.
So, please accept my humble apologies for posting my question/rant in the 'wrong' section of the forum.
Btw: I was not aware of the information you guys put in you're signature because I configured Thread Display Options to not show signatures.
It's just that all those signatures create to much clutter when scrolling a thread.
Sorry, my bad.
Just to add my little bit to op 1st query.
After upgrading a few samsung phones over the years you do pick up a little knowledge.
For me just basic stuff like what rom to use, which kernal etc. etc.
While spending time in the work van talking to my boss about phones once, and what I had done over the weekend to upgrade mine, he was well impressed and thought I was really clever.
I did say to him the truth is, I am certainly not clever.
I read about the experiences and work of others and just copy.
The clever people are the ones who understand, write and develop all this stuff.
Moral is, never take anything or the work of others for granted.
What would you do ? just go ahead and buy a new unit or build one with new & already aquired parts ran with a 8gb Pi4b
Heres the gyst my old sofia mtcd crapped out and I kinda want to build a upgradeable unit myself. I have a 7" screen I have the Pi so I'm almost half way there already lol
I'd just like to know what are the other components/pihats you'd get to finish off this project. ?? The headunits like Mekede and Teyes are super nice but I cant justify spendin that kind of cash when I already have this stuff just sittin here collecting dust. If you could, please post links to the rest of the stuff like amp FM tuner ect
Thanks yahll
Well... This has nothing to do with the thematic of this forum.
Other than that: If you spend 10 minutes of your time and search in Google for Open Auto pro as example, you can find tons of pages about using a Raspberry 4b as car infotainment basis. --> https://bluewavestudio.io/shop/openauto-pro-car-head-unit-solution/
I have thanks tips
I was asking if anyone had pro's or cons to each unit and which they prefer. And now I just wasted 10 minutes of my time replying to your useless post.
Cid6.7 said:
I have thanks tips
I was asking if anyone had pro's or cons to each unit and which they prefer. And now I just wasted 10 minutes of my time replying to your useless post.
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Wow... nice answer. May be you need some extra help?
Go, search for a forum which handles such stupid and time consuming things. At least THIS forum is exactly NOT the right one.
Look at the top, it´s called Android Head-Units.
... was nice to meet you... and now don´t waste my time!
I can only waste your time if you reply to MY post therefor DONT REPLY if you dont have anything worth reading.