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mikechannon said:
"In general "I hate my phone" threads neither contribute soluactions to problems nor do they seek answers to problems in a calm and reasoned way.
These forums are for the giving and receiving of information that assists users to get the best from their device - it is not a vehicle for "sounding-off" about your phone.
This thread does have some useful content, so I will not delete it but will close it as relevant points have already been made.
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Ok .... so, the fact that we know HTC pay attention to people gripes, comments and compliments on these forums.... if that had been a "we love HTC thread" would that have been closed?
I agree being rude and obnoxious are very good reasons but ... why not censor the very few posts related to it. Why close the general dissastifaction with what appears to be a typical HTC release. Without a place to talk about the general failure of HTC, how can the majority of people learn? How can those prospective customers be aware of the challenges they need to overcome to turn a rubbish device (out of the factory) into a great device (after XDA and chefs)?
mikechannon said:
(In addition - this thread has been reported by Members)
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And it appears all you have to do is complain about a thread, not be justified in your complaint.
The one thing i've always used in years is the xda forums and some of that i haven't even owned a HTC device. Like it or not, most people here have invested a lot of hard earned cash (or will over the next 18/24 months) and that will naturaly attract an emotional value - hence some anger when something like this doesn't work. The fact there was so much feeling in that thread should indicate the level of "emotion" about it and the incensed feeling they have about the amount people feel they have spent, money and time, on a device they are so unhappy about. Maybe if you guys created a "vent here thread" you might get to allow people to rant AND get usefull threads - heck, even HTC might read the "vent here thread!" and take note?
I'm so worried after reading todays threads in particular, about ordering mine earlier today but sadly nothing else that supports FULL exchange meets my requirements. I know my consumer rights and will use them to the full should I need to but I hope not it does have so many great points.
Monty Burns said:
Ok .... so, the fact that we know HTC pay attention to people gripes, comments and compliments on these forums....
We don't know that for sure. There are many on here who would disagree, saying that for them, if HTC were listening, then perceived problems would have been resolved quicker.
I agree being rude and obnoxious are very good reasons but ... why not censor the very few posts related to it. Why close the general dissatisfaction with what appears to be a typical HTC release. Without a place to talk about the general failure of HTC, how can the majority of people learn? How can those prospective customers be aware of the challenges they need to overcome to turn a rubbish device (out of the factory) into a great device (after XDA and chefs)?
Problem with this argument is that there are some on here who don't wish to face those challenges, which is fair enough. However what they do is to gripe about it and not help themselves, even when you point them in the right direction.
And it appears all you have to do is complain about a thread, not be justified in your complaint.
Not sure where you get that from. Please provide evidence of this or retract.
The one thing i've always used in years is the xda forums and some of that i haven't even owned a HTC device. Like it or not, most people here have invested a lot of hard earned cash (or will over the next 18/24 months) and that will naturally attract an emotional value - hence some anger when something like this doesn't work. The fact there was so much feeling in that thread should indicate the level of "emotion" about it and the incensed feeling they have about the amount people feel they have spent, money and time, on a device they are so unhappy about. Maybe if you guys created a "vent here thread" you might get to allow people to rant AND get useful threads - heck, even HTC might read the "vent here thread!" and take note?
Any "ranting", as you put it, should be made direct to HTC. XDA-Developers is exactly that; a developers site with a lot of interested non-developers in it. Its not the place to take out your frustrations against a manufacturer.
Re your point on hard earned cash being spent, I can't disagree with this. However ask these people how many of them went out and gave the device a really good test drive and an assessment of whether it would meet their needs or not and you will be silenced by the response.
I'm so worried after reading todays threads in particular, about ordering mine earlier today but sadly nothing else that supports FULL exchange meets my requirements. I know my consumer rights and will use them to the full should I need to but I hope not it does have so many great points.
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If you have doubts about this device then don't buy it. You will be severely disappointed. If you have not taken time out to test drive one before putting your order in then, with respect, more fool you.
Finally, moderators on here bend over backwards NOT to close threads or be seen as censoring debate. However we have to keep a balance and if, in our judgment, a thread is getting out of hand or no longer has any value nor serve any useful purpose then it will be closed.
All the best,
WB
as you've quoted inside of quotes you have made it really dificult for me to "quote" back - nice job! (although i suspect not deliberate).
"We don't know that for sure. There are many on here who would disagree, saying that for them, if HTC were listening, then perceived problems would have been resolved quicker."
Yeah ok. So the very big majority of Winmob market phones are produced by HTC, this site is dedicated to HTC (and historicaly Winmob).... do you REALLY think they don't read these forums? Really? Honestly? Are you sure?
"Problem with this argument is that there are some on here who don't wish to face those challenges, which is fair enough. However what they do is to gripe about it and not help themselves, even when you point them in the right direction."
I agree. There are SOME who want to gripe. There are a ship load more who want to make a device work but can't, no matter the support they get from the community - random users suffering from the SMS bug for example? The very fact most of these people have googled/have knowledge of these forums, means that they have at least gone to some effort to resolve an issue. So yes some, but a VERY small number. So, how can they air the frustrations they have? where? Maybe the most expansive and read HTC forums... thats a good place to start!
"And it appears all you have to do is complain about a thread, not be justified in your complaint.
Not sure where you get that from. Please provide evidence of this or retract."
*sigh* .... ok .... i'll come back to this but, i did quote, if you really want me to link to a thread closed in the past 10 minutes other than i already quoted your mod. I will.
"Any "ranting", as you put it, should be made direct to HTC. XDA-Developers is exactly that; a developers site with a lot of interested non-developers in it. Its not the place to take out your frustrations against a manufacturer."
Yeah ya know, it was a developers site years ago.... its not any more and hasn't been for a long time. Its a cookers and users site now. If you still think HTC don't read this forum then .... The sites success over the years can also be its greatest strength if you let it.
Now this isn't a problem of the site itself, more one with many reviews and fanboys of ALL phones, Iphone, HTC, Nokia....
"Re your point on hard earned cash being spent, I can't disagree with this. However ask these people how many of them went out and gave the device a really good test drive and an assessment of whether it would meet their needs or not and you will be silenced by the response."
Trying out a phone is a shop is a VERY diferent affair to OWNING one. Any person will know that, sadly though, many of us have to go by the reviews and forum comments that are available and try to filter out what may or may not be fanboy. Magazines, forum posts, personal reviews, blogs are all individual and very personal. Saying that someone should have reviewed more is simply not fair. Its impossible. Try asking your local O2 shop if you can take a phone away for a couple of weeks to try?
Hold on .... yes you can!!!! And that was the point of the last thread that got closed! Your fellow mod closed a thread which wasn't actually personal to anyone and (from a personal fed up with moaners point of view) I was trying educate people who purchased there phones in the UK that they had a bucket load of rights. If they are not happy, and it was purchased from the uk, then please "turn it in!" and return it.
Now from my pov, i'm a londoner (can you tell?) but i work all over the world. Currently im in Durban (yeah I was there at the test match! and met the England team) but out here they dont have the HD 2 so, I have to go on the reviews etc. Some people out here will spend near on £600 getting it imported from Expansys UK (ummm .... co.za) and other sites.
also..
Can i provide evidence? No. It was not made public so all I can assume is that if I PM a mod, things will be closed:
mikechannon said:
"In general "I hate my phone" threads neither contribute soluactions to problems nor do they seek answers to problems in a calm and reasoned way.
These forums are for the giving and receiving of information that assists users to get the best from their device - it is not a vehicle for "sounding-off" about your phone.
This thread does have some useful content, so I will not delete it but will close it as relevant points have already been made.
(In addition - this thread has been reported by Members)
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Click to collapse
How can i provide more evidence than that? I'm not privvy to your private messages. The previous line though backs up my "love HTC or go away" argument to a small extent:
mikechannon said:
This thread does have some useful content, so I will not delete it but will close it as relevant points have already been made.
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I really think you guys, having helped, actually almost pushed HTC to where they are should now use your position and be .... responsible(? maybe a bit strong)) ... finaly get off the HTC only band wagon. Let them know that the stunning products they produce will no longer be accepted only 90% complete.
Ok. Lets be realistic. I ain't gona change your minds on anything and I don't want you to rebel against HTC as they make amazing hardware but, at least, in the position you have got.... maybe create a "if your gone B*&% and let off steam, do it in this thread?" thread? Maybe, just maybe there will be a common thread in it that HTC will finaly get to grips with .....?
Oh, and i've had a tytn, tytn 2 and having had both of those replaced under warranty i thought... no! Poke it! And had a tosh g900 when most people couldnt even spell 800 res screens and then foolishly went to a TD. That was refunded quickly under sales of goods act. Have an Acer M900 but due to the fact i'm living in south africa and i purchased that under my company contract, i now need to replace next week when im back in the UK. I was looking at a Milestone but the exchange support is rubbish at best. So, I have a week to try the HD2 or return it as not fit for purpose.... I do however, really want it to work!
And one final word.... my best winmob device without a device? Well two actually .... the Samsung Omnia and the baggage reconciliation devices i'm working with at the new Durban airport (what??? its not just a PHONE O/S!!!!??)
My opinion.
Here's an example of 2 threads.
MY HD2 IS THE WORST FONE ON THE PLANIT
I bought this fone for £x000 dollars and it should do everything I can ever imagine, rite out of the out of the box. I am disgusted that HTC expect ME to fix their problems.
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SMS didn't send
Hi everyone.
I tried to send a text message to my friends earlier and it's stuck in my outbox. Does anyone know why this might be? Does anyone have a suggestion as to what I should do about it?
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This forum is not about defending or slating any particular device. It is meant for users to get together and talk about ways to make the experience better. This forum is not responsible for the fact that some hardware that comes out of some factory and gets some software installed on it is not 100% perfect!
Now for 1 moment, can we please put aside arguments regarding the device and talk about the forum? Which of the above 2 threads is the most constructive?
Thank you.
johncmolyneux said:
Here's an example of 2 threads.
This forum is not about defending or slating any particular device. It is meant for users to get together and talk about ways to make the experience better. This forum is not responsible for the fact that some hardware that comes out of some factory and gets some software installed on it is not 100% perfect!
Now for 1 moment, can we please put aside arguments regarding the device and talk about the forum? Which of the above 2 threads is the most constructive?
Thank you.
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More to the point, what is the point of leaving the first example open? At the very least there should be a dedicated section for those unhelpful posts (as [★] suggested yesterday) but I think they should just be closed as they're so worthless.
Do you work for a newspaper?
Both comments are usefull. Just because you don't see the use in both doesn't mean they are not usefull. Does that mean 10% of men don't like brand x of condoms so they should be ignored of Fred Smiths Condom appreciation website?
(sorry thats a really poor example but its 2am here in SA and i've been on the beer and Eve-online and films for a few hours )
Very fair play to you for putting forward an argument (non abusive as I would hope) and maybe catch up tomorrow.
Monty,
You are a Londoner eh? I should have known. You lot are nothing but trouble makers!
First off sorry about the quotes within quotes; didn't realise it stopped you from quoting back. Now that I do...
OK, lots in your post that I could come back on in detail but I won't because I'm the sort of chap that likes going forwards, not looking back in self pity or whatever.
The one thing that you have suggested, and you are not the first, is that we think on somewhere where people can let off steam WITHOUT cluttering up the forums. As you know there is some work going on as to how best we can restructure the place to make it better. Can I ask you to be a little patient while all this gets worked through.
In the meantime, think on the following:
- Help us to support people who need and want help and please be robust about those that don't but just fancy a moan and upsetting people on here without ever really wanting to seek help or to help themselves (the word Troll comes to mind).
- If you look at the Development & Hacking forums you will see that Development is stronger than ever and does not change what this place is all about. The work of the chefs is recognised and appreciated, and you can argue that is also development so 2-0 there.
- Lets all try to be a little adult, constructive and get along a little. I can tell you that, from a Mods perspective, we really want to be doing other things to make people's lives on here better rather than spending time closing threads down because people just can't have a little respect for each other. I often wonder whether anyone ever reads the forum rules.
Finally thank you for keeping on the straight and narrow re this thread and not going off the rails and getting it closed.
WB
jakem said:
More to the point, what is the point of leaving the first example open? At the very least there should be a dedicated section for those unhelpful posts (as [★] suggested yesterday) but I think they should just be closed as they're so worthless.
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I totally agree mate (hence the support in said thread raised by [★] yesterday.)
I find this site a ridiculously valuable source of information when I need help with my phone, and I find it disheartening to have to wade through complaint after complaint just in order to get to constructive discussions.
If I wanted to live in troll city, I'd pack all my stuff into boxes; call a removals company; do some browsing of estate agents and property letting agents; check the reputation of the areas I was interested in and then guess what.... MOVE TO TROLL CITY!
I'm a placid guy generally, but some posts really make me struggle to just not tell the OP where to go.
+9999999 recurring to real constructive users of this site.
-9999999 recurring to trolls (and we know you don't think you're a troll, but you are.)
Monty Burns said:
Do you work for a newspaper?
Both comments are usefull. Just because you don't see the use in both doesn't mean they are not usefull. Does that mean 10% of men don't like brand x of condoms so they should be ignored of Fred Smiths Condom appreciation website?
(sorry thats a really poor example but its 2am here in SA and i've been on the beer and Eve-online and films for a few hours )
Very fair play to you for putting forward an argument (non abusive as I would hope) and maybe catch up tomorrow.
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If 10% of men don't like brand x of condoms then they should definitely speak their mind. They would be wrong though to go to a forum that supports uses of brand x condoms and slate them. A support forum is for support.
OK first, no idea who Martin is. (Its Monty spelt the wrong way - doh)
Second, guys sounds like we might have a good conversation on the values of "to HTC or not HTC" although I might be on the wrong side, despite just spending a bucket load of fivers on a HT2.
Please, keep it clean and (well funny if you can't) but not personaly insulting. Everyone on a keyboard is a human being!
Be safe, have fun!
Monty Burns said:
OK first, no idea who Martin is.
Second, guys sounds like we might have a good conversation on the values of "to HTC or not HTC" although I might be on the wrong side, despite just spending a bucket load of fivers on a HT2.
Please, keep it clean and (well funny if you can't) but not personaly insulting. Everyone on a keyboard is a human being!
Be safe, have fun!
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I agree with that totally, but I do think this thread should be moved to a general area. Let's face it, it's hardly HD2 specific now is it!
It would be nice to see everyone's thoughts on this, rather than just the ones with The God Phone. (Just kidding - that was meant to incite trouble )
To be fair, those "I hate this phone" ranting type threads really do spiral into a hate fest or at least the few I've seen. If a topic is interesting and you comment on it, and go back later to see how it develops when all that is left is just insults, it has no use to most if not all.
johncmolyneux said:
I agree with that totally, but I do think this thread should be moved to a general area. Let's face it, it's hardly HD2 specific now is it!
It would be nice to see everyone's thoughts on this, rather than just the ones with The God Phone. (Just kidding - that was meant to incite trouble )
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Argh! I'm not a god!!! (although I think I am, with my size 9 shoes... bow down before me!)
Seriously, maybe a good idea. I guess in an odd way this may complement (orb3000s?) the other thread vote about should it be HTC or not site? We don't know you server statistics of course but, we can hope that we can get to the stage where we can give our opinion on HTC honestly..... ( i wanted to deleted that and not type it as its not fair, i think we can, mostly ).
In my view its like a really cool manopoly. The games fun to play for almost all of us (i may/may not include myself in that after 2 years HTC abscense on next Friday) but for some it really sucks cos they keep losing.
I would think that moving it to an adult discussion of the real benefits as us users see if you become "open" but, we have no idea of the server costs... only you guys do.
(you do of course know that pressure will mount and mount and mount with regards to non-HTC phones. Your not silly Samsung, LG, Acer.... to name but a few know that the serious money is in smart phones in the next few years, not feature. In Slough o2 test 150-200 meg 4g phones a couple of weeks ago )
From what I understand, this is a developers forum. i.e. look to the potential rather than to the faults as is.
There are far too many distracting threads along the lines of "the virtual keyboard is killing me", "my wife left me because of the battery life", "the pink camera issue made me kill my neighbour". These type of threads may have valid points but they are all a bit melodramatic and really don't serve the purpose of the forum very well as they fan the flames of discontent rather that rise to the can-fix mindset. Despite what the trolls (for want of a better word) might like to say, this isn't a fanboi site, it's for those who realise a problem and want to solve it, simply just improve things, or just want to tweak things just because they can! I'm sure most of us here are all too aware of the shortcomings of Windows mobile software, just as we recognise the potential & strengths of this platform.
Speaking as a self-confessed technophile I will admit to spending an not inconsiderable amount of hard-earned money on utter crap i.e. gadgets that promised so much, yet delivered so little or were simply just badly executed. The HD2 is non of these, it's a stunning piece of design & engineering. It's not perfect, for example: the sharp edges of the camera lens annoy me a little, but it doesn't induce a desire in me to vent my spleen to the world.
I'm optimistic, I hope to survive longer than my HD2 and maybe via this forum HTC will hear my concern for this non-life threatening design flaw and engineer a more ergonomic lens cover for the next mobile phone I get. If they don't, it will undoubtedly leave a microscopic void in my life, but I'm strong enough to move on and no doubt the HTC designers will burn in hell for their tardiness.
xda-developers is what is says and is a great community that helps us get the best from these intriguing phones, so please diss the efforts of those who contribute and recognise that enthusiasm is a far better fertilizer for technology than manure.
Besides that, looking at my HD2 I've just noticed that it's going to be wet & windy at "My Location" tomorrow. That's fifty miles away and I'm not even going there, so it's a win for me!
Its almost humorous at how many negative threads there are, or how many threads start out positive and you have people come in and bring them down, I have never seen a forum this pissed off EVER, BUT I can say that we as Sprint customers are getting a little tired of the **** we are dealing with, I like many of you just want CTIA to come, I mean the Echo is cool and all but not for me. Also people are ripping on the new Pre 3, I for one am interested, so what if it has 1 core.... SERIOUSLY it may just be me but isn't functionality override the e-boner you get lol?
That said, I will now hide behind my stone wall.
Not going to lie... I love Android, and love my Evo... but the Pre 3 and a TouchPad make for a killer combo... I liked their presentation today.... HP is doing something right, and that is the fact that they are releasing a WiFi only version before their other variants.
As far as the negativity going on in XDA, don't sweat it. There are trolls everywhere online. Best to simply ignore, or if you can't, ask Shift to give out the "thunderous back hand" of his!!!
I think a lot of people in here forget that not all of us grew up screwing with this stuff. That rooting and flashing and all that aren't second nature to us. And I understand some of the sarcasm given to certain posts... though a lot of people are rude to a belligerent degree.
I've opened dumb threads and had my ass handed to me from people, understandably. But sometimes it crosses the line from being facepalmed to being gangraped.
The funny thong is I have noticed the opposite that you posted. Compared to a couple other forums I check out this one has a lot more comradery and people can usually ask a relevant question without too much high school attitude.
yes, there is still a decent amount of rudeness but for as frustrated as a lot of the more informed members can get with the barrage of stupid questions, things tend to stay pretty civil.
Plus, we can always blame shift
I think the Echo announcement is the cherry on top. People have been pretty down on Sprint since their Premier and discount policy chances, and the new $10 tax on any smartphone. =/
It's really so disappointing to see the reception given to SamsungJohn here in XDA. I know many of you are angry about the Froyo delays, but *****ing out the social media liasson won't accomplish anything.
This is the first time ever, AFAIK, that a handset manufacturer has reached out directly to the XDA community. Maybe it's all smoke and mirrors, who knows, but we won't see anything if we just reject their attempts out of hand.
And I think people need to stop with the notion that Samsung is evil or just wants to hurt users. They're a huge company; it may not have even been on the radar of the decisionmakers that we were dissatisfied.
We're in a fairly recent and novel paradigm where users expect timely software updates--a year and a half ago nobody expected that. You bought a phone and maybe there might be a firmware update somewhere down the road. And out of the millions of people who bought SGS phones, we're just a very small minority. If we want cooperation from Samsung we need to impress upon them the advantages of collaborating with devs, because honestly they're going to make billions either way. If we demonstrate that cooperation will involve crass tantrums, they'll just sell their phones to the millions of people who don't give a crap about independent development. Do we really want that kind of belligerent attitude a la Motorola? I don't know about you, but I'd rather we try to move Samsung towards us rather than away from us.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Samsung is trying to help us and we are biting our noses off just to spite our face. I think they are doing a great thing by coming on here.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Agreed...well said...both of you.
I agree that was pretty messed up. It's bad enough all the devs have been scrared away. Ex-da isn't what it used to.
I totally agree. The guy is not a decision maker at Samsung - he came here to try to get feedback about how the company can improve and people just flamed the guy relentlessly. Further proof that there are too many children and buffoons here. It's no wonder that devs loathe coming here. FYI to the guys that tore into SamsungJohn - Krylon had a good conversation with Sammy and they are looking to get in contact with Sombionix as well.
What's not on their radar with a 90% surety is timely software updates. Hardware companies are going to drag their feet as much as possible to provide software upgrades for old hardware, if they do it at all.
I don't meam any disrespect to anyone but I gotta disagree.
Samsung is a huge company but they have also been in the mobile business for quite a while and they have also been known to release products that don't quite work the way they are supposed to, just like the Vibrant and until now there was no post purchase support or at least no usable support or updates... Look at the history of the Beholds and almost any other phone they released.
Releasing a phone like the Vibrant in 2010 that lags out of the box and where the gps issues make the navigation function unusable is just not right. Stock this phone is a joke and after a few days of use it is really frustrating. They are supposed to do a lot more then just release a device after device and look at the sale numbers.
These are very expensive devices and for that kind of money they are supposed to work!
Agree or disagree with me but facts are facts. Not everyone who owns such a device will root or flash their device with a custom rom in order to make it usable. I have played with many other android phones and they all work smoother and stock a lot better than any of the galaxy s series so far...
To list some...
Htc incredible, nexus one, mytouch 4g, tmobile g2, droid x, even htc aria which is not even in the same class as above mentioned models.
If the developers on the xda forums can make this phone perform ten times better than stock, explain to me why Samsung's developers cannot do the same...
I speak for myself, but I am fed up with samsung and their quality control and I can say this was the last Samsung phone I purchased until they do something revolutionary and change my mind...
Isn't someone testing these devices for a week or two before they release them in order to make sure everything works as it should?! If they are then maybe samsung should hire someone from this forum instead...
Also why don't the phone manufacturers just make a survey on the forums for feedback from users as to what the phone should include as far as software or hardware... 2010 top tier android device without a flash for the camera is just wrong and the night mode cannot replace the flash. I do not use the camera as much but just for the sake of it they should have led flash, some people use it and want it, how expensive can it be to do that...
The Super AMOLED display is the best in my opinion for now, but it is not enough to justify the many other mistakes or flaws... The displays on other phone aren't crap either!
Sorry for the long post.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
I'm totally sympathetic to the people who are fed up and say #neveragain. But the solution to that is to complain through other channels and then never buy Samsung again.
This rep came here reaching his hand out to the dev community, and insulting him or whining does a serious disservice to everyone else here. I think he came here to try to create a mutually beneficial relationship, not take complaint tickets. Many of us are skeptical, but we think it's worth seeing if anything can come of this (and if you aren't, the actual devs are).
BorisZX6R said:
I don't meam any disrespect to anyone but I gotta disagree.
Samsung is a huge company but they have also been in the mobile business for quite a while and they have also been known to release products that don't quite work the way they are supposed to, just like the Vibrant and until now there was no post purchase support or at least no usable support or updates... Look at the history of the Beholds and almost any other phone they released.
Releasing a phone like the Vibrant in 2010 that lags out of the box and where the gps issues make the navigation function unusable is just not right. Stock this phone is a joke and after a few days of use it is really frustrating. They are supposed to do a lot more then just release a device after device and look at the sale numbers.
These are very expensive devices and for that kind of money they are supposed to work!
Agree or disagree with me but facts are facts. Not everyone who owns such a device will root or flash their device with a custom rom in order to make it usable. I have played with many other android phones and they all work smoother and stock a lot better than any of the galaxy s series so far...
To list some...
Htc incredible, nexus one, mytouch 4g, tmobile g2, droid x, even htc aria which is not even in the same class as above mentioned models.
If the developers on the xda forums can make this phone perform ten times better than stock, explain to me why Samsung's developers cannot do the same...
I speak for myself, but I am fed up with samsung and their quality control and I can say this was the last Samsung phone I purchased until they do something revolutionary and change my mind...
Isn't someone testing these devices for a week or two before they release them in order to make sure everything works as it should?! If they are then maybe samsung should hire someone from this forum instead...
Also why don't the phone manufacturers just make a survey on the forums for feedback from users as to what the phone should include as far as software or hardware... 2010 top tier android device without a flash for the camera is just wrong and the night mode cannot replace the flash. I do not use the camera as much but just for the sake of it they should have led flash, some people use it and want it, how expensive can it be to do that...
The Super AMOLED display is the best in my opinion for now, but it is not enough to justify the many other mistakes or flaws... The displays on other phone aren't crap either!
Sorry for the long post.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
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I was one of those that got beholded they flat out lied on that one. Here I am again with the vibrant guessing thats samsung mo to screw ya
This rep was hosed due to his own lack of knowledge, nothing else.
He started off by filling the cool-aid cups and passing them around expecting everyone to drink freely.
"Hi, I'm SamsungJohn and I have some REALLY BIG things for everyone here"
*I'll wisely not mention that I can't answer questions about hardware or software and in fact I can't really answer a single question anyone has*
It was Samsung corporate in damage control mode,NOTHING ELSE.
Funk dem. Do they think everyone is so stupid they cannot see thru this BS ?
I honestly do feel sorry for John getting thrown to the sharks by his employer, but I know for a damn fact it could have been handled with tact and finesse.
Oh yea, before the flaming closet dwellers start in....
i.e.
" Hi, I'm John, I work for Samsung, and they have given me the job position of liason with the public.
Now before I go any further, please understand that I am under corporate restraints and NDAs (non-disclosure agreements) so that I can only give so much info and so much data. I do not know yet if they will allow me to give access to unreleased software.
So, within those restraints I will do my best to provide what I can.
Yes, I know a great many of you are upset with Samsung and that is why I am here.
Please go easy on me as I do not own or control the company"
Now, would that really have been so very tough of an introduction ?
n2ishun said:
This rep was hosed due to his own lack of knowledge, nothing else.
He started off by filling the cool-aid cups and passing them around expecting everyone to drink freely.
"Hi, I'm SamsungJohn and I have some REALLY BIG things for everyone here"
*I'll wisely not mention that I can't answer questions about hardware or software and in fact I can't really answer a single question anyone has*
It was Samsung corporate in damage control mode,NOTHING ELSE.
Funk dem. Do they think everyone is so stupid they cannot see thru this BS ?
I honestly do feel sorry for John getting thrown to the sharks by his employer, but I know for a damn fact it could have been handled with tact and finesse.
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It's one thing to remain skeptical towards the guy and his motives but its completely another to flat out accuse him of lying and subterfuge merely because he may have omitted the exact words you need to hear or he wasn't nice enough, etc. It seems fairly obvious to me that if ANY large company was to hold a Q&A session on specifics of perceived missteps, they would choose a much more public forum - not a niche community of developers. On the other hand, if they wanted to incorporate new features or contract out some good developers, they are in the right place.
I don't doubt they (samsung) aren't doing this out of the goodness of their collective hearts, but if this is how changes are effected, I'll take it.
Totally agree with you Kubernetes, people think they'll get something done by impressing their rage upon the messenger. So far all of his threads are closed due to people completely ignoring the instructions and asking for release dates and trolling samsung saying they're gonna tell all their friends to never buy samsung, it's really disgusting if you ask me. I dunno about you guys but I'm the only person I know who cares if samsung releases timely updates...everyone else I know is NOT a power user and could not care less about updates. I think if outsiders say, higher ups in Samsung, were to read those threads they'd see more hostility and uncooperativeness
than a community that's ready to work with them.
Main reason I dislike all the people flaming him is because as soon as I try to ask a legit question, the thread is already locked. Trolls are blaring out people who want to handle this like adults.
Please don't try to put words in my mouth unless you intend to become my wife. I'm a dominating top so consider the job well before volunteering.
At no point did I say that John was lying, yet you say very directly that I did.
Exactly whom is the lier ?
Well honestly the way he was treated was bad, but again that is the way Samsung has treated us from the beginning, but I do have to say something about this section (vibrant) As a whole we fight with each other too much. Just take a look at the 2.2.1 rom release in the development section. It just one big ***** fest, and it is stupid. We need to focus on fixing and making our phones better not our EGO's. If we as a community can't get our collective a$$ together we will just fade away and kill our developer support. There is too much drama. One group doesn't want to work with another so on so forth. If we pooled our collective resources then we could be great.
n2ishun said:
This rep was hosed due to his own lack of knowledge, nothing else.
He started off by filling the cool-aid cups and passing them around expecting everyone to drink freely.
"Hi, I'm SamsungJohn and I have some REALLY BIG things for everyone here"
*I'll wisely not mention that I can't answer questions about hardware or software and in fact I can't really answer a single question anyone has*
It was Samsung corporate in damage control mode,NOTHING ELSE.
Funk dem. Do they think everyone is so stupid they cannot see thru this BS ?
I honestly do feel sorry for John getting thrown to the sharks by his employer, but I know for a damn fact it could have been handled with tact and finesse.
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It Is damage control, but that said, they are (cause they recognize not to do so is suicide) reaching out, but the teaser is just a tactic to buy more time.
I am in the corporate world and I am Senior Exec, So this is just normal proceedings from a business to engage - delay and then reveal what they really are going to offer. That tactic is done cause it lowers expectations so if it is not enough you do not end up with a mass rebellion on your hands. Samsung John is a Big Boy, he knows the rules and expects to hear both happy and hostile comments and takes them like a grain of salt. So there is nothing for us to be ashamed of, he asked for our opinion and comments and we gave them to him.... the good, the bad and the ugly
One other note SamsungJohn released the exact same email in every Galaxy forum, so do not be wooed into thinking he was talking directly to us. It was can statement and a canned response/followup.
This might be his big announcement
I have been a user here four about 2 months and have never posted because I know how to search and I don't want to deal with the egos and the flaming, but this was posted on another forum (has nothing to do with phones) that I use.
"I talked with someone in STA (the division of the company that focuses on mobile devices), no plans at least in the immediate future are int he works for OTA updates on the Galaxy S 3G lineup. Which has me pissed. (edit: by "immediate future" I mean we're looking at like March for the mandatory OTA update, which leads me to think this hardwire update is just a beta)
Even as an employee, I can guarantee this is going to be my last Samsung phone. I STILL don't have Froyo because of all the hoops I had to go through in addition to running errands today.
Why you're forced to use a completely different connection mode, when virtually every other phone on the market can update either OTA or with a standard USB mount point, then Kies refused to connect until I turned on USB debugging, turned off USB debugging, and restarted Kies.
Now? With 88% battery life, I need to let it charge to 100% just to even start downloading the update."
Idid not include a link since it is private forum and the guy has a job he would probably like to keep. This was posted last month when the Kies update came out.
With that said it would still be nice to work with samsung, what may come from it might not be the holy grail, but at least something may come from it.
I find alarming that a lot of people in these threads think of Samsung as some sort of benefactor. An overlord that we must strive to please or else face the consequences. That is the exact opposite of what it should be.
We don't need to please them with diplomacy as if we owe them something. They simply have to treat us like clients and thats the end of that.
I can't believe some of you feel that we must appease a paid employee and thank him for doing what he is being paid to do. What is he gonna do, quit his job because the whole XDA collective is not getting on its knees for him.
An advice to Samsung, and SamsungJohn: stop talking, and start acting. A good start would have been a post saying: "Hi, I'm a representative from Samsung. Here's a source code and some other tools you guys might find useful FOR IMPROVING OUR PRODUCT. THANK YOU!"
Kubernetes said:
This is the first time ever, AFAIK, that a handset manufacturer has reached out directly to the XDA community. Maybe it's all smoke and mirrors, who knows, but we won't see anything if we just reject their attempts out of hand.
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that. right. there.
Mannymal said:
I find alarming that a lot of people in these threads think of Samsung as some sort of benefactor. An overlord that we must strive to please or else face the consequences. That is the exact opposite of what it should be.
We don't need to please them with diplomacy as if we owe them something. They simply have to treat us like clients and thats the end of that.
I can't believe some of you feel that we must appease a paid employee and thank him for doing what he is being paid to do. What is he gonna do, quit his job because the whole XDA collective is not getting on its knees for him.
An advice to Samsung, and SamsungJohn: stop talking, and start acting. A good start would have been a post saying: "Hi, I'm a representative from Samsung. Here's a source code and some other tools you guys might find useful FOR IMPROVING OUR PRODUCT. THANK YOU!"
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Jesus that's myopic. Samsung doesn't need anything from us, we're just a tiny minority of people who have bought their phones. They clearly think there's something to be gained from forming relationships with devs, which is why SamsungJohn is here and not Android Central or a more consumer oriented site.
You want source? Great, I'm sure that's what Krylon and Supercurio are telling them. Like adults. And I'm sure they're also explaining how timely source release can benefit Samsung as well, instead of demanding it or crying about how we're owed better support.
Because in the end, he doesn't have to be here and Samsung doesn't have to do jack about helping XDA because they'll still sell a ****-ton of phones regardless. If you can't understand that there are things we want from Samsung and it's not "appeasement" to try to get them, I have no words for you. It's not like we're holding all the cards and some horrible fate will befall Samsung if they decide this is too much of a headache.
Why is that every little wining brat comes here to “complain to Samsung” and tell XDA users their next will be WP7, iOS or what not!?
Here’s a simple walkthrough if you want to complain:
If it’s about the Galaxy Hardware, complain to Samsung
If it’s about the fact that you don’t have this or that on android, complain to google.
Here, well, it’s about customizing the device. So if you have certain issue with a certain release, REPORT TO THE DEVELOPPER, and please do it in a kind and well mannered way, those guys do it for free on their free time.
And if you just think it’s a piece of no good monkey crap, SELL IT AND BE DONE WITH IT… nobody likes a wining brat…
Some kids enjoy being trolls, because they are starved for attention. It's a shame that anyone would want to troll a place like XDA...
Sent from my GT-I9000 using xda premium
While I'm with you and don't complain, there is a reason people do it:
1. They feel like someone is actually listening (case and point by you starting this thread), whereas Any company, whatever brand don't listen until there is media attention to the fact.
2. They don't want to feel like they are the only ones and want to feel supported or justified.
As I said I agree with you, but you are no better unfortunately. You see, they are complaining, but you are also complaining about them. What's the real difference here?
You tell them to be quiet or leave, but you could also do the same and not dignify their statements/complaints with statements/complaints of your own.
At the end of the day, it's human nature to complain, but it's also up to you/us to choose how to respond to people that do complain. And in this case, there are some things better left unsaid. By choosing not to respond to them will not justify them.
Just playing devils advocate here. But you have to ask yourself what's worse? Them complaining or your response. Their intention was to strike a nerve.
Mission accomplished I'd say.
Sent from my GT-I9000M using Tapatalk
Nokia 1112 Wins
I think Samsung do pay attention to what happens here, they are connected slightly more closely with the developer community having hired a number of developers and teams from here. I'm pretty sure that they get alot of feedback of bugs and faults in those "leaked" roms that are released every so often.
Anyhow, this part of the forum is dedicated to Samsung phones. If one guy complains about something and since this community has tons of members who use Samsung phones, who may also have the same gripes, it becomes slightly easier for your problems to be heard and hopefully corrected, especially if Samsung know its affecting alot of its future and current phone buyers.
There's a world of difference between those 2 things:
reporting something (bug, issue) in a well mannered way and asking for a correction or a way to fix it
or
Winning about how much samsung/SGS/Android sucks, telling you'd never buy another SGS/Android device againt and affirming that samsungs sucks because they haven't released ICS yet...
You see the difference there, reporting and being proactive or winning just to get attention
t1mman said:
There's a world of difference between those 2 things:
reporting something (bug, issue) in a well mannered way and asking for a correction or a way to fix it
or
Winning about how much samsung/SGS/Android sucks, telling you'd never buy another SGS/Android device againt and affirming that samsungs sucks because they haven't released ICS yet...
You see the difference there, reporting and being proactive or winning just to get attention
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I'm not advocating bashing for the sake of it, it's just sometimes you have to do a bit of a song and dance to get heard and if you have a problem and have enough people complaining about it your more likely to be heard. But yh I agree whining for the sake of it is annoying. One thing I've seen alot of on other forums and blogs is people buying $100 off contract android phones, then comparing it to a $800 Iphone and then declaring that android sucks because they don't get as good an experience.
So after I got my note 4 today I called customer service to inquire why they took them out unlike other carriers.
First person blamed Samsung, then best buy and I shot that down. She sent me to corporate, that person stalled and said I would have to ask her boss.
Third level guy is cool and was actually nice about it. I said I just wanted to voice my opinion and that was all, and that I was going to give them to my son because I didn't use them.
Anyway I started to end the call and he stops me and offers to lower my bill $20 a month. I said that wasn't my intention but of course I would accept.
Today was nice, got the phone half off then bill lowered $20 a month even though I told him I just wanted a straight answer and it was no biggie.
And he did admit that it does appear they do that to encourage customers to buy headphones and that was what I wanted to hear. It only took being transferred to a 3rd level boss.
Nice! I will try this out this week!
That's really interesting -- and very nice for you! Just a side note: the Developer Edition shipped directly from Samsung without headphones.
i love how people are still complaining about the cheap, crappy headphones that come with these phones.
all the power to you for voicing your opinion and walking away with a deal, though.
but if you want better headphones than the garbage samsung makes, goto amazon and spend ten whole dollars on a pair of jbuds. problem solved.
(and for me, verizon sold the note 4 off contract for 50 bucks less than other carriers and didn't have headphones, so hey, if that price was a part of verizons deal with samsung to get the phones at a cheaper price, then good on them, and i fully agree with their decision to not include garbage headphones.)
jayochs said:
i love how people are still complaining about the cheap, crappy headphones that come with these phones.
all the power to you for voicing your opinion and walking away with a deal, though.
but if you want better headphones than the garbage samsung makes, goto amazon and spend ten whole dollars on a pair of jbuds. problem solved.
(and for me, verizon sold the note 4 off contract for 50 bucks less than other carriers and didn't have headphones, so hey, if that price was a part of verizons deal with samsung to get the phones at a cheaper price, then good on them, and i fully agree with their decision to not include garbage headphones.)
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Not to be rude, but before you leave posts you should make sure you don't put your foot in your mouth.
I plainly said I wasn't complaining, didn't use them, or care, I just wanted a straight answer.
In fact, why am I bothering to acknowledge your useless post.
Now after you work on your reading comprehension please read my post again and respond appropriately.
Of course, if I misunderstood and you were not referring to me, no harm no foul.
Having been in sales/retail management and a district manager I was wanting some entertainment with the call because I already knew the answer, just wanted to hear it.
Also, my little girl was in the emergency room for the second day with a deadly issue, so it helped me not completely freak out
sprintuser1977 said:
Not to be rude, but before you leave posts you should make sure you don't put your foot in your mouth.
I plainly said I wasn't complaining, didn't use them, or care, I just wanted a straight answer.
In fact, why am I bothering to acknowledge your useless post.
Now after you work on your reading comprehension please read my post again and respond appropriately.
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then maybe you should rethink the title of your post next time, mmkay?
calm yourself, bud. there's plenty of threads around here about people complaining about not having the earbuds. another thread about it is just more wasted space on this forum. and fyi, there's not ONE place in your OP that states "i'm not complaining." perhaps you need to re-read your own postings before making comments like that. you created a thread just to tell us that you called people to ask about the earbuds, when you should clearly know that verizon reps don't know a thing and would have NO idea why verizon didn't include them, and that they offered $20 off your bill. i mean cmon dude, a thread about it wasn't really necessary. this could've been posted in any number of other threads already existing, including the large "verizon note 4 thread."
oh and don't worry, you came off like a complete ass and completely rude in your reply.
The superior, Web stud members of xda. Thankfully you types are few. You sure showed me. Now go do what you guys do and invade threads to show your Web bad assery or flame new people. SMH
And we wonder why it takes forever to get in touch with Verizon customer care...People calling about earphones...
Sent from my Galaxy Note 4
jayochs said:
then maybe you should rethink the title of your post next time, mmkay?
calm yourself, bud. there's plenty of threads around here about people complaining about not having the earbuds. another thread about it is just more wasted space on this forum. and fyi, there's not ONE place in your OP that states "i'm not complaining." perhaps you need to re-read your own postings before making comments like that. you created a thread just to tell us that you called people to ask about the earbuds, when you should clearly know that verizon reps don't know a thing and would have NO idea why verizon didn't include them, and that they offered $20 off your bill. i mean cmon dude, a thread about it wasn't really necessary. this could've been posted in any number of other threads already existing, including the large "verizon note 4 thread."
oh and don't worry, you came off like a complete ass and completely rude in your reply.
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Complaining about other ppl complaining.... Hmmm lol pretty useless
sprintuser1977 said:
The superior, Web stud members of xda. Thankfully you types are few. You sure showed me. Now go do what you guys do and invade threads to show your Web bad assery or flame new people. SMH
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oh don't worry bud, i'm also a stud in real life too.
and you'll find plenty more like me around here when you continue to post useless threads
I noticed when I opened the box at Bestbuy there were no headphones and just made that comment to the Samsung employee selling me the phone at full price. She said I'll give you some. I wasn't looking for any but I took them and as usual....they do suck.
I am more concerned that people actually use buds packed in the box...... Especially if a music fan. I wouldn't even listen to Nickleback with in box buds. Ewww.
Lmao! Too funny....
jayochs said:
oh don't worry bud, i'm also a stud in real life too.
and you'll find plenty more like me around here when you continue to post useless threads
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Yep. You make the place awesome!
Useless? That's an opinion and this thread is in general, which is a place where this topic is fine.
If you wanna troll and correct threads become a mod.
Otherwise save the keyboard strokes.
It's useless yet you made a useless post in a thread you deemed useless?
Good logic. Anyway, as it did help people (several have gotten a perk because of it) i wouldn't call that useless.
As far as other information I am not going to bother replying anymore to people like you. You are the members that discourage people from posting.
I've been here for years so I know it happens.
I help anyone no matter what, and i will read any topic because this forum needs as much life as possible.
Anyway, have at it, post and troll or flame and be that stud you are. I have posted my story and will not respond anymore.
I'm sure you got this thread on notification so you can come be a stud when I reply.
Have fun my friend, I am sincerely sorry I upset or bothered you in any way and I mean that.
I would help you if I ever could and again, I am not in the business of trying to be useless, this forum is an escape for me and I enjoy reading and participating.
No hard feelings on my side and I apologize for anything I wrote that was out of line or made you feel disrespected.
And i mean that.
Have a blessed day bro.
If you have a note 3 please pm me and let me know, if you do have one I'll explain why.
well I for one happen to like the headphones I got with my s3 and s4, the s3 ear buds especially. I returned a pair of $200 earbuds because they weren't doing it for me the way the s3's earbuds were.
and I'm very annoyed the note4 didn't come with any. it's certainly not like they subsidized the phone and had to make cutbacks, the phone is $850 off contact, I expect gold plated headphones and an extra charging kit for that kind of money ffs... give me my damn headphones.
p.s. and while you're at it, did you cut back on the box too? this is my first galaxy box I'd have no reservations throwing away.. what happened to that inspired by nature crap, I want another wooden box like my other phones came in. k now I'm done
We got an email survey asking about our upgrade experience, and i did comment that i thought it was crap removing the earbuds, and a week later we got a call from the Samsung rep for our area apologising about the issue, and letting us know free earbuds for both our phones were waiting for us at best buy, where we got or phones from. Is read the trashing of the ear bud quality here, and was expecting to toss them, but they are much improved over our old galaxy s3 earbuds, so we are using them now, and love them.
The sound on the note 4 with the new earbuds is definitely better than the sound on the old s3 with its earbuds. The only thing i hate is that volume excess warning you see when you have the earbuds plugged in.
There was an option to turn that of in cm11...is there and option to turn that warning off on the note 4?
Gareee said:
The sound on the note 4 with the new earbuds is definitely better than the sound on the old s3 with its earbuds. The only thing i hate is that volume excess warning you see when you have the earbuds plugged in.
There was an option to turn that of in cm11...is there and option to turn that warning off on the note 4?
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there isn't but it's standard across all custom Roms/ first thing done with xposed, because EVERYBODY hates it.. sigh can't wait for root
jayochs said:
then maybe you should rethink the title of your post next time, mmkay?
calm yourself, bud. there's plenty of threads around here about people complaining about not having the earbuds. another thread about it is just more wasted space on this forum. and fyi, there's not ONE place in your OP that states "i'm not complaining." perhaps you need to re-read your own postings before making comments like that. you created a thread just to tell us that you called people to ask about the earbuds, when you should clearly know that verizon reps don't know a thing and would have NO idea why verizon didn't include them, and that they offered $20 off your bill. i mean cmon dude, a thread about it wasn't really necessary. this could've been posted in any number of other threads already existing, including the large "verizon note 4 thread."
oh and don't worry, you came off like a complete ass and completely rude in your reply.
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Interesting. Using the General forum for general posts is not ok?
wow it good to you. sometime we must sound louder.