Database Users

Mains adaptor query

Appologies for duplicating this post here and on the accessories forum but needed a quick answer!
Anyone technically minded who can answer this....
I am using a HTC Touch Pro mains charger for my X1 (as it has a longer cable) which charges the X1 fully.
I did notice the back of the X1 getting a little warm, so double checked the outputs on the original X1 charger and the TouchPro one.
X1 = 5v 700mA
TouchPro = 5v 1A
Is this likely to be a problem?

You should definately not mix power adapters like that. On the other hand they both use mini-USB plugs so if they follow the USB standard (Battery Charging Specification) you are okay. The spec allows for up to 1,8 A, but that does not mean the X1 can take it.
I would have rather bought an extension cable for the X1 charger. Then you are safe _if_ anything happens and you damage your X1. :|

If you need a longer cable, just plug in a standard USB extension cable It will work perfectly and you can extend to plenty of meters if you need to.
Regarding the use of the 1A charger, I don't think it will be that much of a problem, but I wouldn't count on it to cause no problems either. The battery getting warm is not that odd when charging, as batteries generally generate heat when they get charged. The fact that it gets warmer with the 1A, instead of the 0.7A charger, is just because you charge the battery quicker, which in turn causes more heat. You should keep it mind though that heat is a bad thing for LiIon batteries like the X1 uses. Having it being warm reduces lifetime quicker then when it's cool.

maedox said:
You should definately not mix power adapters like that. On the other hand they both use mini-USB plugs so if they follow the USB standard (Battery Charging Specification) you are okay. The spec allows for up to 1,8 A, but that does not mean the X1 can take it.
I would have rather bought an extension cable for the X1 charger. Then you are safe _if_ anything happens and you damage your X1. :|
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for your help. I assumed - like you - that USB was USB in regards to power output. But I will take your advice and get an extension and stop using the old one.
Cheers
.

What I've seen on battery charging on mobile phones is that they have an internal intelligent charging system, at least the Siemens and Wavecom systems I've been using.
LiIon batteries are normally charged using constant voltage/constant current until a certain voltage level is reached, ~4.2V for 3.6V batteries. Then the charge current is reduced with a constant voltage until the charging current reaches zero. This implies that from a 5V charger there has to be some sort of internal charging system to make it work.
If you get a charger for USB it is the internal system that handles the current rate, not the charger. The specs on the charger shows the maximum current possible, not the charger's constant charge rate.
So if the phone's internal charging system thinks it's ok with 1A it will use it, but as mentioned earlier, it will produce more heat, but with a faster charging.
Though USB charging specs is limited to 1.8A, most charging circuits is possible to set to less current, with some part charging the battery, the rest powering the phone.

on8a said:
What I've seen on battery charging on mobile phones is that they have an internal intelligent charging system, at least the Siemens and Wavecom systems I've been using.
LiIon batteries are normally charged using constant voltage/constant current until a certain voltage level is reached, ~4.2V for 3.6V batteries. Then the charge current is reduced with a constant voltage until the charging current reaches zero. This implies that from a 5V charger there has to be some sort of internal charging system to make it work.
If you get a charger for USB it is the internal system that handles the current rate, not the charger. The specs on the charger shows the maximum current possible, not the charger's constant charge rate.
So if the phone's internal charging system thinks it's ok with 1A it will use it, but as mentioned earlier, it will produce more heat, but with a faster charging.
Though USB charging specs is limited to 1.8A, most charging circuits is possible to set to less current, with some part charging the battery, the rest powering the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks very much that's very informative.
I am wondering if the X1 has this internal intelligent charging system you mentioned. Would be useful to know.

Actually the mA ratings are what the charger can deliver. Not what they actually will deliver. A 700mA rated charger will supply up to 700mA if asked for by the device. This is a two way thing. The charger side will never provide more than it's maximum rating, it's a built in safety thing. The charged side should never ask for more than it can handle, providing that it is a well built piece of electronics. I trust the X1 to be well built on this. USB standards rate a maximum of 500mA for high power devices. The X1 does adapt and thus will charge slower.

Glad this is being discussed; as my X1 is a UK model, I don't have a US wall charger.
I found some on monoprice.com, see under the Power to USB section at the bottom:
http://www.monoprice.com/products/subdepartment.asp?c_id=103&cp_id=10311
They have 3 varieties:
High-Speed WALL Power to USB Female Converter (1000mah) - Black
High-Speed WALL Power to USB Female Converter (1000mah) - White
[**cant tell a discernable difference between those two, but one is larger...**]
WALL Power to USB Female CHARGER Converter - Black (500mah)
[**many people complaining about this not charging their devices; either it really does suck or they didnt get one with enough output**]
I WONT kill the phone picking up a 1000mah?
Anyone else in my situation needing a new US charger, this site has great prices on this stuff... these adapters are under 2 bucks, and USB cables are super-cheap too!

Nexus 10 looses battery life when charging

Hey this is a great tablet, but I noticed a bug and was curious if anyone else had this issue? When my screen is on max brightness and charging I noticed the battery will slowly lose charge. This becomes the most obvious if watching netflix or gaming. I hope someone can point me in the right direction of fixing this, unless of course it is a physical limitation of the device.
Edit: I have this problem when charging to a wall outlet, and when connected by usb. I am using the stock samsung charger. I understand the limitations of usb charging through a computer I am more suprised by the AC adapter connected to a home outlet not supplying enough current.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk 2

I have had this problem but only with brightness up and charging via computer.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using xda premium

Search the web I believe I read that this unfortunately is a problem with the device. Maybe it was attack of the show. I know I heard/read it somewhere.
Sent from my NookTablet using xda app-developers app

The Nexus 10 charges pretty slowly, so if it's using more power than it's getting, it's going to go down (though slower than if you weren't plugged in). Computers generally can't supply that much current, and most USB chargers are 1A. The stock charger is 2A, so use that when possible for faster charging.

rp181 said:
The Nexus 10 charges pretty slowly, so if it's using more power than it's getting, it's going to go down (though slower than if you weren't plugged in). Computers generally can't supply that much current, and most USB chargers are 1A. The stock charger is 2A, so use that when possible for faster charging.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The thing that you plug into a AC outlet is a power supply not a charger. The charger is in the N10. I've measured it with a current clamp meter and the N10 isn't even asking for half of the 2A that the power supply can deliver.

wptski said:
The thing that you plug into a AC outlet is a power supply not a charger. The charger is in the N10. I've measured it with a current clamp meter and the N10 isn't even asking for half of the 2A that the power supply can deliver.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Clamp meters generally aren't that accurate for such low amperage (obviously depends on the meter). In any case, the 2A supply can give enough for the battery to charge and for the device to be used concurrently. It may draw an amp just for charging, but that leaves another amp for the device to be used while maintaining peak charging speed.
This is all speculative, as I'm not 100% that the charging and device power usage is parallel.

Here's an easier way to determine N10 charging power that anyone can do. Get a Kill-A-Watt for $18 from Walmart, and plug the AC adapter into that. This doesn't directly tell you how much current the N10 pulls, but does allow you to infer charging current from the wattage pulled from the wall. You can then compare it with iPad 4 charging graph (in wattage) to determine N10 charging power as a percentage of iPad.
Below we see iPad 4 pulling a constant 13.6W for ~4hr before tapering off. iPad 4 uses the new 12W (2.4A) charger w/ Lightning connector. Assuming 80% conversion efficiency, it's about 10W (2A) going to iPad. iPad 4 averages 5-6hr for a full charge.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6472/ipad-4-late-2012-review/7
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iPad 4: Battery size = 42.5Whr, charge current = 2A, charge time = 6hr. N10 has 33.3Whr battery, and also averages 6hr. Assuming similar charging power curve, N10 would need to pull 2A * (33.3/42.5) = ~1.6A to achieve same charging time. So a measurement of less than 1A charging current is likely inaccurate, unless measurement was taken at the (tapered) tail end of the charging process.
Note 1: Per Anandtech, iPad also suffers from net-loss charging under heavy use, so the slow-charging issue stems from USB charging's limitation for high-capacity devices.
Note 2: Charging power may also be limited for thermal reasons. N10 already have a thermal throttling problem as it is, and faster charging would make this worse.

rp181 said:
Clamp meters generally aren't that accurate for such low amperage (obviously depends on the meter). In any case, the 2A supply can give enough for the battery to charge and for the device to be used concurrently. It may draw an amp just for charging, but that leaves another amp for the device to be used while maintaining peak charging speed.
This is all speculative, as I'm not 100% that the charging and device power usage is parallel.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's high quality amp meter using its 4000mA range. It's draw less than 1A total, so if the battery is at 80%, it's not charging it as fast as it can. It runs off the battery and the charger replaces the usage. If demand is high, more comes out of the battery than the charger is putting in, not because it can't get it from the PS either.
It could charge twice as fast but the N10's internal charger is slow.

Arg consensus says it's related to an internal charger limitation, no hope of a software fix? Well thanks for the responses.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk 2

e.mote said:
Here's an easier way to determine N10 charging power that anyone can do. Get a Kill-A-Watt for $18 from Walmart, and plug the AC adapter into that. This doesn't directly tell you how much current the N10 pulls, but does allow you to infer charging current from the wattage pulled from the wall. You can then compare it with iPad 4 charging graph (in wattage) to determine N10 charging power as a percentage of iPad.
Below we see iPad 4 pulling a constant 13.6W for ~4hr before tapering off. iPad 4 uses the new 12W (2.4A) charger w/ Lightning connector. Assuming 80% conversion efficiency, it's about 10W (2A) going to iPad. iPad 4 averages 5-6hr for a full charge.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6472/ipad-4-late-2012-review/7
iPad 4: Battery size = 42.5Whr, charge current = 2A, charge time = 6hr. N10 has 33.3Whr battery, and also averages 6hr. Assuming similar charging power curve, N10 would need to pull 2A * (33.3/42.5) = ~1.6A to achieve same charging time. So a measurement of less than 1A charging current is likely inaccurate, unless measurement was taken at the (tapered) tail end of the charging process.
Note 1: Per Anandtech, iPad also suffers from net-loss charging under heavy use, so the slow-charging issue stems from USB charging's limitation for high-capacity devices.
Note 2: Charging power may also be limited for thermal reasons. N10 already have a thermal throttling problem as it is, and faster charging would make this worse.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The AC current drawn by the charger doesn't infer the DC current. I have "AA" charger that charges at 7.5A(not a typo) and it doesn't draw 7.5A AC. I have a car battery charges at 2, 4, 10, 40A and car start at 100A and of course, a normal wall socket is limited to 20A max.
I'll have to check that again at a lower battery level to make it wasn't in the constant voltage part of the charging process.

I measured over 1800mA current draw with the screen on full and 2400mA with full brightness playing asphalt 7
I measured my tablet going from empty to full in 5.5 hours which makes current from the PSU around 1600mA
Looks to be that USB2 can't keep up with the power this tablet can consume when working flat out. Maybe they should have gone with USB3 as that can supply up to 5A

>The AC current drawn by the charger doesn't infer the DC current.
AC current isn't considered; I'm looking only at the wattage and assuming 80% conversion efficiency. We know that USB = 5V, so from there we can infer DC amperage. It doesn't make sense to use a 2+A adapter at less than 50% of its rated output, especially when the charging time is already a long ~6hr. Using iPad as a baseline provides another point of reference, which says that 6hr charging time is probably considered "normal" for this high-capacity category.
>Maybe they should have gone with USB3 as that can supply up to 5A
As said, higher thermal would be a problem for faster charging. The underlying issue is N10's high-res screen, which only the Exy 5 can drive at the time of design, and why the latter was selected (Duarte dude said as much in N10 promo clip). The screen+SoC combo requires more power than can be compensated for, in both its thermal envelope and its charging capacity.
Found the promo clip. Listen at the 9:46 mark, or click on the link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66-4uMQqerA&t=586

e.mote said:
>The AC current drawn by the charger doesn't infer the DC current.
AC current isn't considered; I'm looking only at the wattage and assuming 80% conversion efficiency. We know that USB = 5V, so from there we can infer DC amperage. It doesn't make sense to use a 2+A adapter at less than 50% of its rated output, especially when the charging time is already a long ~6hr. Using iPad as a baseline provides another point of reference, which says that 6hr charging time is probably considered "normal" for this high-capacity category.
>Maybe they should have gone with USB3 as that can supply up to 5A
As said, higher thermal would be a problem for faster charging. The underlying issue is N10's high-res screen, which only the Exy 5 can drive at the time of design, and why the latter was selected (Duarte dude said as much in N10 promo clip). The screen+SoC combo requires more power than can be compensated for, in both its thermal envelope and its charging capacity.
Found the promo clip. Listen at the 9:46 mark, or click on the link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66-4uMQqerA&t=586
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Watts=volts x current. 2A or 2.1A USB power supplies are a common size. Using a overrated PS isn't uncommon.

skally said:
I measured over 1800mA current draw with the screen on full and 2400mA with full brightness playing asphalt 7
I measured my tablet going from empty to full in 5.5 hours which makes current from the PSU around 1600mA
Looks to be that USB2 can't keep up with the power this tablet can consume when working flat out. Maybe they should have gone with USB3 as that can supply up to 5A
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How did you measuring the current?

I think some of the chargers are defective.
I bought a 3rd party usb power brick and it charges in about 5 hours.
The one that came with it took overnight.

OK what others are saying is that the issue is from the limitations of USB in general unable to exceed 1.8 amps. I guess we have to wait until a decent pogo charger comes out which is rumored to have 2amps. There are 3rd party ones being sold for around 24 bucks on ebay.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk 2

wptski said:
How did you measuring the current?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I calculated these numbers from usage data.
battery capacity / hours of use
screen on full brightness
9Ah / 5 hours = 1.8A
Playing Asphalt
9Ah / 3h 40 min = 2.4A
These numbers actually close to double with the screen on around 20% brightness
---------- Post added at 11:39 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:43 AM ----------
e.mote said:
As said, higher thermal would be a problem for faster charging.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are alternatives. Microsoft managed just fine with a 24w Charger. I suspect it runs at 12V 2A, but can't find any specs
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6385/microsoft-surface-review/9
ASUS also do something similar, using 15 Volts to lower the current and reduce energy lost in heat.

skally said:
I calculated these numbers from usage data.
battery capacity / hours of use
screen on full brightness
9Ah / 5 hours = 1.8A
Playing Asphalt
9Ah / 3h 40 min = 2.4A
These numbers actually close to double with the screen on around 20% brightness.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How can you get 2.4A from a 2.0Ah PS?
I retested making sure my battery was low enough, at 80% with it OFF, I got around 800ma. It isn't my meter but there is one posible flaw in my setup though. I'm using a USB extension cord and it may be causing a voltage drop because of the added lenght and skewing the reading.

The voltage drop should be negligible for a USB cable, and any minor deviations should be corrected via regulator in the Nexus 10.

rp181 said:
The voltage drop should be negligible for a USB cable, and any minor deviations should be corrected via regulator in the Nexus 10.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then my max 800ma charging rate is correct and skally's calculations are incorrect??

Question about the 5.3v charger

I don't know much about voltage and stuff, but with the 5.3v charger, I assume it's okay to use a 5v to charge the Note 3, it just might be a bit slower, correct?
Now what about using the 5.3v charger on the iPad Air? I can't find any info on its charger, or online, of what voltage it uses. will the 5.3v be too much for it or anything?

guttertrash said:
I don't know much about voltage and stuff, but with the 5.3v charger, I assume it's okay to use a 5v to charge the Note 3, it just might be a bit slower, correct?
Now what about using the 5.3v charger on the iPad Air? I can't find any info on its charger, or online, of what voltage it uses. will the 5.3v be too much for it or anything?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's perfectly fine to use 5v, that's standard. The voltage the wall adapter puts out is not what will determine your charge speed, its the amperage your device draws - which I believe is capped at 1800 mah for the note 3. It doesn't matter what the amperage is (it can be higher), but the note 3 will only draw 1800 mah max and lower if the source is lower. When it comes to the 5.3v charger, there's a bit of mixed information from what I've gathered. Plenty of people have used it with no problems considering .3v is a fairly small difference, but there will be some that tell you otherwise. I personally avoid 5.3v just because I have plenty of alternative chargers.

If the source is lower, it will increase the time it takes to charge. But 5.3 volts as an output will actually drop to 5 once it is loaded by your device. Just like 5 drops to about 4.7 when loaded by a device. The unloaded output of a charger is always higher than when it is connected.

It's the device that determines the amount of charge drawn, the numbers on the charger are just the max-charge it can provide. (Think of it like a car. Your engine can go up to 200Kph, but the actual speed is determined by how much you tell it to give you.)
I charge my Note 3 with my 15V Asus TF700 charger. It still only charges at the max the Note 3 can draw.
Essentially a 15V charger can safely provide the 5V, but a 5V charger can never provide the charge for a device which requires 15V.
Besides, a USB2.0 cable can't go over 5Volt anyway, so your iPad is safe.

ShadowLea said:
It's the device that determines the amount of charge drawn, the numbers on the charger are just the max-charge it can provide. (Think of it like a car. Your engine can go up to 200Kph, but the actual speed is determined by how much you tell it to give you.)
I charge my Note 3 with my 15V Asus TF700 charger. It still only charges at the max the Note 3 can draw.
Essentially a 15V charger can safely provide the 5V, but a 5V charger can never provide the charge for a device which requires 15V.
Besides, a USB2.0 cable can't go over 5Volt anyway, so your iPad is safe.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now I'm not trying to be rude or anything, but I think you have a few facts astray here. If you can prove me wrong I'll be happy to learn since it has been awhile since I took circuits. First off your right about the device being a big factor in the rate of charge, in fact technically the charger is in the device, the wall adapter is just the source. The source will force a certain voltage, i.e. 5v or 15v, and can provide up to a certain current (amperes). The charger in the device then determines how much of this current to draw.
With all that being said, the reason you can use your asus transformer charger is because it only forces 5v unless the transformer is plugged in at which point it kicks it up to 15v. So your not actually plugging a 15v source into your n3, if it were possible you'd be on thin ice. Also, I'm pretty sure you'd be able to charge your asus via say the note 3 charger (really slow though), probably not while its turned on, but turn it off leave it plugged in for a few hours and you should see a change.

A USB cable is just a wire, if you put 5.3V on it then your device receives 5.3V (minus voldage drop due to the resistance of the cable but that's negligible unless you're using a cheap thin cable). That said, 5.3V should be within tolerance for pretty much every USB charging device out there including the iPad (which I think uses a 5.3V charger itself).
Sent from my SM-N900T using xda app-developers app

Cool, good to know I wont fry either device. Thanks for all the help

Solarenemy68 said:
If the source is lower, it will increase the time it takes to charge. But 5.3 volts as an output will actually drop to 5 once it is loaded by your device. Just like 5 drops to about 4.7 when loaded by a device. The unloaded output of a charger is always higher than when it is connected.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Galaxy Note 3 have digital charger. so, I don't think undervolting is the case
Sent from Note 3

MILJANN said:
Galaxy Note 3 have digital charger. so, I don't think undervolting is the case
Sent from Note 3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not undervoltage. The resistance "R" of the USB cable is fixed (varies from cable to cable, but is constant for any single cable), so as the current load "I" increases the voltage "V" lost across the cable also increases, according to V = I*R.
Given a 5v source, loaded to 1800 mA, you would expect to see 4.7v at the phone's end of the USB cable. The resistance of the USB cable itself comes out to around 0.1666666 Ohms in that scenario, which is a perfectly reasonable value for the gauge wire used in those cords.

CalcProgrammer1 said:
A USB cable is just a wire, if you put 5.3V on it then your device receives 5.3V (minus voldage drop due to the resistance of the cable but that's negligible unless you're using a cheap thin cable).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Or using a long cable. With my (S5) 5.3V charger, i can finally use those 3M/10ft cables, which is really convenient for me

pizzaman79 said:
Or using a long cable. With my (S5) 5.3V charger, i can finally use those 3M/10ft cables, which is really convenient for me
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In lieu of using higher voltage chargers to use with long cables, you can also use chargers that provide more current @ 5V or, of course, lower resistance cables.

I'm afraid not. The voltage will drop too far below 5.0V, the device will not accept the offered power, no matter how high the charging current. That's both based on physics and personal experience. Resistance in cables is an issue at 10 metres, even those with high gauge copper cores.

Edit: Delete.

pizzaman79 said:
I'm afraid not. The voltage will drop too far below 5.0V, the device will not accept the offered power, no matter how high the charging current. That's both based on physics and personal experience. Resistance in cables is an issue at 10 metres, even those with high gauge copper cores.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are absolutely correct, however that isn't exactly what I was trying to share. I was trying to share a solution to situations where the charger cannot keep up and thus the voltage sags. I did not expect a 10metre situation. The longest I have is 5m. On my 5 metre cable, I don't notice any appreciable voltage drop from any of my chargers, so I generally consider it negligible. How much do you drop across 10 metres and at how many amps?
On a side note, I think the phone has some kind of safety when it comes to voltages. I just plugged in my 5.3V charger from my s5 into the s3 and it seemed to work fine. However, I also recently, and I only just realised this, plugged in a 7.2V supply to my S3 and though it did not charge, nothing bad seemed to happen. It was an off brand 5V USB Charger and when it died, it cranked up the voltage.

fusionstream said:
You are absolutely correct, however that isn't exactly what I was trying to share. I was trying to share a solution to situations where the charger cannot keep up and thus the voltage sags. I did not expect a 10metre situation. The longest I have is 5m. On my 5 metre cable, I don't notice any appreciable voltage drop from any of my chargers, so I generally consider it negligible. How much do you drop across 10 metres and at how many amps?
On a side note, I think the phone has some kind of safety when it comes to voltages. I just plugged in my 5.3V charger from my s5 into the s3 and it seemed to work fine. However, I also recently, and I only just realised this, plugged in a 7.2V supply to my S3 and though it did not charge, nothing bad seemed to happen. It was an off brand 5V USB Charger and when it died, it cranked up the voltage.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The voltage drop is dependant on gauge, copper quality and length. I never measured it at both ends but i estimate 0.3-0.5 volt based on what chargers do and don't charge what phones at 10ft. Note that i mixed up ft and metres lol, my cables are 3m. At that length voltage drop is an issue for me.
7v would perhaps be fine for a 10m cable I wish we knew the tolerance range of what voltages (at the usb in) common smartphones accept.

I think the reason the galaxy tab S tablets have a 5.3volt charger is to compensate a bigger voltage drop through the longer charging cable provided.
The voltage must be the correct voltage or near to it. I think from what others have said 5.3 is near enough to 5.0Volts.

F 0.95

Z3 Battery Charging Thread

Hiya,
I'm copying my original post over from the Z3 Compact forum as there should be a fair amount of similarities between the two models regarding battery charging.
Hiya,
I' hoping this is the right section to post this in.
I don't have my Z3C yet, but I've been searching for information on charging speed, charging current etc. - and there is barely anything to be found. What seems to be consent: A full charge (0-100%) takes about three hours. But then, some people say an almost full charge (0-90%) takes much less, as charging current is greatly reduced for the last 10% to reduce stress on the battery. Sony itself also claims that a small charge (something like 0-10%) should be quite fast as well.
Then there's some speculation about QuickCharge 2.0 being used or not used, that you could use a Motorola 2.0A charger to charge it faster than with the provided 1.5A Sony charger etc., which also brings up the question which resistor values on the D+ and D- wires are necessary to toggle different charging currents. (Or I might be stupid and there's a standard for that by now, which is the same for all Qualcomm devices.)
To cut it short: I'd request those who have a Z3C to post some comments about their charging times, and at best even their charging currents. I used an app called BatteryMonitor on my Desire HD, I'm sure there's others around now that give the same information. If someone could try out different chargers and record charging current over time, maybe even with a pretty graph, it'd surely help all future discussions about chargers, docks, modifications, DIY charging issues etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So, as the same goes for the Z3: If someone can record their charging times, charging current and charger used: Go ahead and post it. Bonus points for taking a look at magnetic charging.

dragonfet said:
Hiya,
I'm copying my original post over from the Z3 Compact forum as there should be a fair amount of similarities between the two models regarding battery charging.
So, as the same goes for the Z3: If someone can record their charging times, charging current and charger used: Go ahead and post it. Bonus points for taking a look at magnetic charging.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A recent tear down confirms the Qualcomm chip for Quick Charge 2.0 support, so what we need now is for someone to get a compatible PSU that can 'talk' to the phone and then supply more power. That should see a huge improvement in charge time.
I am just trying to find a source for a compatible charger. So far I've only seen the Motorola Turbo Charger in the USA, and I'd be wary of buying anything made by a no-name brand at this point.
I have to assume the magnetic charging option won't be as fast, simply as there can't be a way for the PSU to know it is connected to a compatible device. Quick Charge 2.0 appears to require some sort of handshaking, or else the PSU will limit the power output, hence why I'd be wary of any chargers appearing on eBay or Amazon that claim to offer fast charging.

jonmorris said:
A recent tear down confirms the Qualcomm chip for Quick Charge 2.0 support, so what we need now is for someone to get a compatible PSU that can 'talk' to the phone and then supply more power. That should see a huge improvement in charge time.
I am just trying to find a source for a compatible charger. So far I've only seen the Motorola Turbo Charger in the USA, and I'd be wary of buying anything made by a no-name brand at this point.
I have to assume the magnetic charging option won't be as fast, simply as there can't be a way for the PSU to know it is connected to a compatible device. Quick Charge 2.0 appears to require some sort of handshaking, or else the PSU will limit the power output, hence why I'd be wary of any chargers appearing on eBay or Amazon that claim to offer fast charging.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have read excellent reviews for the Blackberry Premium Charger (the one with the yellow tip), super cheap on Amazon right now. Recommended by Android Central and others for its 2A charging capability. I have used it in the past from my HTC One X days and have re ordered for my Z3. Honestly, my Z3 is charging more than fast enough with the OEM supplied charger, which may be less powerful but more optimised than another OEM's charger. The one I'd trust most if I was forced to use one would be the above model of the BB charger.

jonmorris said:
I have to assume the magnetic charging option won't be as fast, simply as there can't be a way for the PSU to know it is connected to a compatible device. Quick Charge 2.0 appears to require some sort of handshaking, or else the PSU will limit the power output, hence why I'd be wary of any chargers appearing on eBay or Amazon that claim to offer fast charging.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
more power can either be achieved through more voltage (that could potentially be harmful if the hardware is not compatible) or more current. More current is 100% save as the charging circuit just takes what it needs, independent of the (more potent) capabilities of the charger.
As Oppo showed with its find 7 just raising the current is a viable option which works. This is also a Snapdragon 801 device.

With the 1.5A original charger and cable, using Battery Monitor Widget shows the charging rate at around 900mA to 1000mA.
So I guess Z3 is restricting to max 1A charging?

jonmorris said:
I have to assume the magnetic charging option won't be as fast, simply as there can't be a way for the PSU to know it is connected to a compatible device. Quick Charge 2.0 appears to require some sort of handshaking, or else the PSU will limit the power output, hence why I'd be wary of any chargers appearing on eBay or Amazon that claim to offer fast charging.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Would it be possible that the PSU simply always limits the power output? For example, the phone might try to draw 1.5A, but the PSU doesn't support it and limits at 1.0A. Then magnetic charging could work with 1.5A or even 2.0A without the need for communication over the D+ / D- pins. (And attaching the magnetic port with a USB adapter to a PC or Laptop might cause the USB Port to shut down and trigger an overcurrent warning.)
AKK03 said:
With the 1.5A original charger and cable, using Battery Monitor Widget shows the charging rate at around 900mA to 1000mA.
So I guess Z3 is restricting to max 1A charging?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That would make sense. Though wonder where the extra 500 mA are going, it surely can't be the phone's standby. And given a typical maximum charging current of 1.0C (C = battery capacity), it would translate into 3.1A of charging current and therefore a 3.5A power supply.
Is this current constant from 1% to about 65%?

AKK03 said:
With the 1.5A original charger and cable, using Battery Monitor Widget shows the charging rate at around 900mA to 1000mA.
So I guess Z3 is restricting to max 1A charging?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If there are restrictions they are most likely within the Kernel and we may be able to change them in the future with custom Kernels

dragonfet said:
That would make sense. Though wonder where the extra 500 mA are going, it surely can't be the phone's standby. And given a typical maximum charging current of 1.0C (C = battery capacity), it would translate into 3.1A of charging current and therefore a 3.5A power supply.
Is this current constant from 1% to about 65%?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is some fluctuation, but is roughly around 1A.

I have test 2 different charger
from "Battery Monitor Widget Pro" logs
with EP880 (1.5A max)
show ...................... 1.1A max
with 2 Amp charger
show .....................1.5A max

maxx228 said:
I have test 2 different charger
from "Battery Monitor Widget Pro" logs
with EP880 (1.5A max)
show ...................... 1.1A max
with 2 Amp charger
show .....................1.5A max
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the results. I have my Z3 by now and recorded some as well.
From 0 to 68%, it charges with 1000-1100 mA, then it goes into CV (constant voltage) mode and stays there until 95%. Then the curent drops slightly. The rest of the charging curve is not usable, as it was the first full charge my handset had. And the last for now, as I have to send it back due to a gap in the frame and microphone issues.
I'll post a complete curve when I have the new one and did a few cycles. What's clear for now:
1. Charging current with the stock charger is around 1.1 A max.
2. The phone charges up to 95% with 0.5% per minute. (Stock Charger)
3. It drops to 0.125% between 95% und 100%, likely to put less strain on the battery.
It's nice to see that there's appearantly support for higher charging currents. Though we should keep in mind that a higher current also means more stress for the battery, especailly when the phone is used while charging (higher battery temperature as the CPU also adds heat).

my Z3 came with the charging dock dk48.. it is rated at 1.8a, charging is fast

I can't speak to the Z3 (yet), but my Z1s charges nearly twice as fast on the magnetic charging dock as it does through the USB connection. As a result, I can leave my screen on at full brightness while on the dock and still charge. I would *expect* similar behaviour from the Z3.

Original charger: about 1.0A - 1.1A. Result: 3h 50p - 4h for fully charged.
Magnetic charging dock or cable: 1.5-1.6A. Spend only 2h 45p
I'm tesing Xiaomi MI Power Banki 10400mAh. First test: 1.6A, much faster than original charger. A bit surprise!
http://www.mi.com/sg/mipowerbank/

Zanr Zij said:
Original charger: about 1.0A - 1.1A. Result: 3h 50p - 4h for fully charged.
Magnetic charging dock or cable: 1.5-1.6A. Spend only 2h 45p
I'm tesing Xiaomi MI Power Banki 10400mAh. First test: 1.6A, much faster than original charger. A bit surprise!
http://www.mi.com/sg/mipowerbank/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The original charger is rated 1.5A, actual charging on Z3 is 1.0A.
Xiaomi is rated 2.1A, so I guess is reasonable to expect 1.5A actual charging from it.
For your magnetic charging dock or cable, are you using the original charger?
With the original charger, I'm getting the same result with or without dock.

Zanr Zij said:
Original charger: about 1.0A - 1.1A. Result: 3h 50p - 4h for fully charged.
Magnetic charging dock or cable: 1.5-1.6A. Spend only 2h 45p
I'm tesing Xiaomi MI Power Banki 10400mAh. First test: 1.6A, much faster than original charger. A bit surprise!
http://www.mi.com/sg/mipowerbank/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
where did you get the magnetic charging cable?

AKK03 said:
The original charger is rated 1.5A, actual charging on Z3 is 1.0A.
Xiaomi is rated 2.1A, so I guess is reasonable to expect 1.5A actual charging from it.
For your magnetic charging dock or cable, are you using the original charger?
With the original charger, I'm getting the same result with or without dock.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With Mi Power Bank, I used micro USB cable, not magnetic.
I'm using Samsung Note 3 2.0A charger. Through micro USB port, I got lower current, about 1.0-1.2A but with magnetic cable 1.5-1.6A.
---------- Post added at 11:31 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:30 AM ----------
Shudder123 said:
where did you get the magnetic charging cable?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Included in my Z3 retail box

Zanr Zij said:
With Mi Power Bank, I used micro USB cable, not magnetic.
I'm using Samsung Note 3 2.0A charger. Through micro USB port, I got lower current, about 1.0-1.2A but with magnetic cable 1.5-1.6A.
---------- Post added at 11:31 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:30 AM ----------
Included in my Z3 retail box
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you mean the USB cable?

Shudder123 said:
you mean the USB cable?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My Z3 Dual retail box has 2 cables: usb and magnetic

Zanr Zij said:
My Z3 Dual retail box has 2 cables: usb and magnetic
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
where did you get yours from? mine only came with a USB cable

I have a z3 dual .. I did not notice the second cable in the box. I have to check again

G5 charging data with QC2.0 and QC3.0

There's a wall of text below, but you can skip all that here and just soak in my answers to some general interest questions. My data is presented below in case you want to bore yourself with the details.
See post #7 for QC3 data http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=66646418&postcount=7
1. Does using a micro-USB to USB-C adapter impede charging amperage, as measured by the Android OS?
No, actually not significantly at all. I'm somewhat surprised by this.
2. Does the LG charger work as fast as a certified QC2 charger?
Yes, pretty much.
3. Does AOD affect charging rates? With QC2, the amperage drops significantly if charging with the screen on, using the phone, etc. AOD probably is different, so let's prove it.
AOD does NOT appear to affect charging rates, though if the phone is charging in a bright environment it might.
4. What are some standard temperatures in these scenarios and at rest?
During charging, the highest my phone hits is ~31-32oC. With it plugged in but not delivering any amperage, it cools to ~23oC. At rest, unplugged, depending on ambient temps, it varies anywhere in the 20s.
5. What amperage does QC2 provide at max?
~3000mA, if the battery % is low enough. And not for very long. For comparison, on my G4, the max was about ~2400mA on QC2, 1800mA with a non-QC charger.
EDIT: I've found that the Android OS cannot accurately list amperage numbers. I think this is because it presumes all input will be at 5V. With QC2 and QC3, this is no longer the case. With my USB multimeter and a QC2 charger, the max amperage is ~2.4A, which slowly drops as the charging % increases.
6. How long does it take to fully charge the G5?
On QC2.0, 1 hour 20 minutes, from 0 to 100%.
There's been some discussion regarding charging rates and charging adapters on our newly released G5s. In the US, on T-Mobile, the phone comes with a QC2-style charger, "Fast Charge." I have read this is not exactly the same an official certified QC2 (I don't know how accurate that is though).
The QC2 standard supports 4 different modes, 5V/2A, 9V/2A, 12V/1.67A, and a 20v option. For comparison, QC3 has dynamic voltage, going from 3.2v - 20v.
The 'fast charge' adapter provided by LG supports the 9v and 5v modes, though the amperage is listed as 1.8A:
9.0V @ 1.8A or
5.0V @ 1.8A
In addition to the LG stock adapter, I also have a Tronsmart QC2 charger which is rated at 5V/2A, 9V/2A, and 12V/1.5A. http://www.amazon.com/Updated-Versi...direct=true&ref_=oh_aui_search_detailpage#Ask
In addition to the stock LG-provided USB-A to USB-C cable, I have some TechMatte micro-USB to USB-C converters, Benson approved. Everyone invested in Android has tons of micro-USB cords, but USB-C not so much. These cheap adapters help with the transition. They are the #1 sellers on Amazon and available here:
http://amazon.com/TechMatte-Connect...&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s00
With my 2 chargers and 2 cable set ups, I attempted to systematically document the charging using Battery Monitor Widget Pro (BMW Pro), a great app because it will log a host of stats with no user intervention. (This may not be as accurate as someone using external equipment like a Charger Doctor, but it's good enough for our purposes).
First, some general observations. The first day I had the G5 I did not activate the SIM, nor did I install all my apps. So overnight, it sat connected to wifi but not doing much else. Doze was able to get an impressive -5mA drain for much of the night. Not such a surprise since it wasn't trying to do much. This is without AOD.
Second, when the phone was going through its initial re-installation of my dozens of apps, it ran up to ~40oC. I don't think this is surprising, but it was good to nail down a number.
Third, the voltage tops out at 4400mV. The charger keeps drawing a decent mA for ~40 minutes after it hits 100%. Maybe some additional top-off juice?
Methodology - No phone interaction during the relevant measurement time. Kept whatever other background apps running. BMW Pro logged measurements every 10 minutes. Connected to wifi.
Scenario A - QC2.0 Tronsmart charger with LG-supplied USB-C cable. I would expect this to be the fastest since the charger has 3 modes to choose from (though the wattage from the 12V and 9V is technically the same) and there is no adapter to flow through.
This charging cycle data was collected after I ran my battery completely down. I then rebooted and plugged in the charger asap. This data shows the max amperage to be ~3000mA. This slowly decreases over time.
A simpler read of the charge rate data:
18% @ 10 min, 3063 ma
38% @ 20 min, 2866 ma
57% @ 30 min, 2653 ma
72% @ 40 min, 2025 ma
84% @ 50 min, 1484 ma
92% @ 60 min, 974 ma
97% @ 1:10, 538 ma
100% @ 1:20, 437 ma
Scenario B - Always on display with Tronsmart QC2.0 and USB-C cable. Does AOD change anything from Scenario A?
One thing I noticed is that the AOD is responsive to ambient lighting! So that definitely could alter whatever charging curve we record. This cycle was initially started at 0% in a room with some fading sunlight but no direct illumination. This run was hampered by the phone shutting down from a low battery at the very beginning of the cycle despite being plugged in! Maybe there was too much current demanded by the phone as it booted up and with the AOD on. So this run necessitated starting at ~2%. Hence a 2% 'bump' in the early data points.
Transcribing the data:
21% @ 10 min, 3017 ma
40% @ 20 min, 3065 ma
60% @ 30 min, 2654 ma
74% @ 40 min, 2022 ma
86% @ 50 min, 1482 ma
93% @ 60 min, 975 ma
97% @ 1:10 min, 537 ma
100% @ 1:20 min, 399 ma
Once again it takes 1:20 for a full charge. Despite the 2-3% variability on the lower end, the higher data points basically match Scenario A's. So I would conclude having AOD on does not affect charging times, though that could change if the phone was in a bright environment.
Scenario C - "Fast charge" adapter provided from LG, with micro-USB to USB-C adapter. I would have guessed this would be the slowest charge.
Starting amperage here was again ~3000mA. I didn't start this cycle at 0%, probably more like 25%, but the charging percentages coincidentally lined up remarkably well for a good comparison. (I'd want a 0% start cycle to really confirm this data which I may add in the future).
38% @ 10 min, 3065 ma.
58% @ 20 min, 2654 ma
72% @ 30 min, 2021 ma
84% @ 40 min, 1479 ma
92% @ 50 min, 974 ma
97% @ 60 min, 664 ma
100% @ 1:10 min, 419 ma
So even though the charging started at 25% battery (so obviously the time measurements can't line up), the % charged sample points line up for nearly direct comparisons to Scenario A. At each battery %, the mA are nearly identical. So I'm concluding there's very little mA loss from the adapter.
You might argue for 2 other scenarios here for full comparison, the QC2.0 charger with the adapter and the LG charger with the USB-C cable. Maybe in another update. Currently, I think Scenario A and C here would be the fastest and slowest, respectively, at charging, so showing there is no difference at the extremes makes the other 2 scenarios less important.

If you get a chance, can you try with screen on & verify if you see what I've found that QC3 charges then at 1A & QC2 at 0.3A above 35c & 0.6A when cooler than 35C.
If so, it confirms that the real tangible benefit of QC3 is if you charge with screen on frequently, eg in a car would see a big boon.
Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk

seems strange they have stepped away from the usual cc/cv li charging routine. is this a QC change?

I'm still in the midst of collecting data for the next presentation. There are a lot of permutations to go through, with a couple of cables and chargers.
In the meantime, I did confirm @stuart0001's observation that with the screen on, QC3.0 charges at ~1000mA, seen below (yellow band means screen on, green means AC power charging):
I didn't charge it all the way, just for ~30 minutes, but each measurement during that time did show the same charging amperage.
Also to add thoroughness, I have ordered a USB current/volt passthrough meter to more accurately report what happens.
More to come!

i find that the cheap as chips Samsung fast adaptive (2we version) charger you can get for around £5 on ebay works perfectly with the G5 and it recognises it as a fast charger.

waylo said:
I don't have a QC3 charger and I am debating if it is really worth it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's easier on the battery so you might get more life out of it.
QC2 charges as fast as it can then slows.
QC3 charges as fast as the phone will allow.
This can have a bearing on battery longevity. How much longer is debatable since you're still using QC which will be more stressful than non QC. The stock charger might not be QC but it is a fast charger and 1h30 is about std to from from empty to full with it.
See this post
less than a year and its replace battery time. Fortunately, not a big deal on LG's

QC3.0 data!
I have been working with 2 QC3.0 wall chargers with USB-A ports over the past couple of weeks. I’ve also purchased a USB voltmeter/ammeter to help with more measurements to understand our charging capabilities.
One charger is the ChoeTech QC3.0 18W USB Wall Charger, available here:
http://amazon.com/Charge-Charger-Co...&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00
The other is the Tronsmart WC1T 18W USB Wall Charger, available here:
http://www.amazon.com/Tronsmart-WC1...rue&ref_=ox_sc_sfl_title_1&smid=ALTVS0Q5KJ7M3
For full disclosure, I received both as free retail products courtesy of each company. They were both delivered via Amazon so they are the same as you’d get if you ordered them yourself.
I purchased for myself a very cheap USB multimeter, available here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/400963912153
It does okay. I then purchased a more reputable Drok multimeter, available here: https://www.amazon.com/DROK-Multime...true&ref_=ox_sc_act_title_1&smid=AFHAE9RJVUMB
Finally, ChoeTech provided a fairly capable USB multimeter of their own manufacture for my testing purposes.
Once again, my talking points first. Then a bunch of nitty gritty details afterwards if you so care.
1. Both QC3.0 chargers are made well and supply variable voltage, the main difference between QC3.0 and QC2.0.
2. The charging times for QC2.0 and QC3.0 are nearly identical!
3. The voltage used to attain these charging times, however, is much lower in QC3.0 than QC2.0. This will help with battery longevity.
4. We do NOT get the 80% in 35 minutes charging that is sometimes touted in QC3 ads. More like 65%. There are some reasons for this.
5. USB-C specification compliant USB-A to USB-C cables DO NOT limit our QC3.0 phone to 5V and 2.4A. This is safe per Qualcomm.
6. Our G5 phones seem to like ~6.5-7.0V charging voltage when used with a QC3.0 adapter. With our LG QC2-ish fast adapter it stays around 9V the whole time.
First, some relevant technical info re: USB-C standards vs QC3.0 charging.
QC3.0 is by definition not compliant with USB-C standards, because variable voltage is not allowed by the USB-C specification. So Nexus USB-C’s charging, which is adherent to USB-C spec, is not the same as Qualcomm QC3.0. You may have heard of Benson Leung, the Google engineer, who has set out to test USB-C devices and accessories. He does not endorse the G5 or the HTC 10 because they do not completely adhere to USB-C spec, but rather Qualcomm’s QC3.0.
Just because the cables are not USB-C spec does not mean that they are unsafe. To me, it really just means that USB-C spec devices may not be able to properly draw current from a power source when using a non-spec USB-C cable, which could damage the power source. Not exactly relevant to Qualcomm’s QC3.0. In fact, Qualcomm put out a statement to qualify this: http://www.androidcentral.com/qualcomm-addresses-usb-type-c-and-quick-charge-30-compatibility
The USB-C specs become a bit relevant when talking about USB-A to USB-C cables and adapters. Due to the circuitry required to make these spec, these cables and adapters are limited to 5V @ 2.4 A when used by USB-C spec devices. All the ones that Amazon sells now are USB-C standard compliant.
Based on my testing, however, this limitation does NOT extend to QC devices. We definitely get > 5V on my voltmeter testing. This was using both the LG-supplied USB-A to USB-C cable, as well as a Benson-approved USB-A to USB-C cable. The amperage measured with the USB volt/ammeter does not typically go >2.5A however. This may be more a reflection of the wattage rating of the chargers. They top out at 18W, and wattage = voltage * amperage. The top amperage their stats spout is 3A.
With the supplied LG fast charger (QC2.0-esque), it will hang out at 9V the entire time with the amperage starting out around 2A and then dropping as the battery fills.
I had stated previously in many places that the amperage tops out around ~3A early in the charging process, which is from data collected via the app Battery Monitor Widget (BMW). This is incorrect, due to the way the Android OS reports amperage. I have been informed that the Android OS amp data is based on 5V charging, so anything different from that (as we would see on QC2 and QC3) can result in erroneously high amperage readings.
I do not know if the LG supplied cord is spec because I do not have the equipment needed to test it (basically just a Nexus and the CheckR app). But I will be incorporating it into our test data to show you how it compares.
Here's a snapshot of the relevant stats printed on the adapters, with the Tronsmart on the left and the ChoeTech on the right:
One notable difference is that on the Tronsmart, the voltages are printed as variable, which is one of the major improvements to QC3.0. Interestingly, on the ChoeTech there is no mention of variable voltage. In my testing it does vary the voltage similarly, but my personal opinion is they are missing out by not advertising this on the label.
Other notable pros/cons:
1. The ChoeTech has a reversible USB-A port, so it doesn't matter which end is up. That's nice. It also comes with a USB-A to USB-C cord, though only 3 feet long.
2. The ChoeTech cable supplied is the same USB-A to C cable which has been reviewed and approved as USB-C spec by Benson Leung here: http://www.amazon.com/review/R3URN3...sb-20&linkId=9f4d7368af5d896b0482e4f62db75d06
ChoeTech support has confirmed this personally.
3. The TronSmart comes with a longer cord, but unfortunately it’s USB-A to micro-USB. It’s too bad it’s micro-USB, because I’m not aware of any QC3 phones that use microUSB. So you’ll need an adapter or a different cord.
First up, the ChoeTech.
@stuart0001 has posted an earlier review of the ChoeTech UK version, seen here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/lg-g5/accessories/choetech-qc-3-0-18w-wall-charger-t3356038. Interestingly, he found that the charge rates were exactly the same as his LG fast charger if the screen was off. There were some situations were QC3 charging was much better with the screen on at high temperatures.
For the first ChoeTech test run, I used the LG-supplied cable.
Top off amperage was applied for an additional 30-40 minutes after hitting 100%.
I repeated this with the ChoeTech Benson approved cable and found identical results.
Onto the Tronsmart. I used the G5 supplied LG cable first.
Repeating the cycle with the ChoeTech Benson approved cable gave nearly identical data.
Comparing side by side by side the QC2.0 data with the QC3.0 data:
So very intriguing. Just like with @stuart0001 's analysis, the charging times did not differ much at all from QC2.0 charging!
But there’s more to this than just the charging times. Using my voltmeter, the voltage for each charger is a bit different. Using the LG fast adapter, the voltage hangs around 9V for the entire duration with the amperage slowing decreasing.
Using QC3.0, voltage ranged between 6.3 - 8.3V, with amperage maxing at 2.7A.
(Note the nonstandard charging time data points. The voltmeter does not have any logging capability, so I physically had to check on it throughout the hour+. Sometimes I had things to do )
QC3.0 advertises 80% fill in 35 minutes for QC3.0, compared with 65% for QC2.0. We don’t really see this though. Possible reasons?
1. The phone has preset charging parameters that won’t let us go that fast. A Tronsmart support person has told me that the G5 likes 6V as its optimal charging level. We do see this on the voltmeter results much of the charging cycle. I believe this is set in the kernel programming.
2. The 18W rating on the chargers tested won’t allow for greater amperage or voltage. There are 24W chargers out there.
3. The USB-A port on the chargers have some limit? Would love to test a USB-C port QC3.0 charger (I think there’s only one on Amazon right now).
4. There is some sort of charging limitation in the USB-A to USB-C cable after all.
More ideas to think about.
EDIT:
Attempts to monitor charging voltage/amperage of the USB-A to micro-USB with USB-C adapter result in repeat disconnects and reconnects.
I think the amperage and voltages are too high for the connected USB meter to measure and pass through.
EDIT 2:
I purchased a more reputable USB meter and it works now. The cheap one would throw a fit and reset/cut off charging when the voltage or amperage hit its upper limits. I may re-test some of the voltage measurements in the future.

@waylo Thanks for that excellent write up.
Picking up on the Qualcomm advertised estimate. It's disingenuous at best (I'd say they're being fraudulent) . They state in small print that it's based on the 0-50% current, so how they can justify extrapolating that instead of using the actual time is beyond me.
https://www.qualcomm.com/products/snapdragon/quick-charge
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Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk

Haha, that is very very sneaky of them. Seriously, why don't just extrapolate the first 20 minutes (40% then) and say it'll be full in 45 minutes then?
Getting some weird results on the USB meter trying to measure QC3.0 through USB-A to USB-micro cable with a USB-C adapter on it. Do you have one to try with your voltmeter?

waylo said:
Haha, that is very very sneaky of them. Seriously, why don't just extrapolate the first 20 minutes (40% then) and say it'll be full in 45 minutes then?
Getting some weird results on the USB meter trying to measure QC3.0 through USB-A to USB-micro cable with a USB-C adapter on it. Do you have one to try with your voltmeter?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes I have. I can have a look later. Something else I've noticed occasionally, but need to try & repeat, is that even different USB-A to C cables are giving quite wildly different voltages on the same charger.
Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk

waylo said:
With the supplied LG fast charger (QC2.0-esque), it will hang out at 9V the entire time with the amperage starting out around 2A and then dropping as the battery fills.
Now, I have stated in many places that the amperage tops out around ~3A early in the charging process, which is from data collected via the app Battery Monitor Widget (BMW). So there is a bit of a discrepancy here. I have been a big advocate for BMW over other apps, due mostly to its passive logging. The dev of BMW has emailed me saying the mA is provided by the Android OS using a current sensor. So as of now, I don’t have a good explanation for how I routinely get ~3A charging amperage logs for the first 20 minutes while my ammeter does not show that draw. Could be a cheap (certainly) and inaccurate (don’t know) ammeter for all I know.
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Am more likely to trust those cheap meters because they have proven to be invaluable in diagnosing charging problems with older devices. Software based tools proved to be not very useful with fault finding.
So getting 3A in software and the meter reading 2A implies an error of 50% with the meter. That is way too high an error. Don't believe it.
It's good to have both as a check but i'd side with the meter. It isn't faulty.
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stuart0001 said:
@waylo Thanks for that excellent write up.
Picking up on the Qualcomm advertised estimate. It's disingenuous at best (I'd say they're being fraudulent) . They state in small print that it's based on the 0-50% current, so how they can justify extrapolating that instead of using the actual time is beyond me.
https://www.qualcomm.com/products/snapdragon/quick-charge
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Usual BS claims in the tech industry...once people start poking around the real picture emerges.

One Twelve said:
Am more likely to trust those cheap meters because they have proven to be invaluable in diagnosing charging problems with older devices. Software based tools proved to be not very useful with fault finding.
So getting 3A in software and the meter reading 2A implies an error of 50% with the meter. That is way too high an error. Don't believe it.
It's good to have both as a check but i'd side with the meter. It isn't faulty.
---------- Post added at 08:16 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:08 AM ----------
Usual BS claims in the tech industry...once people start poking around the real picture emerges.
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It's a trick one. However the reported values in apps seem in step with the % gain and battery capacity. ie it's 2800mAh capacity so at 3A you'd expect 50% charge in 28 minutes which is what you get.
Also, the meter reports output but won't account for usage drain & won't give the net +ve charge current the battery is actually receiving.
It comes down to the correct measure for capacity should be watt hours. I suspect the software reports must be using a fixed internal volt number & applying that to the received watts to give a mA figure.
Ultimately, if we think of the mA software #s as really a relative guidance simply on how fast it'll fill 2800, it's as good as any real life measure
http://www.goalzero.com/solarlife/2...-question-of-battery-capacity-in-electronics/
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYx6GW-HaVg
4:30 onwards.
Says he got from 5% to 91% within an hour with the stock charger..
That would be faster than QC2.

One Twelve said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYx6GW-HaVg
4:30 onwards.
Says he got from 5% to 91% within an hour with the stock charger..
That would be faster than QC2.
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That's bull**** I reckon
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stuart0001 said:
That's bull**** I reckon
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From the last page.
At 90 within the hour.
2. Does the LG charger work as fast as a certified QC2 charger?
Yes, pretty much.
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One Twelve said:
From the last page.
At 90 within the hour.
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I stand corrected. ?
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So is there any need to get additional chargers and cables ? What compelling arguments can be made to support that.
why not just use what came in the box
I don't believe LG would intentionally supply a charger & cable that could be harmful to the G5 despite what Benson Leung says.

Regarding the current discrepancies.
I put my phone in aeroplane mode & killed all running apps room minimise background draw.
If I multiply the Amps by Volts of both meter & 3C app (mV/1000) to get Watts, I'm generally getting a fairly consistent 15% higher on the meter. This is likely due to adapter compensating for efficiency loss of the cable & some draw used by background apps.
So both methods appear to be accurate in their own way.
I'd say the meter is good to assess it's maximum wattage & the voltage range but if you want to know how quick it charges the phone, software is best.
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---------- Post added at 07:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:04 PM ----------
One Twelve said:
So is there any need to get additional chargers and cables ? What compelling arguments can be made to support that.
why not just use what came in the box
I don't believe LG would intentionally supply a charger & cable that could be harmful to the G5 despite what Benson Leung says.
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If you use the phone a lot whilst charging, above 32c with screen on, QC 3.0 is significantly faster. In fact I've seen QC 2.0 not even be able to supply enough for a net positive current.
For me, after seeing the results, in car at least is a must for QC 3.0.
Screen off they are near identical.
The voltage granularity of QC 3.0 may mean slightly prolonged battery longevity but no really an issue when we can swap batteries anyway.
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stuart0001 said:
[MENTION=2562936]https://www.qualcomm.com/products/snapdragon/quick-charge
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Says its a 1.5C charge. But only upto 50%.
Compare with this graph from here.
if you can charge the battery completely in 1 hour its a 1C charge.
But the table above indicated it took 80 minutes to completely charge. Implying its less than 1C charge for the total.
Then there is the discharge bit. Can anyone kill their battery in 1 hour ? that's a 1C discharge.
I don't know anybody that can do that. The fastest i've seen is dead in 1h30 with 4k video. 1% an hour. Still not a 1C discharge.
Am beginning to think fast charge, quick charge some other speedy charge per se ain't doing anything bad for the battery
What is more likely to do it is operating temperature.
All batteries achieve optimum service life if used at 20°C (68°F) or slightly below. If, for example, a battery operates at 30°C (86°F) instead of a more moderate lower room temperature, the cycle life is reduced by 20 percent. At 40°C (104°F), the loss jumps to a whopping 40 percent, and if charged and discharged at 45°C (113°F), the cycle life is only half of what can be expected if used at 20°C (68°F).
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stuart0001 said:
If you use the phone a lot whilst charging, above 32c with screen on, QC 3.0 is significantly faster. In fact I've seen QC 2.0 not even be able to supply enough for a net positive current.
For me, after seeing the results, in car at least is a must for QC 3.0.
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One Twelve said:
Says its a 1.5C charge. But only upto 50%.
Compare with this graph from here.
if you can charge the battery completely in 1 hour its a 1C charge.
But the table above indicated it took 80 minutes to completely charge. Implying its less than 1C charge for the total.
Then there is the discharge bit. Can anyone kill their battery in 1 hour ? that's a 1C discharge.
I don't know anybody that can do that. The fastest i've seen is dead in 1h30 with 4k video. 1% an hour. Still not a 1C discharge.
Am beginning to think fast charge, quick charge some other speedy charge per se ain't doing anything bad for the battery
What is more likely to do it is operating temperature.
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You're probably right. For me, because I can replace the battery, being able to charge quickly in the car is more important than longevity.
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