Dark video looks bad - Nexus 7 (2013) General

Anyone else notice this? I took some pictures comparing my iPad Mini (left) vs Nexus 7 2013 (right). The first attachment is from YouTube F4bnVZmdOKs @ 5:31 - notice the splotchiness in the darkest areas. The second is from G-R8LGy-OVs @ 3:56 - notice the halos around the stars. When I watch on my computer (HP LP2065 IPS LCD) it looks much more like the iPad's display.

Looks like video compression blockiness that you don't see on the iPad because of the horrible black levels. If you look at a black still picture do you see the splotches?

Dimethyl said:
Anyone else notice this? I took some pictures comparing my iPad Mini (left) vs Nexus 7 2013 (right). The first attachment is from YouTube F4bnVZmdOKs @ 5:31 - notice the splotchiness in the darkest areas. The second is from G-R8LGy-OVs @ 3:56 - notice the halos around the stars. When I watch on my computer (HP LP2065 IPS LCD) it looks much more like the iPad's display.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with the above poster, the splotchiness is video compression artifacts, and if you look past them, and take a step back, you'll actually see that you're getting much more detail and a better gamma on the N7 vs. the iPad. On the iPad side, the woman is completely black, yet on the N7, you can see her face and clothing detail that are simply missing on the iPad.
I would guess that the halos around the stars are similarly missing information on the iPad. With the N7, you're getting the whole picture.

That ipad mini picture is terrible. Talk about crushing blacks. ..... Look at the detail in the nexus picture. I hope your TV is not calibrated like the mini.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using xda app-developers app

I think its due to the high DPI. Try any HD video.

Actually the iPad Mini is quite terrible with the loss of dark details.

oh god that ipad looks awful dude.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

there's probably a video player out there that supports gamma adjustment if it's not to your liking.in a specific video. it's hard to tell from that picture how black crushing the ipad is but some would find it looks "better" when the video is of poor quality. one thing you might want to do is adjust the backlight first (no need to do it global if you've got something like mx player) as the new N7 is supposed to be very bright. in the old n7 you can get away with making mx player always use max brightness because the maximum brightness isn't very high.

Good points. I attached a comparison of the black level test from Lagom. On the Nexus 7 I can see the 1 square easily. On the iPad Mini I can see the 5 square fairly well and the 4 just barely (IRL; hard to tell from the picture). The brightness setting for this and the previous comparisons was 25% on the Nexus 7 and around 55-60% on the iPad Mini. The subjective brightness was similar.

I borrowed an iPad 3 (Retina) to do some more testing. This time to eliminate any variables with video streaming I downloaded the 720P MP4s on my computer and captured stills with VLC. I used Chrome on both Android and iOS to view the images. Same videos as before, roughly the same scenes. The first 2 attachments show the comparisons: iPad 3 on the top, and Nexus 7 2013 on the bottom.
The 3rd attachment is the black level test on the iPad 3. I can clearly see square 2 and if I stare enough I can faintly detect square 1 (IRL; hard to tell from the picture again). The 4th attachment is a comparison of a full white image to show that the brightness is matched fairly closely (easier to tell if you convert to greyscale to ignore white balance differences) - 25% on the Nexus and just a hair above 50% on the iPad.
The 5th and 6th attachments are the source images I used for testing. I converted from PNG to JPG to make the attachments fit, not that it matters much since it's from a lossy source.
I still get the feeling that something isn't right about the way the Nexus looks. I was able to simulate the effect almost identically by applying gamma correction of 1.6 in IrfanView. That would seem to indicate that the Nexus's gamma may be way off, but after I finally found a way to view Lagom's gamma test image without scaling on the Nexus it looked pretty much spot-on correct. It it possible that only the very dark areas are "shifted" in a way that wouldn't affect the gamma test image?
This leads to the last attachment - a new black level test on the Nexus. Again, the brightness was calibrated similarly to the iPad, and the camera was set on full manual mode with all the same settings, so you can directly compare it to the iPad black level test image. Notice how the squares get brighter way faster than on the iPad? It's a lot more pronounced in the darkest squares, but the difference shrinks by the time you get up to the 40 square (last one before full white).

For my final test, I took pictures of Lagom's contrast test image on the Nexus 7 2013 and iPad 3. I then applied a Gaussian blur, converted to greyscale, and determined the RGB value for the first 13 bars. The first attachment is a chart of the results. The brightnesses converge around the 10th bar (RGB = 79 in the source image), but before that the Nexus's brightness is inflated. This explains why the gamma test looked fine, because even in the 10% luminance test, the RGB value of the ideal point is 88. The 2nd and 3rd attachments are the Nexus and iPad (respectively) displaying the test image.

you should bring all this to the "yellow tint" thread. this is a nice showcase on what's wrong with Nexus screen.

I recently purchased an X-Rite i1Display Pro display calibrator. I used it to make really accurate luminance measurements* of the Nexus 7 (2013) and iPad Mini while displaying shades of gray from 0 to 255 in steps of 5. I then calculated the effective gamma** at each step to create the attached chart. It also includes the effective gamma of the reverse sRGB transformation.
My conclusion is that the Nexus is fine if sRGB is the ideal target. I'm not sure what the ideal target is though; in fact, I don't really think there is one. A display gamma calibration of 2.2 to 2.4 seems like the most common recommendation. But almost everyone ignores the fact that sRGB's effective gamma is a lot lower in darker areas. I get the feeling that most people calibrate to a fixed target. sRGB is probably more technically correct. But if fixed 2.2 to 2.4 is more common, does that make it a de facto standard? E.g. if professional movie studios edit their movies on monitors calibrated to fixed gamma, but I watch it with sRGB gamma, doesn't that mean I'm not viewing it as intended by the creator? I'm not saying this is necessarily the case. I'm really, really confused .
So anyway, I just wanted to share my results. You will have to draw your own conclusions.
* I used spotread.exe from Argyll with the -x swtich. The first number from the "Yxy" result is luminance in cd/m^2.
** Effective gamma meaning: the gamma value you'd have to use to get the same luminance value from the input value. Formula is log(luminance) / log(input), where luminance and input are percentages from 0 to 1. I adjusted the luminances to account for non-perfect black levels.

mannequin said:
you should bring all this to the "yellow tint" thread. this is a nice showcase on what's wrong with Nexus screen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would say the iPad is just warmer (red) and the N7 looks more cooler (greenish-blue) Not by much though, just a few degrees off. No one device is perfect.
With the dark areas, it seems the brightness and/or gamma is too high. I use my screen at half brightness which seems on par with other devices and haven't noticed a big difference.
Hopefully we get a screen calibrator like on the N4 and can make adjust individual adjustments.
Sent from Nexus 7 FHD from XDA Premium HD

Dimethyl said:
My conclusion is that the Nexus is fine if sRGB is the ideal target...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
all the measurements that you did are only true to the device that you own. the screens in the wild would differ (sometimes drastically) from yours and from one another.

I totally agree with you. I also see lots of artifacts with any dark scene on my 2013 Nexus 7. It doesn't matter if I am playing a higher resolution (HD) scene or lower resolution one. I wish there was a way to fix that.

Dimethyl said:
I recently purchased an X-Rite i1Display Pro display calibrator. I used it to make really accurate luminance measurements* of the Nexus 7 (2013) and iPad Mini while displaying shades of gray from 0 to 255 in steps of 5. I then calculated the effective gamma** at each step to create the attached chart. It also includes the effective gamma of the reverse sRGB transformation.
My conclusion is that the Nexus is fine if sRGB is the ideal target. I'm not sure what the ideal target is though; in fact, I don't really think there is one. A display gamma calibration of 2.2 to 2.4 seems like the most common recommendation. But almost everyone ignores the fact that sRGB's effective gamma is a lot lower in darker areas. I get the feeling that most people calibrate to a fixed target. sRGB is probably more technically correct. But if fixed 2.2 to 2.4 is more common, does that make it a de facto standard? E.g. if professional movie studios edit their movies on monitors calibrated to fixed gamma, but I watch it with sRGB gamma, doesn't that mean I'm not viewing it as intended by the creator? I'm not saying this is necessarily the case. I'm really, really confused .
So anyway, I just wanted to share my results. You will have to draw your own conclusions.
* I used spotread.exe from Argyll with the -x swtich. The first number from the "Yxy" result is luminance in cd/m^2.
** Effective gamma meaning: the gamma value you'd have to use to get the same luminance value from the input value. Formula is log(luminance) / log(input), where luminance and input are percentages from 0 to 1. I adjusted the luminances to account for non-perfect black levels.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow....I just look at my screen. It looks nice.
Not sure WTF all that shizz you posted is about. 250 device = 250 device. /shrug

Mine's right about fine xD .

Related

Epic video calibration

Being a home theater enthusiast and calibrating every hdtv I've got me thinking if its possible on android too. And I don't mean the sensitivity or the like. I mean video as in color and brightness. I watch alot of videos and to my experience both are off. Brightness is way too low you can't make out details in dark scenes. Some would say the color is oversaturated... it isn't. Brightness is too low making colors seem this way. A few notches in the brightness scale should take care of it. Anyone know if its possible?
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Try manually setting your brightness settings in SETTINGS->DISPLAY->BRIGHTNESS?
I'm a professional video editor and I'm not THAT crazy about having perfect settings for watching video on my phone. Why? I'm usually not in ideal viewing conditions to watch an internet quality video for a few moments on a 4 inch screen with a dinky mono speaker.
Although, I know a few Apple Engineers in Cupertino that are REAL geeks that put bars and tone on their iPhone to just show off.
RushAOZ said:
Being a home theater enthusiast and calibrating every hdtv I've got me thinking if its possible on android too. And I don't mean the sensitivity or the like. I mean video as in color and brightness. I watch alot of videos and to my experience both are off. Brightness is way too low you can't make out details in dark scenes. Some would say the color is oversaturated... it isn't. Brightness is too low making colors seem this way. A few notches in the brightness scale should take care of it. Anyone know if its possible?
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://project-voodoo.org/color
It's in vision kernel.
I was thinking of having my Windows desktop show on my Epic's screen using a VNC client. Plop the colorimeter on the Epic, and run the color calibration software on Windows. That would generate an ICC profile for the Epic's screen.
The next question though is how do I get the Epic to apply the ICC profile?
And in case you're curious, my colorimeter measured 7730-7740 K for pure white on the Epic's screen. So yes, it's rather blue.
Yea, nothing personal to the OP, but the colors are most definitely oversaturated. Has nothing to do with the brightness. Samsung, being a display manufacturer as well as a phone manufacturer, has display manufacturer tendencies. One of which is to oversaturate color on a display in order to give a "wow factor" to indiscriminate purchasers who generally assume that brighter and more vivid are better. Every amoled display used on a phone to date has had blooming out the wazoo. Not to mention how ridiculous skin tones look in photographs. I also wish there were a way to calibrate these things. I use a Thunderbolt which is now exhibiting some of the same issues with it's SLCD screen. Although I'm pretty sure that all they did was take the screens used on the EVO and pump up the color saturation. Guessing that's internally what the "S" stands for. The whites are nicer on the thunderbolt though, so at least I get that I guess.

Possible Display Calibration Correction?

"Many of the images were noticeably washed out -- they looked like over exposed photographs with missing highlights, reduced image contrast, and weak colors," Soneira wrote.
But I was curious why these shortcomings weren't showing up in reviews -- and why Soneira seemed to be contradicting himself when he told me that the display itself was "high quality." So, I asked him to clarify this.
Here's what he said.
The LCD panel itself is excellent. Good luminance, high Contrast Ratio, excellent Color Gamut and Color Saturation. So the raw LCD display itself is great. The problem is that the factory calibration of the display parameters (generally performed via firmware) is way off (particularly the Intensity Scale) so the images that appear on this fine LCD display look washed out...the display produces washed out images and colors in spite of the fact that it has a display with excellent color saturation and contrast. Similarly, a great camera will take poor quality photos if it isn't properly factory calibrated.
He expands on particulars in the blog post.
There is about a 25 percent compression of bright image content, which is quite substantial. This holds for both the Gallery Viewer and the Chrome Browser. On some cheap displays this is done intentionally by the manufacturer because the compression actually makes them appear artificially bright. Here I think it's probably just incompetence by the manufacturer, which is too bad because they messed up a really nice display.
I also want to know about this. The contrast seems very low to me. This display can do better than what it's currently set at.
Wrong thread ?
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda premium
I have some faith that when morfic makes a trinity kernel for the n7 that some of this will be rectified. Unfortunately, his order was held up. I guess the first step is to find out what code is tweak able in the kernel to actually do this.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
I believe I saw a mod which corrected some of the Galaxy Nexus dislpay shortcomings by calibrating it a bit differently. I wonder if the same could be said for the Nexus 7. @piam, I don't know why the reviewers never mentioned this in their reviews, but that's the first thing I noticed when I opened up my Nexus 7, and that was on the stock wallpaper that was on.
I just hope that someone gets a mod out soon, cause its a really great tablet looking cheap just because of the washed out colours.
I find that the home screen is not well optimized but Netflix is looking pretty good. I also find that lowering the brightness helps...which does indicate a calibration issue.
Its pretty good already though...almost quibbling.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
mike infinity said:
I find that the home screen is not well optimized but Netflix is looking pretty good. I also find that lowering the brightness helps...which does indicate a calibration issue.
Its pretty good already though...almost quibbling.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've noticed while using YouTube as well. If play videos on my Galaxy Nexus side by side with my Nexus 7, the colors look washed out. Probably there will be a kernel fix.
christophermx4 said:
I've noticed while using YouTube as well. If play videos on my Galaxy Nexus side by side with my Nexus 7, the colors look washed out. Probably there will be a kernel fix.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hopefully software can fix it, if it's a firmware problem.
Anybody knows about today status ?
We need official or not official update for our nexus 7 device!
Asus must give us possibilities for change white color compession!!!
christophermx4 said:
I've noticed while using YouTube as well. If play videos on my Galaxy Nexus side by side with my Nexus 7, the colors look washed out. Probably there will be a kernel fix.
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Click to collapse
Well it would, the GN is oled which would make any lcd look rubbish
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda premium

The black clipping on the Note is a Software Issue. CONFIRMED! Check this out!

Today,I was playing around with my Note, still worried about the black clipping and blocky videos changing ROM after ROM and didnt find any solution.
Out of curiosiry, I copied the GammaTest image to my PC, went to my display adapter settings, and cranked up the gamma from 1.0(default) to 1.5-1.9 and guess what?
http://imageupload.org/en/file/235342/gamma-normal.jpg.html
The first image shows the gammatest as it should. Here the computer's default gamma is set to 1
I increased my gamma value to 1.5-1.9 and this is the result.
http://www.imageupload.org/en/file/235344/gammahigh.jpg.html
And when setting the gamma to highier values, play all your test videos and images, there will be clipping and blocky pixellation just like you see on the Note. Try this for yourself on your PC.
This clearly shows that the clipping on the note is a software issue rather than a hardware defect and if we could somehow get to tune the gamma on the note, its the END of all the clipping and the horrible video playback.
A point to note is, when increasing gamma values, the images tend to become artificially bright and on reducing them, they tend to get darker. Maybe this explains why the Note produces the best whites as far as AMOLED displays are concerned and seems to be brighter than all the other Galaxy devices which includes, the Galaxy S, S2 and S3.
So the only and truly effective solution is to find a way to tune gamma values under the MDNIE settings and this should be implemented in a kernel. I've seen none so far which is capable of doing this. All CM9 based ROMS have Gamma control disabled under MDNIE settings. This also explains why the same problems were corrected on the Google Nexus with the LEAN Kernel.
This is definitely a GAMMA issue and definitely Software related.
I may be wrong, please do feel free to correct me if so.
Although I do agree (in my non-expert and in this regard completely worthless opinion) it is probably a software issue, this does not confirm whether our Notes' black crush is caused by software or hardware, or if it is fixable. This only means that you can make your display crappy by cranking up the gamma too high. The same result can be achieved in different ways.
I still dont understand the gamma test picture.. Which numbers should be seen? I see 4 to 21 perfectly and can barely see 3.. Should 2 and 3 be seen too?
Sry if I went off topic..
First of all, the image should be quite dark to see in a lit environment and on an ideally calibrated display, the image show a gradual fade to black. So theoritically speaking, on a good display, the left side is barely visible and is seen as a dark gray fading to black.
On the stock ICS kernels, the image is seen upto 4 and then clips to black. If you enable, Force GPU acceleration, you can see upto 1 which means more clipping. On stock GB, you can see all the way to 1. It varies from kernel to kernel.
We just need some way to access the gamma control under MDNIE settings on the Note which is at present, disabled on the CM9 kernel and is not present on any other kernels either.
When you wrote "CONFIRMED" i thought there was some quote from Samsung saying it was a software issue and they were looking into it
I had mailed GSMArena regarding this issue and even after they published it and many other blogs too, Samsung didnt give a damn about it. So I dont think they do now either. The EMMC Bug is more of a fatal issue and to date, even after announcing that they are "working" on a fix, there are none. People are literally bricking from the latest stock when all the other custom kernels have disabled the MMC_CAP_ERASE value from their kernels. So its better not to rely on Samsung for anything. They just sell their phones and thats it. The Note and everything alike are experimental phones and we are their lab rats. They basically only focus on the flagship Galaxy Phone. read GS3 and new ways to sell it.
satishp said:
We just need some way to access the gamma control under MDNIE settings on the Note which is at present, disabled on the CM9 kernel and is not present on any other kernels either.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah because we have a unique display that is different from the I9100/I777 - so display tweaks for those won't work on N7000.
Sent from my GT-P7510 using Tapatalk 2
problem
1) Seriously guys, we have to get to the root of this problem. If we can get to the gamma setting on this display we can solve the problem. But how hard can it be to get there?
2) On the other hand, i think that what you did, was change the gamma on an LCD display. As far as I know there are a lot of diferences between LCD and OLED, appart from the fact that we have a pentile display (2 subpixels per pixel, pixels are in RGBG formation) and the LCD uses 3 subpixels per pixel (RGB).
We should join our forces and start on a mission to solve this issue once and for all.
Regards.
It is DEFINITELY a software issue. Try this out: reboot your phone, and while it is still booting and slowish, quickly start the calculator and see the top of the screen perfect and then, for no apparent reason, it gets some kind of a half-circle color spill. Also, when you open the gallery, find a folder with a stock video clip with jelly fish, and when you open that folder, gallery turns to black, and for a half of second it is perfect and then gets sort of color rendering problem. Final test is to start the camera when the night falls, switch to camcorder (for the smoothness), and just look at the screen, it is perfect, no black clipping, and then, as soon as you take the picture, the picture spoils and you get the black clipping- the live image on the screen while observing is totally normal. So, it is 100% SW issue!
I compared my Note to my friend's SIII and the screen is much darker on S3, and images themselves. So, it IS gamma issue. When you open the front camera on the SIII, in a bit darker environment, and look at yourself, you barely see the shape of your head, since gamma is much lower and it only picks up the bright parts, such as your forehead and cheeks. Also, images appear much MUCH darker on the s3 screen than what you see in reality. That is what samsung did to solve the issue: lowered the gamma.
Hope I gave some useful info (no pressure to hit the thanks button )
Cheers
P.S. please, those of you with good screens, post images here of your good note
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1801333
shatroghistro said:
It is DEFINITELY a software issue. Try this out: reboot your phone, and while it is still booting and slowish, quickly start the calculator and see the top of the screen perfect and then, for no apparent reason, it gets some kind of a half-circle color spill. Also, when you open the gallery, find a folder with a stock video clip with jelly fish, and when you open that folder, gallery turns to black, and for a half of second it is perfect and then gets sort of color rendering problem. Final test is to start the camera when the night falls, switch to camcorder (for the smoothness), and just look at the screen, it is perfect, no black clipping, and then, as soon as you take the picture, the picture spoils and you get the black clipping- the live image on the screen while observing is totally normal. So, it is 100% SW issue!
I compared my Note to my friend's SIII and the screen is much darker on S3, and images themselves. So, it IS gamma issue. When you open the front camera on the SIII, in a bit darker environment, and look at yourself, you barely see the shape of your head, since gamma is much lower and it only picks up the bright parts, such as your forehead and cheeks. Also, images appear much MUCH darker on the s3 screen than what you see in reality. That is what samsung did to solve the issue: lowered the gamma.
Hope I gave some useful info (no pressure to hit the thanks button )
Cheers
P.S. please, those of you with good screens, post images here of your good note
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1801333
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ok, it is software. good. let's solve it !
It is not that easy..supercurio worked on it for 6 months and then left us hanging... He is not obliged, though..
We need a kernel which can access the gamma control. That is the only 'real' solution for this issue. You are right about the s3 having lower gamma and hence darker images. I've seen this myself and thats why I mentioned on my post that the Note's screen looks brighter due to the heavily cranked up gamma.
Apparently, this might be an issue with pentile amoled. Lower the gamma and lose pure whites for a clipping free darker image like on the Galaxy S or S3 or crank it up and get "richer" looking colours and whiter whites at the cost of extreme clipping in darker shadows.
This is the root of the cause. Improper gamma. Now only if someone who is experienced in developing Kernels would somehow enable gamma control which is present in the MDNIE settings but strangely disabled due to unknown reasons.
I saw that Liquid Black ROM has Gamma Control but didnt try that ROM yet. I really love the Tablet Mode in the Paranoid ROMS. So I want to stick to it while getting a solution.
I tend to agree with satish, it is then a hardware issue that could be remedied partly at cost other colours. I guess I was wrong, I use to think it was only caused by lower quality images, like watching tv on old crt, then watching same on hdtv, that also looks crap lol.
Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 2
gbb14 said:
1) Seriously guys, we have to get to the root of this problem. If we can get to the gamma setting on this display we can solve the problem. But how hard can it be to get there?
2) On the other hand, i think that what you did, was change the gamma on an LCD display. As far as I know there are a lot of diferences between LCD and OLED, appart from the fact that we have a pentile display (2 subpixels per pixel, pixels are in RGBG formation) and the LCD uses 3 subpixels per pixel (RGB).
We should join our forces and start on a mission to solve this issue once and for all.
Regards.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wasn't comparing LCD and OLED. I just wanted to prove the point that it is indeed gamma which is set higher on the Note and it is not a hardware issue. I dont know why no kernel for the Note is able to access the gamma control settings. Maybe like Entropy said, the Note's display panel might be a unique design such that any tweak applied on the display may cause unwanted results. As you all know OLEDs have certain hidden characteristics and its more or less like DNA. Every OLED panel is different. So the manufacturer tunes it into the most optimum settings possible on the particular technology used in the panel. But here, Samsung just did it wrong.
If you have noticed, many custom ROMS offer scaling down the brightness even below the default Samsung values and thats when AMOLED's hidden weaknesses start showing up.
In the end, I feel the only solution to this is a Kernel which enables the Gamma Control or somehow enabling the Gamma Control in CM9 which is currently disabled in most CM9 based ROMS.
baz77 said:
I tend to agree with satish, it is then a hardware issue that could be remedied partly at cost other colours. I guess I was wrong, I use to think it was only caused by lower quality images, like watching tv on old crt, then watching same on hdtv, that also looks crap lol.
Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not exactly a hardware "issue" but maybe more like a hardware "limitation" of "Pentile" AMOLED. Samsung has hidden this issue in the Original Galaxy S and in the Galaxy S3 by lowering the gamma which results in darker images but "NO" or "Invisible" clipping hence satisfying consumers. Due to the lower Gamma on those phones, darker shadows seem to blend into eachother hence we dont see any clipping as darks are "Dark". And hence, when consumers dont "see" any artefacts, banding or clipping on their videos and images, they are satisfied. But this is at the cost of "dull" whites or artificial whites and lower overall perceived brightness.
As the Note has its Gamma cranked up, White looks white. I may even go forward and say that the Note produces the best whites ever seen on any AMOLED panel. Hence web browsing looks richer, colours look richer and the overall perceived brightness is again higher than other devices, But this again comes at the cost of clipping in darker shadows and hence poor looking videos and images, blocky pixellation,etc
So in the end, everyone is ready to sacrifice their "whites" for a clipping free display. Thats how it works out for consumers. As long as they dont "see" the problem, they believe its not there. So this may be a limitation of "Pentile" AMOLED and lowering the gamma may be Samsung's way of hiding the weakness.
The Galaxy S2 has an overall best screen which I've seen and thats due to the RGB AMOLED Technology. Colours look richer, the percieved brightness is higher and no clipping either. Thereby best of both worlds.
gamma
1) I saw some minor fixes on this thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1715416 but nothing really gets deep down to the problem. Those fixes are actually some kind of effects, they aren't so good. They talk there about some kernels that helps the black clipping issue.
2)I have found an apk that is called voodoo display filter, can you check it out? it does seem to enhance the black.
3)As i was playing around with the screen settings on cm9, i noticed that if i set the screen scenario to VT, the mode to MOVIE, and the outdoor mode to ON, i can see down to number 4 on the gamma test image (usually with the default settings i can see everything down to 1).
regards
gbb14 said:
1) I saw some minor fixes on this thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1715416 but nothing really gets deep down to the problem. Those fixes are actually some kind of effects, they aren't so good. They talk there about some kernels that helps the black clipping issue.
2)I have found an apk that is called voodoo display filter, can you check it out? it does seem to enhance the black.
3)As i was playing around with the screen settings on cm9, i noticed that if i set the screen scenario to VT, the mode to MOVIE, and the outdoor mode to ON, i can see down to number 4 on the gamma test image (usually with the default settings i can see everything down to 1).
regards
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are talking about the screen adjuster app which in my opinion is neither a fix nor a workaround for the problem. It destroys the blacks and uses the screen out of specification.
I have searched everywhere but couldnt find the apk for vodoo screen tuning. So, couldnt try that.
Anyways, this issue cannot be resolved with an app but only a kernel which supports gamma control.
You can find the app on bazaar android, i think it was made by super mario super curio, or something who used to work on this issue, and had a thread of over 50 pages, until he decided to quit the work because of flamers and stupid people.
I've had some ideas:
Can the devs add some new settings under cm9>settings>advanced>screen>mode ? ooooor instead of bumping the gamma on outdoor mode, to lower it?
regards
Op please change thread title, as it is hardware.
Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 2

Low Saturation and Contrast?

Bought the 10...love the way it runs but I bought it to show my photography work on (would use an ipad but I really detest the ios software).
The entire screen seems to be washed out overall with weak black levels and reds in particular are low saturation.
Sharp as a tack for sure....is it just mine? I see such conflicting reports in reviews although I am seeing more now about low saturation and contrast.
Very frustrating....unless someone out there knows some way of calibrating this display which I haven't found?
you are right
i am also a photographer (Canon 5D MkII)
i have watched some photos now(got my N10 yesterday) and as you said the screen is sharp as hell
i have never seen this amount of details with my DSLR photos.
im also doing hardware calibration and i see whats wrong right away and i have also tested it...the problem is that the gamma is to low.
The N10 has a Gamma Level around 1.4 - 1.5 where it should be 2.2!
(yeah that should make some attention hehe)
thats a fact and thats why we have washed out colors and bad contrast
but the good thing is that even at that low gamma we have a decent picture quality with good black levels!
i dont think the black levels on my device is washed out
it shouldnt be this good with this crappy gamma but it is
thats amazing and that tells that this is a quality screen above normal.
with correct gamma at 2.2 this screen will rock for sure.
so lets wait for some kernel guru to make some gamma adjustments
i have said i before that im willing to pay that person that makes gamma adjustment possible for the N10s.
You are correct...gamma is definitely too low.
As far as washed out reds go, I suppose I could process specifically for display on this tablet but that's a pain in the butt.
I wish the darned ipad wasn't such a restrictive ecosystem for the software. The colors rock on the ipad unfortunately but it's just too darned restrictive.
jfenton57 said:
You are correct...gamma is definitely too low.
As far as washed out reds go, I suppose I could process specifically for display on this tablet but that's a pain in the butt.
I wish the darned ipad wasn't such a restrictive ecosystem for the software. The colors rock on the ipad unfortunately but it's just too darned restrictive.
Click to expand...
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im waiting for a i1 Display Pro colormeter
when i get it i will do a hardware calibration.
but i have checked some stuff already and i think that the colors is right for its low gamma.
also the brightness for the colors seems the same for Red/Green/Blue and thats a good thing
also the contrast and black level is reference.
i also think the color temp is close to 6500k
that means that the grayscale is correct.
so the only thing that messes up this display is the low gamma.
(or wrong gamma curve/line)
you have some tests here that you can do without a colormeter,if you want to check it out
http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/
also you can download the AVSHD 709 Patterns here.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/948496/avs-hd-709-blu-ray-mp4-calibration
just copy the mp4 files to your N10 and run them.
one note that i can see is that it seems that the gamma is higher at the lower shades
it seems to be around 1.8 there
that could explain why we dont have completely washed out blacks.
but what you want is a plain straight gamma line at 2.2
the N10 seems to have a hill shaped line starting high at lower shades and lower around maximum white.
I have tested the N10 with a Pantone "hocky puck" and can confirm the observations posted above. As compared to overly saturated profiles most normal users are used to, it's no wonder many see the N10 as flat and dull. My N7 is horrible, not only flat but had a color temp that was blueish green.
Much of my publicly displayed work for general web based consumption, has the saturation pumped up farther then I like, but my "fans" (sarc) seem to enjoy my photographs when contrast and saturation is pushed high. Ironically, my over saturated photographs look good to me on the low gamma N10, lol.
Either way, most all of us would benefit from being able to adjust our N10s. As many of you know this is best done at the kernel level and the master of sound and color Samsung kernels is SuperCurio and his project Voodoo. I have heard hearsay that he is working on kernel code and color profiles that can support adjustments for the N10, but I have yet to confirm this myself.
As usual we are given hardware that needs code improvements to be fully realized and that seems to always be done by the development community. It will taken time but I am confident we'll get there to some degree soon.
As far as I could tell there is no gamma correction in the kernel because the Nexus 10 uses a new display port interface thats in the Exynos 5. Most devices I've seen have at least a static gamma table in the kernel but that doesn't appear to be true for the Nexus 10.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk HD
12paq said:
I have heard hearsay that he is working on kernel code and color profiles that can support adjustments for the N10, but I have yet to confirm this myself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
give him my money!
that sounds great
post in this thread if you hear more about it!
as i said in other threads i will pay around 50$ for the person that makes gamma adjustment possible for the N10.
btw: hockey puck?
are you serious ?

What can this thing do..

I wonder if the shield can, through a custom kernel, adjust rgb, gamma, or color calibration. similar to a nexus 6p with a custom kernel like franco or elementalx i can adjust to a much cooler screen similar to the galaxy series.
Also I saw in the shields display settings there is a dynamic range setting which i changed to full and the screen seemed to have dramatically changed. the darks seemed much darker. i dont have an hdr tv but a sony bravia about 2 yo so i didnt think it was actually hdr but only the output from the shield.
dontbeweakvato said:
I wonder if the shield can, through a custom kernel, adjust rgb, gamma, or color calibration. similar to a nexus 6p with a custom kernel like franco or elementalx i can adjust to a much cooler screen similar to the galaxy series.
Also I saw in the shields display settings there is a dynamic range setting which i changed to full and the screen seemed to have dramatically changed. the darks seemed much darker. i dont have an hdr tv but a sony bravia about 2 yo so i didnt think it was actually hdr but only the output from the shield.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
full vs limited is in the range that the device will output colors to the screen. with limited the normal range of 0-255 values per color is limited to 16-235. (256 values per color ^3 equals 16,7million colors (3 colors: RGB)
most particularly (older) tv's won't process the full amount of 16,7m colors, in comparison to monitors which almost always do. Reason why is probably cost, to make them cheap, and to save bandwidth. So they compressed the output, losing some of the detail in between (more like MP3 in comparison to using 160kbps vs 320kbps mp3's, most people won;t notice the difference, but it is there unconsciously)
Anyway. by compressing the range, the tv then stretches these out so that those values become the new white and black. Else everything would look greyish and faded. But now you have less detail because you miss some information, because some of the gradient is missing.
Your TV is set up to the limited range, so that it stretches those to be the new black and white. But when you switch the incoming signal to the full 256 range, the tv will still stretch these as if they were the limited range, and it basically cuts off black and white information, making everything higher contrast but losing a lot of information because it's cut off. And then you'll have to set your TV to full as well, but that's not always possible. Because most tv's can't process more color information.
That's why HDR is such a big improvement, more color information, more visible dark and bright gradients and the overall brightness contrast is wider.
But I think in your case by setting it to full you will get the feeling of more contrast, but essentially you are cutting off a bunch of information. You'll probably notice in dark scenes that you can't see much, because it's clipped out.
If this makes sense to you. (I may have made some mistakes explaining this)
Regarding calibration, you should calibrate your tv in stead. There's no use in calibrating your shield. That's only necessary if you can't control your screen, which TV's can, but phones can't. So mess around with your tv color settings.

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