Database Users

To all Android newcomers on XDA:

Hi there.
If you're new to Android, how about you actually figure out the OS before you go ***** in the forums to developers?
People seem to think that XDA is a place to go get updates for their phone, and then complain about how it has problems.
It isn't. Developers don't owe you squat. They put out what they WANT to put out. XDA is a development forum, made by developers for developers. If you don't know what you're doing, don't do it.
Also, people tend to ***** about problems that they caused themselves. For example, I see people complaining in kernel threads about how they undervolted their phone by -75mv in SetCPU and then complain about how they got a freeze or a SoD and proceed to ask the developer to "fix kernal pl0x".
If you mess with system settings, take a second to think that what you're doing *might* be causing problems.
If you DO have a legitimate problem, take a second to think that someone else might have the problem. Search the thread and check if someone else has the same problem. One thing that is somewhat recurring is people saying "herp I'm too lazy to search 5 pages in the thread". If you're too lazy to click your mouse a few times, kindly consider driving off a cliff.
Also, fun fact, did you know that every time you ***** about battery life a baby seal drowns? True story.
Let your battery go through 2 charge cycles, check for wakelocks on your phone with BetterBatteryStats. If all else fails, consider charging your phone overnight. It's not like you live in an Amazonian forest with no power and need your smartphone to last for a month without charging. Go buy an old Nokia if you need your battery to last long.
Here's another thought: try to make your post even remotely readable. Use proper English, it helps us actually understand whatever you're trying to say.
Spare us all headaches and use your common sense.
Here's some more reading material: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=19643797&postcount=5298
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leech_(computing)

Good point well made.

Well said - although I might have said in more gentle terms But there is no doubt whatsoever that any settings, ROM flashing, kernel flashing etc. is at the users own risk and no developer can be held responsible for any damage!
Isn't it possible somehow to make a checklist for new users that are important before they mess around? As they are new we got to help them in order to avoid the "stupid" questions.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium

Agree with you that XDA is a Developers forum
But on a side note I am sure Devs like that their work is appreciated and in turn I am sure it motivates them to continue working towards better roms and stuff.
I have seen most Devs on XDA take it as creative criticism and always try to get work arounds preety quickly which is think is super brilliant.
You can't stop people *****ing around its each person's nature and I guess we can just ignore them and carry on with the good things that XDA has to offer us.
Besides N00bs will be Noobs - I still am and grateful for XDA Dev's and Members for their Support
Still a Good Point made...

While I agree with most points made, I should also point out the obvious point that without users there's no need for developers. I'm sure the developers would like people to make use of their work.
Also, while searching in theory is nice, sometimes it doesn't work. A problem can be described in many ways. I fully support that users should search before asking, but don't be too hard on people who ask. Some may have searched and failed to find relevant answers.

Totally agree. But with android selling like wild fire the noob intake will increase like crazy. Call it pure laziness to be honest lol.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium

Logi_Ca1 said:
without users there's no need for developers
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lol.... looks like you really know how this site started..

As i said on a previous thread temporary bannings need to start being issued should people come on and start asking questions which have been answered dozens of times before, i don't know if it's possible in the registration process so newbies can be informed that they need to use the search function first and foremost for any questions where they will most likely find the answer to their questions and only if they cant may then then start a thread where they will most likely get plenty of assistance,when i first joined it was nowhere near as bad as it is now, it's quite painful coming on here sometimes and looking at the same old questions day in,day out.

@OP- Read this before you spread your smart advices to others.
• http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_forum
Forum definition: A public meeting place for open discussion.
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I also may add when i first joined or rather a few weeks before i registered i done a bit of reading on XDA to try and familiar myself with some of the topics and jargon used as i didn't really have a clue about anything like this, but back to my original point, use the search function and chances are it will bring up something that your looking for at this stage i cant think of anything that hasn't been covered on here with regard to the SGSII.

ithehappy said:
@OP- Read this before you spread your smart advices to others.
• http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_forum
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You see, forums are made to discuss specific things. This particular forum was made to discuss development for Windows Mobile and Android. Therefore, we should keep discussion specific to development. And I'm pretty sure development talk isn't "FIX KERNAL PL0X BATTERY DRAINZZ!".
But then again, what do I know.

Maybe a little aggressive, especially to new members, I understand the point being made, but I like many others have come here to ask for advice and share my finding with other like minded android users, some of the advice I've found most useful has been from other new members with similar issues and questions. Be careful not to frighten new folks off. I've seen threads like this destroy forums in the past. It's all about the wording, and coming across friendly, but allowing folks to understand how the forum works. From what I've read, there are plenty of warning on the rooting and firmware threads, so users have been warned before they try anything vaguely risky. There will always be those who don't heed the advice, but those folks ain't likely to read this thread. Anyhoots peace to all, as this a great place.

so unfriendly. everybody started off as noobs, including developers.

Seifer1975 said:
so unfriendly. everybody started off as noobs, including developers.
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I'm not bashing noobs, I'm telling them to stop being idiots.

I agree with the op.
Each time I have come accross a problem, it has been remedied by returning to the developer's thread to follow the instructions properly, along with taking on board what tips fellow members have said in the assosiated thread.
If I can figure that much out -which isn't rocket science- then I am sure that other should be able to. If only we lived in 'should land'.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App

At this point I'm glad that we still have developers here. I couldn't develop my way out of a hostage situation, but am willing to:
Follow the instructions,
Search if I have a problem,
Verify that I did indeed follow the instructions,
Provide a detailed description of problem if I can't rectify,
Present the developer with any info they may need to diagnose (logs, etc...),
Respect the distinction between Q&A and development,
When it doubt watch the video again, you're a noob f-stick and so am I,
Don't piss and moan when I have an issue, I elected to not have a stock phone, nobody held a gun to my head, but if you piss and moan it makes me want to hold a Kalashnikov to yours: search, contribute, learn to troubleshoot.
The Me Generation, need I say more?

I've been sickened keeping up with the siriya thread at the amount of people asking dumb questions too. It doesn't seem to be getting any better.
I work retail and I barely barely have enough free time or energy to keep up with playing with my galaxy s. I have no idea how these developers even do it.
People need to learn some respect for these amazing guys. But I guess the amount of noobs will only ever increase. So I guess the devs will need to adapt.
Anyway, one reason I'm posting this is because it's my 10th post and this allows me to go and post my thanks in the syriya thread!
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App

Logi_Ca1 said:
While I agree with most points made, I should also point out the obvious point that without users there's no need for developers. I'm sure the developers would like people to make use of their work.
Also, while searching in theory is nice, sometimes it doesn't work. A problem can be described in many ways. I fully support that users should search before asking, but don't be too hard on people who ask. Some may have searched and failed to find relevant answers.
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Well that's one of the things. Developers don't do it just for people to use it. They do it for learning, testing, and fun. There were custom roms for smartphones when only other developers used it. Did that stop them? Nope we got great things like Cookies Hometab and MaxSense. Everytime I hear "without users their would be no developers" I just have to sit back and say "really what do you think we have been doing on XDA for years before the average user even knew what a smartphone was?"

There is a lot of pointless stuff posted on xda now, often by people who show no respect for the fact that everything here is free of charge. The price of free is that you do a little legwork & read the threads before posting crap like "help i bricked my phone" or "why don't you take the softkeys off the ics gui" which must have been asked 3000 times, when will you release it, which is the best rom? etc.
The admins asked for suggestions last year on how to manage the influx of new members. I didn't suggest anything so I now reap what I sowed. I do have some suggestions now though; let the devs, admins and people with something to download start new threads for free and make the people starting helpdesk or spammy type threads pay, use a keyword or keyphrase blocklist to stop people who can't be bothered to read or who want to ask unreasonable questions from clogging up the threads.
Xda now has adverts so obviously the more the merrier for revenue but if the target is quantity over quality the mods shouldn't complain when they go and clean all the spam out of threads, instead they should just say thanks for your spam please call again soon.
So what is the aim, quality or quantity?
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App

umadbro?!?!?!

Tester

Just putting it out there that I would love to be a tester for the Galaxy SII, I have the original one, I have flash and went through 90% of every ROM up for it in both sections the original section and regular section, I just love flashing and going through Roms and would love to just help out someone with there Rom and do whatever it is they need me to do as far as testing, please hit me back. I hope I posted this is the right place if not, I will watch the Noob video 20 times in a row for punishment.

ah ok...... that's an idea

Original SGS II ? No kidding! :|

At first, I thought of this as just a pointless thread - but you got me thinking... What if we were to create a thread where people can nominate themselves as alpha/beta/etc. testers for ROM/Kernel developers? The difference lying in that to be eligible for a position, you'd have to prove that you have basic knowledge of how to recover from, for example, a bootloop, or a device that won't even boot, or constant FCs, etc. etc., along with again, pretty basic ADB knowledge, how to create and restore a NANDroid backup, and things like that. It'd come with the usual disclaimer stating that all responsibilities lie with the user, not the developer, and while the developer may be willing to provide support for bugs, etc., they are not liable for any damage resulting either directly or indirectly from the use of their software.
This would solve two things - it would satisfy those who just can't stand to wait for the release of something, who like to always live on the bleeding edge of development, and it would provide the developers a huge testing platform.
In review, though, this provides to main issues: 1) people would only be able to test one thing at a time, e.g. you're not going to be allowed to test a beta ROM with an alpha kernel, for example - it creates too many variables, and makes it harder for the developers to isolate and fix problems - but this shouldn't be an issue for people, just pick what you want and stick with it, and 2) people who leak the otherwise tester-restricted software for the masses - but this can be solved easily: maintain a list of official testers. Anyone who comes begging for support because they went ahead and flashed some leaked ROM/kernel/whatever, and ended up without a working device without being on the list, can be denied support for breaking the rules. Moreover, they, along with the leaker, could potentially face site-imposed bans?
I'll cut the rambling here, but I think it's a good idea?

As a ROM developer, its a great idea.
Sent from HydrOG3N MOD S2.
Technology Evolves, Android Evolves.
HydrOG3N is THE Revolution.

Thinking about it, not bad idea. But to back sceamworks up a bit, there should be a number of post limit, Some form of history for the dev`s to see who is a Noob (sorry Noobs) and who is not...

I'm in
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App

I like the idea and I too would be glad to help people testing there ROMs.
It also seems nice to have a thread where people (like me or the OP) can set them self available for testing.

Most real developers pick their team from watching the threads and see how is willing to put the time in and know how to properly test as well as offer ideas on fixes. But not a bad idea I guess for new rom developers

lodger said:
Thinking about it, not bad idea. But to back sceamworks up a bit, there should be a number of post limit, Some form of history for the dev`s to see who is a Noob (sorry Noobs) and who is not...
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I agree completely, I'd say 50-100 would be a fair starting point? I might PM some devs sometime soon with a proper proposal, and if I get a positive response from a majority of them, I might draft something, and get some official names on-board.
zelendel said:
Most real developers pick their team from watching the threads and see how is willing to put the time in and know how to properly test as well as offer ideas on fixes. But not a bad idea I guess for new rom developers
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I considered this, and I think if anything brings the idea down, it'll be that - it's a hard sell to make, and I'd love to say that there's no harm in trying, but really, there is, so I guess execution is everything?

Good idea, im in....

Show your Support, Don't Whine

The latest Android upgrade has seen a sudden burst of emotion from every corner. From blessings to curses, everyone has been eager to slap on their comments with much vigor, and all the more brutality.
New users wanting to flaunt their know-how, ancient developers suddenly coming out of hibernation to groan at the state of affairs, and worst of all, people squabbling and hurling accusations at our till-a-week-ago awesome developers for anything and everything wrong under the sun (and perhaps beyond it as well)
Instead of cribbing, groaning and showering multitudes of discouraging statements across entire threads, why not do something fruitful?
Why not use that BIG SEARCH BAR before your fingers start flying over the keyboard?
Why not read each and every guide so painstakingly compiled by the developers, thoroughly?
Why not for once actually follow each and every step rather than show just how omniscient we can be?
Developers here devote so much of their time (4 of them even bricked their phones) just to bring us the best there is, the best there can be. And all we do is quickly lap it up, sing praises, write eulogies, but when things go awry, point our fingers at them?
I think this calls for some retrospection. I am no established developer, nor do I claim to be one. Testing releases, providing genuine feedback and helping in my own little way is the most I can do. And even that somehow gets frustrating when you're faced with the same questions again and again.
Think of what the devs have to face when they're 'judged' by us, when they are bombarded with personal messages asking stupid questions, and on the whole not allowed to do what they want to do.
I might be going overboard, but I feel the message has to reach out to every corner. Help each other, show your support; you wouldn't be biting into your sandwiches if they hadn't splashed the ice-cream on for you.
If something's wrong, cry yourself a river.
But then don't forget to build a bridge and get over it.​
------------------------------------------------
When we talk of responsibility towards other users, it implies that we do not DELIBERATELY try to cause any form of damage to the user or to his device. And I am sure that is the last thing on anyone's mind (or so I hope).
And if we still want to enter into the legal technicalities of the issue, I can very well claim without hesitation that whenever any person willingly signs up for forums of these kind, willingly and consciously attempts to execute any process listed herein - he automatically loses immunity to any loss he may incur as a result of his actions, and thereby forfeits any semblance of legal refuge that he might have.
Despite this, developers post repeated warnings in their guides and that is the best that they can do. Users must understand that what they undertake is at their own risk. No point arguing on the fact that Super User X or Noob User Y bricked his phone because of something that Uber Cool Dev Z posted in any of the threads.
We don't know what we want.
Yet we are willing to fight to the death to get it?
Peace and Respect. Everybody.

epic
make this a sticky!

we dont only devote our time, 4 of us have bricked devices at the moment

JamieD81 said:
we dont only devote our time, 4 of us have bricked devices at the moment
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yeah, unfortunate.

Sticky this mod

jtribaco said:
Sticky this mod
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^ +10

the best description to this is that its like a Roulette, you wont now when you are hitting the jackpot (sorry im not good with sarcasm.. haha)
i do believe at first that the problem does not exist due to small incidents of brick and most came from LEAK... but once i started reading people who got bricked for wiping on stock recovery, people getting unrecoverable /data and /system partitions, i decided to give up the "amazing" ICS until all problems are ironed out... i flashed GB using pc odin and gave up on chrome beta and nova launcher...
OPTION 1 (the dangerous path) : short usage of ICS (not knowing when and how it will end, but i think at this point you know how notes die..lol) and have longer suffering of having a bricked note (as for me im just a student and it is a gift)...
OPTION 2 (playing the WAITING GAME) : having GB for a while or a few weeks as i deduct and wait for a better ICS in the future...
if you ask me, I'm Playing the WAITING GAME....

That's the best thing I've heard all week
+1

Sticky?
why isn't this being made a sticky?
And yeah, awesome toolbar toxic!

sticky

I think this message needs to get to everyone... but I don't think its Sticky Worthy.
I mean this is just Common Sense, and I wished that people who risk tinkering with their device to have more of it than those who don't.
Sometimes I see people being ignorant and ignoring posts/instructions and resulting in a brick and sitting behind this screen I think "man you kind of deserved that one" though I don't necessarily condone that response. I try to PM them, or help them... but I see how it can start to get "too much".
I think people need to understand this: Developers are doing this FOR FREE, and they are doing it in THEIR SPARE TIME. If they don't use netiquette and xda-rules, they should try to solve their problems themselves by learning the skills and making builds in THEIR TIME. Or they should pay someone hundreds, nay thousands of dollars to work several weeks by taking some time off from their usual work to develop.
I can see the problem. Its common sense, its just not common.
Damn that was a long rant, I'll shut up now.

Totally agree.
As for the sticky request, it was made when sentiments were running high and devices getting bricked. Guess it caught the mood of the times...
But doesn't imply it still isn't relevant.
Sent from my GT-N7000 using xda app-developers app

Well said!
Sent from my GT-N7000 using xda premium

Kangal said:
I mean this is just Common Sense,.
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right
no sticky needed

I think the biggest whiners are the handful of regulars who think they own the forum and constantly bash others, both new and old, whenever they ask even the simplest and most innocuous jelly bean questions. Even with the stickies, any forum in xda is always a mess of info, both good and bad, poorly written, and conflicting. Not to mention this stuff changes at a drop of a hat, and is frequently wrong. As long as xda allows noobs to easily sign up and post, because this is a public forum after all, there will always be an endless stream of noob questions, especially about jelly bean. Asking about something, especially WHY isn't it out yet, does not constitute whining. It's actually on-topic. Littering every other post complaining about the noobs however, IS WHINING. If you are so annoyed, go create a private forum of your own. Maybe go lobby xda to ban everyone that asks a dumb question, which is pretty much 99% of the users here. Or you could just get off your soapbox, learn to skim past posts you are not interested in, and STOP WHINING.

Best 4.4 rom you have used

best 4.4 rom you have used and why

4) No threads or posts asking for the best/most stable ROM/Kernel/Mod/whatever, or created for the purpose of comparing Phones/ROMs/Kernels/Mods/whatever:
These threads/posts will be deleted promptly and without warning. They have a history of causing problems due to trolls, and fanboys, along with various troublemakers, and therefore are no longer allowed. Regardless of that, there is really no way to judge whether or not a particular piece of work is better than another because it's all relative to begin with. If you want to know what piece of work is better for you, install something and try it out for a while. If you don't like it, try something else. Our Developers work hard to provide us their contributions, free of charge. Please show them the respect they deserve by trying something out and giving them your feedback.
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Yep, illegal. Cuz someone might get offended that their baby doll favorite is not yours also. But techiefanboyPC bull**** aside, how about some opinions so people can learn without having to waste time.
I know learning without wasting time and trying BS only a programmer should know is against the xda techieCode, but hey, some of us just want to use our phone and not recompile the universal android binary code just to customise it a little.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

Thread closed for the stated reasons

[DEVS] - Please Read - [Request]

Hi Developers,
You folks all do a great job of trying to sort out install issues and confusion regarding vendor images for our devices and whatnot and we less inclined to develop really do appreciate all you put into it for the rest of us.
That being said, one thing that I personally think should be included in the ROM's initial posting is a link to the **LINK---> FACTORY IMAGES<---KNIL** for our device.
I know that you all have the link memorized and every flavor imaginable already downloaded, but when a normal person flashes something and it doesnt work its a pain in the joint to try to remember where the list of imperatives is in the forum. The first place most look is to the thread where they were coming from.
It's ok if you flame me for this and I understand. Personally I'm usually all over it myself, but when I see questions in all of the ROM threads asking where someone got a vendor image and then they say they found it in the marlin thread it's just not right, if you know what I mean.
Anyway, thanks for considering it.
Regards,
Dtrud0h

If users don't know where the factory images page is they really shouldn't be unlocking their bootloader.
Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

dtrud0h said:
Hi Developers,
You folks all do a great job of trying to sort out install issues and confusion regarding vendor images for our devices and whatnot and we less inclined to develop really do appreciate all you put into it for the rest of us.
That being said, one thing that I personally think should be included in the ROM's initial posting is a link to the **LINK---> FACTORY IMAGES<---KNIL** for our device.
I know that you all have the link memorized and every flavor imaginable already downloaded, but when a normal person flashes something and it doesnt work its a pain in the joint to try to remember where the list of imperatives is in the forum. The first place most look is to the thread where they were coming from.
It's ok if you flame me for this and I understand. Personally I'm usually all over it myself, but when I see questions in all of the ROM threads asking where someone got a vendor image and then they say they found it in the marlin thread it's just not right, if you know what I mean.
Anyway, thanks for considering it.
Regards,
Dtrud0h
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I always just do a GOOGLE Search - "Factory Images Pixel Sailfish" and it comes up as the first or second link every time. Easy Peasy. I think you have to remember, it is not the Developers place to make life easy for anyone. They already did all the work by creating the rom in the first place. Everyone flashing a rom takes on a major responsibility to know what they need to do if something doesn't go right. if they can't figure this out by searching - or at the very least by TRYING to search first, they should never try in the first place. Of course if they do try on their own to figure something out and still need help - I am sure they will find it by asking.
Too many people have gotten to the point of EXPECTING the developers to hold their hand while they flash roms - why is it the developers place to do that? They didn't hold a gun to the persons head when they flashed - and frankly, I believe they expect each of us to at least try to find things out on our own first - they already put a huge amount of work into creating the rom and then chose to allow us to use it as well. I think they have done enough -
Just my two cents.

joetheshmo said:
If users don't know where the factory images page is they really shouldn't be unlocking their bootloader.
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Very true, but it seems a lot of people are doing so. I dont recall a new phone that had so many noobs to flashing. Not complaining, I help them out a lot. Just an observation.
And no, not the devs responsibility to help them. And if they posted links for flashing stock they would get inundated with requests to help with that.

Some phone forums on XDA are more user-friendly than others for flashing ROMs. It used to be so easy and I was (I thought) a pro - I helped others a lot. This phone confuses me more. You learn by doing, but people also don't want to risk $800 phones for the sake of learning.
I personally think it would be nice to include all crucial links as well, but most people on this forum are more inclined to believe you should just find it yourself, haha. I got a "let me Google that for you" response to a question this month, I recall.
When I was back in the Galaxy S3 or HTC One M8 forums, things were a little more noob-friendly but this place is full of nice people who help. It's just harder to do it yourself (without research or asking) because the threads are written at a more advanced level, in my opinion, and the steps are more complex than they used to be.

I agree, some forums are much more friendly than others. It is also easy for the ones that get in on the ground floor than it is for the ones that get in later. People sometimes answer questions in a more complex manner than is needed and probably without realizing it. Throw that in with someone that maybe hasn't had an unlocked bootloader in years and you have some uneasy and nervous people. Yet these guys have a right to get in there, get their feet wet, and eventually contribute. Imagine how clean a Dev's thread would be if not only a link to the firmware was given but if only a vendor image was needed, then that was provided as well. There would fewer questions about the little things and people going back and forth with one another about how stupid or lazy people are on one hand, and how unhelpful or rude people are on the other. I'm not a Dev though.

I agree with you all. lol. It is not the devs responsibility to make sure that your grass is covered, it's usually the first thing in all the threads, **Your Own Risk** I think are the key words. I haven't built any roms but I can get around the platform tools pretty well. But for the sake of keeping the rom threads clean and informative, especially with all the new variables related to most notably the Pixel, but android flashing in general supplying the correct files would probably cut thread clutter down by 40% and with uniform installs bug tracking would be a bit easier.
Anyway, thanks for looking and thinking about it, I appreciate all the points of view expressed.

I'm not complaining about anything, but I originally posted this in the Development Forum and it got moved to Guides and News...Whatever.
Starting to get a stiff neck from shaking my head at the posts in the rom threads, one right after the other asking where to find files, among other things that the user should know.
Just sayin'