So I have been playing around with various USB game controllers as well as various storage devices and everything has worked so far (except BT, its detected but thats it). Hashcode has put a low priority on OTG in the kernal dev queue so I would like to get a discussion going about possible hardware solutions to over come the current 3.3v limitation of the USB port when running as a host (which is why devices dont work directly, only through a hub). Someone already suggested a current pump DC-DC in the kernal thread so my current focus something like this: http://www.circuitsathome.com/dc-dc/33v-to-5v-dc-dc-converter
for some motivation to this end, here is my USB NES controller hooked via OTG:
Controller use brought to you by HaiKaiDo Inc. lol
usb otg will work nice if we can up the voltage
usb otg will work nice if we can up the voltage from 3.7 to 5 volt
southbird already did a proof of concept with a voltage regulator from pololu
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=25943787#post25943787
barrmulio said:
southbird already did a proof of concept with a voltage regulator from pololu
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=25943787#post25943787
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep saw that. My aim here is to go beyond that and come up with a real design
Sent from my Xperia X10 using xda premium
Can the voltage regulator be wired into the OTG cable? If so I am willing to try this but I need help with the wiring. I am searching now for some type of soapbox enclosure to house the voltage regulator. Any suggestions?
It would serve as the otg cable. The vreg will sit on the power rail between the kf and the normal usb connector. Ultimately, i want to lay out a smd board with the micro usb and regulator that goes in some little enclosure.
Basically what I am thinking of doing is putting the regulator inbetween the micro usb and female usb. It will look like other otg cables but the enclosure with the female usb will be larger.
I am assuming that the red(power) from micro usb is connected to the vout and the red(power) from female usb is connected to vin on the regulator. Do both sides of the ground need to be connected to the regulator or just to each other?
Can this work with GPS receiver?
sent from the greezals fire.
meturne2 said:
Basically what I am thinking of doing is putting the regulator inbetween the micro usb and female usb. It will look like other otg cables but the enclosure with the female usb will be larger.
I am assuming that the red(power) from micro usb is connected to the vout and the red(power) from female usb is connected to vin on the regulator. Do both sides of the ground need to be connected to the regulator or just to each other?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You could but IMHO, it would be simpler and cheaper to integrate everything as one device. The OTG cable is nothing special, just a micro USB B to regular USB A. The power needs to run from the micro in the KF to the vReg Vin, vReg Vout to the USB A connector, the ground is connected to all three.
greezal said:
Can this work with GPS receiver?
sent from the greezals fire.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No clue. I'm sure a google search would yield some answers
OK I'll look it up now and see if I can get the answer.
sent from the greezals fire.
greezal said:
OK I'll look it up now and see if I can get the answer.
sent from the greezals fire.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just looked it up and not much on the subject have not got a straight answer. Would be great though.
sent from the greezals fire.
Ok, the ones I ordered are in. Size is NICE, it should be really easy to integrate this into existing USB connector enclosures. This is the 120 mA version, the 600 mA version is about twice the size
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
altitude909 said:
Ok, the ones I ordered are in. Size is NICE, it should be really easy to integrate this into existing USB connector enclosures. This is the 120 mA version, the 600 mA version is about twice the size
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
very nice - i ordered the pololu one and still waiting for it to arrive
my thoughts were similar; integrate the regulator into the usb female header area of the otg, or somewhere mid-cable...but I'm having a hard time finding an elegant solution to either re-enclosing the plastic end of the female header or enclosing it mid cable
i just back another otg cable today, i'll be cutting it apart to see if there's enough space by the usb a
success! kinda.. For super low current devices (i.e. NES game controller) it is working fine, anything larger (flash memory) its drawing too much current causing the voltage to sag below 2.5V which is not enough to power the regulator. Will try the LTC3426 one tomorrow since that should be able to operate at a lower input voltage
altitude909 said:
success! kinda.. For super low current devices (i.e. NES game controller) it is working fine, anything larger (flash memory) its drawing too much current causing the voltage to sag below 2.5V which is not enough to power the regulator. Will try the LTC3426 one tomorrow since that should be able to operate at a lower input voltage
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
just to make sure I got your wiring right
from micro usb b
- red to vReg Vin
- pin 4 to ground
- pin 5 to ground
from usb a
- red to vReg Vout
- black/pin 4 to ground
?
my stupid otg cable doesn't have standard colors (it's green, blue, yellow, red, yellow&red), so other than vcc i'm not sure what's what (edit: now i think blue is gnd and yellow/red is sense, yellow is d-, green is d+).
I was also expecting the otg short to be on the micro side and not on the usb a side, but it wasn't
my idea is to have the regulator sit inside the hollowed out area of the female header seen on the bottom left
Just take a meter and see what is connected to what. It does not matter where pin 4 and 5 are shorted.
Unfortunately, it looks like without some sort of magic, the port on the kf cannot supply enough current to drive these regulators. Im observing the same thing as southbird did, the devices show up but do not work. Measuring the voltages at the power pins with a flash drive connected i get 2.4v at the vreg input and 4.5 at the output which means that there is too much load. Time to start looking for battery powered usb hubs
this battery charger or this usb charger both work well for me with a y usb cable...i've seen some other posts with folks that just wired right into the charger, e.g. here
ok, the regulator arrived today and i played around with it
the otg cable was too frail for my poor soldering skills to do properly, so i ended up cutting up a usb extension cable to about 1' in length and soldering it halfway...i'll enclosure in heat shrink later
my results were pretty much the same as southbird and altitude909
My 8Gb centon usb however mounts perfectly *every* time, however my 4Gb, 2Gb or 512Mb sticks will not mount. When I try the elago w/ a 32Gb micro it conks out mounting as a whole, requiring a reboot of the KF to remount the 8Gb stick (probably some kernel protection)
so you need a regulator to get flash drives to work? that explains why it never worked for me lol
Related
Not sure if usb host without a Motorola media hub / lapdock has been mentioned. I managed to get my Atrix working with full host by applying 5vdc to the usb power rail. Seems to work with any usb hub and keyboard / mouse combo long as 5vdc is present on the host side(phone microusb connector). This works in both webtop and normal android shell. Mouse control in Android just jumps from widget to widget but works normally in Webtop mode. Anyone seen a cursor apps for android?
Demo of it in action.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shvFmLRUNGA
*update* I got usb drive mounting to work!
It would seem to be very easy, Motorola seems to have blocked auto mounting without the media/lapdock (why must they be such c*&ts)
*MAKE SURE ITS FORMATED FAT32!* NTFS might be doable with a ntfs-3g module but I haven't tried yet.
Run file manager (root explorer ect...) browse to /dev/block and see what you have listed in there. I had sda and sda1 listed only when I inserted a usb drive so I knew it had to be the drive.
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
Run "Terminal Emulator"
su
mkdir /sdcard-ext/usb (this can be any directory you want on ether the internal or microsd)
mount -t vfat /dev/block/sda1 /sdcard-ext/usb
To unmout the drive safely before removing it. just make sure all apps that might be using the usb drive are close or it'll fail to unmount
umount /sdcard-ext/usb
That's it; your drive will now show up in the file manager and webtop. I decided on the microsd so applications could see it without messing about.
Optional
Grab gscript off the market and then run the mount / unmount script from it insted of typing it out.
So, correct me if I'm wrong, but here is what I understand about this.
By applying a constant 5V DC through a powered USB hub, we can get USB host functionality by plugging devices into the hub?
Could you be more specific, if this is not the case? Also, what adapter are you using on the Atrix side, and what cables are connected to the hub? It seems like you are using a straight microUSB male to USB male, then connecting a female to male cable from the atrix to the hub. I can't tell for sure though.
Either way, it works, which is awesome!
That's it exactly, haha. It's really just that simple.
Your micro to female A adapter isn't an OTG-specific one?
can you post links of the stuff you bought so others may do this?
agentdr8 said:
Your micro to female A adapter isn't an OTG-specific one?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is, I got it from dealextreme
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/micro-usb-on-the-go-host-otg-adapter-pair-50774
The rest is just a cheap dlink usb2.0 hub and a normal A to B usb cable. The +5vdc is need to activate the host port just like most newer arm soc's. This same trick works on the Nexus, Desire ect...
I would like details on where the wire needs to be soldered.
You don't need to solder any wires! That's the beauty of it!
rozzco said:
I would like details on where the wire needs to be soldered.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You do need to solder wires, you need to make a bridge from the DC power to the +5vdc usb host line. The little orange wire is my bridge, each usb hub will be a little different. If you don't bridge nothing will work, the Atrix doesn't supply any power to the devices.
You think this hub would work? I have around 9 dollars of DE credit, so I wanted to get the powered hub from there as well. There's no information on how much voltage the external power supplies though.
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/mini-usb-4-ports-hub-black-787
callen81 said:
You do need to solder wires, you need to make a bridge from the DC power to the +5vdc usb host line. The little orange wire is my bridge, each usb hub will be a little different. If you don't bridge nothing will work, the Atrix doesn't supply any power to the devices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How do you bridge the power over without soldering?
rozzco said:
How do you bridge the power over without soldering?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did solder.
callen81 said:
I did solder.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To pin 1 correct? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:USB.svg
Correct. My hub uses a USB B input but one with USB mini or micro should work just the same. All that matters is +5vdc makes it up stream to.
bad hub?
Maybe I got a bum hub. I have soldered the +5 from the power adapter terminal like in the video, to the power line of the usb hub's single "out" port. so then i plug in my atrix to that same port and the keyboard to one of the 4 "in" ports and I get nothing. seemed simple enough so maybe my usb hub is not compatible. I have usb debugging off, i have usb mounting set to none. if you do happen to notice anything i f'ed up please let me know. ill go hub shopping maybe tomorrow i guess.
tbm48813 said:
Maybe I got a bum hub. I have soldered the +5 from the power adapter terminal like in the video, to the power line of the usb hub's single "out" port. so then i plug in my atrix to that same port and the keyboard to one of the 4 "in" ports and I get nothing. seemed simple enough so maybe my usb hub is not compatible. I have usb debugging off, i have usb mounting set to none. if you do happen to notice anything i f'ed up please let me know. ill go hub shopping maybe tomorrow i guess.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your also pluging the hub into a 5vdc source right?
yes, its a powered hub that is plugged in. it is a http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817107609 and ive tested my soldering and work with a multimeter.
tbm48813 said:
yes, its a powered hub that is plugged in. it is a http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817107609 and ive tested my soldering and work with a multimeter.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you using a usb micro OTG adaptor, or just spliced the wires. Cause I think it needs a few pins on the usb micro side to be crossed. I haven't read into it enough.
(UPDATE) Looks like I was right the ID pin on the microusb has to be grounded.
callen81 said:
Are you using a usb micro OTG adaptor, or just spliced the wires. Cause I think it needs a few pins on the usb micro side to be crossed. I haven't read into it enough.
(UPDATE) Looks like I was right the ID pin on the microusb has to be grounded.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that must be it. im just using a gender changer with a regular micro cable not thinking the otg adapter was anything special. thank you. ill rewire.
http://blogs.forum.nokia.com/blog/kate-alholas-forum-nokia-blog/2008/01/21/usb-on-the-go This shows which pins to jump, nice pictures and breakdown to making a OTG cable.
didnt want to order a usb otg cable. so...
whatever it takes, right? hacked this together with crap laying around.
http://imgur.com/IqaW3
updated to 3.1
http://imgur.com/jRdtR
btw, this is on a wifi xoom.
Also, if anyone is curious, the red thing is a micro usb break out board from sparkfun. the other usb thing is a expansion slot from a old motherboard. just google it. SparkFun is down right now, but i think its this: http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/pro...ducts_id=10031.
Part Originally ordered cause of this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/arch.../t-819551.html
edit:
thought you might be interested in this too....
http://imgur.com/Ptg3H
http://imgur.com/rUIQq
this is connected directly to a Nikon D60 DSLR.
wonder what other cool **** i can plug into this
this is NOT a rooted device. yet. i want to see what it can do stock.
Diff between micro-A USB and the more common micro-B cable is that pin 5 is grounded in the first, and open in the second.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Serial_Bus#Human_interface_devices_.28HIDs.29
Short pin 5 to pin 4 to get the u-A (OTG) type. Many u-USB cables don't have pin 5 wired at all, so this may not work.
Otherwise, just buy one for a few bucks.
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?mpart=ZX40-A-5S-75-STDAJ
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/genuine-nokia-ca-157-micro-usb-otg-to-usb-data-cable-14cm-length-51045
I'm really happy that HC3.1 now has improved I/O (USB host, MTP/PTP).
Can you break it down for me? What exactly does it do?
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
Any ideas where one could buy one of these cables from?
http://www.meritline.com/micro-usb-type-b-male-to-usb-a-female-cable-black---p-62877.aspx
Oh, I guess I shouldn't hijack this thread.
Could anyone with an answer reply here please?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=992415&page=2
>Any ideas where one could buy one of these cables from?
Read above.
>What exactly does it do?
http://google.com/search?q=usb+otg
Effing awesome!!! was looking for this all night, fetched a couple old mobo's but couldn't find a "single" female usb plug, maybe I'm lucky tonight..
Good to see this thread.
e.mote said:
>Any ideas where one could buy one of these cables from?
Read above.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But those are the micro A cables... they will not fit into Xoom, will they?
By the way, will getting a female to female work for the OTG purpose?
So have the micro B male to normal A male plugged into female of female to female, so that the other side female is available for a usb device to plug into?
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...d=10314&cs_id=1031401&p_id=362&seq=1&format=2
Seems simple to me, but will it work? I might have a lot better chance of finding a female to female here than a micro usb OTG.
In case I didn't explain what I was talking about clearly, I made this diagram.
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
*Edit
I'm guessing the answer will be no... as the default cable is probably only designed to be used as host from the normal USB Side..
i.e. the 5th pin on the micro is floating?
But... Will it work if you had a switch built into the cable that toggles the state of the 5th wire between connected to 4th and floating?
So that you could use the same cable and switch between normal and OTG..
Sort of like this:
This would take a bit of trickery to get right, but then one would only need to carry one cable and a small female to female.
Ya, I suppose you could just buy one of these:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0..._m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=1VCNAYJJHNGVY48CAHKY
(although I'm not sure if this one will actually work as it says it is an adapter and doesn't mention OTG at all...)
But I think it is too bulky at the Xoom side and and I would worry about bumping it and snapping something off inside the Xoom.
Any ideas?
I might be completely wrong in how I understand this whole thing, so feel free to tell me so.
>But those are the micro A cables... they will not fit into Xoom, will they?
Form factor difference between micro-A & micro-B:
If Xoom supports OTG, its plug receptacle should be the micro-AB variety, i.e. it should accept both A & B connectors.
If Xoom only accepts the beveled connector of micro-B type, then it's not in-spec with respect to OTG. That said, there are cables/adapters labeled as OTG and yet have the beveled connector of the micro-B type. You just have to pay attention to the actual connector. It's all a bit hit-or-miss, since USB host on mobile devices is still rare, and implementations are somewhat ad hoc despite specs availability.
>will getting a female to female work for the OTG purpose?
Can't use micro-B cable (per your pic) if Xoom is to be host device. Get correct micro-A cable for your needs.
The adapter you linked to is a simple size converter; it doesn't allow OTG capability. What you're talking about is more like these,
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/micro-usb-on-the-go-host-otg-adapter-pair-50774 (micro OTG)
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/mini-usb-on-the-go-host-otg-adapter-2-pack-50944 (mini OTG)
Note: These haven't been verified to work, unlike the previously-linked Nokia OTG cable, which has been confirmed as OTG capable. Also, as you said, these can damage the port with an inadvertent bump.
Different devices need different connectors. Flash keys & USB HDDs need the USB-A female connector (for the other end). Digicams & cellphones require mini-USB male or micro-B USB male.
Ideally, you'd get three different OTG cables, each with micro-A on one end and micro/mini/regular connector on the other end. Practically, you can't find micro-A to mini-B types (at least from a cursory search), and will have to settle for one cable + two adapters to fit all three USB sizes.
Lastly, note that the host device (Xoom) needs to provide sufficient power, if slave device isn't self-powered. In many cases with micro-USB, there isn't enough power, even if said slave device is a flash key or card reader. As above, it's hit-or-miss.
As obvious, confusion factor is high for all this micro/mini/A/B/male/female beeswax. I suspect this will be resolved once tablets become more common, and the simplest way to resolve it is to use full-sized USB ports. When you think about it, the micro- form factor is a holdover from the smartphone, as there's no rationale for it to be on tablets. Ironically, cheap shenzhen tabs for now are most likely to sport full USB ports.
In short, buy whatever cable you need for the Xoom. But for your next tablet (if you care about USB connectivity), buy one with full-sized USB ports. It will save a lot of headache.
Hmm, previous reply is a little confusing. To simplify,
There are 3 instances when you want to use Xoom in host mode:
1. Connect to USB flash key, (self-powered) USB HDD - Get one of these below
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/genuine-nokia-ca-157-micro-usb-otg-to-usb-data-cable-14cm-length-51045
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?mpart=ZX40-A-5S-75-STDAJ
-or-
search eBay for USB OTG http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=usb+otg
2. Connect to USB periph w/ mini-USB port: Get cable in #1, plus a mini-USB male to USB-A male adapter,
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/usb-male-to-mini-usb-male-adapter-32709
3. Connect to a USB periph w/ micro-USB port: Get cable in #1, plus a micro-B USB male to USB-A male adapter,
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/usb-to-micro-usb-adapter-58818
To provide external power-assist for un-powered devices, get a Y-cable,
http://www.amazon.com/Male-Power-Sync-Cable-Drives/dp/B002ZUV9IK/
The Xoom only takes Micro USB B, as far as I know.
You can see so by looking at the shape of the port:
I think if you got a Micro B to female normal A you wouldn't need all those other cables, as they would already come with the normal A male to what ever male they required and the host connection would be the right way.
Do I have that right?
Thanks for your input, I appreciate it.
>I think if you got a Micro B to female normal A you wouldn't need all those other cables, as they would already come with the normal A male
You can't use a normal micro-B cable, as it doesn't have OTG (pin 5 not grounded). The USB-A connector at the other end is irrelevant.
Given the Xoom can't take a micro-A connector, you'd have to find an OTG cable that uses the micro-B shell. I'd avoid using an adapter for reasons already mentioned. Since this has come up in this forum before, I'm sure solutions have already been found.
Via http://www.google.com/search?q=xoom+usb+otg+cable+site:xda-developers.com
and via http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=11997885
comes the apparent solution,
http://cgi.ebay.com/Micro-USB-Host-Cable-Nokia-N810-OTG-go-N-810-/250817547531
looks like the Nokia N810 OTG cable has the beveled micro-B connector. Credit goes to the OPs.
Awesome, thanks.
I bought that one from ebay that you suggested. It looks like the right one, in the picture it has a micro B male.
And they will even ship it here, for free. I'm amazed.
Will post results here. Thanks so much for your help.
Suggest also this cable if you're planning to hook up USB HDDs or digicams w/ mini-USB port. The Y-cable allows external power assist.
http://cgi.ebay.com/USB-2-0-Mini-5-Pin-Male-Data-Power-PC-HDD-Y-Cable-/130498137552
I'm confused.....
Will this fork for connecting a keyboard with my xoom when I get the update?
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/genuine-nokia-ca-157-micro-usb-otg-to-usb-data-cable-14cm-length-51045
And if not please please link me to one, as I have been looking forever but keep finding ****.
The eBay link you sent i can't see because I'm on my xoom and it just loads mobile.
Sent from my Xoom using XDA App
Work... not fork
Sent from my Xoom using XDA App
RadDudeTommy said:
I'm confused.....
Will this fork for connecting a keyboard with my xoom when I get the update?
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/genuine-nokia-ca-157-micro-usb-otg-to-usb-data-cable-14cm-length-51045
And if not please please link me to one, as I have been looking forever but keep finding ****.
The eBay link you sent i can't see because I'm on my xoom and it just loads mobile.
Sent from my Xoom using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No that won't work because that has a Micro A male and the Xoom only takes Micro B.
The ebay one is the one that works:
To view non-mobile, type in about:debug in the address bar and hit enter, it will look like nothing happened, then go to menu>settings>debug>UAString and change it from Android to Desktop. Then reopen the ebay link. It will reset to mobile every FC or when you restart your Xoom. But each time after you just need to type about:debug, it will remember the UAString setting.
But this is also a link to the same type of cable:
Meritline
Although they seem to be out of stock at the moment.
Hope this helps.
Tanks a lot
Sent from my Xoom using XDA App
I too connected my camera to the Xoom and it was recognized right away. I just wish it transferred the files automatically instead of manually. Anyway, I posted this link in another thread but in case it was missed, this is the Ebay seller I got my OTG cable from and it works for me:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Micro-USB-Host-...=260760886893&ps=63&clkid=9130826876118408283
e.mote said:
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/genuine-nokia-ca-157-micro-usb-otg-to-usb-data-cable-14cm-length-51045
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for pointing to this cable! So now I ordered 2 even here in Poland we dont have much of "OTG" "Y" etc available ... at least they are hard to find.
Now I'm thinking on powering it.
I know we can use Y cable and powered usb hub.
But I'd like to have mobile solution.
I was thinking to pay someone (I dont have any tools and knowledge) to modify the nokia cable.
What do you think of buying a battery pack, that can output 5V / 500mA (I thing this is usb standard?) and connect it somehow directly to the nokia cable?
XOOM does not power the usb cable/ right? to there are 2 wires that should supply power, but they dont? What if we could just plug the power into them?
This is just an idea and I dont even know which wires to plug into
If anyone of You know what I'm talking about please comment on this... Thanks!
niematunikogo said:
Thanks for pointing to this cable!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That one won't fit into the Xoom.
You are going to have to try file the Micro A to fit into the Micro B port, as one of the other members of the forum has done, or get another cable.
Your cable end:
Micro USB A
The Xoom Micro B Port:
The difference between the 2:
Sorry man
Over in this post Cellzealot opined that I might be willing to share the pinout of the "factory cable" clone that I worked up. I absolutely am, but needed to find several hours of free time to do the writeup, images, etc.
The other night I set aside the time and did the writeup. If you would like to make your own cable, you can read the writeup here.
To oversimplify it, here is the map:
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
The map is simple enough. The main problem (as detailed in the writeup I linked to above) is that since pin 4 is normally unused in a Mini/Micro B connector, there is no wire connected to it (to tie to), and in the case of the Mini B that I surgically dissected, the actual pin for pin 4 was nipped off at the back of the connector as well.
This doesn't preclude you from making a cable as you can always order brand new connectors and solder them up any way you like.
I'll be happy to answer any questions you might have in this topic.
great guide
Thanks for linking this to us! This would be tremendously useful to many on this forum. My question is, since the docks Motorola sells basically do the same thing, could the process be applied like callen81 did to make USB host functionality? It seems like the same process is used, albeit simpler.
Or just buy a USB 3.0 cable!
ya i picked up like three for like 1.50 each. monoprice.com has alot of cables for super cheap, good quality too
edit, i also got the 10 footers so i dont have to be bounded to the 4 footer that comes with it
Moved to proper forum.
Guys, a factory cable is not like the micro USB cables you buy, nor the standard "OTG" micro usb cables/adapters to become USB host.
Notice that PIN4 is tied to POWER, the +5V on PIN1, not to ground on PIN5 as in OTG cables (or left floating like on most mini/micro cables.)
This cable is essentially for being able to nvflash the phone, although perhaps it has other uses I am unaware of.
eval- said:
Guys, a factory cable is not like the micro USB cables you buy, nor the standard "OTG" micro usb cables/adapters to become USB host.
Notice that PIN4 is tied to POWER, the +5V on PIN1, not to ground on PIN5 as in OTG cables (or left floating like on most mini/micro cables.)
This cable is essentially for being able to nvflash the phone, although perhaps it has other uses I am unaware of.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It can also be used to charge the phone while flashing SBF.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA App
eval- said:
Guys, a factory cable is not like the micro USB cables you buy, nor the standard "OTG" micro usb cables/adapters to become USB host.
Notice that PIN4 is tied to POWER, the +5V on PIN1, not to ground on PIN5 as in OTG cables (or left floating like on most mini/micro cables.)
This cable is essentially for being able to nvflash the phone, although perhaps it has other uses I am unaware of.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
isn't it also possible to use a usb keyboard with this method given that you have a usb powering hub in the middle?
The most useful thing to do at this point would be linking places that sell easily modified cables / adapters. As he said 99% of cables you find will not have the 5th wire connected or soldered on to the connector. Even if I had a cable or source of cables that had an easily solderable 5th pin this cable would be decently cheap to make. Most of the space cables I've hacked apart just have 4 solder points and a 'dummy' pin #4 (what, to look cool?) sigh.
bearsfan172 said:
It can also be used to charge the phone while flashing SBF.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't say for the Atrix, but for every other phone I've used the cable on, while it will power the phone while flashing, it will not charge the phone while flashing.
eval- said:
Guys, a factory cable is not like the micro USB cables you buy, nor the standard "OTG" micro usb cables/adapters to become USB host.
Notice that PIN4 is tied to POWER, the +5V on PIN1, not to ground on PIN5 as in OTG cables (or left floating like on most mini/micro cables.)
They do indeed have many uses
This cable is essentially for being able to nvflash the phone, although perhaps it has other uses I am unaware of.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They do indeed have many other uses besides the nvflash interface which is strictly for Tegra based devices. They not only power the device without battery, but autoload the Motorola networking driver and other interfaces for diagnostic mode NV access with both Motorola and Qualcomm service ware as well as flash tools like RSD Lite.
The device is always initialized properly and identified by the applications for various operations.
Similar powered cables have been used for all P2K generation Motorola devices for many years in various configurations. The real factory cables are made with a Mini USB B end and come with an adapter so they are compatible across a much wider range of older devices.
We hope very much that getting this info out will generate a lot of outflow for the many ways to apply the unique properties of these cables for newer devices.
In another topic Kholk had an idea that does away with the "missing pin 4 on the micro" problem. You can sacrifice a Motorola Mini-to-Micro USB adapter (SKN6252) which is wired for all 5 pins. This makes it a heck of a lot easier for the average Joe to make one and avoid the expense of buying a custom-made cable.
For most folks that would try this, that tip is all they need to proceed. If you want more detail, I did a step by step here.
If you make one up, post up and let me know how it went.
Enjoy!
MotoCache1 said:
In another topic Kholk had an idea that does away with the "missing pin 4 on the micro" problem. You can sacrifice a Motorola Mini-to-Micro USB adapter (SKN6252) which is wired for all 5 pins. This makes it a heck of a lot easier for the average Joe to make one and avoid the expense of buying a custom-made cable.
For most folks that would try this, that tip is all they need to proceed. If you want more detail, I did a step by step here.
If you make one up, post up and let me know how it went.
Enjoy!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm working on making my own, just to see if it'll work. I think it's going to turn out more frankenstein-y than yours, however.
PixoNova said:
I'm working on making my own, just to see if it'll work. I think it's going to turn out more frankenstein-y than yours, however.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cool. I'd love to see it when you're done (if you wouldn't mind posting a pic). As long as you get the pinout right, it will work. Your attempt can't possibly be worse than my initial prototype was. If you have an SKN6252 lying around, you could actually make a pretty respectable looking cable.
Where can you buy one of these if your not good at soldering??
Make a friend who is good at soldering.
Does anyone know why Moto is allowed to call their connector USB when they don't comply to USB.ORG's standards and do things their own way?
cellzealot said:
They do indeed have many other uses besides the nvflash interface which is strictly for Tegra based devices. They not only power the device without battery, but autoload the Motorola networking driver and other interfaces for diagnostic mode NV access with both Motorola and Qualcomm service ware as well as flash tools like RSD Lite.
The device is always initialized properly and identified by the applications for various operations.
Similar powered cables have been used for all P2K generation Motorola devices for many years in various configurations. The real factory cables are made with a Mini USB B end and come with an adapter so they are compatible across a much wider range of older devices.
We hope very much that getting this info out will generate a lot of outflow for the many ways to apply the unique properties of these cables for newer devices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Moto has been using nonstandard USB cables since they came out, many of which were dumb devices. The reasoning that they needed to be different so that they can do X Y or Z is bull. They want to lock you into Moto cables. No one has ever shown a logical reason for being different. You can flash phones with regular USB cables so the logic for a different format holds no validity.
Does this mean we could make one of these cables and have the phone "think" its either docked in the car or in the HD dock? I assume for the HD dock you might need added power but why cant I make a USB cable, plug it into my phone and hook up a USB hub to it like the dock?
not to hi-jack but it would be interesting to see if anyone has made their own docks, somehow the 3.5mm audio is integrated into the dock and is played through the usb cable...
Using the factory cable, Not insert the battery, display SVF: 105:1:2
Failed to boot 0x1000, infinite reboot
I haven't ordered a Nexus 7 yet, as I need to get this question answered. I have read the OTG thread in general, but no answers to this.
Since OTG is now working, if you use a Y cable, can you charge while playing media off of a thumb drive?
I want to use the nexus to replace my in car dash mountEd Samsung galaxy tab 7, and 16 gigs isn't enough space (podcasts, [video and audio] and my music), and I need it to be able to charge while driving.
Thanks in advance.
Sent from my ADR6425LVW using Tapatalk 2
It sounds like it would work, but I've never seen a Y usb cable, only usb hubs.
Sent from my R800i using xda app-developers app
There are a lot of them.
http://www.amazon.com/Apricorn-Power-Adapter-Cable-AUSB-Y/dp/B000JIOHDE
There is an example. Plug one end into the charger, the USB thumb drive into the female end, and the other into the USB OTG dongle.
Sent from my ADR6425LVW using Tapatalk 2
RED ZMAN said:
There are a lot of them.
http://www.amazon.com/Apricorn-Power-Adapter-Cable-AUSB-Y/dp/B000JIOHDE
There is an example. Plug one end into the charger, the USB thumb drive into the female end, and the other into the USB OTG dongle.
Sent from my ADR6425LVW using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.amazon.com/Utstarcom-Uni...=1342116083&sr=1-1&keywords=usb+power+y+cable
http://www.cellphoneshop.net/usbycable.html
Here are some cheaper versions
Off the top of my head, the cables listed won't work as-is.
USB OTG is a male micro plug to female USB receptacle.
The Y cables have the requisite 2 male ends and one female, but they are connected wrong.
(I own several different ones, and they are all wired the same way, so I'm assuming that will be the case for a majority of these types of cables...)
These are desired to draw data & power from one of the male plugs, as well as drawing power from the second male plug. The female plug receives the data and the increased power from the second plug.
You would need a cable that actually has a male where those have female, and replaces the existing data/power male with a female.
(The more times I read that, the less sense it makes to me, so please let me know if more clarification is needed...)
Guys, that's just the first cable I found what I searched the Internet for a USB Y cable from my phone.
Thanks for your input though.
The question still stands, with the appropriate cables will it charge while you access data from a memory card?
I'm told this setup will work on the galaxy tab, I just want to know if it will work before I buy one.
Sent from my ADR6425LVW using Tapatalk 2
Now that these are arriving and in some peoples hands, can someone try this for me please?
Sent from my ADR6425LVW using Tapatalk 2
This is exactly a question I asked in general q&a. I would also love to know this as I was thinking about doing this.
Sent from my SGH-I777 using xda app-developers app
Eagletec H10A USB OTG
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
Would this work, it seems to have a micro usb which I assume is a through power for changing and maybe would power usb hd?
Unknown.
I'm really surprised barely anyone is interested in this question...
Sent from my ADR6425LVW using Tapatalk 2
this is my understanding
otg usb take pin 4 and ground to pin 5, that's all that's special about them, and doesn't mess with the vcc (power wire)
however since the N7 is powering devices downstream, then also sending power upstream can damage the device...
i use the y-cable+power setup for my kindle fire because the usb port doesn't supply enough power, all it does is provide enough to power the device so the KF can read it
maybe we'll get this when we can use the pogo plugs
good reading in these threads:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1613536
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1712117
@twobikes - there's a button on the top there that switches it from usb host to usb slave (thus turning off otg), which allows it to charge
twobikes said:
Would this work, it seems to have a micro usb which I assume is a through power for changing and maybe would power usb hd?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have something exactly like that, didn't work.
Bump, anyone try yet?
Sent from my ADR6425LVW using Tapatalk 2
it works on samsung S3 with a usb hub i can connect a 160gb HDD wireless keyboard tongle and mouse and charge it at the same time why this should work for the N7 ??? /i will get on tomorrow afternoon then i can report
cazzo69 said:
it works on samsung S3 with a usb hub i can connect a 160gb HDD wireless keyboard tongle and mouse and charge it at the same time why this should work for the N7 ??? /i will get on tomorrow afternoon then i can report
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey, that adapter that was posted above works for you? OTG and Charge at same time. I really need your reply. Thank you.
May be in the future, modder can modify Nexus 7' s kernel n add sth which make OTG cable work.
I'm not sure, because I've not received my N7 yet, but I think it will works
Sent from my MI-ONE Plus using xda premium
The VCC pin supplies energy to device from Android, right?
If we plug the VCC pin of the Android in a external source and the VCC pin of the device in another, sure, don't closing the circuit of VCC from Android to device, and supplying 5v, it will work, charging Android and using OTG function?
I was wondering if some kind of "jerry-rigged" solution, almost "doing a MacGyver on it" haha, would work.
* Please note the image is only for explanation, this is not a valid configuration, is totally fictitious.
I remember the problem with xperia arc before that using usb otg y-cable does not charge the phone. I even made one myself. It must have been the standard usb spec not to accept voltage in vbus when in host mode. But the xperia dock can charge and usb host at the same time. There is some sort of circuitry inside but none has posted a disassembly yet. I am guessing the current might have been pulsed via pwm.
My cheap china tablet won't do both either. It has two usb ports but only one hosts (but not charging), the other guests and charges.
The samsung has a proprietary port with many pins so it is irrelevant.
Yes the LiveDock charges and enable OTG at the same time.
This pic is from a member:
http://dl.xda-developers.com/attach...01fc2c2/1/1/0/4/0/1/7/IMG_20120603_234200.jpg
Is the LiveDock circuit board.
Hi,
I'm making this thread because i have seen alot of bricks for this phone including my own. What seems to be most annoying is, my phone boots, shows LG Logo splash and after that completely black screen whereas flashing the Mako (Nexus4) Rom via LGNPST works, it boots without any issues. So the idea is to see the startup log and identify whats been causing the problem in actual.
The UART pads on this phone are completely not made to be accessible by normal means and below is an attached pic of the same
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
As you can see, the molex is just barely a cm long and contains 15pads on each side. The problem is however, m not very much familiar with UART/Serial stuff. I have hooked up a serial connection with the pogoplug sometimes back and all m aware of is basic programs used and Profilic USB-Serial converter (Nokia CA-42 Data cable in mycase). Right now i'm having a USB-RSR232(Com Port) converter at my place and i'm unable to get any outputs to putty/terminal. Any info regarding this will be hugely appreciated.
I know nothing about the specifics of this phone,
but be aware that many UART interfaces are not at 5V levels but at 3.3V, 2V or lower.
What does a voltmeter say on the TXD pin?
I got my Nook's kernel console UART working using a home-brew/cheesy RS-232 converter.
I don't even remember what the levels are, but it works fine.
Thanks for the reply, i will to gather the readings later today. One more question, the current Signal converter m having right now i.e, USB-RS232 will work or do i need to get anything else?
If I read that correctly, you only have a USB to RS-232 converter?
Regular RS-232 swings at least + and - 5V and will blow things out.
A "data cable" usually uses "TTL level" which swings between ground and some fraction of +5V, maybe 3.5V, 2.8 being the nominal threshold.
I've got one for a GPS puck that uses a Prolific chip.
I've used that as a debugger hookup for an ATMega32u4 which runs on 5V.
Nowadays I have a couple of transistors on a board for going from my Nook to a regular PC RS-232 input.
Below readings were taken with battery and USB cable connected.
TX- 0.03v ~ 1.65v
RX- 0.03v ~1.65v
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i'm having a Profilic USB-Serial converter which is having a USB type B connector and a com port connector on each sides. I'm only connecting the RX and TX wires on the phone's board to gain direct access to UART rather than using USB type data cable. Phone is powered by USB and battery.
If you want a pre-fab solution you can use a Bus Pirate:
http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Bus_Pirate
That will handle low voltage.
The thing is, even at 115.2 kbaud, your signal is so low speed that you don't have to get that serious.
When you are talking about the USB connected, do you mean the phone's USB adapter?
Those TXD & RXD readings were measured with nothing connected?
funkym0nk3y said:
I'm only connecting the RX and TX wires on the phone's board to gain direct access to UART rather than using USB type data cable. Phone is powered by USB and battery.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should connect ground of the phone with ground of your serial-converter/PC.
Ground is connected from the PC, i have tried with connecting ground from riff box, no help.
Renate NST said:
If you want a pre-fab solution you can use a Bus Pirate:
http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Bus_Pirate
That will handle low voltage.
The thing is, even at 115.2 kbaud, your signal is so low speed that you don't have to get that serious.
When you are talking about the USB connected, do you mean the phone's USB adapter?
Those TXD & RXD readings were measured with nothing connected?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
RXD and TXD readings were taken with both USB cable from PC and battery connected.
btw how did you find/identify the UART-pins and why are sure that you have the correct pins?
I'm very interested in this process because I have an Xiaomi MI2 with nearly the same hardware.
i located them using the service manual so m indeed sure they are correct.
M having this converter
and i guess that is perfect for serial output, but the thing is m still unable to get any outputs from the phone, i'm attaching the svc manual for the same incase some1 is willing to help out.
http://d-h.st/agQ
The UART is accessible via 3.5mm earphone jack in Nexus 4 and not in any of the og variants.
Well, your adapter is fine and dandy, but I don't see any photos of a level shifter.
If you connect some of the DB9 pins on that adapter to something inside your cell phone you are going to blow something up.
See this post for a photo of my setup: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=35328483&postcount=11
Hey, thanks for the reply, m not connecting the pin9. M just connecting the pin2 and pin3 on rx and tx pads of my phone,below is a pic of my current setup.
That last photo does not look like the first photo.
I'm not talking about pin #9, I am talking about the 9-pin connector.
Yes, you should be using pins #2, #3 & #5 but don't connect them directly to your phone!
What comes out of the 9-pin connector is higher voltage that will blow out the circuits on your phone.
You measured it yourself, the phone works on levels less than 2 volts.
Now measure what is coming out of the 9 pin connector.
Scary, eh?
You need a level shifter.
Besides the voltages being different, the polarity is different.
I guess this should be fine ?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-JY-MCU-...157?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5aebfc73f5
funkym0nk3y said:
I guess this should be fine?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, that is a [5V logic level] <=> [3.3V logic level] converter.
What's coming out of the 9-pin connector is [RS-232 level].
What your phone wants apparently is [2.5V logic level]
So what you need is a [2.5V logic level] <=> [RS-232 level] converter that inverts.
Here, in summary are the logic standards:
Code:
Standard Zero One
---------- ---- -----
RS-232 5.0V -5.0V (notice that this signal goes [b]minus[/b])
Cheesy 5.0V 0.0V (we're cheesy and don't have a minus supply)
5V logic 0.0V 5.0V
3.3V logic 0.0V 3.3V
2.5V logic 0.0V 2.5V
If you have a "USB data cable" that uses "TTL levels" [5V logic level]
then all you would need would be a [5V logic level] <=> [2.5V logic level] converter.
If you want to stick with your 9-pin adapter you will have to have something that converts from/to [RS-232 level].
If you were building this thing seriously, you would use a MAX232 chip or something that would convert from/to [5V level].
If you were going to be cheesy, you can drive your 9-pin connector with [Cheesy level].
This is logic which does not meet the spec for [RS-232] level but is "good enough" to work.
I mean, what is it that you want out of this? 90% is to get a log out while booting.
Then you only have to do one side of the deal, a [2.5V level] => [Cheesy level] that inverts.
Enough for now...
Reading this thread, I'd be surprised if you have not already blown-up something in your phone. Randomly connecting HW to the inside of your phone without knowing the difference of +/- 15V RS-232 levels and 1.8V CMOS logic is a sure killer!
But if its still working...here are a few comments:
1. We'd need to see the entire PCB, to help you identify the proper UART ports.
2. If it's based on Qualcomm, and anything similar to their reference design, you probably don't even need to go inside to get debug output. You might be able to get it via a modified micro-USB jig...
3. You say you have schematics, why don't you post that instead?
4. Get yourself a proper serial cable, ASAP. (You will for sure find other occasions where it is useful.) I always preach for the FTDI products...
5. The port you show, look like a JTAG port...or is it a strip-connector?
6. Never, ever, solder directly to your PCB, use connectors!
Nothing is damaged, i already measured the voltage coming out from rx and tx of the converter which i connected with the phone, however i was not aware that i might need to use a level shifter and m sure that might be the deal breaker. Anyway, i got my phone running after 3weeks and would like to use it normally for sometime now, i will be doing the this again once i get the proper setup at my place. Also the UART ports are correct as they are obtained by the service manual.
I have posted the service manual in the thread to avoid all the confusions already. Finding the receptacles is not easy for me as i'm unable to find them locally or online, samsung receptacles are easily available here in my country but they aren't seems suitable for this molex thats the only reason i did soldering on the molex legs itself.. Yes you are correct, the port which is posted is a jtag port and the wires connected are coming from my jtagbox.