Database Users

ROM makers: Want a different host for your files?

For the last 6 months I've been hosting files for developers in the Eris section. I made the site to people wouldn't have to use all that MultiUpload crap, got sick of the waiting 60 seconds to download a file, entering a verification code, etc etc.
Anyways, the site's worked well. You can direct link to your files, upload everything via a simple web interface.
I just thought I'd offer the site to developers in other forums now.
http://android.grdlock.net
Anyways, if you're interested in using it to host your files, just make a username on the site real quick, shoot me a PM, and I'll give it upload permissions.
And no, this isn't an advertisement or anything. People in the Eris section have just liked using the website over MultiUpload, so I thought I'd offer to let other people use my bandwidth as well.

I got yelled at by the mods for posting something similar a while back. Seems like they don't like you pimping your site, even though I wasn't making any money off it either.

pieter3d said:
I got yelled at by the mods for posting something similar a while back. Seems like they don't like you pimping your site, even though I wasn't making any money off it either.
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Click to collapse
The mods in the Eris section fully approved and encouraged it. They said as long as it's not a site that would compete with XDA (ie: a site with news, a forum, tutorials, etc) it was fine, and it's not... it's just a file host, nothing more.
If mods in this section don't like it, I apologize, feel free to delete the thread.

Damn, you beat me by like less than a day... I just bought androidfiles.org to do the same kind of thing with.

Now you can use that as a redirect to Gridlock's site, lol.

GrdLock is the tits. I was an Eris user. no doubt the man.

From an end user's standpoint I say...thanks.

(ATTN)ROM Hosting(DEVS)

So for quite some time, there has always been issues and complaints about users not being able to download roms from the links posted by the devs on new releases and/or updates (4shared, Rapid share, Mega upload to name a few)
with that being said they are always complaining and begging for someone who gets a complete download to re-upload with a mirror, to make their lives easier...understandable. But if there's one thing I know, "Most" devs hate it when users fill their threads up with a bunch of links...why? well that’s simple:
It confuses others (especially noobs) as to which link is the correct one and the one intended for download by the OP. This means that if someone put a faulty link/mirror that contained a bad file, un-signed zip, or their own custom version of the rom/mod that they decided to play "dev" with and screwed it up rendering it full of bugs...the Dev and/or OP has to deal with the complaints when that user comes back to post. Leaving him confused and dumbfounded as to what the hell they are talking about because nobody else is reporting these issues.
Download count just so happens to be very important to a lot of devs. It gives them a general idea of how many users are flashing their work, which can not only make them feel appreciated and needed by the community because of all the attention...but also create a ratio of problems to success. Example, 300 users download, only 50 come back to report bugs, the rest either don't post at all (I call them ghost readers) or give good feedback. Now, out of that 50 only 7 reported bugs can be legitimately confirmed, which means the other 43 people either did not follow directions clearly, or already had some other stuff going on that effected their experience. Why are these numbers important? Because, if the numbers of bugs are high...the dev knows to update quickly and correct things, if the number of user errors are high...the dev knows he needs to re-adjust his instructions or make them more clear and descriptive so that nobody misunderstands. And if the number of successful flashes are high...well...you know. And all of this can be based on number of downloads...which other users screw up when they post their own links!
Lost and forgotten is what all these mirrors, linked threads/topics, and uploaded fixes by random users become when the topic is over populated (especially big named threads like Eugene, CM, Wes Garner etc). So if the thread has 105 pages and an important link was dropped by a user that proved to be helpful way back on say...page 23! How in the hell is anyone who hasn't been following the entire topic to know that? And nobody in their right mind, who has a life, is going to sit there and skim all 105 pages. So if you must, or feel, that you have a useful link pertaining specifically to the topic that can help others, the best resolution would be to PM it to the OP, so that they can update the first post where all users can easily refer back to if need be.
Now with the why covered, let's move on the the what. And the what is what I have to offer:
A hosting service that I paid for out of my own pocket. This is my way of contributing to the community, as I do not offer donations, sorry. But for the exchange of helpful information, resources, mods, and great roms! I hereby offer all devs, and I do mean DEVS ONLY (yes that includes themers) the use of this hosting service is at no cost to them.
How beneficial is this you ask?​
For Devs:
unlimited online storage space for all zips, rar's, and other files that are specifically related to the xda development (No personal storage like mp3's, movies, and family portrait please)
direct download links! No pop-ups, No ads, No human text box verifications
unlimited links- they never run out of time or number of downloads they will stay on the internet forever!!!! (or until you remove it)
Detailed info- keeps track of number of clicks, page views, downloads, you name it, you get your own personal page to view this statistics at any time
No size limit! Big or small, you upload it all (multiple uploads at once supported as well) I have not seen anything in any of these forums over 200mb...so if you're running up 1-2 gigs of use in a matter of days I will be investingating your usage!
For users
No more 4shared yay! Lol
No time wait (30 secs, 90 secs or whatever) Downloads start immediately after clicking the link!
No pop-up or separate browser pages to go to, download starts without the need to open a new page or tab, so you can easily continue on reading through the forum you are in
Links are never broken-they will always work until the OP removes it
No signing up, no memberships.. paid or free, just download. Same benefit as downloading links uploaded directly through Xda, except you don't have to be logged in to click these!
To keep things under control and fair I will only allow 3 request per week for access to this service. I'm not sure how many devs are registered and active but I'm quite sure there are a lot. Eventually all devs who are interested will have the opportunity, but for my own conveyance I will only take 3 request a week, because I will not be online everyday to take all request, this also give me the time to help each individual to get set-up and answer any questions they may have.
I do not discriminate by phone make or model. All devs are welcome to this offer regardless of what phone they developed for. However; I will only post this thread here in the Vibrant forums, well, because that's the phone I use. But Mods are more than welcome to sticky it or link the word to other locations so that all devs can read. My only rules are:
Must be and already have been a member of XDA for at least one year.
Must provide at least two links to their work contributed here in the xda forums
Must have a valid email address and/or twitter account. (simply so that I can contact and update you if any changes or problems occur)
Must only use this service for the development of roms/themes/mods. Please do not take advantage of my kind heart, and use this hosting service for your own personal purpose, I will know, and I will take away privileges.
How to sign up for this?​
Simply PM me if you are interested... with the above^^ requirements, and I will give you all the details and instructions you need.​
Unfortunately, I will not start taking request until Monday of next week, a relative has just passed away a couple of days ago, and I am closing a deal on a new home, trying to fit time for a funeral, and moving all in one week can be a headache. But you are welcome to start sending me request if you like, but as I said I will only deal with 3 at a time. So if you send a request and don't hear back, please do not continue sending me your inquiry. Your voice has been heard and will be responded as soon as I get to you. Thank you.

Wow, I'm not a dev or anything like that but this is real nice of you. Kudos to you sir.
Working in the er its nice to know when your help is appreciated. So thank you.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

bguzmanz2 said:
Wow, I'm not a dev or anything like that but this is real nice of you. Kudos to you sir.
Working in the er its nice to know when your help is appreciated. So thank you.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Click to expand...
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+1
This will not only help the devs, but the forum community in general, making it much more easier on both ends, so i thank you for this. Kudos to you.

TL;DR
You might also want to post this in the Dev sub-forum too. It's over here --> Vibrant Android Development.
Thanks for providing the service.

I hope you have some serious monthly download allowences. I do some hosting not related to XDA and I'm easily pushing 30Gig a month, which spikes even more depending on releases.
What your doing is awesome none the less.
If you find that you are pushing some serious downloads you could always turn some builds into torrents and use your machine as the master seed and let others help out that want to help out. Lord knows my machine at home has been seeding many Linux builds over the past months.
http://burnbit.com/

Not to disrespect you in any form or way, I appreciate this thread to the developers but this idea has been made quite a while ago since the first-generation of Android phone (G1).
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=665957
AndroidSPIN has been around for a long time and has provided hosting for developers and their ROMs as well as a pretty organized database.

zephiK said:
Not to disrespect you in any form or way, I appreciate this thread to the developers but this idea has been made quite a while ago since the first-generation of Android phone (G1).
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=665957
AndroidSPIN has been around for a long time and has provided hosting for developers and their ROMs as well as a pretty organized database.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, I already know this. But please understand this is specifically for xda...androidspin is its own website in itself, also still has its limitations as well as ads and opens new pages/tabs for downloads. My service does not do that, and is without limits.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

That is very helpful, and I appreciate it. But no I have no monthly cap, and I pay for my services once per year.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
kizer said:
I hope you have some serious monthly download allowences. I do some hosting not related to XDA and I'm easily pushing 30Gig a month, which spikes even more depending on releases.
What your doing is awesome none the less.
If you find that you are pushing some serious downloads you could always turn some builds into torrents and use your machine as the master seed and let others help out that want to help out. Lord knows my machine at home has been seeding many Linux builds over the past months.
http://burnbit.com/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

Kudos to you sir
Sent from my Samsung Vibrant

try it and soon you will get email from your hosting company of over usage. Unlimited in your contract means nothing.
They might make you pay for overusage by saying that you abused their network.

Klyentel said:
That is very helpful, and I appreciate it. But no I have no monthly cap, and I pay for my services once per year.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Congrats I wish I had an unlimited bandwith host. I can get away with gigs of storage, but they caped me around 60gig a month.
Anyways hope it works out.

good luck, ive tried this a few times but seems like devs like those crappy upload sites. i'm gonna take a guess and say you are on a site like hostgator or something with "unlimited" bandwidth, watch it cuz its only unlimited untill you use to much resources.

Just an idea.
Why don't we create a distributed system using available tools/software like torrent files.
We need one or more torrent server/tracker and list of volunteers to be reliable seeders. Once you sign as a seeder, you will receive a list of # files you'll seed 24/7 until you receive an updated list.
I don't mind seeding 5-10 files 24/7.
We can retire any file at any time if there is no interest and archive it.
By archiving i mean switch to more "standard" way of hosting it like http or ftp access.
And when a new release is out the downloading will be even faster.

Scam warning, please read

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1083280
Please read and help fight! This guy is a thief and deserves to be shut down. Please help out the smartphone community!
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA Premium App

I agree this is extremely shady and should be discontinued...
Yes, there's a "but"...
The guy has no links, no information, no purpose for the money other than "it gets you full access". Once full access is achieved, presumably, one can then access the forums.
It seems as though he's charging money to allow access into a message board and not specifically to access ROMs.
Only a fool would purchase access to a forums which contains information freely available anywhere else with a little searching.

othan1 said:
I agree this is extremely shady and should be discontinued...
Yes, there's a "but"...
The guy has no links, no information, no purpose for the money other than "it gets you full access". Once full access is achieved, presumably, one can then access the forums.
It seems as though he's charging money to allow access into a message board and not specifically to access ROMs.
Only a fool would purchase access to a forums which contains information freely available anywhere else with a little searching.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. It makes me really pissed because he has einherjar roms/mods/themes behind his donation wall. All of us at EDT put way too much hard work and countless hours into our work. And to have some punk ***** steal it, charge people for it, and claim its his own work by editing the build prop, really gets under my skin.This goes for all devs/teams. I speak for all of them.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA Premium App

I support your cause, what this guy is doing is wrong. If he posts ANYTHING related to donation requirements on XDA then notify a senior mod and have his ass escorted to the door. Both promoting outside sites that are designed to compete directly with XDA and requiring donations is strictly against the rules. He's treading in waist high water here...
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

Dan_Brutal said:
Agreed. It makes me really pissed because he has einherjar roms/mods/themes behind his donation wall. All of us at EDT put way too much hard work and countless hours into our work. And to have some punk ***** steal it, charge people for it, and claim its his own work by editing the build prop, really gets under my skin.This goes for all devs/teams. I speak for all of them.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And you have every right to deny anyone distribution rights to your product. So I'm behind you on this and will spread the word as I can.
Is there anything in the licensing for open source (GPL?) that can be done to send this person a C&D letter prior to lawsuits?

Why this guy?? When you have things like Appl**et pirating every Android app, hes small time.

Why this guy?? When you have things like Appl**et pirating every Android app, hes small time.
**Sorry about the double post, cant delete a post i guess.

Don't know if anyone knows this but he's also using fake users to post positive comments on his YouTube site. I researched this. For example, the user 'sfanua42' was used to post the following comment 4 weeks ago,
"THIS GUY RIGHT HERE IS THE BEST YOUTUBER/ CUSTOMER SERVICE GUY EVER! I RATE ***** ."
Clicking on this user brings up a profile that was created 4 weeks ago and hasn't been used in 4 weeks. It's also devoid of any user information whatsoever. He's a scam artist right down to the dotted line. I'm truly disgusted by this and hope something can be done about it and I feel for the original developers involved in the works available on his site.

To all devs and xda..

First i want to start by saying im sorry that you all are not understanding what the 5 bucks is for . its hard to find things on the net and in the forums. When i first started i came here to xda i soft bircked my phone from a rom so i asked for help here and got yelled at, called names and told im posting in the wrong room . I didnt know, but still someone could of helped me instead i was made fun of and laughed at for my spelling here at xda . so i went out and found out alot about phones made a couple videos and poof everyone found me ....i was helping so many people, my phone was none stop ringing but i picked up . i helped them out by telling people where to go, how to get what they want was hard so i made a site it was free all day up intill 5 months ago . see the site was coasting me 250 a month that i did not have but people still needed help they tryed to come here but people where mean cuzz where noobs . so thats why at akaskriller.com it coast 5 bucks . everyone knows these roms are free on the net there not paying for the roms there paying for a just cause for helping people in need no matter what . for the roms i put out i say i hacked theme or themed them out . its fun to theme them out and help people ..
so im sorry if u all got it wrong and i give back to the devs that i take the most calls on lol but for real you all stop being silly and saying bad things about me.
and we pay peoples bills that can not ... ask your selfs y do you all care so much what others do for help?

seriously? why hide the roms behind donations then? why not post it freely and market it as a pay support site? why post paid apps for free behind the donation? why not post it all for no donation at all and post a link for 5.00 a month tech support? i'm certain this thread will be locked in no time and look forward to the humiliation headed your way.

I do not accept your apology. You are a fraud. You stole peoples work to make money
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA Premium App

it doesn't matter your logic for any of that.
1) you cannot advertise anything that has a registration/paywall on xda, it's against the forum rules (it's the same reason we don't see posts by samfirmware stuff anymore, even though we all know about it)
2) you cannot include links to services/devices you sell (it's fine to tell people of a download mode JIG and even to check ebay or other places, but to point directly to yours is also against the rules)
3) if you don't have the money to run the site, don't run it (why host anything at all beyond a few lightweight html files with explanations)
4) make the donation optional. register for the site for free and then people can donate if they want (hey, sounds an awful lot like what xda is)
5) do you have the permission of the ROM developers to repost their work elsewhere? (especially behind a lazy paywall)
if you can't follow xda's rules, then what do you expect to happen?

What you do is wrong!
1. You host warez on your site.
2. You steal all of out Dev's roms
3. Just link you "subscribers" to xda

Why not use something like forumotion.com to so you don't have to pay?
And the no credits?

This... this is going to get nasty unfortunately.
Be respectable people.

Suck my balls.
@aka , not s15 >.>

see this is xda all you all do is talk bad im sorry but there are no paid apps in site and app brain or 4share.com lol theres all your apps for free ... i tell you all and you dont here me

And the lying about creating a Gingerbread ROM with GPS?

I think the point that most are upset with is that you have done this in a sneaky manner and not asked any dev if it was okay to post their work. For us to put sometimes months into building a better rom and then you to take it change a couple icons or colors and then post it as your own work when you probably wouldn't know a XML from a bml and charge people for "support" which they get here for free. I personally have tried to answer every "noob" that has approached me and not once charged.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA Premium App

You pay for 250 (A dedicated box) for your forum?
Damn. That's silly.

You are in breach of Apache Software License Version 2 & GNU General Public License Version 2.
You are in breach of your AdSense account by hosting copyrighted material, you have been reported - LINK
You have been reported to Gameloft for hosting their pirated/warez apps, they have notified their legal dept.
You have been reported to your web host - LINK - for hosting & distributing pirated/warez apps.
You have been reported to Paypal for profiteering off pirated/warez apps.
Enjoy the next few days.

tissle said:
You pay for 250 (A dedicated box) for your forum?
Damn. That's silly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
^
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA Premium App

Quit trying to front dude. And if you're paying 250 a month for your site that's a joke. Learn the rules before you break them. All youre trying to do now is bend them. Quit taking other devastating work!!
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA Premium App

And it appears that most scammers would try to post an apology explaining their situation in order "recreate" their image again.

250? more like 10
Get Godaddy and pay that much.
We don't care you have a crappy website that costs that much.
The not helping? You think its just here? Look at your own forums buddy...
Someone here posted a link to one of your threads where someone asked if OC can be used on all of "your" roms, 1 reply "try it and find out"
Very nice answer?
Everyone here will hate you and probably do, you know why?
YOU STOLE WORK.
and now your trying to make excuses like a 5 year old kid lying about stealing his friends toy car.
Grow some balls kid.
andyharney said:
You are in breach of Apache Software License Version 2 & GNU General Public License Version 2.
You are in breach of your AdSense account by hosting copyrighted material, you have been reported - LINK
You have been reported to Gameloft for hosting their pirated/warez apps, they have notified their legal dept.
You have been reported to your web host - LINK - for hosting & distributing pirated/warez apps.
You have been reported to Paypal for profiteering off pirated/warez apps.
Enjoy the next few days.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your ****ed.

Ill give you 5 dollars to shut the hell up.....oh and gps on 2.3

s15274n said:
This... this is going to get nasty unfortunately.
Be respectable people.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i thought exactly the same thing when i saw this lol. made damn sure i jumped in with justifiable questions and hope for an answer before it got locked. guess i'll pop some popcorn and watch the show.
ps. still hoping for some answers to my questions akaskriller.

tissle said:
You pay for 250 (A dedicated box) for your forum?
Damn. That's silly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He doesn't have a dedicated server, his server IP is 216.17.96.218 and as you can see it goes nowhere. Its a shared IP.

Off-site Roms and XDA support threads

This has become a stickler point for me.
How exactly do these "roms" that post on xda to gain the large audience with links to thier own sites with thier own forums and downloads do it?
Why does XDA allow the threads to exist?
To me it's a confusing point, on one hand you've got the huge user base that XDA has and it's "helpful" but on the other hand these "roms" have chosen to move else where to have a clear cut definition of "who" their users are.
I for one would love to see xda delete these threads, if your rom isnt hosted here why should XDA pick up the tab on the traffic and moderation to "support" the people that don't want to follow basic rules.
It's one thing to post on here saying that it's out it's quite another to have a thread devoted to the rom for "support" when they've got their own site and thier own "donation" setup and don't offer direct links to the roms.
I'm thinking of Bonsai and Baked Snack when I say this, although other sites like ppcgeeks are guilty of it as well.
Here's the breakdown...
Baked snack was a rom a while back that Herver ran, he had people that loved his roms, but he wouldnt share his gpl code, so XDA to avoid issues banned him and removes his threads.
Bonsai started up thier own "business oriented and non-hobby"(randy's words) website and started offering up betas to people that donated, BANNING people that would share this beta software if they found out.(or so his users have said)
PPCGeeks.com basically is a forum that has very little of it's own content and tends to backlink to threads here on XDA. This should not be allowed. it's cheap and annoying to think that other forums all link back to xda but refuse to use and follow it's rules touting it as the devil for thier moderators sucking and other offhanded badness, while at the same time using it's resources for thier own gain.
If you want to follow the XDA rules on rom posting fine. Post here. If you want to have your own site to support the rom fine have the site, but if you get removed from the site for not following the rules, do NOT expect to keep using it to support your users.
The rules of posting should be simple.
If you post a rom in a thread there should NOT be an external sign up on said site to get the rom.
If you post a rom, there should NOT be a pay to play system in place to get "advanced" copies,(nor a "shopping cart" for the rom)
If you post a rom, there SHOULD be a direct link or mirror link to the rom.
If you post a rom, there should be open disclosure and read-only sources to what you've done.
In essence i for one WANT to see all support threads for non-hosted on XDA roms removed, they put a burden on XDA to moderate, the put a burden on XDA for bandwidth and hardware, and they cause undue traffic to those that don't want to play by the rules they signed up for.
Side note, i'd love to see hotlinking from other sites also disabled on XDA to stop those crap spring up offshoot websites thinking they're better and "more laid back" from not having to bother with their own content and users.
Analogy time:
Think of it like this... You've spent a lot of time and money to make a large car lot, you allow others of the community who've used your car lot to gather and sell their own cars on your lot free of charge. It all runs fine until along comes one person that feels they should be allowed to use the facilities of the lot for only themselves and break ruin the good bathroom, now they setup thier own bathroom close to thier table but only people that come to thier table and purchase a car may use this bathroom. After a little while you find that they have opened up their own car lot across the street. You ask them to take their cars elsewhere, and remove them from your lot. BUT they setup a table on your lot and take up valuable real-estate to "answer questions" about their car lot across the street AND about their cars. while using your facilities and security etc. Would you do that in normal circumstances? or would you remove their table as well and let them use their own car lot as a support and sales team for their own cars?
Anyways, thats my take on the whole off-site roms but XDA support.
Add thanks to this if you support this idea, OR post away and add something new to the conversation, *I* personally think that XDA should take a hand in removing these threads from here as they are a detriment to the community that exists and undermines the ideals attached to opensource projects.

I definitely agree with Art3mis on this one. Its ridiculous that they are still allowed to have support threads (and more that they even have support threads instead of just having them all on their own private forums as they either, didnt follow the rules of XDA, or left at their own accord).

Yeah it annoys me that bonsai still has support threads here.

you are right and i agree 100% with everything except this:
art3mis-nyc said:
Side note, i'd love to see hotlinking from other sites also disabled on XDA to stop those crap spring up offshoot websites thinking they're better and "more laid back" from not having to bother with their own content and users.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hotlinking from other sites is how all the roms are posted whether it be private domains or sites like multiupload. there is an 8meg limit on xda attachments...so big 100+ meg rom downloads have to be linked from somewhere else to save xda's bandwidth. i personally like hosting my own files and giving direct links in threads because i can look at awstats and know how many times a file has been hit.
on that same note i agree there should be a direct link...and i mean a real direct link....not a redirect to sign up or a redirect to an ad page or anything like that...the rest of your article i agree 100%

Then don't click on the thread?? Is it really that hard?

art3mis-nyc said:
This has become a stickler point for me......(other stuff)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Get off your high horse. You are no dev (not even cut and paste) and no mod.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using Tapatalk

XDA doesn't allow software that breaks the rules or off-site competition, but they allow discussion of said software. Kind of counter-intuitive, really.
Rodderik said:
hotlinking from other sites is how all the roms are posted whether it be private domains or sites like multiupload. there is an 8meg limit on xda attachments...so big 100+ meg rom downloads have to be linked from somewhere else to save xda's bandwidth.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think he means other websites hotlinking to XDA.

All the Bonsai support threads are gone, and have been for a long while. The only thing left is the user discussion thread in the General section. It's for news and users helping other users. Everyone knows where to go for dev support when it comes to Bonsai.
But there are a couple reasons why the thread exists. First off, it doesn't break any XDA rules. They would have to break their own rules or create new ones to get rid of it. The other reason is XDA does not want to remove it. Anything that is considered controversial gets hits. The more hits, the better for advertising revenue . Every time someone tries to start a Bonsai hate thread of *****es about why it exists, people come along and either argue or agree with the OP. XDA does not care one way or the other, they get paid the same.
As Randy stated here-
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=15035075&postcount=1026
He has made every attempt to work things out, but it has been a one way process.

Deleted. Counter productive.
Sent from me!

tl;dr
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

I think this whole thing is kind of silly. The analygy given by the OP isn't even close. In xda, no physical damage was done and nothing illegal was done. You might as well been comparing a frog to a cow .
I am a huge proponent of open source, but as a business owner, I know that time is very important and good developers should be paid.
In other open source industries (I will use Drupal.org as my example), commercial and opensource get along just fine. There are many commercial companies (acquia.com) that's entire business is providing service and support for the open source products they use and promote. The commercial companies have made the open source community way stronger in these last few years. Another example would be Linux, Canonical the business backing Ubuntu.
Those industries have standards too and don't allow any non-GPL (back to the Drupal example) code to be committed in there repository. They still allow commercial companies with closed source to participate.
The "groups" (bonsai, etc...) that are talked about here are still contributing to the the community. They may not be doing it according to xda's rules, but that doesn't mean they aren't contributing.
I understand xda's motives for disallowing closed source stuff in the forums. But banning everyones ability to talk about sites outside of the forum is ridiculous. Thats like saying "we encourage and love open source" but "we hate open (source) communication".
Lastly, why you throwing PPCGeeks under the bus. Before my epic I owned 3 winmo phones. I could find way more CDMA winmo roms on PPCgeeks than I ever found on xda. Fixes were rolled out fast and the winmo community on ppcgeeks was very strong.

Rodderik said:
you are right and i agree 100% with everything except this:
hotlinking from other sites is how all the roms are posted whether it be private domains or sites like multiupload. there is an 8meg limit on xda attachments...so big 100+ meg rom downloads have to be linked from somewhere else to save xda's bandwidth. i personally like hosting my own files and giving direct links in threads because i can look at awstats and know how many times a file has been hit.
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This is more in relation to say i started a "forum" for Superawesomeroms.com and then i have nothing to post so all i do is post links to XDA threads all the while bemoaning and berating XDA for thier crap moderation and blah blah blah blah

Well, I for one post my content here, ppcgeeks, and ACS. Obviously most of the traffic I get is here.
What I can say is that other sites linking to xda is how I found this site. I was on ppcgeeks a few months before xda, and found xda through a link off their site. I also link back to xda quite often when I'm trying to help other on another site. What that shows me is that other sites linking back to xda drives traffic here.
Traffic=revenue. Guess I don't see the problem with that.

art3mis-nyc said:
This has become a stickler point for me.
How exactly do these "roms" that post on xda to gain the large audience with links to thier own sites with thier own forums and downloads do it?
Why does XDA allow the threads to exist?
To me it's a confusing point, on one hand you've got the huge user base that XDA has and it's "helpful" but on the other hand these "roms" have chosen to move else where to have a clear cut definition of "who" their users are.
I for one would love to see xda delete these threads, if your rom isnt hosted here why should XDA pick up the tab on the traffic and moderation to "support" the people that don't want to follow basic rules.
It's one thing to post on here saying that it's out it's quite another to have a thread devoted to the rom for "support" when they've got their own site and thier own "donation" setup and don't offer direct links to the roms.
I'm thinking of Bonsai and Baked Snack when I say this, although other sites like ppcgeeks are guilty of it as well.
Here's the breakdown...
Baked snack was a rom a while back that Herver ran, he had people that loved his roms, but he wouldnt share his gpl code, so XDA to avoid issues banned him and removes his threads.
Bonsai started up thier own "business oriented and non-hobby"(randy's words) website and started offering up betas to people that donated, BANNING people that would share this beta software if they found out.(or so his users have said)
PPCGeeks.com basically is a forum that has very little of it's own content and tends to backlink to threads here on XDA. This should not be allowed. it's cheap and annoying to think that other forums all link back to xda but refuse to use and follow it's rules touting it as the devil for thier moderators sucking and other offhanded badness, while at the same time using it's resources for thier own gain.
If you want to follow the XDA rules on rom posting fine. Post here. If you want to have your own site to support the rom fine have the site, but if you get removed from the site for not following the rules, do NOT expect to keep using it to support your users.
The rules of posting should be simple.
If you post a rom in a thread there should NOT be an external sign up on said site to get the rom.
If you post a rom, there should NOT be a pay to play system in place to get "advanced" copies,(nor a "shopping cart" for the rom)
If you post a rom, there SHOULD be a direct link or mirror link to the rom.
If you post a rom, there should be open disclosure and read-only sources to what you've done.
In essence i for one WANT to see all support threads for non-hosted on XDA roms removed, they put a burden on XDA to moderate, the put a burden on XDA for bandwidth and hardware, and they cause undue traffic to those that don't want to play by the rules they signed up for.
Side note, i'd love to see hotlinking from other sites also disabled on XDA to stop those crap spring up offshoot websites thinking they're better and "more laid back" from not having to bother with their own content and users.
Analogy time:
Think of it like this... You've spent a lot of time and money to make a large car lot, you allow others of the community who've used your car lot to gather and sell their own cars on your lot free of charge. It all runs fine until along comes one person that feels they should be allowed to use the facilities of the lot for only themselves and break ruin the good bathroom, now they setup thier own bathroom close to thier table but only people that come to thier table and purchase a car may use this bathroom. After a little while you find that they have opened up their own car lot across the street. You ask them to take their cars elsewhere, and remove them from your lot. BUT they setup a table on your lot and take up valuable real-estate to "answer questions" about their car lot across the street AND about their cars. while using your facilities and security etc. Would you do that in normal circumstances? or would you remove their table as well and let them use their own car lot as a support and sales team for their own cars?
Anyways, thats my take on the whole off-site roms but XDA support.
Add thanks to this if you support this idea, OR post away and add something new to the conversation, *I* personally think that XDA should take a hand in removing these threads from here as they are a detriment to the community that exists and undermines the ideals attached to opensource projects.
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As long as your calling everyone else out. Mentioning a competitive site, I do believe, is against the rules.
Guys, these are just phones and at this point why even bring this up? I'm not suggesting that the rules be ignored but everyone constantly getting bent out of shape over this stuff isn't productive or even healthy for that matter.
PLEASE, just let the Bonsai thing just die already. They made their choice and no matter how many people complain about it, is't going to change anything. All it does is start flame wars. If you have something to say to them I suggest you contact them directly and give them a chance to address the concerns directly.
Why can't we do something.......anything...but complain. Does anyone stop to think that Bonsai leaving for setting up their site the way they did has little to nothing to do with the direction the Epic forums are going in? It's bad attitudes and feelings of entitlement that are KILLING this forum, IMHO. Stop complaining and contribute to positive change. If we focus on the negative all the time that's all we are going to get.

If any threads should be deleted it is ones talking about other phones. There are forums for those. This is the Samsung Epic forum, that is the phone I have chosen for 2 years and only want to see threads about those. If an accessory or ROM is avaliable off XA for it, I want to know about it. I don't give a crap about the EVO 3d or Within or any otherstupid little phone that comes out. XDA has a general forum for that and most of these have their own forums. Don't clutter our threads with that garbage, or whiny kids saying "it's official our phone is a piece of crap"! This is the clutter that needs to be removed. Not a single thread for an offsite ROM.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

icevapor said:
I think this whole thing is kind of silly. The analygy given by the OP isn't even close. In xda, no physical damage was done and nothing illegal was done. You might as well been comparing a frog to a cow .
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Not really it's a valid argument, and while you dont see it, BW useage etc is a hit when it supports items that arent on the site itself.
icevapor said:
I am a huge proponent of open source, but as a business owner, I know that time is very important and good developers should be paid.
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Some very fine work perhaps the best work as far as the epic goes, is from people that do it for fun and hobby, and dont ask for donations and in some cases dont even have a link for it, yet others believe as you do apperantly that they should be able to take the others work, rename it and change it and "sell" it(ie the Bonsai clockworkmod that they simply renamed and recoloured) as noted i'm fine with charging for support, it's the software i dont like the charging to exist for.
icevapor said:
In other open source industries (I will use Drupal.org as my example), commercial and opensource get along just fine. There are many commercial companies (acquia.com) that's entire business is providing service and support for the open source products they use and promote. The commercial companies have made the open source community way stronger in these last few years. Another example would be Linux, Canonical the business backing Ubuntu.
Those industries have standards too and don't allow any non-GPL (back to the Drupal example) code to be committed in there repository. They still allow commercial companies with closed source to participate.
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The difference between that and this is that the Opensource lives along side, doesnt require a signup and in most cases is "on par" with the pay version, again you're paying for support, which im fine with, but the software is available to all or none, not to who pays.(minus some features of course but rarely advanced beta copies etc)
icevapor said:
The "groups" (bonsai, etc...) that are talked about here are still contributing to the the community. They may not be doing it according to xda's rules, but that doesn't mean they aren't contributing.
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I can't think of a single thing that has been contributed back, aside from the kernel fiasco for marcusants "psuedo rom"
icevapor said:
Lastly, why you throwing PPCGeeks under the bus. Before my epic I owned 3 winmo phones. I could find way more CDMA winmo roms on PPCgeeks than I ever found on xda. Fixes were rolled out fast and the winmo community on ppcgeeks was very strong.
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ppcgeeks was the first site that i noticed it on and while it's not directed specifically at them, they are guilty of the above mentioned content links.

i'm not scared of negativity
and you shouldn't be either
if discussing negativity means thats all you will end up with
then ask yourself who is the real source of negativity?
deciding your fate...premonitions?
let it roll
if you never go there...you will never get it out of your system
and i'm sure thats why anyone would participate in this thread to begin with
so do it, and dig deep
just try and be as respectful as possible in your aims
dont cloud this life with misconstrued karma
if you cannot understand someones apparent stance and it appears ignorant or childish,
then try and be the bigger person and post something constructive they can actually do
otherwise you are just bickering for the sake of it
before i get too far off topic
if xda's main goal is truly web traffic...then thats what the userbase is going to comprise of...otherwise you are just out of place and belong elsewhere.
if you are just part of traffic then dont claim to be a leader with every post you make
and vise versa...dont get lost in the traffic when you know damn well you have something to offer the community that is truly valuable. Everyone has a part to play, dont care how many babies are born today.
If in fact this is truly xda's goal...who knows...the site is large...plenty of room for emotion to find its way in.
Life is useful. (dental dams are your friend)
And above all...hitler was nothing compared to billions the russians killed of their own people...
History...it owns people every day.
Stand for something better than the illegitimate use/abuse of people.
Especially when most of these things being created are not very reliable and designed to support jobs and sales and an economy and false hopes and everything that goes along with a society that throws its lives to the foothold of a dollar bill that is utterly useless in the reality of the universe.
Real answers are not easy...take the time as much as you possibly can.
LISTEN
and when you think you cannot take anymore without putting in your two cents
LISTEN SOME MORE
there are plenty of people just hanging around that have been through it all and seen it
and you can stop acting anytime like you are one of them
real life steps in before anyone could ever make a worthwhile decision
humans...making decisions for others since breakfast
tough titties?
we'll see who's talking then...when?
the sooner the sooner

mattallica76 said:
The only thing [Bonsai] left is the user discussion thread in the General section. It's for news and users helping other users.
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I can't say whether this is ideal or not. However, folks are going to ask about Bonsai whether discussion is allowed or not. Thus, it's arguably prudent to allow one thread for its discussion to avoid having it being asked about repeatedly in new threads.
shane6374 said:
What I can say is that other sites linking to xda is how I found this site.
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This is perhaps the most important point of the thread. However it happened, xda became the definitive resource for phone hackery. If xda were to forbid off-site hotlinking, that would have the result, both direct (PageRank, robots exclusion, etc.) and indirect (through absence of news articles and other discussion) of sinking it in search results. At which point--at best--some other site would become definitive and discussion would move there, or quite possibly, no one site would emerge as definitive and discussion would become horribly fragmented.
To be honest, the primary reason I post patches here with lengthy technical descriptions is becuase, in 3-6 months time, I know someone Googling a similar problem will come across my threads and find an answer. The fact that it also contributes code to this community is a wonderful secondary benefit, but to be honest, discussion and ROM development is too ephemeral to make it worth the effort if Google wasn't around to archive the result. And it's far easier for me to do it here, and gets far more exposure and use, than if I were to run my own blog or something.

ptfdmedic said:
As long as your calling everyone else out. Mentioning a competitive site, I do believe, is against the rules.
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yeah yeah, pedantic argument.
ptfdmedic said:
Guys, these are just phones and at this point why even bring this up? I'm not suggesting that the rules be ignored but everyone constantly getting bent out of shape over this stuff isn't productive or even healthy for that matter.
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oh im not bent out of shape, that post would have been a lot more incoherent if i was.
ptfdmedic said:
PLEASE, just let the Bonsai thing just die already. They made their choice and no matter how many people complain about it, is't going to change anything. All it does is start flame wars. If you have something to say to them I suggest you contact them directly and give them a chance to address the concerns directly.
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it's called an example. Happens to be the most obvious so it's used.
btw i did contact them directly and thats how i came to the quote from randy stating that Bonsai is not a hobby it's a business.
and then the tired out saying of "i for one like to pay for good software rant" while touting the virtues of opensource.(<3 me some hypocrites)
ptfdmedic said:
Why can't we do something.......anything...but complain. Does anyone stop to think that Bonsai leaving for setting up their site the way they did has little to nothing to do with the direction the Epic forums are going in? It's bad attitudes and feelings of entitlement that are KILLING this forum, IMHO. Stop complaining and contribute to positive change. If we focus on the negative all the time that's all we are going to get.
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this isn't negative unless you read it that way, i honestly want it to change, and to find out WHY it exists.
People commenting and saying we should "all get along" sadly contribute nothing(good nor bad) to a thread.

mkasick said:
I can't say whether this is ideal or not. However, folks are going to ask about Bonsai whether discussion is allowed or not. Thus, it's arguably prudent to allow one thread for its discussion to avoid having it being asked about repeatedly in new threads.
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You would think so, but the same can't be said towards heros' rom, many threads are started to talk about it are quickly killed and its poster banned.. so it's sort of a double edged.