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I didn't think it belonged in Dream Android Development, so I'm putting it here. If it needs to be moved, move it.
Is it possible to boot anything other than Android on the Dream?
I've seen the Nokia N900 and its Maemo 5 firmware, and I'm absolutely drawn to it, thanks to its debian-based OS (sudo apt-get install anything), it's X-based graphics system (REAL linux GUI programs), and all the apps it already has (Native Gizmo > Hacky Sipdroid).
I've also taken a look at other Linux-based open phone firmwares.
What is keeping us from doing this? If it's drivers, do they exist for another similar Linux-based firmware?
Could we dual-boot Android and this other OS using a third-stage bootloader which loads as a kernel from within the BOOT: partition?
I've seen the (albeit extremely hackish) method of getting Debian on the G1, chrooting into a loop-mounted FS and using a loopback VNC to spring into a KDE/Gnome/LXDE UI, but it's slow, still has Android and its apps loaded into memory, and very hackish and unstable.
I'm more than willing to test anything firmware-wise on my phone as long as it doesn't mess with my SPL.
The possibilities are nearly limitless - WINE under Linux means true "Windows Mobile" without the WinCE kernel.
Or perhaps WinMo/WinCE can be booted on the Dream?
It's more of a question of whether or not it's possible right now than a concept or implementation, but once that's answered, I'll either throw some time into testing and porting, or kick back and enjoy the Android as it is.
For starters:
- How does the SPL hand off to the BOOT: partition and its kernel/initrd?
- What devices need what drivers? What should be thrown into the kernel?
- Do things need reverse-engineering or is it all straightforward and documented?
- How can we use the space provided without messing with the SPL? (use cache partition for OS? Modified recovery that doesn't depend on cache partition?)
- Is dual-booting between Android possible? Can this be switched and launched before Dalvik and the Android stuff loads on the Android kernel?
- Can this be done with other Android-powered, rooted devices?
Have you seen wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_on_HTC-Dream or lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2009-August/052529.html? (Crap, I can't post links) Looks promising since Angstrom is a very powerful embedded distro, but it's a one-man project now. I hope some people will join it or start a similar project.
G1 is a great device, however, I can see only a few people hacking on OS alternatives for it. You always got to have either an active community or a company in order to complete such a project.
The Android hackers community is very vibrant, however, people are not really interested in bringing a fully-featured Linux distro to G1 or other Android phones. Android is too trendy itself
The Debian/Ubuntu opportunity that we have now is nice, but it looks like an addition to the Android which takes a lot of memory and CPU.
I have just set up a small Ubuntu environment booting on my G1 together with Android. I combined the userspace prepared by Paolo Sammicheli (xdatap1.wordpress.com/2009/05/03/jaunty-under-android/) with Bayle Shanks's instructions (bayleshanks.com/wiki.pl?tips-computer-android-g1_debian_cyanogenMod). I am going to use it for mutt, vim, some coding. X11/VNC experience has been frustrating so far.
I am pretty sure though that there will be more people wanting to use alternative OSes on their phones: Moto Droid and Nexus are powerful enough for a full desktop environment.
vaskas said:
Have you seen wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_on_HTC-Dream or lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2009-August/052529.html? (Crap, I can't post links) Looks promising since Angstrom is a very powerful embedded distro, but it's a one-man project now. I hope some people will join it or start a similar project.
G1 is a great device, however, I can see only a few people hacking on OS alternatives for it. You always got to have either an active community or a company in order to complete such a project.
The Android hackers community is very vibrant, however, people are not really interested in bringing a fully-featured Linux distro to G1 or other Android phones. Android is too trendy itself
The Debian/Ubuntu opportunity that we have now is nice, but it looks like an addition to the Android which takes a lot of memory and CPU.
I have just set up a small Ubuntu environment booting on my G1 together with Android. I combined the userspace prepared by Paolo Sammicheli (xdatap1.wordpress.com/2009/05/03/jaunty-under-android/) with Bayle Shanks's instructions (bayleshanks.com/wiki.pl?tips-computer-android-g1_debian_cyanogenMod). I am going to use it for mutt, vim, some coding. X11/VNC experience has been frustrating so far.
I am pretty sure though that there will be more people wanting to use alternative OSes on their phones: Moto Droid and Nexus are powerful enough for a full desktop environment.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i really think it lies in what you want from your phone... i know you say you use your ubuntu env for things such as vim and mutt, but everything that vim and mutt can do, can already be done under android..
the biggest challenge is getting people to latch on to an alternate distro which offers MORE than android, which has yet to come to surface... ultimately this is a phone.. not a netbook...and for a phone android is pretty dam sweet...
although in terms of geek work, running ANY other os on non native hardware is cool....albeit not really worth it
anybody were successful by using the internal-memory-image from the openmoko wiki?
I always get kernel panic, when booting it. I flashed it with flash_image boot/system, does this matter? In the wiki they use fastboot.
scheich, I only tried the SD-card way (see my post in http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=624392)
It shouldn't really matter whether you use fastboot or flash the image. The kernel panic could occur due to the inability to find the root filesystem. Try reflashing the yaffs2.
By the way, why did you choose to put OpenMoko in the internal memory? Are you going to use it exclusively or as the primary OS on the device?
Some of what you suggest can be done, but not recommended.
1) Nokia/Maemo is a bad fit for a phone. It is a real HOG. It is also shoehorning (with a sledge hammer) a desktop OS into a phone. It just doesn't work right. Android exists because a totally new UI model was needed to work optimally with a phone's physical form.
2) WINE will NEVER work since the CPU in the phone is ARM and not x86. If you want to run windonkey programs (can't imagine why you would), you would have to run a PROCESSOR EMULATOR, and this will be REALLY REALLY REALLY slow and memory intense.
TylTru said:
I didn't think it belonged in Dream Android Development, so I'm putting it here. If it needs to be moved, move it.
Is it possible to boot anything other than Android on the Dream?
I've seen the Nokia N900 and its Maemo 5 firmware, and I'm absolutely drawn to it, thanks to its debian-based OS (sudo apt-get install anything), it's X-based graphics system (REAL linux GUI programs), and all the apps it already has (Native Gizmo > Hacky Sipdroid).
I've also taken a look at other Linux-based open phone firmwares.
What is keeping us from doing this? If it's drivers, do they exist for another similar Linux-based firmware?
Could we dual-boot Android and this other OS using a third-stage bootloader which loads as a kernel from within the BOOT: partition?
I've seen the (albeit extremely hackish) method of getting Debian on the G1, chrooting into a loop-mounted FS and using a loopback VNC to spring into a KDE/Gnome/LXDE UI, but it's slow, still has Android and its apps loaded into memory, and very hackish and unstable.
I'm more than willing to test anything firmware-wise on my phone as long as it doesn't mess with my SPL.
The possibilities are nearly limitless - WINE under Linux means true "Windows Mobile" without the WinCE kernel.
Or perhaps WinMo/WinCE can be booted on the Dream?
It's more of a question of whether or not it's possible right now than a concept or implementation, but once that's answered, I'll either throw some time into testing and porting, or kick back and enjoy the Android as it is.
For starters:
- How does the SPL hand off to the BOOT: partition and its kernel/initrd?
- What devices need what drivers? What should be thrown into the kernel?
- Do things need reverse-engineering or is it all straightforward and documented?
- How can we use the space provided without messing with the SPL? (use cache partition for OS? Modified recovery that doesn't depend on cache partition?)
- Is dual-booting between Android possible? Can this be switched and launched before Dalvik and the Android stuff loads on the Android kernel?
- Can this be done with other Android-powered, rooted devices?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
vaskas said:
scheich, I only tried the SD-card way (see my post in http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=624392)
It shouldn't really matter whether you use fastboot or flash the image. The kernel panic could occur due to the inability to find the root filesystem. Try reflashing the yaffs2.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tried reflashing the system image. Also the older image on the ftpserver. The same. I will try the sdcard installation.
vaskas said:
By the way, why did you choose to put OpenMoko in the internal memory? Are you going to use it exclusively or as the primary OS on the device?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Two reasons:
1. Thought that would be the faster way to get it work. I used BART to backup my android installation.
2. Thougt, I would get a bit more perfomance in using the internal memory.
I really would like to use SHR(or other) as primary OS, because I had an GTA02, depends on what is(could) work(ing) on the dream.
would it be possible to boot ubuntu netbook remix? it uses far less resources.
zenstitution said:
would it be possible to boot ubuntu netbook remix? it uses far less resources.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
NBR is targeted at x86, but Ubuntu MID edition is installable. It's similar to the netbook remix. We'll have to wait before we have a proven/stable installation method though.
I would really like to see another OS on my Dream as well - just in addition to android
Che123 said:
I would really like to see another OS on my Dream as well - just in addition to android
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, you can try the OpenMoko port (it's in the alpha stage now): http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=5521417
The more people get interested in the alternative OS, the sooner we'll get one.
vaskas said:
Well, you can try the OpenMoko port (it's in the alpha stage now): http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=5521417
The more people get interested in the alternative OS, the sooner we'll get one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really hot stuff - but i don't want to loose my recovery
But i will definetly keep an eye on it!
edit: Adding a bootmngr like grub for selecting boot OS (android/openmoko/recovery) would be really nice Or adding bootoptions to the current amon_ra Recovery would be a soloution too. But I'm no dev, so I don't even know if it is possible.
Hello! I've been just a reader for some months, my questions have been always already answered here for basic things (rooting, performance tips etc) but now it's the time to register and start participating I am a professional programmer, just have been "out" of the development world for the last 1+ year, so I'm a bit untrained now...
I was thinking on buying a BeagleBoard for trying some programming in it, just wanted to see what's the power of that board when doing image processing stuff (namely playing with OpenCV). But, before spending those $130 in one, I realised that my Archos A101IT has almost the same board (SoC), well actually even a bit faster (BeagleBoard comes with OMAP3530 while A101IT comes with OMAP3630).
The BeagleBoard works with a linux Kernel for the OMAP architecture, so what would be the closest to bare-bones thing I could get for the A101? If this was Desktop, I'd answer "Debian with the lightest Desktop setup and OpenCV libraries installed", but in this architecture I'm lost.
I see a lot of "custom kernel for you", "Ubuntu over Android" and stuff like that, but I don't get if that's what I'm looking for or just that people here are building replacements to the underlying Android kernel. As you see I'm not interested at all on the Android part of the A101.
Hope you can give me some orientation...
juannm said:
Hello! I've been just a reader for some months, my questions have been always already answered here for basic things (rooting, performance tips etc) but now it's the time to register and start participating I am a professional programmer, just have been "out" of the development world for the last 1+ year, so I'm a bit untrained now...
I was thinking on buying a BeagleBoard for trying some programming in it, just wanted to see what's the power of that board when doing image processing stuff (namely playing with OpenCV). But, before spending those $130 in one, I realised that my Archos A101IT has almost the same board (SoC), well actually even a bit faster (BeagleBoard comes with OMAP3530 while A101IT comes with OMAP3630).
The BeagleBoard works with a linux Kernel for the OMAP architecture, so what would be the closest to bare-bones thing I could get for the A101? If this was Desktop, I'd answer "Debian with the lightest Desktop setup and OpenCV libraries installed", but in this architecture I'm lost.
I see a lot of "custom kernel for you", "Ubuntu over Android" and stuff like that, but I don't get if that's what I'm looking for or just that people here are building replacements to the underlying Android kernel. As you see I'm not interested at all on the Android part of the A101.
Hope you can give me some orientation...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That isn't anything particaly solid but the best you can do is either install one of the os from here http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1198389
or look at archos sde http://www.archos.com/support/support_tech/updates_dev.html?country=gb&lang=en
juannm said:
The BeagleBoard works with a linux Kernel for the OMAP architecture, so what would be the closest to bare-bones thing I could get for the A101? If this was Desktop, I'd answer "Debian with the lightest Desktop setup and OpenCV libraries installed", but in this architecture I'm lost.
I see a lot of "custom kernel for you", "Ubuntu over Android" and stuff like that, but I don't get if that's what I'm looking for or just that people here are building replacements to the underlying Android kernel. As you see I'm not interested at all on the Android part of the A101.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure about what really you want to know, but would note the following:
It's possible to run a Linux kernel on Archos, and Ubuntu on it will be "Ubuntu over Linux kernel". The problem is that Archos needs an Archos-friendly kernel, and it's so tweaked that I don't know at what point Linux ends there and Android starts. So here is another problem: it seems rather hard to make the mainline kernel running on Archos. This means that you'll stay with 2.6.29 till the end of your Archos' days... But if you're happy with custom-made GPL'ed 2.6.29 by Archos -- installing "Debian with the lightest Desktop" on it should be no problem. On Archos-Debian.org they've already made a few rootfs images.
Question: justo out of curiosity, do you know if the Debian compilation from (www .debian-archos.com) is made by following this (dev. openaos.org/wiki/Debian%20gen8) ??
In the other hand, I have just installed Urukdroid 1.6 over my previous system (letting the installer to wipe my previous partitions and creating new ones), and now I'm going to try the Angstrom "rootfs.img" option (that I copied somewhere before installing Urukdroid) and also the Debian beta2 one (altough its a wooping 3,8 GB file... I wonder what did this people install in it? KDE? hahah).
Then for cross-compiling from my desktop computer, I guess all I need is the ARM Gcc version, right? I'm in Kubuntu 11.10 so that would be the g++-4.6-arm-linux-gnueabi package (just tell me if this is not the right direction...)
I guess compiling and copying some "hello world" binary file to the Debian or Angstrom in the tablet would be enough for running it, am I right?
Probably, it's better to send an email to OpenAOS people about how they made their package. Also I think it's not a "compilation", but an "installation": standard Debian binaries installed over Archos-specific 2.6.29 kernel. I don't think they recompiled the kernel or built Debian from stratch. The way shown at http://dev.openaos.org/wiki/Debian gen8 is a working one (at least, in general: I don't know about the goodies like wifi, I didn't get that far).
3.8Gb -- it includes free space too: rootfs.img is like a virtual HDD, it contains the system, user data, and free space.
For cross-compilation you need a toolchain: a cross-compiler plus some other tools. Look for Mentor (Codesourcery), Emdebian, OpenEmbedded, Buildroot, etc. Here is a ready-made custom built one: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1328027 . Maybe Kubuntu has their own build-in toolchain too, I don't know. Which one is better for you, and how to install and use it -- it depends on many things, actually. Generally: yes, g++-arm-linux-gnueabi looks like a cross-compiler for ARM. And yes, if you cross-compile a "Hello, world!" correctly -- it will run on Archos.
Hi juannm,
welcome to XDA-Developers
juannm said:
I was thinking on buying a BeagleBoard for trying some programming in it, just wanted to see what's the power of that board when doing image processing stuff (namely playing with OpenCV). But, before spending those $130 in one, I realised that my Archos A101IT has almost the same board (SoC), well actually even a bit faster (BeagleBoard comes with OMAP3530 while A101IT comes with OMAP3630).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was able to buy an A101it with was a brick few weeks ago and merely had the same intent. Thought of getting an OMAP3 platform to fiddle around with.
I started to collect some information of the hardware in use.
Luckily i was able to repair it.
For information about that look here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1199450
The design of the board is pretty clean and apart form running Android OS, Archos offers the SDE as people already pointed out.
You might also start from scratch and build up Ubuntu or Debian images for this device.
In fact i consider it nearly perfect for such experiments.
juannm said:
The BeagleBoard works with a linux Kernel for the OMAP architecture, so what would be the closest to bare-bones thing I could get for the A101? If this was Desktop, I'd answer "Debian with the lightest Desktop setup and OpenCV libraries installed", but in this architecture I'm lost.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What exactly do you mean?
It's too much to built up rootfs from scratch...
Need a starting point?
So basically you'll need to know how the boot process works on these devices, how rootfs is stored and how the rootfs gets mounted during boot up.
First i recommend to install SDE from Archos to get the alternate bootloader installed.
This way you might use bootmenu to load custom kernels and install your own rootfs on top of this.
It's too much to explain it all, so look around and read first.
Just in short:
Stock OS uses squashfs images as rootfs, which are mounted ro if you don't tweak anything.
SDE uses uncompressed EXT2 image, as far as i remember.
It might be a good idea to install UrukDroid (this will wipe out SDE, but leaves Stock OS untouched).
Afterwards you got true EXT4 filesystem, which is still Android but offers a lot of useful tools.
You'll need some background of course and it might be useful to tweak the bootloader to accept the first kernel to be unsigned as well.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1018260
juannm said:
I see a lot of "custom kernel for you", "Ubuntu over Android" and stuff like that, but I don't get if that's what I'm looking for or just that people here are building replacements to the underlying Android kernel. As you see I'm not interested at all on the Android part of the A101.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As already pointed out the kernel needs hardware specific tweaks to run on the Archos devices.
So does the Beagleboard kernel.
The vanilla kernel won't do it on these platforms.
Anyway there are some projects which use standard ARM distributions (e.g. Ubuntu, Debian) to get a working Linux on top of a custom kernel, which is based on stock kernel sources (2.6.29-omap1).
If you intent to change to a newer kernel version, there's more work to do.
There'd been some progress for 2.6.35 recently.
It really depends on what you expect to have working on the device.
I might even write more on this, but i guess you'll need to get a better overview yourself.
All i might say is, that Archos give good support for the open development (at least compared to other manufacturers).
They keep their git repo up to date and try to fix bugs as well.
So start hacking and have fun!!
scholbert
Hi there,
Just wanted to add few tidbits on top of what Scholbert said which I agree with 100%:
If you want to tweak the bootloader like Scholbert said to have three different bootable kernels (main android, sde, recovery), contact me first, I have few resources that could help you and add extra safety.
However, I believe that it's not needed at first and safer to get a hold on the platform to go sde route first.
Compared to beagleboard, you won't loose much with the a101, the thing I miss the most is a serial port to help with kernel dev, but even this is possible if you're comfortable with opening the a101 and soldering.
alright finally i made up my mind for making android CLI app
now i want to make an app on linux , i can simply write a small CPP program
but what about android (Especially acer iconia)?
how should i begin
what are the tools required?
Thanks in advance
Not sure what your asking for exactly.
But if you have not developer.android.com. is a place you MUST Visit for all things android..
Android doesn't really work with CLI... You'll probably have to go with a GUI, and most apps are written in Java (other languages are somewhat tricky, as you have to use the JNI or IPC to use most android libs)... as mentioned above, you'll get the required tools on developer.android.com. Other than that: Android's libc is fundamentally broken, with many standard functions being unavailable or misbehaving -- a major cause of headaches.
i am talking in general
for example "Busybox"
its written in C/C++
i just wanna know how to compile my own C code for android
Busybox is a bit different, as it's not a user fronting app. For something like that, just cross compile to arm. I believe theres one in the ndk:
http://developer.android.com/sdk/ndk/index.html
You'll need the ndk for user fronting apps with c code as well, btw.
you can use other cross compilers as well:
https://sourcery.mentor.com/sgpp/lite/arm/portal/release324
aman11dhanpat said:
alright finally i made up my mind for making android CLI app
now i want to make an app on linux , i can simply write a small CPP program
but what about android (Especially acer iconia)?
how should i begin
what are the tools required?
Thanks in advance
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hello, and welcome to the exciting world of Android Development! *insert sparkles*
In the Android world, CLI apps aren't the most popular. Making an app with a GUI would be a much easier starting point to some extent.
What you'll need:
1. A computer with the necessary software installed. This can be a Linux, Mac, or even Windows machine. In the case of a Windows machine, be sure you have the correct drivers installed. With the Linux machine, be sure you have the correct udev rules for the Iconia. Install the Android SDK. Install Eclipse, and the Android plugin.
It sounds like you want to run some native code as well. Use the Android NDK. There's a nice little beginner's guide here. Every good programmer starts with their first Hello, World!
2. Preferably some experience with Java. Almost all Android apps run on the Dalvik VM.
3. Patience. A lot of patience. Compiling takes time.
4. A device to test your code on. Running in an emulator is not good enough. Enable developer debugging on your device in the settings.
Hope this helped a bit.
Thanks alot guys
now i guess i'll be able to make some of my own apps
I was wondering if it would be possible to install linux (ubuntu) on the Nexus Player? I feel like this would be the perfect device for this.
No. Seriously. This is worthwhile. Small footprint, capable hardware. No significant hurdle.(?)How? Tutorial! Please!
lefigue said:
No. Seriously. This is worthwhile. Small footprint, capable hardware. No significant hurdle.(?)How? Tutorial! Please!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. The only thing I can see possibly being a problem is getting 3D acceleration working because of the PowerVR GPU. Everything else on this device seems well suited for Linux. Would just need a boot image akin to Ubuntu Touch on the old Nexus 7. Sadly I haven't seen anything that would help get this started on the Player, and I currently don't have the experience to start it myself.
Uh, it's already running Linux. It sounds like you just want to run a different Linux distribution than Android. Shouldn't be difficult. You can run debootstrap on a clean system partition from recovery. You'll need to modify the boot image to run your distribution's init instead of trying to boot android. I would just look at the Ubuntu phone images for an idea of how they do it.
hackel said:
Uh, it's already running Linux. It sounds like you just want to run a different Linux distribution than Android. Shouldn't be difficult. You can run debootstrap on a clean system partition from recovery. You'll need to modify the boot image to run your distribution's init instead of trying to boot android. I would just look at the Ubuntu phone images for an idea of how they do it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's usually not that simple. The boot partition from the examples I've seen (Ran Ubuntu desktop on my Nexus 7 2012) has to contain the kernel for the regular Linux install. I haven't looked into how big the partition is on the Player, but I know I had issues getting a mainline kernel to fit on the 8MB of the N7 2012. Plus most of the people here (including myself) wouldn't know where to even start at trying to get this to work for the Player (Hence why we ask in a community that has the expertise to possible pull it off). Specs wise the Player could be a fairly nice cheap NUC (If the PowerVR has support, that would be even better)
parkerlreed said:
It's usually not that simple. The boot partition from the examples I've seen (Ran Ubuntu desktop on my Nexus 7 2012) has to contain the kernel for the regular Linux install. I haven't looked into how big the partition is on the Player, but I know I had issues getting a mainline kernel to fit on the 8MB of the N7 2012. Plus most of the people here (including myself) wouldn't know where to even start at trying to get this to work for the Player (Hence why we ask in a community that has the expertise to possible pull it off). Specs wise the Player could be a fairly nice cheap NUC (If the PowerVR has support, that would be even better)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are not making sense. Usual linux distro has a boot partition that contains 1 or more kernels, and 1 or more ramdisks that match those kernels. Usual linux distro also has a multi-boot boot loader, which is able to select between the available kernels and ramdisks. An android device is arranged such that it has a SINGLE-boot bootloader, and its boot partition is just a kernel+ramdisk stuck together. You can stick a ubuntu kernel and ramdisk together in the EXACT SAME WAY, if that is what the bootloader requires.
As far as "getting a mainline kernel to fit... blah blah blah", the thing is... mainline kernel isn't any bigger than what you have. The difference with a "typical linux kernel" is that it isn't built with just the drivers that support that specific device, it is built with pretty much EVERY common driver built in, so that it will work on most hardware without being rebuilt. Delete the crap that you don't need, and it should fit just fine.
OR for that matter, what makes you think that something like Ubuntu won't work just fine with a kernel built for Android? Android runs on a LINUX KERNEL. Just change out the ramdisk for one more suitable for... whatever, and call it good.
Now the big question I would have about doing this.... is WHY? Nexus Player is awesome BECAUSE it runs Android TV. If you are looking to run a desktop linux on a thing that plugs into your TV, look into something like an INTEL COMPUTE STICK.
I've been trying different ways of entering bios and/or disabling secure boot, but can't figure out exactly if it has a BIOS menu at all.
Connected a keyboard to it and tries different keys during boot but I can't find the right combination.
Does anyone know how to enter the BIOS menu, or how do we go about disabling secure boot?
Thank you,
cocacola2015 said:
I've been trying different ways of entering bios and/or disabling secure boot, but can't figure out exactly if it has a BIOS menu at all.
Connected a keyboard to it and tries different keys during boot but I can't find the right combination.
Does anyone know how to enter the BIOS menu, or how do we go about disabling secure boot?
Thank you,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Keyboard is disabled(no driver installed, thanks Lenovo). Bios is usless.
From my LG-G4, Rooted running Stock 5.1
I was afraid that this would be the case. There seems to be no way to circumvent it either to boot a linux kernel.
http ://i.imgur.com/Tfd9U3i.jpg
Am I right to assume that the only thing we have that are signed are the stock Lenovo Yoga kernels, making them the only thing we can boot?
Also, does anyone know if these are the Microsoft keys, or some Lenovo keys, that they use for secure-boot. http ://i.imgur.com/dm1i16B.jpg
I'm wondering, because linux grub distributions do have a signed grub "shim" with the Microsoft key, maybe making us able to execute that at boot.
Ok, I've found out that it does have the microsoft keys, among other keys, which means it should in theory be possible, in theory. Will be looking into this more.
cocacola2015 said:
I was afraid that this would be the case. There seems to be no way to circumvent it either to boot a linux kernel.
http ://i.imgur.com/Tfd9U3i.jpg
Am I right to assume that the only thing we have that are signed are the stock Lenovo Yoga kernels, making them the only thing we can boot?
Also, does anyone know if these are the Microsoft keys, or some Lenovo keys, that they use for secure-boot. http ://i.imgur.com/dm1i16B.jpg
I'm wondering, because linux grub distributions do have a signed grub "shim" with the Microsoft key, maybe making us able to execute that at boot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
actually the problem is not in the unlocking but in making a working kernel for this tablet... because you see... Lenovo released the "source code" so they won't risk being sued for breaking the opensource (kernel) licenses, yet what they released is crap, broken drivers (i had to download all the source packages from all the YT2 models because they didn't even un-tarred crap and each one was 400MB and move things around and still it wont do the job as it should) they intentionally crippled the mk files, removed others, stupid and not working configs and so on... driver files missing... you get the picture and this was intentionally (not to say that this is only the kernel, not a chance to see in their source whats even more interesting: the code for the libraries, binaries etc) i am not saying it cannot be done but the amount of work it requires... hmm does it justify? in the end there are few people on this tablets and even lesser with the knowledge/available time to try and do something that will look like a custom rom
i thought at some point in making a rom but the hassle and time required don't justify it (what would i have? except that it's trendy to have a costom rom) so i for one will stay on my Android+Linux combo but who want to go further has my help
a better approach would be to build a custom rom based on the stock kernel/initramfs, this way you will start having the drivers in order and do your custom system (while no longer used in these days still it was cyanogenmod's way of making custom roms in the past) yet this one too is difficult and requires lots of work (and again for what? what's the gain?) but this one is much more acceptable than the rebuilding all previous one
the secure boot is passed (pm and you will understand) but to what end? see... the problem isn't so much in opening the door but in what you will do once inside (and i am inside that room for some time now yet no better bed than my Linux+Android combo) but feel free to continue on the road..
this is not to discourage you but to warn you about issues others (me) had on the road you're stepping now.
Thank you for the reply.
You're right, going the route of compiling whatever Lenovo has put out, is not the most streight forward option, but I disagree on not putting Linux on this tablet. This is the biggest and highest resolution tablet I've seen, and having Android on it instead of a full-blown Linux distribution, is a waste. Things like X forwarding to use it as a thin clinet, does not work well, I've tried all options. The only viable thing for using this as a thin client, is to run Linux on it, with its native input methods on the display server.
The gain is not having to pay twice as much for a Microsoft Surface tablet to install linux on, with it even being lower resolution and smaller screen.
well in this area @workdowg can give you more details as he is the one who loves X on this tab me i'm more like an Y type (aka windows gui/y) (i am happy with my openvpn and sshd) but again consider the unlocking part done and start collecting stuff for making your kernel
ionioni said:
well in this area @workdowg can give you more details as he is the one who loves X on this tab me i'm more like an Y type (aka windows gui/y) (i am happy with my openvpn and sshd) but again consider the unlocking part done and start collecting stuff for making your kernel
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very exciting. Need to boot a compatible kernel with the provided drivers, as you also suggested, and eventually get a full fedora distribution up and running.
Since this is an x86 tablet, no cross-compilation will be needed so it will allow for more flexibility with getting tools into initramfs to make it bootstrap systemd, and eventually run a full distribution from the system partition.
Would be very interested if workdowg can also provide some input on the issue.
cocacola2015 said:
Thank you for the reply.
You're right, going the route of compiling whatever Lenovo has put out, is not the most streight forward option, but I disagree on not putting Linux on this tablet. This is the biggest and highest resolution tablet I've seen, and having Android on it instead of a full-blown Linux distribution, is a waste. Things like X forwarding to use it as a thin clinet, does not work well, I've tried all options. The only viable thing for using this as a thin client, is to run Linux on it, with its native input methods on the display server.
The gain is not having to pay twice as much for a Microsoft Surface tablet to install linux on, with it even being lower resolution and smaller screen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
as short as it was yet i still read it on fast-forward
i wasn't saying to not put linux on it (i have linux on mine too) i'm saying that putting ONLY linux was not worth (for my needs) the work required for (maybe i was too subtle ) i mean even if i had a full linux distro solution for my 1380 tablet i would still go for my current Android on Linux set-up that i have. yet, each has his own needs
oh boy it's getting late
cocacola2015 said:
Very exciting. Need to boot a compatible kernel with the provided drivers, as you also suggested, and eventually get a full fedora distribution up and running.
Since this is an x86 tablet, no cross-compilation will be needed so it will allow for more flexibility with getting tools into initramfs to make it bootstrap systemd, and eventually run a full distribution from the system partition.
Would be very interested if workdowg can also provide some input on the issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ionioni said:
as short as it was yet i still read it on fast-forward
i wasn't saying to not put linux on it (i have linux on mine too) i'm saying that putting ONLY linux was not worth (for my needs) the (huge)work required for (maybe i was too subtle ) i mean even if i had a full linux distro solution for my 1380 tablet i would still go for my current Android on Linux set-up that i have. yet, each has his own needs
oh boy it's getting late
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I purchased my tablet with intention of dual booting Linux and Android and eventually going with Linux alone (being x86 I thought this would be a piece of cake). Now after getting Linux running (with Android in a chroot).... My vision has changed. TTY Linux is great, I have so much I can get done when not home. Using Xsdl, X runs well enough ( I had wine installed to run a Windows app) and I don't think it would be all that much better on the framebuffer.
The problem ends up being.... (and it has been stated before).... Touch still sucks on a small screen! Android just excels at it. So for me, if someone were to develop kexecboot or such I would definitely play with it (proof of concept) but I'm positive I'd go right back to my current setup.... ssh and the Xsdl for X as needed are perfect.
ionioni said:
as short as it was yet i still read it on fast-forward
i wasn't saying to not put linux on it (i have linux on mine too) i'm saying that putting ONLY linux was not worth (for my needs) the work required for (maybe i was too subtle ) i mean even if i had a full linux distro solution for my 1380 tablet i would still go for my current Android on Linux set-up that i have. yet, each has his own needs
oh boy it's getting late
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh I see. The highest priority for me at least, is to get any linux distribution to boot.
workdowg said:
I purchased my tablet with intention of dual booting Linux and Android and eventually going with Linux alone (being x86 I thought this would be a piece of cake). Now after getting Linux running (with Android in a chroot).... My vision has changed. TTY Linux is great, I have so much I can get done when not home. Using Xsdl, X runs well enough ( I had wine installed to run a Windows app) and I don't think it would be all that much better on the framebuffer.
The problem ends up being.... (and it has been stated before).... Touch still sucks on a small screen! Android just excels at it. So for me, if someone were to develop kexecboot or such I would definitely play with it (proof of concept) but I'm positive I'd go right back to my current setup.... ssh and the Xsdl for X as needed are perfect.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Touch will probably work better on the larger screens, I've got the 13inch one.
---------------
So I got the latest kernel from kernel.org to boot but I'm not sure why it doesn't find the initramfs, I assume it has to do with it not existing on a partition, but being built into the boot.img.
http://i.imgur.com/IxdwXre.jpg
I'm trying to make it boot a live OS directly from USB, without initramfs. It's a bit difficult because I don't know how the block devices are named, maybe if anyone knows the kernel command line for booting the live linux using the custom kernel, using sdhci or normal usb.
Basically, instead of the normal LiveUSB sequence:
grub from USB -> kernel from USB -> root filesystem from USB
I want
custom kernel with android boot.img -> root file system from USB/SD card
cocacola2015 said:
I want
custom kernel with android boot.img -> root file system from USB/SD card
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
there's something wrong with your boot.img, and from the image there not enogh info
link the boot.img you make
ionioni said:
there's something wrong with your boot.img, and from the image there not enogh info
link the boot.img you make
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What's wrong is you need the root= kernel argument, and I'm not sure how the block devices are named (For example, it doesn't have /dev/block/ like on the android kernels). The initramfs isn't modified yet, it's a custom compiled kernel with the source at kernel.org.
Created a boot.img that one can add root= kernel arguments to, to test booting from other media:
https://anonfiles.com/file/177753c2344c3c64c200cdb3803236bd
It has these kernel command line arguments built into the kernel:
Code:
oops=panic panic=360 vmalloc=172M debug_locks=0 bootboost=1 vga=ask i915.modeset=0 drm.vblankoffdelay=1 selinux=0 nomodeset ro debug noinitrd
Another one with UHCI (USB2.0) driver, instead of xHCI (USB3.0), because it might not reach init sometimes otherwise when plugged in, for some reason.
https://anonfiles.com/file/d41f495d118ab1e5ccef961baeb1bcce
No command line arguments built into the kernel, all in boot.img, boot_delay= disabled
Code:
oops=panic panic=360 vmalloc=172M debug_locks=0 bootboost=1 vga=ask i915.modeset=0 drm.vblankoffdelay=1 selinux=0 nomodeset ro debug noinitrd root=/dev/mmcblk0