Hermes Lithium Battery. End of story. - 8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam General

Hello everyone. First of all, let me congratulate all of you who have made this incredible site. I've been reading your threads for 3 weeks and finally i wanted to make my first post. I didnt wanted to be a stupid post so thats why it took me 3 weeks to make it.
I got my first Hermes 5 days ago (yes i searched for info about hermes 2 weeks before i got it) and it is everything i always wanted/needed.
I live in a city called Temuco in Chile (A southamerican country ) and this toys are very expensive even if its a 2 or 3 years old toy like hermes).
When i received my Hermes i was ready to flash roms and got everything to do it, thanks to you guys),
I'm very pleased with some of your roms and now im using [OPTIMIZED Manilla2d][20755 09/29](AlmostNak3d)(V8) by joshkoss.
The only subject that worried me was.................... Battery life, so i did some searching and thats my first post about. Hope you guys find it usefull. I know there are some battery related posts around but wanted to make some conclusions about the subject.
Here we go.
I've been searching and reading different articles about optimizing a li-ion and li-ion polymer battery, as they basically behave the same way.
In recent days i've been thinking a way to keep my battery life longer.
What i first thought, and without any knowledge, is what i've heard all my life: "A fast charged" battery lasts shorter than a "slow charge" battery.
In some battery chargers there are two ways to charge batteries. Slow and fast. And i always feel that slow charge was better than fast, so i thought.
My Hermes charger is 5V 1A.
If i charge my hermes through USB (Which i think has less than 1A) my battery should be "better charged" and the charge should last longer.
I never quite tested this but as a normal "battery user" it sounded more logical to me.
So i searched on google if there was any information about li-ion batteries and its characteristics.
I went to www.batteryuniversity.com and what i read astonished me.
Battery Conclusions
1.- Lithium batteries are completely different than older nickel based batteries.
2.- Lithium is a very unstable element and behaves abnormally when overcharging and overdischarging.
3.- According to batteryuniversity, "Overcharging makes the cell causes plating of metallic lithium on the anode; the cathode material becomes an oxidizing agent, loses stability and releases oxygen. Overcharging causes the cell to heat up. If left unattended, the cell could vent with flame."
4.- Over-discharging is as dangerous as overcharging. According to batteryuniversity, if discharged, "Copper shunts may have formed inside the cells, leading a partial or total electrical short. The cell becomes unstable. Charging such a battery would cause excessive heat and safety could not be assured."
5.- Lithium batteries are usually overcharge and over-discharge protected.
6.- You shouldnt use chargers different than the manufacturer's one.
7.- End of story and End ob battery thoughts.
I (we) just have to live with that.

The Li-on cells for my Makita tools are charged on a computer controlled charger. It reads temp and level of charge and charges accordingly. Manufacturers estimate 3000 charges before the battery is dead, and this after fast heavy discharge that can make a battery too hot to hold and fast charge that takes 22 minute on a 3ah batttery from fully flat to fully charged.
The people who use Li-on at the edge of their accepted use, the radio control flyers, use computer controlled chargers that read the same parameters and more. Many of their chargers read individual cells and balance the charge. Again, after use, the batteries can be too hot to hold.
In a phone or a laptop we use a wall wart the same as any old nicad. I dont know if any clever stuff goes on inside the laptop or phone to regulate charge level according to battery condition but I don't think so. We get about a year out of a laptop that is trickle charged. I'm on almost 2 years for my Tytn with no discernable drop in life but I think I've been lucky, it seems to be about a year for many people. So that's 365 charges, approx.
My guess is that it's charger technology rather than battery technology that limits our battery life.

The Hermes does have a battery sensor. It can be screwed up though when you go below a certain level (<10%), hence people who have trouble recharging a TOTALLY flat battery. The Hermes sensor doesn't detect a battery giving a red LED.

I don't know anything about battery...
I'm currently have a problem with a battery or power-related. My X01HT have just 1 day life in use. I was try it with different second-hand battery, but it likes first condition when only life in 1 day. Hmm.. may be which is the wrong? The battery or the phone?
I have 2 set of X01HT, next time I will try to exchange the battery from both of it. I want to test their battery life to compare and make conclusion about which is the wrong between the battery or the phone.
My tested phone have radio version 1.14.01.10 and have unlocked with NextGenServer. I am using the newest Pays ROM Full. IPL: 1.04. SSPL: 2.60 (Olipro). I have experienced using Pays ROM in twice, first which already sold and the second is this case. Both of the have the same radio version. I think the first one is okay about the life stability, but this one have a problem. May be ROM have influenced the battery life? Or may be IPL/SSPL have caused instability too?
Sorry guys, about poor in English. May be I need to make a thread to share my problem with you.
Thanks.

Hermes are battery hogs but some programs can be power leeches too.
If the radio rom isn't good for your area it also can be a power drain as it is constantly scanning for connection.
I tend to find about 2 days is all my battery lasts for with a little bit of use. Depends what you are using....
Cheers...

I have 3 pieces of SoftBank X01HT.
One of them just fine in the life of the battery, so network here is fine too (maybe). But this one is already sold, so I can't test the battery to my another X01HT which have a critical power problem.
Another X01HT so sleepy, the life of the battery just 1 day. I was try to replace the battery with another battery (2ndhand and I don't know the condition actually) but it have no change, just 1 day too, may be less... Now I try the third battery. I'll reported soon about this...
So how about your opinion about critical power in the X01HT? May be there is another factor beside the battery? Beside the program/OS? May be some physically probelm with their board or etc?
Sorry about poor in English.

I can't say much about the X01HT... All Hermes internals should be the same, but they may put extra things in or take things out depending where you buy your Hermes.
So saying, the Hermes, if not all HTC phones, seem to use a large amount of power. If you use apps it will of course discharge faster.
Sometimes it can be as simple as changing the radio rom but this is risky as the radio rom tends to be permanent brick if something goes wrong with the flash.
Maybe an app you have running and don't realise, I had a BT program that did this, had to shut it down or my battery was down to 70%in about an hour or 2.
Cheers...

Related

Could it be Battery or WM6 problem?

Hey, I have bought myself a second-hand Universal and found it turn off at about 40% of battery. Could it be a software fault?
i have the same problem ( need help plz
i have the same problem ( need help plz
I'm pretty sure it's a battery issue. It has been reported numerous times, my Universal started turning off at ~35% battery after about one year, bought a new one, problem solved.
akpidis said:
I'm pretty sure it's a battery issue. It has been reported numerous times, my Universal started turning off at ~35% battery after about one year, bought a new one, problem solved.
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oh....
Maybe it is somehow recoverable?
I have no money for a new one... in my country they're quite expensive.
i have the same problem in wm5 and mw6
cycling the battery
You could try cycling the battery. Its probably LithiumION. You need to somehow drain it all the way down, then charge it up all the way a few times.
This should bring the battery back to full capacity. Only you can't do it on the phone cuz the phone shuts off at 40%.
That may or may not work. Typical life of a lithium Ion is only 2-3 years.
Ebay has really good deals on them for phones.
It is a battery issue.
Why don't you search a little.
There are some exact same threads already.
Buy a new battery!!!!
All well an good saying look at other threads and "buy a battery" but from my experience I am very sceptical about this issue. I have read many forums on other similar phones and it appears that the Exec seems to be the only model that seems to have this battery issue.
I cannot seriously believe that buying a new battery is the answer, there must be an underlying problem here which allways goes unanswered...!!!
I am now on my third battery, the last one lasted no more than four weeks when it started shutting down at around 75%, and this was a battery from the manufacturer...
My only other option now is to purchase a big blob of a thing which once fitted, will not allow my exec to sit in its cradle whilst on the move...
oh... these Universals seem quite problematic, but anyway I think i'll stay with one a little longer.
I think Universal needs too much power and this is why batteries, which loose some voltage after being drained, are so weak with it.
Some say that when they turn WiFi on, the battery faints at 80% I think it is caused because WiFi module takes even more power.
The problem is, Li-Ion batteries only last around 1000 dis-/charge-cycles. (see Wikipedia) and on WM6 I found no way to disable the charging while connected to my PC. (Okay, I didn't try another cable.) So every time you plug your device to your PC for some minutes, it's like charging your battery and it gets a bit weaker.
Also there's no memory-effect with Li-Ion-batteries so a full discharge followed by a full charge may not bring any results despite of an even worse capacity. You should only do this on the very first usage of the battery.
Wikipedia also says the capacity depends on the age of the battery. So if your dealer sells you a battery he has had in his shelf for 2 years, it won't have the capacity as a brand new one.
Read Wikipedia for more info on Li-Ion batteries. WM6 seems to consume some more power than WM5 and thus the battery shuts down a bit sooner than with WM5. It's really a battery issue.
If you could manage to charge the battery only when it is at around 10%, it will last longer than if you charge it every day or even on every PC connection.
Cheers,
-mARKUS
So every time you plug your device to your PC for some minutes, it's like charging your battery and it gets a bit weaker.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Also there's no memory-effect with Li-Ion-batteries
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you could manage to charge the battery only when it is at around 10%, it will last longer than if you charge it every day or even on every PC connection.
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Click to collapse
AFAIK there is no problem to charge Li-Ion batteries every day even if it still has any level of charge exactly because there is no memory-effect.
from my experience - WM6 issue
reverted back to WM5 and now it happens at 20% rather than 40% previously with WM6.
try reverting back to WM5 to find if that is the same case for you as well.....
If you could manage to charge the battery only when it is at around 10%, it will last longer than if you charge it every day or even on every PC connection.
-mARKUS
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Click to collapse
this ain't what HTC FAQ section says. That states the battery can be charged at any level withoyut any detriment to the battery life over a period of time.

Batteries, Batteries, Batteries

I felt this would be necessary since there seems to be varied battery usage. Perhaps we could all post how long our battery lasts, how we use it and most importantly how we CHARGED it as soon as we took it out of the box.
Some people say we have to CONDITION the batteries. While others say CONDITIONING is not necessary with these types of batteries.
Perhaps the results of several users will help us figure out the best methods. Feel free to ask ?s.
search
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=446131
g2tl said:
search
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=446131
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try reading,
There posts are not detailed. That is how i want to start this thread out. Stop thread crapping.
So i just got my tilt and i am currently charging it, i will post as i use it.
Battery usage is sooo variable I doubt you'll ever get an apples-to-apples comparison.... but for what it's worth, here's my .02.
1) I fully charged my battery as-soon-as I got home from the store with the phone. I have since drained it as-far-as 5% remaining and fully charged it several times. (I realize that this probably doesn't do anything with a lithium battery, but it makes me feel better.)
2) Battery life is hugely dependent upon signal integrity and strength, both of which are marginal at my house. I get 3G most of the time, Edge some of the time, and nothing now and then.
3) In my week of ownership, it seems that both Wifi and GPS are BIG battery hogs. Even avoiding Wifi, my phone was down to 38% by 1:00 pm today with usage as follows - Charged overnight and taken off the charger at 6:45 am. About 25 minutes of browsing while on 3G. Email scans on one account every 5 minutes, but little traffic. A few text messages and about 35 minutes of GPS use with TomTom.
Bottom line, I thing there will be battery issues if you do much more than use the Fuze as a phone.
Hope this helps,
Richard
The sales guy turned the phone on for me and started setting it up right at the store. Walked half a block to my job and started charging the phone. It charged fully, however, I played around with it as it charged.
I use the data connection only when needed.
Here's a typical day:
Charged the phone over night. Woke in the middle of night, around, and unplugged it as it was fully charged. Woke up around 8am. Use the data connection to check e-mails, weather, and browsed for no longer than 10 mins.
By the time I left my house, which was about 8:40am, one line was down.
Used browsing and e-mailing again between 9:30-10:30.
Used AIM for about 15 mins after that.
By 1pm... my battery was half way drained!
That is the typical usage of the phone. Didn't really receive or make phone calls much... perhaps 2 or 3 calls for about 4 mins each.
I tried getting a new battery from the store but they don't have any yet. They had me call up AT&T and they don't have yet. Trying to get one from the manufacturer now.
This is the only thing that I don't like about this phone... the battery life!
I would use the 8125 with Wifi and lasted all day!
What is the difference between NiCad, NiMH and Lithium Ion batteries?
Nicad vs. NiMh
The main difference between the two is that NiMH battery (the newer technology of the two) offers higher energy density than NiCads. In other words, the capacity of a NiMH is approximately twice the capacity of its NiCad counterpart. What this means is for you is increased run-time from the battery with no additional bulk or weight. NiMH also offers another major advantage: NiCad batteries tend to suffer from what is called the "memory effect". NiMH batteries are less prone to develop this problem and thus require less maintenance and conditioning. NiMH batteries are also environmentally friendlier than NiCad batteries since they do not contain heavy metals (which present serious landfill problems). Note: Not all devices can accept both NiCad or NiMH batteries.
Lithium Ion
Lithium-Ion (Li-Ion) has become the new standard for portable power in consumer devices. Li-Ion batterys produce the same energy as NiMH battery but weighs approximately 20%-35% less. This is can make a noticeable difference in devices such as cellular phones, camcorders or notebook computers where the battery makes up a significant portion of the total weight. Another reason Li-Ion batteries have become so popular is that they do not suffer from the "memory effect" at all. They are also environmentally friendly because they don't contain toxic materials such as Cadmium or Mercury.
​Just as a rule of thumb (so to speak) I would NOT recommend fully discharging your Lithium battery. If you look at the physics behind it, you can break down the threads that help hold the charge and cause the battery to deterorate more rapidly.
Lithium battery do not need to be fully discharged and based on my experience, if you do that you better buy a few spares. You can plug your phone/battery in to a charging source frequently and often if it's available.
My battery for my Fuze last me all day (6:30am-9:00pm) with heavy surfing and hour+ calls on 3G.
I fully charge and drain my battery (until it tells me to charge) for the first few charges (i'm on my third charge so far, and will continue into the 5th charge). like previously mentioned, it probably doesn't do much for Li battery, but makes me feel better.
So far I've been getting 2 days out of a single charge from the following activities:
- scan for email every 4hrs
- data connection set to turn off after 45 sec of inactivity
- browse on internet for close to an hour a day on 3G
- on phone for about 30min/day.
- music for varying lengths of time
I know I can get 3 days out of a single charge if I wanted to, but I usually drain it on purpose by playing music on speaker on second day.
I am definitely considering getting a spare battery + cradle charger, but I will probably wait until I visit Asia later this year. After all, HTC's home is in Taiwan and apparently accessories are cheaper there.

Cradle use and battery health

At the office I leave my phone in a cradle. When I get calls I remove the phone to answer and then return it to the cradle when done. My battery goes from 100% down to somewhere in the 90's then charges back to 100% in the cradle. Does this repeated process harm the battery in any way? I've read that these batteries don't suffer from the memory effect, but I'm still not sure if this counts as a charging cycle.
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App
You should always let the battery run down completely some times maybe once a week.
Really? I've read on this forum that there is no need to do that with the new Lithium Ion batteries. I've even read that this could have a negative effect and you should try not to let the battery drain completly.
I don't understand why there isn't a proper battery care section in the manual. Its as if its some kind of voodoo science.
Perhaps not Once a week. But Once a "while"
The reason is that, Phone software uses approximation to calculate the charge left in the Battery. So over time, battery ages and software may not be calibrated to match with the battery's storage capacity. So draining the battery entirely and charging them fully gives the phone's software to assess the battery's health and recalibrate.
It's a lithium battery mate. The only way you can really damage it is by a complete discharge. So long as you don't switch the phone back on once it switches itself off due to low battery you needn't worry about anything else.
Also in theory the lithium batteries have a lifespan of say about a 1000 charges for example and everytime you charge it has one charging less left. This ofcourse isn't exactly how it is in practice but charging the battery alot wears it down. It isn't good either to keep it in the charger for a longer time after it's reached a 100%.
Hi,
this is only partly correct:
Suppose the battery can make 1000 (which I don't believe) charge cycles,
it means that you can charge 1000 times from empty to full.
If you just charge 1000 times from 50% empty to full it counts for 500 cycles!
So,
don't worry, let it stay in the cradle if you like
There are 500 opinions about that but believe, as I wrote is correct.
Theo
Yes, what I said wasn't exact science and I used 1000 cycles as an example, but from what I've read it is better to let the battery drain to less than 50% and then charge it full rather than charge 5% at a time. My previous post was meant to illustrate this.
Sent from my Leedroid powered pocketsized supercomputer using XDA App
geenome said:
You should always let the battery run down completely some times maybe once a week.
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Click to collapse
That's a load of crap, no offense... Lithium batteries have no memory effect and have absolutely no need to be completely discharged, that's a ancient thing from the time of nickel-metal hybrid batteries. The only actual reason for full charge cycles is to calibrate the device for that exact battery.
Keeping a lithium-ion battery in a charger most of the time will wear the battery down faster than getting it drain more and then charging it. Keeping the battery almost fully loaded/in a constant loading state wears the battery capacity by approximately 20% a year (can't recall the source/study just now)(EDIT: and my personal experience is that the battery capacity will wear that much anyway, no matter how you use it). The life-cycle of phones these days are roughly two years nowadays so IMO you can keep it in a cradle with no worries, if you wish. And lets face it, a new battery after a year of usage won't be that big an investment after all.
To add to the above post, running down a lithium battery completely does more damage than benefit. This is almost impossible though with normal use as the phone shuts down long before the battery is completely empty

Battery Chemistry

We all know that the One (and many other modern cellphones) have a Lithium Ion battery. While these batteries have no traditional 'memory effect' the way NiMH did, it seems that different chemistries for the electrolyte would suggest different strategies for recharging.
For example, after looking at the Wikipedia entry for Lithium batteries, it would seem that we should be mindful about 'topping off' the battery, because charging deteriorates the lifespan, implying that running down the battery might be a more advisable practice than plugging in to fully charge every night.
Wondering if any of you experts out there can comment and discuss, given that we One users no longer have replacable cells.
Good question, I too would be very interested in hearing from some of the posters that are knowledgeable in this area.
Sent from my HTC EVO 3D X515m using xda premium
This is pretty well established knowledge right now. I'll list everything pertinent about lithium ion batteries and charging smartphones:
Edit: Note that I mention Lithium Ion in this post, but the HTC One uses Lithium Polymer. They are for all intents and purposes equal in terms of their usability, except for slightly less charge cycles
Edit 2: Hello Reddit! No idea this would have taken off. I'm "coolmatty" on reddit. This is an overall generalization, and there are plenty of resources that go into more detail. Places like Battery University are great sites to start.
1. Charging is what reduces the life of a lithium ion battery. Batteries are usually rated between 700-1000 charge cycles while keeping 90% of their capacity.
2. Charging 0-100% counts as one cycle. Charging 80-100% 5 times counts as one cycle.
3. Leaving your phone on the charger after it is charged has the potential to reduce battery life, although this is less of a problem with newer devices as they often disconnect the charging circuit until the battery drops below ~95%. Generally only an issue if you leave it on the charger for 24+ hours.
4. Lithium ion batteries do not require any conditioning.
5. Most lithium ion devices arrive with ~40-50% battery life remaining, because this is the optimal charge level to store a lithium battery for long periods (such as sitting on a store shelf for months).
6. Slower charging maintains the battery's overall lifetime capacity better than fast charging. This is likely why the HTC One does not have Qualcomm's Quick Charge enabled. It's debateable whether you'd notice the effects over the typical lifetime of a smartphone, however (2 years).
7. Not exactly related to lithium but just in general: smartphones (and tablets, etc) have charging circuits that only draw a certain amount of amps regardless of the number of amps the charger provides. Using a 3.1 amp (tablet-level) charger is not going to significantly increase the speed at which your phone charges. Most phones only use between 0.8 - 1.2 amps. Anything over that is overkill.
8. Storing a lithium ion battery at 0% is really bad for its lifetime capacity. Running it to 0% generally isn't recommended all the time, but a few instances won't hurt it.
9. Recharging from 0-100 doesn't make your battery run longer. It can, however, reset Android's battery level stats so that it can more accurately state the battery level.
10. Charging from ~95% to 100% takes a long time because it must do a trickle charge. Maxing out the battery like this can reduce overall lifetime capacity, but generally not enough to matter. You'll see this impact more often in larger applications of lithium batteries (like cars).
You have no idea how many people need this post (on some points, myself included). Thanks.
Vincent Law said:
2. Charging 0-100% counts as one cycle. Charging 80-100% 5 times counts as one cycle.
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Click to collapse
It does not seem to be that uniform, according to this:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
From what I understood from the link above in Table 2, you can get the best longevity by charging from 50% (2nd row).
jasahu said:
It does not seem to be that uniform, according to this:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
From what I understood from the link above in Table 2, you can get the best longevity by charging from 50% (2nd row).
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Click to collapse
But is it practical to charge it at 50% every time?
Doesn't the one infact have a Li-Po battery ? Would these points still apply ?
Nyxagamemnon said:
But is it practical to charge it at 50% every time?
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Click to collapse
What is a practical approach for me now, after reading this all, is to charge it every night.
This way
- I have better chances for not running out of battery during the day
- either it was at 75% (3rd row) or 50% (2nd row) I still have better longevity than charging from 0% most of the time.
Battery life will not degrade as long as you donot empty its charge for long time and donot use it while on charge... over heat on battery aged the battery...
Sent from my GT-I9082 using xda premium
Just wanted to add: li-ion and li-po batteries now-a-days have protection circuitry to prevent overcharge and over-discharge. Overcharge protection based on what is stated above, known as trickle charge. Over-discharge protection means that your phone will shut off when your battery is around 3v per cell, whereas you should refrain from force starting the phone. The only benefit you get from fully charging/discharging is battery calibration for cell mismatches. It is also good to know that partial charges are better than full charges when it comes to lithium ion (and lithium polymer) batteries.
The HTC one uses li-poly, not li-ion
Can read all about the advantages and disadvantages of each other here:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/is_lithium_ion_the_ideal_battery
li-poly
Advantages
Very low profile - batteries resembling the profile of a credit card are feasible.
Flexible form factor - manufacturers are not bound by standard cell formats. With high volume, any reasonable size can be produced economically.
Lightweight - gelled electrolytes enable simplified packaging by eliminating the metal shell.
Improved safety - more resistant to overcharge; less chance for electrolyte leakage.
Limitations
Lower energy density and decreased cycle count compared to lithium-ion.
Expensive to manufacture.
No standard sizes. Most cells are produced for high volume consumer markets.
Higher cost-to-energy ratio than lithium-ion
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Click to collapse
As far as I am concerned, li-poly is overall better for phones where you can't change the battery.
by the looks of that article it was done quite a while ago (for the tech. world) so the disadvantages might not be as much of a problem these days.....
jasahu said:
It does not seem to be that uniform, according to this:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
From what I understood from the link above in Table 2, you can get the best longevity by charging from 50% (2nd row).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was using a simplification. It would be better not to let it go to 0, but most charge cycles are rated on this. I do mention the impact of letting the battery go to 0%.
Miketoberfest said:
Doesn't the one infact have a Li-Po battery ? Would these points still apply ?
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Click to collapse
A flub on my part, you are correct. There are minor differences (the only one that matters to us is slightly shorter lifetime capacity) but otherwise it works the same.
Now that i see a battery 'expert', a quick question.
Back in the dack, if you bought anything with batteries, you would have to charge them for 24h, no matter how much charged they were. But if i were to buy a phone today (Lith-Ion), Do i still have to do that?
I think not, but i'm not quite sure. Lots of people (even smartphone sellers) still recommend charging it 24h, wich i think is bull.
Bartcore3 said:
Now that i see a battery 'expert', a quick question.
Back in the dack, if you bought anything with batteries, you would have to charge them for 24h, no matter how much charged they were. But if i were to buy a phone today (Lith-Ion), Do i still have to do that?
I think not, but i'm not quite sure. Lots of people (even smartphone sellers) still recommend charging it 24h, wich i think is bull.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think that was only for the old Ni-MH batteries as they had to be bedded in as such. The newer ones dont need this
Vincent Law said:
This is pretty well established knowledge right now. I'll list everything pertinent about lithium ion batteries and charging smartphones:
1. Charging is what reduces the life of a lithium ion battery. Batteries are usually rated between 700-1000 charge cycles while keeping 90% of their capacity.
2. Charging 0-100% counts as one cycle. Charging 80-100% 5 times counts as one cycle.
3. Leaving your phone on the charger after it is charged has the potential to reduce battery life, although this is less of a problem with newer devices as they often disconnect the charging circuit until the battery drops below ~95%. Generally only an issue if you leave it on the charger for 24+ hours.
4. Lithium ion batteries do not require any conditioning.
5. Most lithium ion devices arrive with ~40-50% battery life remaining, because this is the optimal charge level to store a lithium battery for long periods (such as sitting on a store shelf for months).
6. Slower charging maintains the battery's overall lifetime capacity better than fast charging. This is likely why the HTC One does not have Qualcomm's Quick Charge enabled. It's debateable whether you'd notice the effects over the typical lifetime of a smartphone, however (2 years).
7. Not exactly related to lithium but just in general: smartphones (and tablets, etc) have charging circuits that only draw a certain amount of amps regardless of the number of amps the charger provides. Using a 3.1 amp (tablet-level) charger is not going to significantly increase the speed at which your phone charges. Most phones only use between 0.8 - 1.2 amps. Anything over that is overkill.
8. Storing a lithium ion battery at 0% is really bad for its lifetime capacity. Running it to 0% generally isn't recommended all the time, but a few instances won't hurt it.
9. Recharging from 0-100 doesn't make your battery run longer. It can, however, reset Android's battery level stats so that it can more accurately state the battery level.
10. Charging from ~95% to 100% takes a long time because it must do a trickle charge. Maxing out the battery like this can reduce overall lifetime capacity, but generally not enough to matter. You'll see this impact more often in larger applications of lithium batteries (like cars).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks Vincent. Great post will certainly bear it all in mind when charging my phone.
Sent from my HTC EVO 3D X515m using xda premium
ragingredbull said:
Thanks Vincent. Great post will certainly bear it all in mind when charging my phone.
Sent from my HTC EVO 3D X515m using xda premium
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I'm not sure everyone noticed one of the things he said. I know from my HD2 and Ruby that HTC phones will not continue charging after hitting 100%. The phone will indicate %100, but shortly after you disconnect the charger and start using the phone the indicated power level will drop to what it actually is - and it will be lower depending upon how long it has been sitting at "100%". Their phones have a protection circuit that kicks in. So if you really want 100% in the morning, power the phone down to charge it.
Bartcore3 said:
Now that i see a battery 'expert', a quick question.
Back in the dack, if you bought anything with batteries, you would have to charge them for 24h, no matter how much charged they were. But if i were to buy a phone today (Lith-Ion), Do i still have to do that?
I think not, but i'm not quite sure. Lots of people (even smartphone sellers) still recommend charging it 24h, wich i think is bull.
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As I mentioned in my first post, Lithium batteries do not require conditioning. The purpose for this on old Ni-Cad batteries was to avoid the memory effect, which could result in a battery appearing to be dead long before it actually was. For instance, if you always charged it from 60%, after many instances of this, the Ni-Cad battery would suffer a voltage drop at that point, which most electronics can't handle (some can, however, and once past the short period of low voltage, they will recover and continue normally).
Charging for 24 hours is most certainly not relevant, as once the battery reaches 100%, charging has ceased anyway. There's no need to charge it to 100% anyway, other than to give you more time to play with your new toy
---------- Post added at 01:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:41 PM ----------
stevedebi said:
I'm not sure everyone noticed one of the things he said. I know from my HD2 and Ruby that HTC phones will not continue charging after hitting 100%. The phone will indicate %100, but shortly after you disconnect the charger and start using the phone the indicated power level will drop to what it actually is - and it will be lower depending upon how long it has been sitting at "100%". Their phones have a protection circuit that kicks in. So if you really want 100% in the morning, power the phone down to charge it.
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You'll see this in most devices nowadays. It's especially noticeable on laptops, which typically won't lie to you about the charge. It depends on the models, but I know Macbooks for instance will happily sit at 95% charge as "fully charged". This is by design and other than turning off the device, you shouldn't try to "top it off". Any other method (such as unplugging and plugging it back in) hurts the overall lifetime of the battery.
Vincent Law said:
...
You'll see this in most devices nowadays. It's especially noticeable on laptops, which typically won't lie to you about the charge. It depends on the models, but I know Macbooks for instance will happily sit at 95% charge as "fully charged". This is by design and other than turning off the device, you shouldn't try to "top it off". Any other method (such as unplugging and plugging it back in) hurts the overall lifetime of the battery.
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Most of the modern laptops allow you to turn on or off the battery saving feature. For those who use the laptop while plugged in most of the time, it will stop charging at 80%. For those who will be using it off the plug, the option is there to get it to 100%.
I often see posts from people (in various forums) asking why their laptop will only charge to 80%...
stevedebi said:
Most of the modern laptops allow you to turn on or off the battery saving feature. For those who use the laptop while plugged in most of the time, it will stop charging at 80%. For those who will be using it off the plug, the option is there to get it to 100%.
I often see posts from people (in various forums) asking why their laptop will only charge to 80%...
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I've never heard of this, and I don't recall seeing it on any Windows or Mac laptop I've used recently. Sounds like some proprietary crap one of the manufacturers came up with. Stopping the charge at 80% doesn't make much sense, since you'll still have the issue of constantly recharging the battery (as soon as it drops below 80%).
Edit: I will say that it is marginally better than keeping it at 100%, but that said, there's steps you can take on your own that are much better.
The ideal way to use a laptop that will be plugged in for most of its lifetime is to discharge it to about 45%, and then remove the battery entirely. At that point, the battery can maintain its capacity for months without major issue. Just make sure to recharge it once every 3 months or so, as the battery will discharge (slowly) even while unplugged, but at a far slower rate than it would be inside the laptop.
Vincent Law said:
I've never heard of this, and I don't recall seeing it on any Windows or Mac laptop I've used recently. Sounds like some proprietary crap one of the manufacturers came up with. Stopping the charge at 80% doesn't make much sense, since you'll still have the issue of constantly recharging the battery (as soon as it drops below 80%).
Edit: I will say that it is marginally better than keeping it at 100%, but that said, there's steps you can take on your own that are much better.
The ideal way to use a laptop that will be plugged in for most of its lifetime is to discharge it to about 45%, and then remove the battery entirely. At that point, the battery can maintain its capacity for months without major issue. Just make sure to recharge it once every 3 months or so, as the battery will discharge (slowly) even while unplugged, but at a far slower rate than it would be inside the laptop.
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The latest research from the Auto manufacturers is that Li-Ion technology works longest if the battery level is between 50 and 80%.
My Toshiba U925 ultra portable uses the optional 80% max. If you use the laptop almost exclusively while plugged in, it will help provide battery longevity, or so I understand.
Many laptops won't work unless the battery is in place. It depends on how they built the power circuits.

Whats is the best Battery charging practice for better battery life?

Using always connected to Charger?
For long term battery health I wouldn't recommend keeping it plugged in for long periods of time. People say today's batteries have protective circuits that prevent overcharging, but I don't really trust this. So I simply unplug it as soon as it is fully charged.
As for actual better battery life, turn off everything you don't need - GPS, Bluetooth, Wi-Fi, Mobile Data etc. This phone should give you an average of 6 hours SOT. To obtain more you will probably need a custom kernel, but even then the results may vary.
Yeah it has protection circuit to protect overcharging. Lithium based batteries can always take charge, and might self-combust. (ok , worst case. basically, lithium can't get in contact with water. RH in air is just enough to start the self combustion reaction). Nowadays, Li-ion or Li-Po are well made, and this is less problematic.
This as been said, it doesn't mean that this circuit won't trigger the battery every 0.XXX% drop, which is not good, so yeah, until someone do electric reading test on the op5, I won't suggest to let the device plugged in when full.
Simple rules for lithuim based batteries :
- time will kill the battery, even if it's brand new sealed. (normal chemical reaction). Nothing we can do here, limit extreme temperatures, not too cold not too hot.
- heat will decrease battery life and capacity. This mean, dash charging will decrease life. So, 1.2A to 2.0 [email protected] charger is more appropriate. Even if dash tech will regulate the charge, you still have a time that it will optimize to max power, so more heat.
- Polarity direction changes will decrease life/capacity. This mean, do not charge it if you don't need to.
- do not wait to drain it at 0%, I don't know what is the security factor from OnePLus. A single lithium based batterie under 2.60-2.75V, will mostlikely be dead , or will loose more than 50% of his capacity.
Some lithium based battery will perform better, but to keep low price, do not worry, oneplus use standard li-po.
More developed info here :
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
When the phone is plugged, it doesn't use the battery anymore, therefore the battery is not drained. Once it reaches 100%, it just stays at 100% until you unplug it.
Some says that leaving the charger plugged is not ecological, because it still uses energy even if it doesn't charge anything, but in reality it hardly use energy. I don't remember the numbers, but it is really insignificant.
In the end, there are a lot of superstitions concerning charging and battery life, most coming from old habits and false/outdated information spreading through the internet. The only things very true is that you should avoid letting your battery going to 0%, and don't let your battery overheat, and that's all. Charge when you please, as long as you please, and avoid using low-cost chargers or batteries as some can be dangerous.
I used my Xiaomi Mi3 for 3 years, letting it plugged every night with a QuickCharge charger, and it could still handle a whole day when I finally sold it.

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