WM video acceleration lacking? - Shift General

Does the Shift's WM side suffer from the dreaded lack of video acceleration enabled drivers affecting most current HTC devices? This would show up as relatively mediocre video performance while playing TCPMP or Slingplayer. On the Shift I would expect no less than 30fps using Slingplayer.

ok, if no one knows the answer directly, maybe we can infer it...
I'd really like to find out the performance of Slingplayer for example. It is well-documented that this is an app that suffers in many newer HTC devices due to the lack of drivers specifically taking advantage of the video hardware.
Can anyone report the fps and bitrate they are getting while using Slingplayer Mobile on the Shift? I have a Slingbox available if anyone needs testing.
I think RealVGA may be needed to see the full layout of Slingplayer while it is running to display the fps in the upper right hand corner of the screen.
thanks.

Related

What's the status of the video performance of TyTN/Hermes?

Hi! I'm considering buying a HTC TyTN and have been reading about the problems with the video performance and the ATI Imageon drivers. One of the key things that I'm interested in using my TyTN for is watching video.
I have been browsing around on the forums, reading different threads and trying to assemble a picture of the current status of this. It wasn't that easy, however. My apologies is this question has been asked a million times already.
I've seen that many new ROM's for the TyTN includes an ATI imageon fix cab and that this together with TCPMP player should solve many of the previous problems with playing video.
Are the drivers for the Imageon-chip still poor or does this fix mean that the performance is basically as good as it gets?
What I wonder is how well does it work now? Will I be able to play for example "standard" TV-ripped videos in Xvid/Divx with decent performance? I would like to not have to do transcoding of the "standard crop" of video files. I guess that the TyTN should be able to play them at least "in theory"?
What are your assessments of the current situation?
Thanks in advance!
Imageon drivers can be flakey yes but there is a simple workaround.
Switch your Video player to use "Raw Framebuffer" instead. I've tested this with TCPMP and Coreplayer on the Stock Orange WM5 Rom and an upgraded WM6 Rom from here without issue.
I can play downloaded tv eps and films fine - I've been playing around with spb mobile dvd to convert them down to about a third of their original size and they play perfectly.
I'm using raw framebuffer mode in TCPMP with sleuths ati fix and it all works fine
Awesome, this is sounding better and better! Seems like I should be able to unlock the device as well. I think I'm gonna get me one of these babies
ATi playback .... using hardware acceleration has been working for AGES, make sure you have an up to date WM6 ROM and you should be fine.
Ive been using Coreplayer (yes its the payware bigger brother of TCPMP....bloody cheap for what you get) and the hardware based video playback ROCKS!
ID recommend buying coreplayer over using TCPMP any day, considering the price of a Hermes the small price for coreplayer is peanuts in comparison.
Interesting! What would you say are the big advantages with Coreplayer over TCPMP?
Better ATI hardware support, resulting in better video performance?
Diztinct said:
Interesting! What would you say are the big advantages with Coreplayer over TCPMP?
Better ATI hardware support, resulting in better video performance?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Better ATi support, better looking skin, more functionality (storage card library system etc..) more support from the developers, free updates etc...
Totally worth buying.
Now I'm the happy owner of an HTC TyTN
I have SIM-unlocked it and upgraded to Pays WM6 2.05. Everything went fine after I had spent some time reading threads, the wiki and being nervous
I've been checking out Coreplayer and I've decided on buying it.
Now I just need the 8 GB MicroSD-card that I ordered.
I also plan on modding the included handsfree so that I get a 3,5mm jack for my favourite headphones.

Touch HD Video Playback Performance Concerns

So here's my story:
I recently bought Samsung Omnia on which I did extensive tests on video playback
with CorePlayer 1.2.5 and TCPMP and with various video formats such as:
H264 Baseline 3 480x272 (originally encoded for playback in iPod Touch)
Various XviD encoded videos with resolutions varying from 640x360 to 720x400
Using DirectDraw as video output in both CorePlayer and TCPMP
the result was awful, dropped frames, awful motion and distorted colors.
However since the Omnia has the fastest CPU I know in WM Device so far,
the Marvell PXA312, 624MHz with IntelXScale acceleration,
the CorePlayer and TCPMP gives this as an option for video output the IntelXScale acceleration.
So when using this setting the video playback of any type of encoding was absolutely beautiful.
Colors were correct, performance was amazing (even in double playback speed) it was in general as smooth as it gets.
For a powerfull (hardware-wise) device such as omnia, I was very disappointed
in the resolution of the screen (240x400 - wqvga) and its size 2.8".
For this kind of device which has literally everything one would expect it
to have same screen size and resolution as the touch hd.
I rushed to buy this device I must admit and so I sold it to a friend after experimenting with it for one week.
The reason that I gave away so fast the Omnia was simply the Blackstone.
Since I am kind of perfectionist as far as it concerns screen resolutions, the touch hd is no match with any other phone/ppc device out there.
So here comes the real concern, how is the performance on video playback on the blackstone?
For a multimedia device like this one would expect that the performance
would be excellent (much like the omnia or even better if it can).
But what concerns me is the Qualcomm cpu at 528Mhz which as far as I can tell
doesn't have IntelXScale acceleration (plz correct me if i'm wrong on this)
So if it uses only DirectDraw and the results are crappy, then this would be such a turn off.
Can this CPU give a smooth video playback performance on a 640x360 XviD avi video
with "Smooth zoom: ON" and "Zoom: Fill Screen" settings on either CorePlayer or TCPMP?
And keep in mind that we are talking about realtime upsizing of the video to 800x480
which IMHO requires quite a lot of cpu power for such device.
Because really I am not willing to spend 700 euro on a multimedia phone
that can't actually perform well on multimedia.
I'd love to hear someone that has it and tested it on that matter.
Thanks for reading!
We really want to know the answer for your question, And I think that we have to wait until we see the phone on the market and get some benchmarks.
Also I think that SE in their xperia phone did what you are asking for ..! In the same beautiful screen resolution 800x480
Thank you,
Mohammed
mohdtmn said:
We really want to know the answer for your question, And I think that we have to wait until we see the phone on the market and get some benchmarks.
Also I think that SE in their xperia phone did what you are asking for ..! In the same beautiful screen resolution 800x480
Thank you,
Mohammed
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
More like SE said to HTC "We want an awesome phone, but we don't want you to tell us what's in it, and we'll just make Magnus make up stuff as we go, also we suck at marketing."
touch HD has a slower cpu, without xscale acceleration. but it has a dedicated graphics chip, which matters more in video play back. at the resolution you have mentioned, i have full confidence it will do just as well if not better than omnia.
buggybug0 said:
touch HD has a slower cpu, without xscale acceleration. but it has a dedicated graphics chip, which matters more in video play back. at the resolution you have mentioned, i have full confidence it will do just as well if not better than omnia.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I sure hope so, because I would say I'm not so satisfied with the Touch Diamond performance. Let me explain:
Since this matter is really killing me, I need to be sure it can perform well on video (not extreme stuff, the standard-like video formats we all use).
So I decided to make a test, since i don't own a Touch Diamond (which has the same hardware), I went to a local retail store that had the device on display for ppl to see and experiment with, I installed coreplayer and sent a 40" 608x400 xvid video with ~900kbps bitrate to test it.
CorePlayer was set automatically with video mode QTv and with TytnII Driver mode enabled (which i suppose is the accelerator driver)
I made sure nothing else was running in the background and the results was not so ok. I was playing just ok, I noticed some frame skips and some "lag" in fast motion.
I just hope the Touch HD has revised hardware (if that's possible) and better drivers maybe?
I really would like to hear an answer from someone that has already his hands on the touch hd
buggybug0 said:
touch HD has a slower cpu, without xscale acceleration. but it has a dedicated graphics chip, which matters more in video play back. at the resolution you have mentioned, i have full confidence it will do just as well if not better than omnia.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
but htc is also notorious for not not allowing 3rd party software to use the graphic chip, that is when they do provide drivers for the chip
fallenczar said:
but htc is also notorious for not not allowing 3rd party software to use the graphic chip, that is when they do provide drivers for the chip
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so are you saying if i were to install a 3rd party video player, when i try to play video, i will see a blank screen? because this player is 3rd party and can't access the graphic chip?? :S
buggybug0 said:
so are you saying if i were to install a 3rd party video player, when i try to play video, i will see a blank screen? because this player is 3rd party and can't access the graphic chip?? :S
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Click to collapse
No, i'm saying that coreplayer/TCPMP will only be able to use the default qualcomm chip, its exactly like having a graphic card in your pc with no drivers and no in built support
Thats sux
I hope Touch HD has better driver ... because the hardware is the same.
Quite a downer ...
mkMoSs said:
I sure hope so, because I would say I'm not so satisfied with the Touch Diamond performance. Let me explain:
Since this matter is really killing me, I need to be sure it can perform well on video (not extreme stuff, the standard-like video formats we all use).
So I decided to make a test, since i don't own a Touch Diamond (which has the same hardware), I went to a local retail store that had the device on display for ppl to see and experiment with, I installed coreplayer and sent a 40" 608x400 xvid video with ~900kbps bitrate to test it.
CorePlayer was set automatically with video mode QTv and with TytnII Driver mode enabled (which i suppose is the accelerator driver)
I made sure nothing else was running in the background and the results was not so ok. I was playing just ok, I noticed some frame skips and some "lag" in fast motion.
I just hope the Touch HD has revised hardware (if that's possible) and better drivers maybe?
I really would like to hear an answer from someone that has already his hands on the touch hd
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
fallenczar said:
No, i'm saying that coreplayer/TCPMP will only be able to use the default qualcomm chip, its exactly like having a graphic card in your pc with no drivers and no in built support
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Click to collapse
If that is the case, then I dont understand it. I mean why HTC would go through all this trouble to have an extra graphics chip in their devices when no other than their own app could ever use? So they put a graphic chip with 3d capabilities and video acceleration for just their own apps like touchflo 3d ?
Isn't it just stupid?
Yes, that would be stupid. Fortunately though, there is quite some talk about the HD having an optimized chipset compared to the Diamond, even though this does not include the processor. It is already evident by the many movies that the device performs faster than the diamond even with the same processor, so I doubt you'd have exactly the same performance issues as with the diamond. Though there is only one way to be sure: wait 2 more weeks and everybody will own one.
nin2thevoid said:
.......... wait 2 more weeks and everybody will own one.
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Click to collapse
Hell...i cant agree with you more..almost everyone i know is either 'buying one' or 'Wants to buy one'....whatever happened to the times when there were a few geeks like me who went out and bought a winmo phone....whatever happened to the iphone??...lol
gauravdc said:
Hell...i cant agree with you more..almost everyone i know is either 'buying one' or 'Wants to buy one'....whatever happened to the times when there were a few geeks like me who went out and bought a winmo phone....whatever happened to the iphone??...lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
iPhone died, blackstone killed it
Blackstone is a killer... Woohoo.. We have to send it to prison!!.. I think I might have a good prison here at my home so my blackstone, come for punishment *roarr* lol
Coreplayer 1.3.0 is said to have major improvement with QTv rendering on MSM7201A/7200A. This was promised by them on their forum about a month ago.
Head over there and hurry them up! Those guys are reeaaaalllly slow, probably too busy working on Coreplayer for stupid iPhone.
wuzy said:
Coreplayer 1.3.0 is said to have major improvement with QTv rendering on MSM7201A/7200A. This was promised by them on their forum about a month ago.
Head over there and hurry them up! Those guys are reeaaaalllly slow, probably too busy working on Coreplayer for stupid iPhone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, if I buy the current coreplayer-version from them, do I get a free update when the 1.3.0 will arrive? Or should I wait until it comes out? This would be the most important application for me on the Touch HD.. Greez, cad^^
wuzy said:
Coreplayer 1.3.0 is said to have major improvement with QTv rendering on MSM7201A/7200A. This was promised by them on their forum about a month ago.
Head over there and hurry them up! Those guys are reeaaaalllly slow, probably too busy working on Coreplayer for stupid iPhone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Fingers crossed!
They should just forget the iPhone, ppl will be finding out about blackstone and they will be throwing their iPhone from the window xD
I guess no problem with playing video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fv9lLAVidgA&fmt=18
Thanks to johnkorver who own the device, create the video review, and upload it to youtube.
looks promising even though we don't have any other info on the video file except the codec used (xvid).. anyway upscaling works nice and that says much..
one more video playback demo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wo7I6K8U7L4

Can someone explain to me the lack of video acceleration?

i have heard that qualcomm has the drivers or something to that effect, and wont release the info for programmers to take advantage of the graphics accelerator. the effect is i cant play simple videos, unless i run them through a program first to recode them
if that is the case, why would sony ericsson give them the contract, knowing this?
When do you think this problem may be cracked?
Why wouldnt sony ericsson include codecs in their media panel ( i understand this has video acceleration)
Although QTv is still not very well understood, CorePlayer can (and does) use it to accelerate video playback.
Leddy said:
Although QTv is still not very well understood, CorePlayer can (and does) use it to accelerate video playback.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i thought it didnt yet??
I don't know how they do it.. but coreplayer is 99.9% smooth !
only the really fast scenes in normal xvid sometimes drop a frame... but it's very acceptable.
as the others said keep an eye on the core player 2.0 release which is said to do better hardware decoding. its not bad now though .
dont know much about the details of qc driver mess as i am new here. but even if you have full proper access to the driver, applications needs to written to take advantage of the accelerated hardware to notice a performance increase.
Thanks for information
THE GRIZZ said:
as the others said keep an eye on the core player 2.0 release which is said to do better hardware decoding. its not bad now though .
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Click to collapse
It is bad, real bad. My 3 years old Palm T5 plays movies 20% faster, at 100% (ie the same resolution). But then no WM device of X1 generation is any better. Faster devices only starts to appear (like new ASUS and Toshiba promised 1GHz device).
Dr.Sid said:
It is bad, real bad. My 3 years old Palm T5 plays movies 20% faster, at 100% (ie the same resolution). But then no WM device of X1 generation is any better. Faster devices only starts to appear (like new ASUS and Toshiba promised 1GHz device).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But the T5 doesn't have to display all the extra pixels.
I say with no scaling .. so extra pixels should not count. I mean when the picture is small enough to fit on both displays at 100%.
When playing at fullscreen, Xperia is even slower, while not much ..
With null video the speed is more or less same. But even copying the image with no scaling seems to be slow on Xperia. On Palm 100% scale is only a bit slower then null video.
On the other hand Palm is slow at scaling. For Xperia (crystal player, qTV driver) scaling makes only little difference.
I only watch language lessons on Xperia, and only rarely. I don't need that to be perfectly fluent. And then, you can always convert the video, which should help.
I guess the reason is Palm T5 was really good at that time. The difference is it was just PDA. No wifi, no phone, no gps. It could have strong CPU. Communicators have to feed and cool all that, and they started with weaker CPUs (even communicators from Palm, or even models with WIFI (Tx) had slower CPU). Only last year communicators catch up with CPU power. But then there are many other things, like buss speed, display driver, OS support (Palm is quite simple OS).
The ultimate pocket movie player is just not here yet. T5 was a bit closer to it then Xperia (it also has bigger screen, worse colors on the other hand).
Anyone knows how is TouchHD in this aspect ?
read this
http://mobile-enthusiast.blogspot.com/2009/02/saga-of-htcs-video-performance.html
Good find ! That explains a lot. Only if I knew it earlier

Video playback on LEO

Will there be issues on video playback like all other HTC devices ?
Will leo be able to play a not converted divx ?
firiel said:
Will there be issues on video playback like all other HTC devices ?
Will leo be able to play a not converted divx ?
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Click to collapse
I think it's able to play till 480p res. videos even no exist video acceleration or drivers... It's powered by brute cpu force with snapdragon to process vid. codecs IMO...
firiel said:
Will there be issues on video playback like all other HTC devices ?
Will leo be able to play a not converted divx ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not gonna worry about that. For Touch HD, I used Total Video Converter, I used Iphone H264 MP4 best settings and play in Windows Media Player, even in Touch HD it is smooth and stunning at full 800 X 480, only that scrolling through time frames or during video startup is sluggish. And for HD2, I believe the loading time will be shortened.
Playing high quality videos have been non issue with these HTC devices, you just need to do it right.
precsmo said:
Playing high quality videos have been non issue with these HTC devices, you just need to do it right.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you don't mind wasting time on conversion, that is.
From HTC website: Video supported formats: .wmv, .asf, .mp4, .3gp, .3g2, .m4v, .avi
Can't speak to quality because the phone isn't out. ;-)
Reason4444 said:
I think it's able to play till 480p res. videos even no exist video acceleration or drivers... It's powered by brute cpu force with snapdragon to process vid. codecs IMO...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which means that when a device from another manufacturer like samsung or acer grabs the snapdragon we will cry with the results, right ?
And dont have me even mention tegra
rebecker said:
From HTC website: Video supported formats: .wmv, .asf, .mp4, .3gp, .3g2, .m4v, .avi
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Touch Diamond2 specs also mention .avi, but it's a half-truth. I use a Topaz ROM on my Touch HD and can't view regular DivX/XVid videos with anything built-in. Maybe the FullScreen Player from HTC Album (or Windows Media Player) here can play .avis with some weird codecs, but it's absolutely irrelevant to real-life scenarios.
vangrieg said:
Touch Diamond2 specs also mention .avi, but it's a half-truth. I use a Topaz ROM on my Touch HD and can't view regular DivX/XVid videos with anything built-in. Maybe the FullScreen Player from HTC Album (or Windows Media Player) here can play .avis with some weird codecs, but it's absolutely irrelevant to real-life scenarios.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've gone back to the stock rom on my hd, after an unfortunate incident with some muggers. But Coreplayer (ver 1.3.2) seems very adept at handling any native divx/xvid files
AshHD said:
I've gone back to the stock rom on my hd, after an unfortunate incident with some muggers. But Coreplayer (ver 1.3.2) seems very adept at handling any native divx/xvid files
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then we probably have very different HDs because mine reminds me of the era of 200MHz HTC devices. Playback of unconverted is jerky with visibly very low FPS, dynamic scenes are more like slideshows than films, even with 700MB rips, 1.4GB ones are even worse. This is not to mention that CorePlayer doesn't support AC3 audio which means that half of the movies I have are mute. If this is called being "very adept at handling" then I don't know what isn't.
Stock ROMs are exactly the same in terms of video performance, the reason why I mentioned Topaz ROM is simply because that device boasts .avi support, which it is in fact lacking. That said, ".avi support" is pretty much a meaningless phrase since .avi is just a wrapper, there could be a full zoo of codecs inside.
firiel said:
Which means that when a device from another manufacturer like samsung or acer grabs the snapdragon we will cry with the results, right ?
And dont have me even mention tegra
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In what way do you imagine that these devices will be superior to the HD2 when it comes to video playback? If the HD2 can play back video at full screen resolution (800x480) with no dropped frames at all and support any wrapper or codec you might want, how much better can any other device really get? That (most likely) is what the HD2 running Coreplayer will deliver.
The only time there's likely to be an issue is if you expect to play back a high-definition (e.g. 1280x720) video downscaled to the screen resolution in real time. But, even if it's only for reasons of storage space, you'd probably want to downscale any clips like that to 800x480 resolution anyway.
It's possible that other devices (the ones that can use GPU acceleration when playing xvid and divx stuff) will offer better battery-life during video playback, I guess, but I doubt it'll be that big a margin.
Shasarak, it's not clear how the downscaling will work performance-wise without GPU support, and CorePlayer doesn't support AC3 sound. Not that I need to listen to AC3 on a phone, but I certainly have movies with it. So at this moment CorePlayer is definitely a mediocre solution as far as I'm concerned.
Shasharak,
Am not arguing that the device hopefully might be able to play, by CPU power 480p, but what about HTC not delivering for once again, what our money worth.
If u search for comparisons of omnia and any htc 528 based model, you will see great differences on video playback. This is unacceptable from me.
And what about gaming or 3d accelerated apps. We are getting to a new age of handheld devices, that should be (MUST BE) able to deliver video, web, audio and entertainment. And should do it with all their power.
vangrieg said:
Shasarak, it's not clear how the downscaling will work performance-wise without GPU support, and CorePlayer doesn't support AC3 sound. Not that I need to listen to AC3 on a phone, but I certainly have movies with it. So at this moment CorePlayer is definitely a mediocre solution as far as I'm concerned.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, as I say, I don't imagine anyone will want to downscale video on it anyway - HD video won't look any worse if it's downscaled off-line, and it will take up far less space on the memory card than the original HD file.
Coreplayer not supporting AC3 is a problem, I'll grant you. It's possible that Coreplayer version 2 will support it. If not, then you'll have to see if you can get TCPMP running on the Leo - I expect there will be a version that does.
firiel said:
Shasharak,
Am not arguing that the device hopefully might be able to play, by CPU power 480p, but what about HTC not delivering for once again, what our money worth.
If u search for comparisons of omnia and any htc 528 based model, you will see great differences on video playback. This is unacceptable from me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, but that's the point: you won't see those differences on the HD2. I own a Touch Pro2, so I understand how annoyed you are. But the difference with the HD2 is that the CPU is so powerful that it should be able to play back anything with a resolution of 800x480 or less without dropping any frames using the CPU alone - why would you care if it's using the CPU or the GPU if you can't see any difference in the playback? The Snapdragon CPU is nearly three times as powerful as the one in the TP2. Even without GPU acceleration it'll still work just fine.
firiel said:
And what about gaming or 3d accelerated apps. We are getting to a new age of handheld devices, that should be (MUST BE) able to deliver video, web, audio and entertainment. And should do it with all their power.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, we know from existing benchmarks that the Leo will deliver hardware-accelerated OpenGL ES, so that's a good start. On some 3D benchmarks it's more than 20 times as fast as a TP2. (I doubt there will be any 3D-accelerated apps for Windows Mobile, anyway - otherwise people who own cheaper, slower WinMo phones will buy them and then complain they can't run them. WinMo apps tend to be written for low-end hardware.) Web should be fine - especially once we have a version of FlashPlayer 10.1 which will be in beta before the end of the year. I wouldn't worry.
Shasarak said:
Well, as I say, I don't imagine anyone will want to downscale video on it anyway - HD video won't look any worse if it's downscaled off-line, and it will take up far less space on the memory card than the original HD file.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I, on the other hand, can't imagine why anyone would want to convert any videos to watch on the phone. I have a notebook with a 60GB SSD and some 1.16GHz processor - it's blazing fast for Office/internet use but it'll take forever to convert any videos. I also store files like videos on a network drive, so using the more powerful desktop is still slow. And I need to watch videos only occasionally - when going on a trip I can copy a movie or two to take with me on a plane. So space isn't a problem really while ability to watch unconverted video is.
In any case, there was a question you asked about how another device may be more powerful in video playback - I guess with proper driver support they can be, and there are use cases when this is important.
vangrieg said:
I, on the other hand, can't imagine why anyone would want to convert any videos to watch on the phone. I have a notebook with a 60GB SSD and some 1.16GHz processor - it's blazing fast for Office/internet use but it'll take forever to convert any videos. I also store files like videos on a network drive, so using the more powerful desktop is still slow. And I need to watch videos only occasionally - when going on a trip I can copy a movie or two to take with me on a plane. So space isn't a problem really while ability to watch unconverted video is.
In any case, there was a question you asked about how another device may be more powerful in video playback - I guess with proper driver support they can be, and there are use cases when this is important.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As a TP2 owner with a slow desktop PC I feel your pain, I really do. I'm simply pointing out that the HD2 won't suffer from this problem to anywhere near the extent that current-generation HTC phones do. My best guess is that no video clip that runs at 800x480 or lower will require conversion; it's only ones in higher resolutions that will. And the chances are that even your netbook wouldn't be able to play a 720p video smoothly, so what use is it to store the videos in hi-def format in the first place? You might as well download a lower-res version.
If you end having to convert something very occasionally then just leave it running on your desktop PC overnight - it's not that big a deal.
The key difference, here, is that a TP2 can't even get close to playing a 624x351 xvid clip without conversion, while the HD2 will play it perfectly. It'll play anything other than high definition clips perfectly without conversion - so there is exactly one use-case where GPU acceleration is relevant, and it's not an important one.
Shasarak said:
I'm simply pointing out that the HD2 won't suffer from this problem to anywhere near the extent that current-generation HTC phones do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is most certainly true. I still bought HD even though I knew about these problems, but it's still an annoyance. HD2 will be better for sure.
Shasarak said:
And the chances are that even your netbook wouldn't be able to play a 720p video smoothly,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not a netbook, it's a "real" notebook, Thinkpad X300, but anyway - I don't watch movies on my computers - I use a network media server and a network player, they are streamed to my TV. So my phone is the only computer-like device that needs to be able to play videos, actually.
Shasarak said:
so what use is it to store the videos in hi-def format in the first place? You might as well download a lower-res version.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In fact, I try to avoid downloading HD videos whenever I can as I don't care for viewing them in high resolutions even though I have a large Full HD TV. The problem is only that low-res versions aren't always available, and increasingly so. It's not my preference but rather an unfortunate trend.
So you think that the snapdragon "RAW" is enough. Enough for what ? There are no limits for what to expect.
Should HTC, continue to ignore what GPU means, we should not. once again accept it It was like 2 years ago when I complained about my TC performance, without getting any answer. And now Samsung, on their first winmo device (omnia), has really better results, using the same processor. There will be tons of snapdragon devices, or even tegra powered (hopefully) soon enough.
If Qualcomm refuses to give the guys who write CorePlayer access to their intellectual property, that isn't altogether HTC's fault. Any software actually written by HTC does use GPU acceleration - there's a limit to the extent that they can be held responsible for the deficiencies of third party software.
firiel said:
So you think that the snapdragon "RAW" is enough. Enough for what ? There are no limits for what to expect.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I set down very precise limits in my prediction: CPU-only video decoding will (IMO) be adequate for all videos with a resolution of 800x480 or lower. Any video with higher resolution may require transcoding - but it obviously couldn't look any better than an 800x480 video if it's being played back on an 800x480 screen.
firiel said:
Should HTC, continue to ignore what GPU means, we should not. once again accept it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And how exactly should we "not accept it"? I am also pissed off at HTC, but I don't think we can do anything except buying something else, but there are also reasons not to (all of them very individual).
Shasarak said:
If Qualcomm refuses to give the guys who write CorePlayer access to their intellectual property, that isn't altogether HTC's fault.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True, with a BUT: they (HTC) could enable their software to play real-life video formats. Samsung's Touch Player does that. And a smaller "but": they could also provide generic driver that would provide DirectX/OpenGL interfaces for Qualcomm's quirky technologies. Both options would cost them money I guess, so they chose not to.

HTC HD2 720p Video Recording

Hey people, i was wondering since HTC are going to update the HTC Desire with 720p recording in the future via an update. HTC HD2 has the same camera why cant we have an update????
and by the way dont start using because windows mobile 6.5 doesnt allow it blah blah blah......
ps just recieved an update read below....
Dear Yus,
Thank you for contacting us. In regards to updates on the HD2 I can help you with that. No updates are planned at this time to enable HD Recording. The hardware may not even be compatible. The only official information on updates is on our website www.htc.com/support We cannot comment on what is seen on the internet as this is not official HTC published content. I trust that this resolves your query, please do not hesitate to contact us again if required.
To send a reply to this message or let me know I have successfully answered your question log in to our ContactUs site using your email address and your ticket number*************.
Sincerely,
Philip
HTC
its hard the hardware its capable of doing it software might not be. Windows Mobile its old and a bit dusty. Im pretty sure theirs a way but HTC dont care the HD2 its like the last strong windows Mobile device standing. HTC are putting their effort to android and windows 7.
josemedina1983 said:
its hard the hardware its capable of doing it software might not be. Windows Mobile its old and a bit dusty. Im pretty sure theirs a way but HTC dont care the HD2 its like the last strong windows Mobile device standing. HTC are putting their effort to android and windows 7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
^^Hey, I know you!
.....
It might be plausible to enable the HD recording in the future, but I know WinMo is incapable of supporting HD recording. You'll never know, maybe something miraculous will happen and this might work!
However, at least it's nice to get pics at higher resolutions than 5mp. There's a tweak here, if you didn't know.
its not hardware problem... but the winmo 6.5 dont support hd recording...
show me one win mo 6.5 device with HD recording...
its support only android or difrend os...
so maybe in the final android port can hd2record high definition...
but maybe not
ilijan said:
its not hardware problem... but the winmo 6.5 dont support hd recording...
show me one win mo 6.5 device with HD recording...
its support only android or difrend os...
so maybe in the final android port can hd2record high definition...
but maybe not
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, and I'm thinking Microsoft might work on fixing that in WP7 and completely ignore WM6.5.x.
Hopefully the devs get that to work. The TP2's Android port still doesn't have camera support and the port's been around since December.
Lets ask another question has anybody here been able to prove that our beloved HD2 supports 720p recording hardware-wise? And if yes its just a software/driver issue thats keeping us from recording at 720p?
guys if wm6.5 dont support 720p rec
ok how about 720x480 or WVGA like samsung omnia ii ?
something better than nothing
Euroman28 said:
Lets ask another question has anybody here been able to prove that our beloved HD2 supports 720p recording hardware-wise? And if yes its just a software/driver issue thats keeping us from recording at 720p?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
look at the nexus one
scrizz said:
look at the nexus one
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can you confirm to use that the camera in the Nexus One and HD2 are identical?
im pretty sure its 720p recording will be possible in thw android port, but because WM6.5 is well old and sucky (or ancient if you dont like to call it sucky)... it wont be possible in it, but hopefully it will be possible in WP7... and i belive android devs said it will be possible in android but thats when its fully ported of course...
Euroman28 said:
Lets ask another question has anybody here been able to prove that our beloved HD2 supports 720p recording hardware-wise? And if yes its just a software/driver issue thats keeping us from recording at 720p?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well, ive tried lol but not successful, camera shuts down everytime i try it, but i can record on WVGA(800x480) plus a bit smoother frame rate than normal HD2
See i'm kinda holding back from buying one of those mini HD camcorders because im certain someone can create a break through with the HD2's camera. saves me taking two devices everywhere just for the camera, when the HD2's camera seems more than capable.
I've not been on the forum long so can someone explain the process that could make this work? Im aware of the WM 6.5 limitations, has anybody got a solid port to android or WM7 yet...?
Dani01c said:
well, ive tried lol but not successful, camera shuts down everytime i try it, but i can record on WVGA(800x480) plus a bit smoother frame rate than normal HD2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How are you recording in WVGA? I know the Android Camcorder app does but I have never heard of the WinMo recorder going beyond VGA
I don't see how the OS has anything to do with the resolution that the camera can capture at. The limitation is probably in the firmware (in the camera module), camera module driver, or the camera software. Could also be a hardware issue with whatever bus interface is between the camera module and the HD2, it could be a standard USB bus which would have the bandwidth for HD video, or it could be something proprietary with a low bitrate that wouldn't handle the bandwidth of a 720p/24/30 real time video stream. The bus could be a real issue, notice how some of the 1st camera phones that could do 720p were 720p/24. 720p/24 is a lower bitrate than the 720p/30 more common now
I do know that I have gotten my HD2 to capture WVGA video in one of the android builds. I never took the time to evaluate if it was capturing a true pixel per pixel WVGA image, or if it was really capturing a VGA image and then either zooming or stretching it to WVGA in software
chrisrj28 said:
How are you recording in WVGA? I know the Android Camcorder app does but I have never heard of the WinMo recorder going beyond VGA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd like to know as well. I'm more interested in doing widescreen video recording natively. When I run android it does it. How can we do this on the WinMo side? It's not HD just widescreen...
juiceppc said:
I'd like to know as well. I'm more interested in doing widescreen video recording natively. When I run android it does it. How can we do this on the WinMo side? It's not HD just widescreen...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its quite possible that android is still recording VGA mode and then just cropping off the top and bottom, basically leaving you with 640x360 effective pixels.
We need someone that knows the android cam software that can tell us exactly what its doing, or someone to do a resolution test recording a pattern to measure the recorded resolution
well... actually You are wrong. some android builds ARE capable of recording 800 x 480 videos. what more, those are being recorded flawlessly, no frame drops or stuttering.
I believe that I have recorded those with mattc rom.
bronx said:
well... actually You are wrong. some android builds ARE capable of recording 800 x 480 videos. what more, those are being recorded flawlessly, no frame drops or stuttering.
I believe that I have recorded those with mattc rom.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
but is it really true 800x480 pixels or the 640x360 upscaled to fill out 800x480? only true way to test is to use a resolution pattern
http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content/How-We-Test-Camcorders-36180.htm
I am pretty sure that the HD2 has a 4:3 not a 16:9 sensor for the camera. this would explain why we loose resolution when the still camera is put into wide mode. it takes the 4:3 5mpixel image and chops the top and bottom off to make it "widescreen"
drownage said:
im pretty sure its 720p recording will be possible in thw android port, but because WM6.5 is well old and sucky (or ancient if you dont like to call it sucky)... it wont be possible in it, but hopefully it will be possible in WP7... and i belive android devs said it will be possible in android but thats when its fully ported of course...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hey guys so after looking into this a little bit more i have found a few odd solutions but a resurfacing of one of the hd2's faults. i have been able to play high res .mp4 movies in the htc video player no problem. it was designed to fit the series of images best to the screen it is given(just to point out the obvious). now due to the fixed screen res on the device, the MOST your going to get out of any video that you watch is 480x800. the program is just running a data summary per pixel when dealing with a pixle count higher than 480. its the same (or similar) process as to when you you choose full screen or wide screen on the device to play movies. you are not getting true pixel to pixel data play back (unless you record with the phone camera at 480p or convert a movie to EXACTLY 480x whatever. which btw does not matter.) with that being said, the htc video play supports a vast amount of resolutions including 720p .mp4. (you guys have made a mountain out of an ant hill) yes i do understand different res vids also have various bit rate and playback qualities, but the best thing to do for that is download chainfires 3d drivers and manually clock your processor to 998Mhz. rendering becomes seamless at that point. so to end one vicious cycle, yes, you can play 720p videos on your hd2 just make sure its the propper file type. now back to the other issue... 720p RECORDING. absolutely the phone can handle it! its a matter of opening an additional camera function to the htc camera. easier said than done. the general idea is changing a value within either the firmware or through the registry for you input image pixle count. for ex:
blah 12031029 blah 2398x1098
blah 239840923
blah blah blah 90238942
bada bing pixel count per image 480x640 <= we need a way to edit this.
or in a reg directory
blah1/YOUR MOM/HTC CAMERA/CAMCORDER/INPUT VALUE/-_-X-_-
SO basically the sooner we can figure a way to change these values (i know its SUPER SIMPLIFIED) the closer we are to getting 720p recording on the hd2...... so yea ..... WHOS WITH ME!?! and if you have any ideas on how to please add to the brainstorming!
mmendez92 said:
hey guys so after looking into this a little bit more i have found a few odd solutions but a resurfacing of one of the hd2's faults. i have been able to play high res .mp4 movies in the htc video player no problem. it was designed to fit the series of images best to the screen it is given(just to point out the obvious). now due to the fixed screen res on the device, the MOST your going to get out of any video that you watch is 480x800. the program is just running a data summary per pixel when dealing with a pixle count higher than 480. its the same (or similar) process as to when you you choose full screen or wide screen on the device to play movies. you are not getting true pixel to pixel data play back (unless you record with the phone camera at 480p or convert a movie to EXACTLY 480x whatever. which btw does not matter.) with that being said, the htc video play supports a vast amount of resolutions including 720p .mp4. (you guys have made a mountain out of an ant hill) yes i do understand different res vids also have various bit rate and playback qualities, but the best thing to do for that is download chainfires 3d drivers and manually clock your processor to 998Mhz. rendering becomes seamless at that point. so to end one vicious cycle, yes, you can play 720p videos on your hd2 just make sure its the propper file type. now back to the other issue... 720p RECORDING. absolutely the phone can handle it! its a matter of opening an additional camera function to the htc camera. easier said than done. the general idea is changing a value within either the firmware or through the registry for you input image pixle count. for ex:
blah 12031029 blah 2398x1098
blah 239840923
blah blah blah 90238942
bada bing pixel count per image 480x640 <= we need a way to edit this.
or in a reg directory
blah1/YOUR MOM/HTC CAMERA/CAMCORDER/INPUT VALUE/-_-X-_-
SO basically the sooner we can figure a way to change these values (i know its SUPER SIMPLIFIED) the closer we are to getting 720p recording on the hd2...... so yea ..... WHOS WITH ME!?! and if you have any ideas on how to please add to the brainstorming!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i'm wit u 100%

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