Hey,
just upgraded my MDA Vario to the MDA Vario II (my third HTC phone in less than 18 months, these things are addictive) and wanted to share my thoughts for people who might be thnking of doing the same. To a lot of people there doesn't seem much more to shout about between the two but I believe the upgrade is well worth it.
Form Factor, Appearance and Build Quality:
- The Vario II (from here on referred to as as VII) is slightly longer but also marginally thinner than the VI, the difference is only small but to me the reduction in thickness is certainly welcome. The shape of the VII is very similar to the Magician, less rounded compared to the VI and flatter.
- In terms of build quality the VII is far superior, it feels much more solid especially when the keyboard is concealed (you cannot tell that there is one, feels like one continuous unit). The buttons all have a nice tactile feel to them and the jog wheel is very solid.
- Appearance is obviously a subjective matter but in my opinion the VII looks far nicer, especially the dark metallic red keyboard. It has a much more professional look to it, rather than the plasticy VI.
==> The VII takes this round hands down, it's thinner, better looking and more solid feeling with great build quality.
Ease of Use:
- The VII has more buttons than the VI which is a welcome addition for me. I used to map the top buttons (Messaging and IE) to the Start Menu and OK, there are now dedicated buttons below the soft keys. I used to find that I accidently would hit the camera button, so far have not pressed any button by accident on my VII.
- The scroll wheel wasn't a feature I was to bothered about until I used it and have got to say that it makes one handed operation even easier, especially considering there is a second OK button below the wheel which cleverly acts as the Start Menu button when on the today screen meaning you can launch programs using just your thumb. It also allows you to scroll through documents easily although for making large jumps it is a pain. I would mention the equivelent on the VI but that would be the volume slider which was the tackiest part of that phone.
- Another small but overdue feature is the new layout of the number on the keyboard, they are now arranged in a standard numerical block. This feature really comes into its own when dialing a phone number as you now no longer need to double click circle to access the numbers, when your in phone mode you just use the keys and it automatically recognizes that it should use the numbers instead of the letters (this works with SmartDialer and without).
- Keyboard shortcuts have considerably improved, you can now launch File Manager, turn on WiFi and use PgUp/PgDn using the keyboard. There is also a new input method, Symbol Pad which has common and unusual characters in a list (this can be launched directly from the keyboard).
- The stylus is almost identical to that of the VI, although it is very stiff in the VII.
==> Again the VII has some great improvements, some minor but they all add up to make a more satisfying experience using the VII.
Communication:
- Data transfer is the big change between the two devices, the VI has GPRS/EDGE compared to the VII which supports HSDPA. With the VI I only had 6Mb allowance per month and so my general usage was kept to a minimum (MSN, vgsmail and occasional web browsing) and for this purpose GPRS was generally acceptable. Not trying to sound cheesy but HSDPA is going to completly change the way I use my phone, browsing is now almost instaneous even with pictures set to download and I no longer have to worry about how much data I use. Some people mention that although download speeds are impressive there is a lag between loading pages, I have not found this to be the case. I was browsing xda-developers on my phone today and I wouldn't say there was a noticable difference between browsing on my phone and my laptop (4Mbits/s Cable). I did a speedtest on http://www.bandwidthplace.com/speedtest/ and it rated at 1.2Mbits/s (I'm in Leeds)
- Speech quality, without doing professional tests is subjective but in my opinion has improved with the VII as has reception.
==> This is where you'll notice the biggest difference, I don't think it's an overstatement to say that the VII will drastically change the way you use your phone.
NB: The phone came with HSDPA enabled in software but I had to phone customer services (150 from your phone then options 2 => 6, they have to get through the tech department but don't think there's a direct number)
Hardware:
- You can definitly tell that there is a more powerful processor in the VII, menus load without lag and programs load faster. There is a known issue at the moment which affects video playback (search on the forums) but this would be my only grumble with speed. Overall it is far more responsive than the VI (I always had the latest ROM and not one of them matches the VII in responsiveness).
- The one issue the VII has with speed is the length of time it takes to come out of sleep, there is a gud second lag which can get irritating if you just whipped your phone out to check for mesages.
- The camera has received a much needed upgrade as has the camera software. There does seem to be a noticable difference in quality but I don't use it much so won't comment on differences although it is clear that the VII has a better camera than the VI. One thing the VII has which at first I thought was its most pointless feature has actually turned out to be great, on the main camera theres a little macro slider (lets you focus on close-up objects) and it really works. It is excellent for taking photos of documents or writing and you can actually read the text easily from the photo. There is also a second camera on the front for video calling but I don't know anyone who has video calling so cant test it.
- Yet another memory format yet another damn card to buy, the good news is I can't feasably see how a memory format can get smaller then MicroSD without running the risk of it absorbing into your skin so hopefully this one will be around to stay for a little while longer than MiniSD. Have not yet bought a MicroSD card so cannot comment on any performance differences.
- I'm hoping that the battery life on my phone is still being misread as I have only charged it once now but if not then it is awful. I left the house this morning at 9 with a fully charged battery, as I'm still in the honeymoon phase with it I used it constantly until 2pm (webbrowsing, live messenger, no calls, 2 texts, imap idle) and the battery was down to 10%!!!! Another known issue at the moment is that the battery level goes down in 10% blocks, apparently a lot of early ROMs for HTC have this issue and it then gets corrected so fingers crossed. Something else to note is that the VII battery capacity is 100mAh higher (1350mWh vs. 1250mAh).
Update on battery life, it has indeed improved but not as much as I had hoped. My VI is still sitting in my draw, turned on waiting for messages and with no exageration its well over a week between charges. My VII on the other hand needs charging every couple of days, but I do use it a lot.
==> Apart from the battery life the VII beats the VI
Software:
- For the stock ROM unlocking the extended ROM is simply a case of running fit4cats registry tweaker, there seems to be far less less applications in extended rom as well (total ~ 3Mb). For the first time I'm not bothered about letting the extended rom as it doesn't install anything instrusive or bloating.
- Live Messenger Beta runs fine, any problems being related to the software bugs rather than the phone (all my contacts appeared to be offline, had to "Switch User" option to fix that). The voiceclips feature works flawlessly and combined with HSDPA makes for a useful method of communicating when you cant type. Live beta is currently not working
- VGSmail works fine as expected
- Resco Explorer 2005 is fine
CONCLUSION:
The Vario I was a great phone but not perfect by any stretch of the imagination, on the whole it worked but had too many annoyances for me. The Vario II I believe corrects almost every single one of these as well as providing new features. I would not consider this to be a necessary upgrade for those who don't use data communication and can live with the Vario's flaws. For the heavier users I could not recommend this phone more, as I mentioned before I have had the Magician, Wizard and now the Hermes. I'm sure it comes as no surprise that for me this is the best out of the three, but it also the first time I have considered a Pocket PC to be a worthy substitute for a dedicated phone. It truly is an amazing piece of hardware and could not imagine anyone who takes the plunge being the slightest bit disappointed.
Pros:
- HSDPA
- More responsive
- Better keyboard, buttons and general buil quality
- True one handed operation may now be a reality
Cons:
- Battery life (under very heavy usage on new battery)
Hope this helps some people when deciding whether to go for it or not, I will keep this post updated if I think of anything and don't hesitate to post any questions.
When your battery went down that quickly, where you in an area that was spotty with its UMTS reception? (sorry I'm not familiar with your area) I know I am almost on the line of UMTS and no UMTS and when I am on either side of the line I am fine, but when I am close to the line my battery drains ridiculously fast.
after some charges the battery do the best... my Tytn now as about 3days of autonomy...
not comparable with the 2 days of my magician!
great recension...
many thx
bubu
With regards to the battery I know that they take a little while to be worn in and the OS usually takes a while to learn the battery as well so I'm not to worried. I think I was in an area of spotty coverage yes, as I was only getting 3G 75% of the time.
I think this is a great summary so bumping it up for other potential buyers to read.
The new keyboard is rarely mentionned as one of the improvements over the wizard but it really is a big step forward in that department.
cheers for the bump, just a few updates:
- the keyboard issue has corrected itself, it seems that when fresh from the box some of the contacts need to be worn in. all the keys are now as responsive as each other.
- battery life has also improved considerably but that could well be down to me using it less.
- the stylus is now feeling a lot smoother going in and out of the device.
- unfortunatly the screen alignment issue has cropped up on my phone. this is by far the biggest problem people have with these phones. this should not hinder potential buyers as operators are recognizing this as a factory hardware flaw and replacing/repairing it free of charge.
people looking to buy this phone should not be put off by the screen alignment issue. most newer models aren't having this problem but if they do it's just a case of getting it replaced (on that note, make sure you buy from a reputable supplier with good customer service).
hope this helps those looking to buy this great phone.
Great comparison! I'll link it on the PPC Magazine blog!
(BTW, as far as "- Data transfer is the big change between the two devices, the VI has GPRS compared to the VII which supports HSDPA." is concerned: the VI supports EDGE with speeds up to 240 kbps under good circumstances. See http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/index.php?blog=3&p=518&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1 for more benchmarks.)
Guys, hears sweet stuff abot the tytn - but how about tytn vs universal - my current pda . . . i am due an upgrade in like 6 months . . what you guys reckon???
cheers
lr
Thanks Menneisyys for the link and also the correction, have edited the post to include VI having EGDE. The reason I didn't mention it is that tmobile uk doesn't support EDGE so I never got to use it.
I bought a 1Gb Sandisk Transflash/MicroSD card, just stuffed it in the slot and rebooted (for some reason wouldn't appear until I reset, I've noted that other people have also experienced this)... But it just works.
Copied over some xvids via my LAN (PC wired to router, PDA on wifi) using Opera as it's more effective at handling large files than PIE... The files just went. I kept an eye on my upload and I was sending the file to the device at around 550-600kb/sec, which I guess is about the max that 802.11g can handle minus overheads, and the file just wrote without any lag, delay or pauses to the SD card, so I'm very happy with its performance
Not run (or installed) TomTom on it yet, so I've not really had a chance to do a long-duration endurance test of the SD card's throughput performance, but I doubt I'll have many problems compared to the issues I had with my Alpine I know there's apps available which can benchmark your storage card, but I reaaaally can't be bothered to get them right now.
I'm having a continued issue with not being able to sync my device with my computer (just doesn't recognise it at all), but I'm thinking that's a problem with my PC as it's a bit... 'touchy'... anyway All in all, a great device. That is, great device provided you get one without a screen alignment issue! I wish there was an adaptor available to convert the mini USB slot to a standard 3.5mm headphone jack for when you want to listen to music though, that's my only wish - I have some WAY better headphones which I'd love to use with my device say when I'm on the bus going into Uni in the morning, now it can stream live TV over the HSDPA... The included headset is a bit of a waste really.
I hope that the video playback issue in TCPMP is to be resolved soon, because I've had to implement my own workaround for that, but it's just one of those things with any new piece of hardware... You get it soon as it comes out, there's bound to be software bugs. As pleased with my Hermes as I was when I got my Alpine, if not moreso - it's a real all-rounder, and, like a previous poster commented, with the Web 'n Walk tariff, it has also really changed the way I use my phone when I'm on the go.
Brilliant comparison, glad I cancelled my contract with O2 now as they don't have the latest Compact XDA, instead signed with Vodaphone on a better tariff and got the phone FREE (VPA Compact III) instead of having to pay the w*nkers at O2 £150 for the older model!!!
Having been an Exec user previously, this little thing is speedy, compact, neat, modern and has a very 'well designed' feel to it - my Exec in comparison just looks old fashioned and clunky, not to mention a bit creeky with old age!!
Just about to purchase a MicroSD for it, they seem to be about £45 for 2Gb, very good value, I do hope that microSD becomes a standard for memory storage, sick of having to upgrade my desktop Card readers!!!!
Cheers, Ash
Hi there. I've had the MDA Pro/o2 Exec for over 8 months and am very happy with it (except of course it's size which can be uncomfortable). I have an upgrade due in about a week and was wanting to know how the resolution compares to the Pro? I got the MDA Vario and ended up keeping the Pro as the resolution was excellent and the sound quality was better. Just wondering how the Vario II compares to the Pro.
ashleyhall said:
Brilliant comparison, glad I cancelled my contract with O2 now as they don't have the latest Compact XDA, instead signed with Vodaphone on a better tariff and got the phone FREE (VPA Compact III) instead of having to pay the w*nkers at O2 £150 for the older model!!!
Having been an Exec user previously, this little thing is speedy, compact, neat, modern and has a very 'well designed' feel to it - my Exec in comparison just looks old fashioned and clunky, not to mention a bit creeky with old age!!
Just about to purchase a MicroSD for it, they seem to be about £45 for 2Gb, very good value, I do hope that microSD becomes a standard for memory storage, sick of having to upgrade my desktop Card readers!!!!
Cheers, Ash
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm out of my contract with O2 and am looking at the Vario with T-Mobile (their web n walk looks very good) but they're advertising the vario (as opposed to the vario II) how do I know which they're dishing out?
http://www.t-mobile.co.uk/Dispatche...phones_ews_overview&menuid=ctl_phones_details
MarkyMark7890 said:
I'm out of my contract with O2 and am looking at the Vario with T-Mobile (their web n walk looks very good) but they're advertising the vario (as opposed to the vario II) how do I know which they're dishing out?
http://www.t-mobile.co.uk/Dispatche...phones_ews_overview&menuid=ctl_phones_details
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Click to collapse
The Vario2 is out of stock currently. When it's back in stock, it will be listed as the Vario 2. Meanwhile as your link shows, they're still selling the original.
Ah haaaa, that'd make sense.
I rang them yesterday and the best they could say was sometime towards the end of next week.
Is it safe?
Hi friends.I want to buy an mda vario 2 on ebay.Is it safe.What do i need to search before buying an mda vario 2?Can it be unlocked to be used in any country in the world?Can someone sell one which has screen alignment problems?
Is it safe?
Hi friends.I want to buy an mda vario 2 on ebay.Is it safe?I mean i won't know if it wil be in good condition n i wil also not know if it suffers from the screen alignment problem..What do i need to search or ask before buying it.Can the mda vario 2 be unlocked to be used all round the world?
eBay is a dangerous place to buy this kind of thing from, apparently there are quite a few scams going on relating to this phone. If you ask a seller about the screen alignment problem it is very unlikely they will tell you the truth as they can just claim afterwards that it developed after they sent it to you. You could obviously ask for the serial number but that is no guarentee that it won't develop the problem (as far as I know there isn't a single serial number that hasn't had some duff units).
You will have to use your own judgement but personally I think buying this phone from a private seller at this point is dangerous. Plus if the price on eBay is ludicrously low, it's almost certainly a duff listing.
Good luck
Thanks for your advice.I searhed for the mda vario 2 on tmobile.co.uk but it seems that it is out of stock.Could you tell me what is the cheapest price plan concernin this phone?Thanks.
T-Mobile UK are having serious stock issues with this phone, I've been waiting a month for my local T-Mobile shop to get some Vario IIs in so that I can get a replacement. Personally I think their flext packages are very competitive when combined with W'n'W. I currently pay about £38 per month and I get unlimited browsing and £180 worth of texts and calls included. Probably a tad too much but it means I get to use my phone without worrying about usage as I know I'll never go over my allowance. Also going for the bigger package meant I got the phone cheaper (I only paid £40 for the handset), plus I can downgrade my package after 6 months.
My advice would be to go to your local T-Mobile shop and haggle with them, there's a fair few deals that they can do for you. Obviously it would help if they had some stock.
Related
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its on its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
I'm keeping mine. The 'faults' are mostly little niggling things that can usually be gotten round by various hacks/tweaks people have made. And yeah it's a bit big, but you do get used to it
Positives:
- It's like having a little laptop.
- Connectivity wise it truly has it all - 3G, WI-FI, BT, video calling, SDIO, IRDA, etc. No other device has all of this.
- The WM5 OS makes it very easy to write programs/hacks for, so we will see a lot of these over the coming months.
- The VGA screen has a massive "wow" factor!
- Mini-USB connector and charger are very convenient indeed.
- Full-size headphone/speaker socket.
- Built in terminal services client is VERY useful!
- Awesome little keyboard with very good looking backlights.
- Persistant flash-based storage.
- Battery life is very good, lasts for many days on one charge.
- 4 (FOUR) speakers, and 2 (TWO) cameras! Flash is a nice gimmick too.
Basically for me, the huge amount of positives outweigh the small amount of negatives. Best "phone" I have ever owned.
dreamtheater39 said:
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its own its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on a side note,
how much is your sister gettin it for for you from the US? did she have to sign a line?
vapor said:
dreamtheater39 said:
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its own its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on a side note,
how much is your sister gettin it for for you from the US? did she have to sign a line?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bought it at Mad Monkey Boy's Gadgets for 930 USD [qtek 9000]...and 20 USD for shipping to her address...
That makes it a total of 950USD....in comparison to 1350 USD here in India!!!
San
@sl9, I can only manage one day of use from my Exec's battery. I have been very careful with it from new. My Nokia 9500 with similar use can give me twice the life of the Exec battery. With the Exec if you use BT and forget to shutdown PIE you could run out of battery while you think the unit is "off/standby".
dreamtheater39 said:
vapor said:
dreamtheater39 said:
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its own its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on a side note,
how much is your sister gettin it for for you from the US? did she have to sign a line?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bought it at Mad Monkey Boy's Gadgets for 930 USD [qtek 9000]...and 20 USD for shipping to her address...
That makes it a total of 950USD....in comparison to 1350 USD here in India!!!
San
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
wow thats crazy man. but thanks for the heads up
I echo everything sl9 has said. The most important positives for me are:
- persistent storage
- WM5 means I never have to use my stylus, except for 3rd-party apps that haven't caught up yet
- full keyboard makes SMS a breeze
- some very useful touches in the software, like the easy switch on/off of BT and WiFi using just a couple of keyboard presses
- flexible and automatic speaker usage depending on the machine's orientation
- the way the thing feels in your hands (cool/cold, solid, 'tight'): it's nice to hold
- the VGA screen for browsing, Excel, calendar, contacts, ListPro and Today screen (I'm in proper VGA mode)
- battery lasts days for me, but I'm probably a lighter user than y'all and now (because most are awful on WM5) have no 3rd-party apps except PocketZenPhone, TomTom and ListPro (per day: 8 hrs Bluetooth, 1 hr phone, 10 SMS, 1 hr general use, 30 mins WiFi browsing)
- stability: Haven't done a reset in a week or so. I never force-close apps, but rely on WM5 to handle it. I have no idea how much program memory I have free, and I don't care: it just works
- Microsoft's contacts app is very good for keyboard-only use: makes dialling a contact easy
- there are some neat improvements in the UI, such as the way BT comes on automatically when you choose 'ActiveSync over Bluetooth', and headset mode is always on automatically if BT is on and the machine has found your headset to pair with
Negatives for me:
- WiFi reception is very poor
- OEM-supplied voice dial is poor. I hate having to record voice tags, and it's not 100% reliable with detection. This could be my HBH-65 headset though. Sometimes the voice dial prompt cuts in when I'm trying to answer a call on the headset :evil:
- Microsoft's calendar app is very very weak, as is PocketIE, and PocketOutlook for emails
- the phone app should scale to VGA properly and it should have a built-in T9 contact finder (the O2-supplied 'Smart Dialler' doesn't take advantage of the hardware keyboard, so is pointless)
- speaking of which, O2's bundled software is pointless and unhelpful
Umm....
- oh yeah: the cameras are still very weak and useful only for taking emergency pictures, such as recording car accidents that you have and newsworthy moments
- the camera flash is useless as a camera flash, but very good as a torch, if only the machine had an easy way of using this feature
- the hardware application buttons aren't as programmable or flexible as they could/should be. I wish we could program each button through the OS for both Press and Press-'n-Hold
Of course a big negative ATM is the lack of 3rd-party apps that are truly compatible with WM5, but this is hardly the fault of HTC or the mobile operators.
So, the hardware is excellent (with the exception of the cameras and WiFi reception) but the OS-bundled software is flawed. Hopefully we'll get ROM updates that will improve things, just like we did for earlier HTC machines.
jah said:
@sl9, I can only manage one day of use from my Exec's battery. I have been very careful with it from new. My Nokia 9500 with similar use can give me twice the life of the Exec battery. With the Exec if you use BT and forget to shutdown PIE you could run out of battery while you think the unit is "off/standby".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then I would say your battery may be faulty. Do you have wi-fi on?
With bluetooth on permenantly, my MDA PRO lasts for 3~ days on one charge. Without bluetooth, it lasts for 4-5 days.
I'm a fairly light user though, 1 short voice call a day on average, although I do open it up and turn on the screen about 10 times a day to check for reminders, text, notes etc.
Perhaps you are a much heavier user of it than I am? Even so, battery life on your device does seem unusually short
@sl9,
Without BT I get 3.5 hours of use with a combination of eBooks, PIM, email & web browsing (50% using 3G). With BT on that reduces to 3 hours. I use my Nokia in a similar was as a phone, ebook reader, PDA, etc. This is my second Universal as I had a JJ before the Exec and the JJ's battery life was a little worst. This level of use is not unusual for a business user who also travels a lot.
SiliconS said:
I echo everything sl9 has said. The most important positives for me are:
- persistent storage
- WM5 means I never have to use my stylus, except for 3rd-party apps that haven't caught up yet
- full keyboard makes SMS a breeze
- some very useful touches in the software, like the easy switch on/off of BT and WiFi using just a couple of keyboard presses
- flexible and automatic speaker usage depending on the machine's orientation
- the way the thing feels in your hands (cool/cold, solid, 'tight'): it's nice to hold
- the VGA screen for browsing, Excel, calendar, contacts, ListPro and Today screen (I'm in proper VGA mode)
- battery lasts days for me, but I'm probably a lighter user than y'all and now (because most are awful on WM5) have no 3rd-party apps except PocketZenPhone, TomTom and ListPro (per day: 8 hrs Bluetooth, 1 hr phone, 10 SMS, 1 hr general use, 30 mins WiFi browsing)
- stability: Haven't done a reset in a week or so. I never force-close apps, but rely on WM5 to handle it. I have no idea how much program memory I have free, and I don't care: it just works
- Microsoft's contacts app is very good for keyboard-only use: makes dialling a contact easy
- there are some neat improvements in the UI, such as the way BT comes on automatically when you choose 'ActiveSync over Bluetooth', and headset mode is always on automatically if BT is on and the machine has found your headset to pair with
Negatives for me:
- WiFi reception is very poor
- OEM-supplied voice dial is poor. I hate having to record voice tags, and it's not 100% reliable with detection. This could be my HBH-65 headset though. Sometimes the voice dial prompt cuts in when I'm trying to answer a call on the headset :evil:
- Microsoft's calendar app is very very weak, as is PocketIE, and PocketOutlook for emails
- the phone app should scale to VGA properly and it should have a built-in T9 contact finder (the O2-supplied 'Smart Dialler' doesn't take advantage of the hardware keyboard, so is pointless)
- speaking of which, O2's bundled software is pointless and unhelpful
Umm....
- oh yeah: the cameras are still very weak and useful only for taking emergency pictures, such as recording car accidents that you have and newsworthy moments
- the camera flash is useless as a camera flash, but very good as a torch, if only the machine had an easy way of using this feature
- the hardware application buttons aren't as programmable or flexible as they could/should be. I wish we could program each button through the OS for both Press and Press-'n-Hold
Of course a big negative ATM is the lack of 3rd-party apps that are truly compatible with WM5, but this is hardly the fault of HTC or the mobile operators.
So, the hardware is excellent (with the exception of the cameras and WiFi reception) but the OS-bundled software is flawed. Hopefully we'll get ROM updates that will improve things, just like we did for earlier HTC machines.
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Click to collapse
woah! your negatives sure scares the daylights out of me!
- bad wifi reception??? what seems to be the problem???! for me, this is going to be really important!
- bad camera quality? how bad is it??? I saw a few pictures taken from the universal on a couple review sites, and they looked pretty good! am i missing something? (damn i didnt play around enough with the camera when i had the device with me the last week )
S
Well, the WiFi is hard to measure, but the range is nowhere near as good as my HP laptop. I struggle to get a signal on my Exec if I'm not within about 4 metres of my Access Point in my house. (Standard modern house, thin internal wooden walls.) I can use my laptop anywhere in the house (up to 10 metres away) and in the garden too, but no chance with the Universal. I need to move the Access Point.
As for the camera, I guess it's subjective, but I wouldn't rely on it for decent photos. It's OK for times when you just have to record an image but you're not needing to print it out. Here's a comparison between my Universal and a 4 year-old 2 MPixel Canon Ixus300. Both photos without flash, because the Universal's flash has no effect on photos when the subject is more than a metre from the lens. Both photos are at 640x480 and at the same compression level (filesize 38KB). Neither camera is at its native resolution, to make it a realistic comparison.
Edit: moved photos to a new thread
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=33960
Hmm. Not sure why they don't both appear as thumbnails. :roll:
Forgot to add: Universal was in 'Night' ambience mode.
Edit: Incidentally, when you take pictures at the Universal's native resolution (1280x1024) the quality is better, but the same problems are there: poor light sensitivity, poor light colouration, blurred focus, indistinct details etc.
It's better, but a long way from good.
And don't forget, the Canon camera is old now: 4 years. Just 2 MPixel - only twice that of the Universal.
Edit edit: Moved photos to a new thread so they don't break this one
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=33960
@SiliconS
thats a nice comparison shot! ( still wondering if you took them both with similar lighting conditions!!! )
i did read that the universal is fairly bad with "colors" as such....guess we have to live with it!
with the wifi range issue....gosh!! 4metres??? tell me your joking please!
S
dreamtheater39 said:
thats a nice comparison shot! ( still wondering if you took them both with similar lighting conditions!!! )
i did read that the universal is fairly bad with "colors" as such....guess we have to live with it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same room. Same lighting. Photos just one minute apart.
It's not really much better than my XDA2. Just bigger resolution. Low-light shots are really not its strong point though. Only by comparison can you see how bad it really is.
dreamtheater39 said:
with the wifi range issue....gosh!! 4metres??? tell me your joking please!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry - I'm serious. Maybe others can confirm, or tell me that mine is worse than theirs. It's hard to measure objectively though.
You have to be kidding about the 4m WiFi range. I have the router placed in my bedroom and i can actually connect 2 rooms away which are in serial. Oh and there are 2 concrete walls in between.
I still get 2 bars inspite of all this. If you call this weak, then i dont know what to say.
Regarding the camera, its oodles better than the xda2 or the xda2s. It is also much better than the JAM, but then again these are not very good standards to compare to. Yes, it is not as good as Nokia or SE but if the camera is the reason one decides not to buy this device, then this device is clearly not for you.
Yeah, the camera sucks. Who cares? The rest of what's on the Uni - the critical stuff - works great. Quality in a cell phone camera is few years off ...
universaldoc said:
You have to be kidding about the 4m WiFi range. I have the router placed in my bedroom and i can actually connect 2 rooms away which are in serial. Oh and there are 2 concrete walls in between.
I still get 2 bars inspite of all this. If you call this weak, then i dont know what to say.
Regarding the camera, its oodles better than the xda2 or the xda2s. It is also much better than the JAM, but then again these are not very good standards to compare to. Yes, it is not as good as Nokia or SE but if the camera is the reason one decides not to buy this device, then this device is clearly not for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hi universaldoc!
i currently have an xda2 running on wm5! So when i junk my device and buy a new one, i'd first of all see what are the pluses i get by making such a decision.....
heres what i can count -
1. Awesome keyboard (i really love it!)
2. VGA screen (finally!)
3. Built in Wifi
4. Better Camera
5. 3G support (currently useless to me....but its still good!)
6. The cool factor???
7. 10MB more device root space??
8. I'm running out of points!!!
Having said that....I still have bought my universal (but i'm waiting for it get here :evil: ) only because, i'm a god damned gadget freak and wouldnt mind trading away my spare kidney for one!
I'm just reconfirming my buy....the "reality hits" phase....you know???!!
San
I totally agree with all the positives already mentioned. As far as negatives are concerned, I have none. I love my O2 XDA Exec!
One point I'd like to mention though. My XDA Exec has GREAT WiFi. When I was setting-up my MSN Messenger, my Exec detected 4 different access points including my own. I happen to notice my neighbors' access point which I helped her setup included in the list. Now, she lives about 3 apartments down, so you can just imagine the lenght and obstacles my Exec has to traverse.
I don't have wi-fi yet though hoping to get it sorted in the next month or so. Though on the odd occasion I've switched the Exec's on, I've picked up stuff that must be about 30 - 40 metres away. I know for sure I picked up my cousin's network from around 20 metres outside his house the other week - and he lives in a converted barn with thick interior / exterior walls!
Regarding everyone else's positives and negatives, I agree with most. The camera is a LOT better, and is better than the 2.0MP one we had up to a few months ago. However, it's certainly not the main reason for buying a phone and certainly not in a feature-rich device such as the Exec. The pose factor alone is worth it, especially when sat in laptop mode in the car :wink:
It's 3G. It's an awesome looking bit of kit. One or two niggles in the software that will be ironed out. It's inspired 3 of my colleagues and bosses at work to get one. Less kit to carry around between home and work (no cradle, just a lead). VGA screen - which I STILL look at in awe sometimes. I didn't think I'd get to like landscape mode, but now I LOVE it.
Best XDA by far for me, and I've had most :wink:
Cheers
Ant
if else is positive, the main negative would be the response to incoming phone calls especially thru BT headset :evil: ... you would be lucky to take it from the 1st time ... usually it takes 2-3 sec which is more than enough for the caller to hang up :evil:
Believe it or not ... I use the Universal now only for data activities (e-mail, net, ...) and I have to carry my old i-mate for phone things ... nice scene ... huh ? :x
I can't wait to see a real update for the Radio ROM
ohh ... and a one hell missing feature ... a secondary LCD on the cover to avoid opening the screen just to see who's calling ... a very simple idea you find on almost all flapping mobile phones!!!!
Hello guys,
I've had XDA / XDA II devices for several years and have found this forum an enormous help to get the most out them.
When the XDA Mini S was launched I loved the compact look of the device and immediately got one; I managed to get an upgrade for free from my O2 Store which was a very acceptable price; but I've since discovered that even "free" may be too much money for this baby...
The Good News:
I love the size and feel of the device, the slide-out keyboard works very well. Its small enough to fit in your pocket (just) but big enough to work on a spreadsheet. Great!
The Bad News:
The mini seems to be badly let down by a slow processor and insufficient memory. The performance is painfully slow at times; with pauses of several seconds before it reacts even with just 1 or 2 programs running. I've already experienced "not enough memory" errors when starting the camera; with just 1 other program running.
Overall; the performance seems slightly worse that my XDA II. Which I wasn't expecting.
I should point-out that I have removed O2 Active; so I can't blame the poor performance on that (I dread to think how the device would perform with Active running as well) and I haven't installed any programs or utilities beyond those provided with the device.
I have yet to try it out with a demanding application; such as Tomtom 5; but I'm not very optimistic that it'll be able to cope well.
I will be looking into ways to improve performance (all suggestions most welcome), but so far I'm rather underwhelmed by the device and surprised that O2 felt it is good enough to be launched.
Your views/comments would be most welcome,
I have had 2 of these babies.
I am not an experienced user of PDA/XDA devices but agree there is a lag on it. I guess similar to when using the likes of the SE T68i or T610. Not too much of an issue for me as I am using it as glorified diary.
The first didn't have any of this O2 active stuff, and in my opinion ran quite well but the second has O2 active which I cannot turn it off and does struggle at times. It really lags from one thing to the next.
The speaker you use for listening to a conversation crackles, it did on the first and also on this one, so I guess it is a fault of some sort.
I wish I got it free, but I do have a ridiculous tariff where I pay little for a lot of minutes and my bill is only about £30 per month.
I have had 2 of these babies.
I am not an experienced user of PDA/XDA devices but agree there is a lag on it. I guess similar to when using the likes of the SE T68i or T610. Not too much of an issue for me as I am using it as glorified diary.
The first didn't have any of this O2 active stuff, and in my opinion ran quite well but the second has O2 active which I cannot turn it off and does struggle at times. It really lags from one thing to the next.
The speaker you use for listening to a conversation crackles, it did on the first and also on this one, so I guess it is a fault of some sort.
I wish I got it free, but I do have a ridiculous tariff where I pay little for a lot of minutes and my bill is only about £30 per month.
Microsoft fully admit that in order to achieve Persistence storage with WM5 it means you have a slower file system which is making these new devices appear slower than ones running WM2003SE. Which would you prefer, faster system but if the battery dies you loose all your data, or slower but guaranteed to keep your data on a flat battery?
i would definatly like to keep my files.
just my 2 cents
http://blogs.msdn.com/windowsmobile/archive/2005/11/29/498154.aspx
Mine was slow, but a Vario not an O2 job. First thing I noticed after coming from a Magician was the start menu took ages to pop up in comparison and the other menus were similarly slow. Slowly after mucking about with the registry and deleting bits of unwanted garb its up to speed. I know they should come ready done, but like is said lots of times, these devices are just ripe for messing with and customising. Sort of like an Old Mini or Muscle Car or something.
I've got a Magician at the moment, and was thinking of upgrading to a Prophet.
Is is worth it? Obviously this question is relative, so if you think so (or why not) then us know why =]
I have updated myself from Magician to Prophet and would say it is worth it. Windows mobile 5 with its new soft keys is so much easy to use than WM2003. I would upgrade for that reason alone.
Besides, the slower process (in MHz) is not really a difference. The overall performance of the device is on par with Magician.
Moreover, WiFi and EDGE and additional benifits if you make use of it.
On a side note, I like the looks of Prophet better than Magician. It feels more professional than Magician.
I would definitely echo what Itanium2 said. I have also upgraded from the Magician to the Prophet and love it, one handed use is so a lot easier and the softkeys are great.
There are a couple of minor annoyances for me with WM5 over WM2003:
1. Contacts forgets where you are, so if you have scrolled down your contact list, or opened a contact, then say go back to the Today screen, click on the contacts button you are back at the beginning of your contacts list - this is very annoying!
2. Mobile Excel doesn't save your zoom settings. I use Excel quite a bit and WM2003 used to save your zoom settings for each spreadsheet, however now everytime you open a spreadsheet you are at 100% zoom...
Still on the whole, after upgrading to the latest Imate ROM I find the device as stable as the magician was, with a good battery lif. One thing you might like to consider when buying your Prophet is the Imate Jam vs the Orange M600 - the Imate has a much brighter screen (unfortunately I did not find this out until I had brought the M600). Side by side it is really noticeable.
I upgraded my Magician to a Prophet.
Things that made me upgrade.
Wifi (tired of carrying around a wifi SD card)
Brighter screen in daylight
WM5-when power is lost, you still have a working PPC
There are lots of other little things that are better, but for me these were the biggies. Edge is nice of course, but that wasn't a deal breaker since in Europe we avoid data over providers because it is so expensive. If you don't use your Wizard in bright daylight and Wifi isn't important to you on a frequent basis then I think it comes down to money...if you can afford the new toy then why not, otherwise save the 500 dollars for a digital SLR etc.
Do it! I did.
It felt a bit slower to me so I have overclocked it using the tool in this thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=55782
It flies along quite nicely now. 8)
TheBrit said:
Do it! I did.
It felt a bit slower to me so I have overclocked it using the tool in this thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=55782
It flies along quite nicely now. 8)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I still have my Magician as well the Prophet and I have to say that even with the overclocking utility the Prophet is still very much slower than the Magician. Also the screen on the Prophet although undeniably brighter seems to be less responsive in comparison to the Magician. This last point may be down to my units only and could be affected by the screen scratch protection which are from different makers.
Other than those two points, Prophet beats Magician in every other respect.
Here's my 2 cents.
I have upgraded to the Prophet (JAMin) as well. I have to say that I would never get back to the Magician.
Usability has improved greatly, battery life is amazing, overall speed is definitely acceptable.
Well, I am not able to play any of my videos without overclocking the device (or re-encoding them - no way!), but considering all improvements I have found and loved, I would not really care... Unless a new fast CPU equipped device hits the market, of course !
Ciao.
I have had both a Magician and a Prophet, and there isn't a large enough difference to warrant the upgrade. You should wait! Wait to get a 640x480 display with the same dimensions as the Jam. They already have 2.8 inch 640x480 sceen, it’s just a matter of time for them to stick in it in the form-factor
http://www.engadget.com/2006/07/04/sharps-w-zero3es-ws007sh-winmo-5-pocket-pc-hotness-redef/
Why I use the Jam over the Jamin:
1} The Jamin is WAY slower, people can rationalize all they want with FileCache and OCing, but I run my Magician at 585Mhz and there is no way the Prophet compares to it, they are completely in different leagues… and though people say its really only a problem in watching movies, (which it IS!) you still brutally feel the loss when you are tasking around the device…
2} Though persistent storage is nice, its 1/2 the reason the device is slow. I run a SpriteBackup every night, keeping 8 rollover copies on the card, (4gig card)... worst case I lose a day... If the Prophet becomes unusable, (virus, corrupted registry, from all that writefilecaching)) you lost the device and have to hard reset... everyone should do nightly backups regardless of device, but if you did that, what do you need persistence storage for?
3} Wifi: That is a tough one… if there is one thing I miss its wifi, but you rarely find free-hotspots and if you primarily use it at home, (I do) then get a Bluetooth dongle, they have 300 foot range, which covers the whole house. But if you HAVE to have wifi, consider something like this...
http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=121110
4} Camera: the 1.3 and the 2meg are the same in that they are both complete crap.
5} WM5: I am most concerned about this. If MS or others developers make WM5 only apps, then that will become a HUGE problem. But for now it hasn’t happen. And given how many W2003SE there are, its not going to happen for a while.
Final Thoughs: As soon as a JAM-type with a 640x480 display comes along I will toss the JAM but for now, why bother getting a device that has more shortcomings then enhancements.
Thanks for all your replies!
One reason I was worried about upgrading is that I always use my device overclocked - it just seems too slow without. I knew that I couldn't use PHM with the different processor, but it's good to see there's an OMAP overclock util. But it's in beta, and I'm not sure if I could be bothered tinkering with it if somebody already has and says that it's slower anyway.
Flash memory and extended battery life have never been an interest, as I backup weekly (Sprite Backup FTW) and always carry a spare battery.
I have a sandisk 128mb+wifi (hard to find cheaply in Australia), which I'm sure I'll find a use for one day. USB+Card Export = faster regardless.
I never use the camera, mind you, I've seen some shots from the Jamin and they look better.
Also, I'll be moving to Japan in the next year or so, and I didn't really want to spend that much on a device that I'll have to sell later on when I move. Besides, that link James posted looks like it's probably worth waiting and getting a new phone over there.
Ultimately, I was looking for some majorly convincing argument to upgrade. At the moment, it'd only be for the extra two buttons because I've already given AE Button Plus three events for the three buttons I've got. Oh well. Thanks anyway guys.
slvrbllt said:
Well, I am not able to play any of my videos without overclocking the device (or re-encoding them - no way!)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Say what? I've heard this a couple of times now and I can't help but wonder what you people are doing to your devices? My Prophet runs on normal speed and I've never had problems playing my videos! I use Pocket DivX Encoder and if you choose the right setting the video will be crisp and clear and the playback will be smooth like... err... something REALLY smooth!
As I said I've never had any problems with videos so please don't use this to bash the Prophet. You should rather look into what you're doing wrong!
JamesManios said:
4} Camera: the 1.3 and the 2meg are the same in that they are both complete crap.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ha! What? The last time I went on vacation I actually left my digital camera at home since I now have a real good camera in my pocket all the time. The pics are great. If you want to enlargen them to billboard size of course you might want to get some other equipment. I'll attach a picture that I took so you can look at the quality yourself. And no! It is not porn, thank you!
[edit] Oh, nevermind the picture. Is there a way I can attach it for everybody to download without the pic being displayed and completely destryoing the look of the thread?
A) I must agree with Jayxz. Played DivX from Sandisk 512 (old, relatively slow one) with no problem, 29fps and all.
Never had to overclock.
I had a chance to play with Mio 701 which has a faster processor and the only difference in performance I noticed was with the iGO nav software. And that was just a slight improvement.
B) Jayxz: Personally I need no proof of picture quality, but if you want to post it any way, just zip it (better for downloads any way) or change the extension.
Also read this:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=4992
Ok thanks!
[IMAGE_00315.jpg noframe]
Saying the camera's no good is just nonsense. Anybody with doubts click on the link, please.
As for the camera: I would say the quality is the same/similar to the JAM, and not terrible/great, (though that is a good shot!) You usually get a lot of blur from both devices using them in real-life. Almost everyone has a better digital camera, so what I was saying is that it’s not really a reason in comparison to the JAM to upgrade, (ie a much better camera).
You technically are re-enocding when you did the Pocket Divx Encoder. If you download and play a divx off the net that was meant for the computer, (like a 800meg size one) you will find the prophet isn't up to par to play it smoothly. I fully agree a re-encode of a DVD for example can be made to play fine.
If I run TCPMP in benchmark on the same video the Prophet overclocked to 230 gets 230Mbit on video, the JAM overclocked to 585 gets 487mbit, the JAM definitely can dish-it-out more.
Remember I have both devices so I do lots of side by side comparisons, and don’t really have a bias, the Prophet is a good pda! But if you already have a Jam it’s not worth upgrading, (well in my option, save the money for the next device that will be much better).
Does anyone know of a 640x480 JAM sized phone that maybe I don’t know about, (no Exec please)?
James,
Did you forgot to change the focus on the lens ( don't know what it called ). IMHO, the quality is just fine, much better than 1.3 camera. See attached images, one is taken with close focus, another in normal forcus and in room light.
Thang
Its the macro switch for close up. Actually those pictures kinda demontrate what I was saying which is the blur affect. You can see it by the persons head, and in the bottom right corner of the macro picture.
Anyways, we are a little off the topic. I was just saying, comparing the two devices it was really not a big difference, not a reason to upgrade
Ok, we established that EDGE, WiFi and better (even if slightly) camera are not worth the upgrade.
What about memory then?
I admit I don't have a JAM but according to specs it has 64MB RAM, which for WM2003 is split for both storage and program.
Now I know you can install most apps on a storage card, but what about contacts, calendar and the rest of outlook? Not to mention any plugins, utilities and apps you want to use with contents from different storage cards, like TCPMP?
Just how much 'program' memory do you have left in the end, and how much does windows try to reserve for storage even if not needed?
As you can see from my sig, I have a iPaq 1710 which runs WM2003, and I came to despise the slider. What is the point of letting the user change memory allocation if the OS changes it right back.
Thankfully, tweakradje posted a fix for that.
Those naughty MS programmers, NeverDorkMemory he, he :lol:
Ok, first I'm going to apologies to Jed D`Lagged cause we have derailed his original article, but I have to reply to this because of the sheer irony.
Prior to getting my Prophet, a friend of mine, also with a Prophet made the exact same argument. To which I made him a small bet, (figuring I would actually lose). I bet him that I could get a full installed JAM with more free program memory then a similar installed Prophet. Cause even though the Prophet has 64RAM you seem to only get access to much less, something like 42 of it on a bone clean install.
Using BigStorage, and NeverDorkMemory set to limit Storage to 4 Megs (the pre-agreed on number), I installed all the base apps needed to BigStorage, things like Wisbar, 1 Theme, SpriteBackup, Resco, PHM, all the usual suspects. In the end, (sorry I forget the exact number), the JAM had 8 megs more Program Memory then the Prophet... and I know it sounds hard to believe, we were pretty surprised ourselves... the only theory is that maybe WM5 uses a lot of RAM while running the OS??
Now someone will immediately say, ‘but didn't you make the device slow by having all 3rd party apps loading off slow storage’. Yes, I did, but the device was still faster then the Jamin. Once a program loads on either the JAM or JAMIN it runs from RAM and will run at 230Mhz as opposed to 585Mhz which is a noticeable difference.
On one final note, I think people are thinking I'm knocking the Prophet, I'm not, hell I have one, (not for long though), but it’s a good device. Again, I'm just telling Jed, (for what I think are pretty solid reasons) its not worth upgrading...
I've observed the same outcome between the Prophet and Magician. However, if you don't overclock and don't use the Bigstorage hack on the Magician, the RAM amount and speed differences are not nearly as noticeable. In other words, if you don't know how to hack and tweak your phones the differences are not as obvious. I suppose that most people fall into this category, the members from this forum excluded of course
Just bumping my own thread to say that I had started to look at picking up the Prophet for the extra ram because having two Japanese dictionaries, Excel, Word and TCPMP was chewing up ram causing the machine to go slow while it swapped/"Dorked" the memory.
However, NeverDorkMemory fixed that, now I always have ram free.
Hooray!
Jed D`Lagged said:
I've got a Magician at the moment, and was thinking of upgrading to a Prophet.
Is is worth it? Obviously this question is relative, so if you think so (or why not) then us know why =]
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not if you're looking for a phone that will still receive further ROM updates.
I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for HTC/QTEK/Dopod/i-mate et al to release AKU3 for the Prophet.
Hey everyone,
I currently have a Wizard and am very happy with it. I am extremely tempted to buy a at&t 8525 just cause I have a huge amount of money to play with right now, and I would like to know what everyone thinks of their phones. Do you like it? What are your favorite ROMs? How is the battery life? Camera? Speed? etc etc. Please post something of a mini review. Much appreciated.
-Nstefanelli-
well, i love mine, the 3G and large keyboard buttons were a seller for me and my huge thumbs.
not a very detailed reply but thats my 2 quick cents
I've had little but problems with the Cingular and AT&T ROMs. I thought for a while that I had a defective phone, but it turns out they just don't know how to program well. If you do get it, just make sure you unlock the thing and get a better ROM.
I have used PocketPC phones for a very long time.
I had some really old one that I don't even remember what brand it was.
I also had a Hitachi G1000 and a Blue Angel.
I also have an 8125 (wizard) that is still in use.
The 8525 is the best, hands down. The main drawback would be that case seems the least rugged out of them all, but this might just be a perception issue -- it's smaller than the others and the battery door seems far too flimsy for its own good. However, there are hard plastic snap-on skins available for just a few dollars on ebay which eliminate this problem -- though these of course make the 8525 a little bigger.
The other drawback would be the MicroSD card slot. MicroSD is a BAD IDEA. These cards are far too small. My biggest fear is having the card pop out when I'm out and about and never being able to find the card again. If you make a device that uses a memory chip that is the size of a fingernail, you really need a door over it. Or, better yet, don't design devices that use them and let MicroSD die quiety....
Otherwise, the 8525 is nicer than the others in every measurable way. It's not much smaller than the 8125/Wizard, but it is more rounded so it feels smaller. I use the 8525 far more than I ever used the other devices, and as you can tell I've been sold on the technology for a good while.
Amazon had 8525s for $99 and $149 for a few weeks with a new plan or a renewed plan if you're eligible to renew. Totally unbeatable price.
Hi. I've been lurking here for a couple of weeks. I had checked the boards here for "real life" use of the 8525 before actually getting my own. Then I started watching for devices on eBay. Then one Saturday morning, I lucked out and was able to get a *really* !! great deal on a refurb from AT&T with a 2-year plan. The phone I got did not have the new ROM and - from what I've read - not so sure I'm going to upgrade until the WM6 comes out.
Having had the opportunity to play with it for 2 weeks, I really love the device. This is my first PDA phone, and use of the PPC platform - having come from the world of Palm OS devices. I'm a gadget freak, and this one has kept me up nights downloading new apps, playing, deleting apps, performing backups, and ultimate resets. I've hard reset the phone at least 3 times so far.
Not having played with other PDA phones, my biggest complaint is the internal memory - or lack thereof. I've encountered a couple of low memory issues, even though the few extra apps I was running were installed on the MicroSD. Wi-fi has been testy - it seems to find networks when I don't need them, but fails to find and/or connect when they are available (i.e., my office).
All in all, I love the 8525. And, am looking forward to more good things to come.
dKaye
I have come close to throwing this thing out the windows so many times
So many problems with mine. Freezes about once an hour. If not more. Randomly freezes. Sometimes it'll freeze when it's in standby mode in the case so I end up missing calls and emails and everything. WTF.
I have installed (most on my 2 gig card - ex. for SPB Shell, PP, PS, Diary and GPRS Monitor):
SPB Mobile Shell
SPB Pocket Plus
SPB Phone Suite
SPB Diary
SPB GPRS Monitor
SPB Pocket PC Tips and Tricks
SPB Air Islands
SPB Backup
Google Maps
Windows Live
Microsoft Live Search
PHM Registry Editor
Blue Point Studios Pocket Earth
DIVX Inc DivXPlayer
PhatWare PhatPad
NoviMedia NR Deluxe
Resco Picture Viewr Sync Module
Resco Photo Viewer
Resco Today Plugin
Resco FTP Add-in
Resco Explorer
Microsoft .NET 2.0
Aspecto Software WiFiFoFum
TomTom Navigator 6
Microsoft Voice Command
e-mobile Pocket Streamer
e-mobile HandiTV
Pocket Mechanic
Blackberry Service Connect
Webcamera Plus
Landware Shanghai
Landware Shanghai Tilesets
Landware Shanghai Music
Come to think of it... I think it's just really bloated with too much stuff?
nstefanelli said:
Hey everyone,
I currently have a Wizard and am very happy with it. I am extremely tempted to buy a at&t 8525 just cause I have a huge amount of money to play with right now, and I would like to know what everyone thinks of their phones. Do you like it? What are your favorite ROMs? How is the battery life? Camera? Speed? etc etc. Please post something of a mini review. Much appreciated.
-Nstefanelli-
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
After initially being enthusiastic about it, am getting more and more negative about my Hermes.
- the functionality is excellent, but that comes from WM 5/6 not from Hermes.
- the design (shape and color) looks somehow cheap - but that's of course a a matter of taste, other ppl might love it
- the manufacturing quality is miserable, absolutely cheapest plastic parts of any PDA/phone in this price category you can buy these days,
- the sliding mechanism is worn out (if not loosing its hold entirely) after a very short while.
- I suffer from the screen alignment issue + weird colors and fading white screen, The screen is fading, and if you touch certain points on the frame, you get weired artefacts, and such stuff.
- the camera is bad, it's not only that auto-focus is missing or that it has only 2 Mega, other build in cameras with the same specs deliver far better quality.
I see the Hermes based on an excellent idea, but cheaply designed and at least partially of shoddy quality .
randomtask16 said:
I have come close to throwing this thing out the windows so many times
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Click to collapse
yep, considering the "official" price for an unlocked one without a carrier contract, Hermes is not a good buy.
nstefanelli said:
Hey everyone,
I currently have a Wizard and am very happy with it. I am extremely tempted to buy a at&t 8525 just cause I have a huge amount of money to play with right now, and I would like to know what everyone thinks of their phones. Do you like it? What are your favorite ROMs? How is the battery life? Camera? Speed? etc etc. Please post something of a mini review. Much appreciated.
-Nstefanelli-
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have the Hermes..but if I was you, I would go for the HTC Kaiser! That will be my next device!
i really like it specially coz there are so many roms to put on it and ways to upgrade it.
furthermore, the people making them are ace and are so easy to use, unlike the other HTC machines which are less popular and their upgrades can be still confusing at times.
i really like this phone!
Moving from the Wizard to the Hermes was the best decision I have made in ages.
The Processor is faster and browsing is 10x faster
Bram87 said:
I have the Hermes..but if I was you, I would go for the HTC Kaiser! That will be my next device!
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Click to collapse
yep, Hermes is almost history. Softbank, for example, will stop selling it soon. There are better devices, from HTC but also other manufacturers now in the market.
I have to say it's the best phone I have ever had. Featurewise it is brilliant and I have never had any problems that I didn't cause myself .
In terms of it's build, well i dropped it onto a hard concrete surface from about 2 meters last week (it was one of those moments where the world seems to suddenly drop into slow-motion) and all that happened was a couple of scratches and the battery cover flying off. I just clicked it back on and all was fine.
All that said, I would probably be looking at the HTC Kaiser now which has the built in GPS and thinner size. Anyway, just throwing in my 2 cents. Hope it helps
I agree with Dinty. The best device I ever owned so far. The flexibility of the the device is amazing.
The device is just terrible. I keep having problems with the screen alignment.
I even replaced the device with a completely new screen, but to no avail.
With the new screen, the aligntment issue is a little bit less worse. Alot of times I can't close applications with the close button. It just seems unresponsive. The funny thing is, when I either re-align the screen, or click the start button once, I can close the application.
My girlfriend has the same device, and is also having the same problems.
We both have the 3.0 Black WM6 ROM.
I originally bought this as a business tool. However if I had my time again I would think twice before buying one.
Apart from the software lockups which have taken me the best part of 6 months to resolve, I now find that the quality of the product is questionable.
The stylus head fell off the other day (my second) and now stylii simply slide in and out without the ability to extend as you could do when new. So you get the situ where you slide the stylus out, then have to struggle to physically extend it before you use it. I now carry a non collapsible item in my pocket rather than go through this palaver.
As an innovative idea the Tytn is a great one; however its execution in a number of areas is rather poor.
WB
After you have your new Touch Dual and played it for awhile, what do you think?
Share your thought please
Built quality, speed, responsiveness, battery life, etc.
At least how do you rate it? 1 (worst) - 5 (excellent)
I did a video review for italian forums :
http://it.youtube.com/watch?v=VsOF5JrmHug
In the last year or less I've owned a S710, Tytn, Touch (elf), tytn2, S730 and now Dual (nike).
I've given up on smartphones, the 730 was a mistake I had it 1 day and just couldn't cope without the full PPC interface. The tytn2 was very good, but for me was just too heavy and bulky, I loved the Touch (elf) but it was not 3G and was slow for me. So the Dual does a very good job for me. I dont need the wireless as I never used it on any of the phones I had. Its quick and looks good. Overall happy so far..... but then the Cruise is out next, so you never know (although it looks a bit ugly!)
i like mine ... but here are more thougts:
http://www.coolsmartphone.com/article740.html
http://www.theunwired.net/?item=review-o2-xda-star-windows-mobile-6-professional-smartphone
I like it.
But it is not a 5 for me, just a 4,75, because i miss wifi. Since i got a T-mobile Hotspot flatrate, i am sad, not being able to use it with my Touch Dual. I can use it with my Communicator, but the Nokia is quite bulky and i love the size of the Dual.
I know, i cannot have everything i want; actually i would have stayed with the Communicator, if it would have had UMTS; but this way i end up to have two smartphones, two worlds and each of them missing a feature, the other one offers.
And i also wanted to give a shot at Windows mobile...
So to make a short story long:
Pros:
- Display
- Ease of use (keys & touchpad)
. quite fast
- customisable
- might support 16 GB micro SD card.
- no prob with connecting to my car's bluetooth; first try, and it worked. The Nokia is a real pita, since it seems to loose the connection to the car every two or three weeks or so and it takes several tries to pair them.
Cons:
- no wifi (this really bother me, but if the device is able to do it, i would pay for upgrading it)
- no gps (this doesn't bother me at all, but if the device is able to do it, it should be upgradeable to enable it)
- I'd like to have a real carrying case not just this kind of sock....
- They should give you a micro SD card (i have an unbranded, unlocked HTC phone)
Perhaps there are some more issues later, but as of today i like it.
The other options include the Cruise, but it doesn't have a hardware keypad and the heralds/kaisers are too bulky...
Best
we
i think they left out gps and wifi for marketing reasons. there is surely space for at least one antenna. the wizard had a telescopic stylus and that wasn't so bad. and there is space underneath the battery if they wouldn't be using such a bulky battery cover.
but who would take a polaris or a kaiser??
Check out this review I posted 18 days ago when I got my Touch Dual
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=346999
I've had mine for a bit over 2 weeks now. Very happy with it. No wifi is not a big deal for me since I find it quite difficult to locate free hotspots anyway. Besides 3G is not too expensive in my area. The only thing that can be done better would be to make the screen more sensitive a-la the iPhone/iPod Touch. I find I have to use a considerable amount of pressure to fingerscroll on the Touch Dual.
I'm going to try to compare it to the S730 and TyTN II (should be interesting to see which wins...)
http://www.clieuk.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=14706
stmcgill said:
I'm going to try to compare it to the S730 and TyTN II (should be interesting to see which wins...)
http://www.clieuk.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=14706
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would compare it to the TyTN II but not the S730... I don't think it's just to compare a PPC with a Smartphone... the PPC will always win
Not convinced by that- there S730 has some very worthy attributes
I got a Dual and a Tytn II at the same time and am trying to make up my mind which of them remains and which one gets sold... I decided to give each a week. The Dual had it's week and now it's the Tytn II. I must say it took me a day or two to get used to the Dual (had a Trinity before) but I liked it better with every day. Now it's the Tytn II turn and I kind of miss the Dual. Much nicer and better feel. I only wish it had GPS enabled somehow and that would have nailed the decision for me. It's a close tie as it is right now (day 3 with the Tytn II).
With the Dual, I switched the camera button into "OK" button which I missed alot. Other than that - I got used to the sparse hard key layout (or lack of).
Get me that GPS working!!!
Wrote a quick review in my blog about it.
Summary?
I'm close to being in love.
I really hope there is a OK button on the keyboard. That should be standard for all PPC! The location of charging port is really annoying! I like it to be placed at bottom. However, memory card slot is brilliant idea. Wat a split character the designer is!