Database Users

Phone upgrades.

I'm one for technical innovation, don't get me wrong. I'm loving all the new tech that comes out. The atrix 4g basically wet my panties with its specs.
BUT. I hate how youhave top of the line equipment one day, then 6 months later it is completely outclassed.
Imagine if the video game systems did this?
The gamecube/xbox cam out in 2001
The 360 came out in 2005
The wii in 06
The ps2 is STILL kicken, but its original life was from 2000-2006
And the 360 and ps3 are here for a while to come. That much is clear. Why? Because the hardware is still underutilized!
Yeah, there were remakes, but nothing was remade to the poin where you were just "I HAVE TO UPGRADE."
they build stuff that's aheadof their times. Just recently the gamecube was found to have hidden 3d connectors!
Also, when there is a remake of a system, its usually a LOT cheaper, mostl because the cost of the tech drops. Look at the xbox 360 kinect.
Its like thedifferencebetween the galaxy s and nexus s, yet its CHEAPER!
Now look what else samsung is doing
Our Vibrant Brethren got fluffed big time. T-mo is getting a "Vibrant 4g" which is the vibrant with the original galaxy s specs (same thing but with hspa+ and ffc) and....RUNNING TW FROYO!!!!!!
Samsung is the company I wouldn't wanna follow. I've always loved samsungs hardware. Its always top of the line. But I've never had a samsung phone before this one, and I'm pretty sure this is gonna be my last -_- I thought all the stories about samsungs horrible track record regarding updates was a bunch of hoopla becaue my hero was updated regularly. My thought was "lol if htc is pushing these updates out, imagine samsungs speed!"
Boy was I wrong.
If it wasn't for the android dev community, samsungs android phones would've been dead a long time ago. They should realize this.
/endrant
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

A_Flying_Fox said:
I'm one for technical innovation, don't get me wrong. I'm loving all the new tech that comes out. The atrix 4g basically wet my panties with its specs.
BUT. I hate how youhave top of the line equipment one day, then 6 months later it is completely outclassed.
Imagine if the video game systems did this?
The gamecube/xbox cam out in 2001
The 360 came out in 2005
The wii in 06
The ps2 is STILL kicken, but its original life was from 2000-2006
And the 360 and ps3 are here for a while to come. That much is clear. Why? Because the hardware is still underutilized!
Yeah, there were remakes, but nothing was remade to the poin where you were just "I HAVE TO UPGRADE."
they build stuff that's aheadof their times. Just recently the gamecube was found to have hidden 3d connectors!
Also, when there is a remake of a system, its usually a LOT cheaper, mostl because the cost of the tech drops. Look at the xbox 360 kinect.
Its like thedifferencebetween the galaxy s and nexus s, yet its CHEAPER!
Now look what else samsung is doing
Our Vibrant Brethren got fluffed big time. T-mo is getting a "Vibrant 4g" which is the vibrant with the original galaxy s specs (same thing but with hspa+ and ffc) and....RUNNING TW FROYO!!!!!!
Samsung is the company I wouldn't wanna follow. I've always loved samsungs hardware. Its always top of the line. But I've never had a samsung phone before this one, and I'm pretty sure this is gonna be my last -_- I thought all the stories about samsungs horrible track record regarding updates was a bunch of hoopla becaue my hero was updated regularly. My thought was "lol if htc is pushing these updates out, imagine samsungs speed!"
Boy was I wrong.
If it wasn't for the android dev community, samsungs android phones would've been dead a long time ago. They should realize this.
/endrant
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
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I agree with you 497%
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/114/1143070p1.html
just a little link I found about the ps3 totally unrelated to this forum but hey

Intersting observation and comparison. I think the difference is that it takes so much development to introduce a new system that the entire process is excessively costly. From my understanding, each manufacturer (Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft) loses money on each system sold because the costs are so high. They recoup the costs in peripherals and software development (getting game devlopers onboard to make games for their systems). Phone manufacturers make their money on the front end (phone sales) so they have every incentive to continue pushing out as many new phones as possible to cover every segment of the available phone market.
Different ideas at play.

tphillips78 said:
I agree with you 497%
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/114/1143070p1.html
just a little link I found about the ps3 totally unrelated to this forum but hey
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Lol sony really hates having open software. If they REALLY go through the effort of designing a Whole new system JUST to do what htc thought they did with the g2, then the video game world as we know it will clearly be gone.
They sould just pull a nintendo. "Hey, If you manage to hack it, whatevs. But ifyou accidentally update and we brick it, don't get mad boo "
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

running_the_dream said:
Intersting observation and comparison. I think the difference is that it takes so much development to introduce a new system that the entire process is excessively costly. From my understanding, each manufacturer (Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft) loses money on each system sold because the costs are so high. They recoup the costs in peripherals and software development (getting game devlopers onboard to make games for their systems). Phone manufacturers make their money on the front end (phone sales) so they have every incentive to continue pushing out as many new phones as possible to cover every segment of the available phone market.
Different ideas at play.
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But they're catering to the SAME individuals with ever release everyfew months.
Look at the HD2 and HD7 -_- STUFF LIK THAT KILLS ME
REALLY HTC? THE HD2 CAN'T HNDLE WINDOWS PHONE 7 BUT THE SAME HARDWARE RELEASED A YEAR LATER CAN?

Btw thanks for not flaming even though I was ranting
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

A_Flying_Fox said:
Lol sony really hates having open software. If they REALLY go through the effort of designing a Whole new system JUST to do what htc thought they did with the g2, then the video game world as we know it will clearly be gone.
They sould just pull a nintendo. "Hey, If you manage to hack it, whatevs. But ifyou accidentally update and we brick it, don't get mad boo "
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
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Lol what gets me is that they complain about the ps3 being hacked what about when the playstayion phone comes out on android? Back to Samsung/Sprint for a hot second though. If samsung can release Froyo on all these other carriers worldwide with the TW interface what's truly stopping them from a US release? Is it the fact that if its ready for one carrier and not the others the others ***** threatening to drop samsung support for there customers? That's my opinion on the subject. If and when Froyo is released it will be on all carriers at the same time
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

tphillips78 said:
Lol what gets me is that they complain about the ps3 being hacked what about when the playstayion phone comes out on android? Back to Samsung/Sprint for a hot second though. If samsung can release Froyo on all these other carriers worldwide with the TW interface what's truly stopping them from a US release? Is it the fact that if its ready for one carrier and not the others the others ***** threatening to drop samsung support for there customers? That's my opinion on the subject. If and when Froyo is released it will be on all carriers at the same time
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
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Yeah they're probably gonna go the moto route and put a blocked bootloader and then drop all support if you root it lol.
But yeah bck to sammy/sprint, I though about that. Until the nexus s came out with gingerbread on tmo.
Same hardware, latest software. So its clearly possible to put the latest software in.
What if its google?
I mean...so far only the nexus s has gingerread, but all the phones at ces blow the pants off the NS and NONE of them were running gingerbread (cept the arc I guess).
I just wish that they would embrace the O in AOSP.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

A_Flying_Fox said:
Yeah they're probably gonna go the moto route and put a blocked bootloader and then drop all support if you root it lol.
But yeah bck to sammy/sprint, I though about that. Until the nexus s came out with gingerbread on tmo.
Same hardware, latest software. So its clearly possible to put the latest software in.
What if its google?
I mean...so far only the nexus s has gingerread, but all the phones at ces blow the pants off the NS and NONE of them were running gingerbread (cept the arc I guess).
I just wish that they would embrace the O in AOSP.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
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Very true it could very well be google to promote their "Flagship Device" oddly enough made by Samsung. Which is only available at Best Buy I believe still and not through T-Moblie Corporate (why I don't know). The only reason I don't think that it is Google is the fact that Google has promoted the "O" in AOSP to the fullest if they didn't we wouldn't be on this site with this discussion. Sammy could have struck a deal worth millions with Google to have their device pushed through so quickly. I still have yet to play with one. From what I have heard it's not very sturdy. That's from friends and acquaintances at Best Buy. They recommend the Vibrant over that thing if T-Mobile is your thing.

There is also the issue of phone contracts. So they are not catering to the same exact customers. For example, I am out of the market because I recently purchased the Epic. But, there are other people whose contracts are just ending or will be ending soon. So they constantly need the next new thing out there to entice those folks into paying customers. Video game hardware is different because there are new video games (as opposed to new phones). The games developers make better games over time by learning the hardware. While phone manufacters make better (usually) phones over time.

running_the_dream said:
There is also the issue of phone contracts. So they are not catering to the same exact customers. For example, I am out of the market because I recently purchased the Epic. But, there are other people whose contracts are just ending or will be ending soon. So they constantly need the next new thing out there to entice those folks into paying customers. Video game hardware is different because there are new video games (as opposed to new phones). The games developers make better games over time by learning the hardware. While phone manufacters make better (usually) phones over time.
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And some games have better resale value than others. Imagine if Game Stop was called Phone Stop and you could trade your old phone in for half the price you paid for it and buy a new one. I think I just had an epiphany lol. That settles it. Who's in with me to start this company lol. We just need $50,000 to start. I take pay-pal too lol

Haha. It's a nice notion. Ebay is the de facto 'phone stop' though. But hey, I have $1 to pitch in for start up money

running_the_dream said:
Haha. It's a nice notion. Ebay is the de facto 'phone stop' though. But hey, I have $1 to pitch in for start up money
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Click to collapse
True Ebay is. You have just shattered my dreams. Crushed my soul. Thanks lol

It may not compare to console gaming, but look at PC gaming which gets "outdated" faster than phones. Sure <insert game> will run marginally better on a high end gaming PC built today compared to 6 months ago, but the same game will play just fine on that 6 month old system.
I bought this phone in particular to future proof myself. The hardware on this thing should be more than efficient enough to handle anything thrown at it software wise until my contract is up for another upgrade.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

CapsLockKey said:
It may not compare to console gaming, but look at PC gaming which gets "outdated" faster than phones. Sure <insert game> will run marginally better on a high end gaming PC built today compared to 6 months ago, but the same game will play just fine on that 6 month old system.
I bought this phone in particular to future proof myself. The hardware on this thing should be more than efficient enough to handle anything thrown at it software wise until my contract is up for another upgrade.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
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Yeah I will give Sammy that. The Hardware is absolutely unbelievable. I just get angry with all the software upgrades going around to other phones and not the Samsung "Flagship" (other than the Nexus S) device. I mean come on the Intercept has 2.2.

An interesting observation - SE using cat-string theory as its main business practice

i am a business management student...so i thought of sharing my perspective over how Sony Ericsson is playing the smartphone game...
by exagerrating a lot before the product launch ...and after the launch..giving small doses of updates so customers dont change phone in the hope of getting new features.
think of it..
they build great hype for a product months before the launch by strong advertising (probably spending more on ads than R&D itself) , promising a revolutionary interface with ground breaking custom interfaces....X panels for X1 (remember?) and timescape/mediascape (biggest garbage) for X10 ..both over-ambitious
just so they can differentiate from other companies..
ya they have great product design.. which initially attracts impulse buyers...they build anticipation...so we cant wait to get our hands on their phone!
and then they finally launch the product which will NEVER have the latest updates because their entire focus was on marketing the product i.e bringing it to market before competition and capturing market share.
they never really focussed on industry shaking R&D like Apple..c'mon without Apple, touchscreen was a dead market.
and without Android...Apple had a monopoly.
This is revolution....not timescape or mediascape..which are my least favourite apps...battery sucking with extremely slow response rates.
then they ll keep launching small small updates over couple of months...more like over a year...adding little features..so we dont change brand loyalty....giving the wounded customers a faint vision of hope...
finally they release a small update and the entire community goes 'wow' with excitement...like a virgin getting his first blowjob.
by that time..the phone has suffered scratches, has started showing signs of wear..which means very low re-sale value.
and meanwhile announcement for newer model is made...slimmer, sexier with more bugs which will be fixed via update over the next upcoming year.
good strategy for a short-term profit making....but they are losing brand loyalty.
i am not gonna buy SE Xperia Arc...ya its the sexiest phone on the market.
but its like a hot model u bang and can never have a healthy relationship with...coz she is dumb and full of flaws on the inside...such as daddy issues etc.
/rant
its like they keep us jumping over small small updates like a cat does to a string which the master will never let it catch.

but its like a hot model u bang and can never have a healthy relationship with...coz she is dumb and full of flaws on the inside...such as daddy issues etc.
epic comment
well it's true and from your perspective which one is better?
i know getting a big income is the main focus of any company but hey customers loyalty also counts. it's something i hate from sony in general, they keep pushing new tech every year and let the customer to feel outdated

Epic thread.
Sent from my GT-P1000 using XDA App

Couldn't have said it better myself, spot on mate!
Swyped from my ZDZ Froyo X10i

bang on, while i am happy with my x10 as it was my first droid comming from a long **** list of wm devices, i am also not going to be sticking with se, already contemplating the droid 2 global, yes se makes sexy phones but, im looking for something a little more with my next device.
Sent from my X10i using XDA App

Funny thread
so what do you think about HTC's strategy with Desire ( Desire/HD/Z )
Just because they released a better handset after a year of the previous handset's release it doesn't mean that they do not care about brand loyalty...
so what? you want them to stick with the X10 for two years while other competitors advance with technology????
believe it or not, many will buy the ARC, even more that who bought the X10...
Next time, go buy an HTC or Motorola
and by the way, Samsung is locking their bootloader so do not buy a Samsung android so you won't end up whining like many here about unlocking it, unless you like samsung
but despite all that, I would like to thank you for the effort made by you to explain what many of us are not aware of.. it's a good practice for your uni
good luck mate with your studies

Nocturnal310 said:
i am a business management student...so i thought of sharing my perspective over how Sony Ericsson is playing the smartphone game...
by exagerrating a lot before the product launch ...and after the launch..giving small doses of updates so customers dont change phone in the hope of getting new features.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, I wish you luck with the business management, since your management of the English language makes me want to punch babies in the stomach.
Also, replace "Sony Ericsson" with every technology company ever and you have a point.
/thread

iead1 said:
Well, I wish you luck with the business management, since your management of the English language makes me want to punch babies in the stomach.
Also, replace "Sony Ericsson" with every technology company ever and you have a point.
/thread
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Grammar and syntax of the English language is not the point of XDA in MHO...
Very well written, kudos to you Nocturnal310...

@Nocturnal310:
Of course you're right. But as someone said before, you could say this about any company producing technical stuff and you would be right as well. (I expect some very negative comments on what I'm about to say...). I understand your point, but I just don't think that SE is somehow different in their approach from any other company producing consumer goods (is that right? stuff which are bought in great numbers just to be replaced by newer models...you know, we have to watch out for our English, right iead1? ). Thats quite important because we just can't expect infinite support for our product, because sooner or later (the former is more probable) it will get replaced with brand new model with brand new stuff inside making it lot more attractive. The only thing we can complain about is, that the support may have last longer... thats true. But despite all of that, I'm still not changing the brand loyalty as I just dont know what else should I buy next time. I dont like Apple and their iStuff, also don't like HTCs because of how they look. Samsung is an option, but if I should choose between Samsung and SE just by looking at the phones, SE would definitely win (and with Samsung locking their bootloaders as well, I wouldn't help myself much by buying it). You may call me a hardcore fan of SE who doesn't think about what he's buying, but thats not me. I just think that X10 was an unfortunate mistake (which I personally still love!) of SE and I really hope they will learn from it for the reasons mentioned above.
Thats my opinion and I do not force anyone to share it, but I wanted to say it, because I just don't uderstand all that poeople saying how betrayed they feel by SE.

i think SE`s problem is that they don`t really know what they do,at least so far.
they use UIQ for a while then they leave it.
they use win mo,but after x1 and x2 they desided to go for android.
but now Android is very good platform and they should find their way.i hope so.
their main mistake is that they don`t care about customers and the weak points of their products.

I must add my mustard ...
There was a time long ago, Sony Ericsson created really nice phones with a solid build quality. My x10 is 3 weeks old and is making crazy noises when twisted a bit. The whole frame is not stiff enough.
If I saw it right on arc video presentations at youtube, the crappy timescape is now a widget and it is still choppy. This uggly blue is still there. Why blue? SE colors are Green and Orange. What a bunch of stupid designers ... I think w'll have a lot of alternatives out there with lesser crappy UI-Mods.

Well, I agree with most of your points, but let's remember: they're not ceasing support, they're launching a new model and planningto lock x10 customers in outdated Android. Motorola intended to do that too, but customers did such a big buzz that they changed their minds. The bull**** about low performance on Android 2.2 is already discarded, we can see that on all the unofficially built ROMs available at xda-forums. I risk to say that even Google has his part on this entire drama. Obviously, Sony Ericsson and their UXP loaded with much more processing hunger than x10 can support is the one we should blame, because we chose to buy SE, not Google devices (which are HTC, actually ). The removal of MediaScape from Arc tells us that they know where the problem is. Let's hope they fix this "problem" on x10 too.
I truly hope no one takes my comments personally, since I'm just expressing my opinion as a SE consumer. I still like them, but not how they use my money.
Sent from my X10a using XDA App

Apple Iphone 3G is still getting latest updates - same day as the latest iPhone 4, not ALL the features because it's got old hardware but there aware of that.
SE should be aware of it to, yes x10 can run 2.1 2.2, 2.3 ect so they should. There opinion is why there not updating. (why not the majority, the users decide)
Why can't we get hardware based updates? HTC magic/hero got tons of updates..
Yes new models will come out, but it's the same OS to update, not that much off a difference, our devs do there work in spare time and takes 2-3 weeks to come up with ASOP OS, (which is what i prefer anyway). Imagine an entire DEV team full time? yes it takes more time for testing ect but still.....
At least SE have reconized they F'd up. that's the first step!

robbyf66 said:
At least SE have reconized they F'd up. that's the first step!
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They say a lot. Saying and doing are not the same.

moacyrfilho said:
The removal of MediaScape from Arc tells us that they know where the problem is. Let's hope they fix this "problem" on x10 too.
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I think they removed the mediascape app because it was so hard to new people to find the music player and photo gallery.
just think about it:
you have a new phone, and you would like to play some music, you first go to the music player but you can't find it because there is no music icon on the menu
Grab a samsung phone and try to play some music, the player is called "Music", the video player is "Videos" and the gallery is "Gallery"

robbyf66 said:
Apple Iphone 3G is still getting latest updates - same day as the latest iPhone 4, not ALL the features because it's got old hardware but there aware of that.
SE should be aware of it to, yes x10 can run 2.1 2.2, 2.3 ect so they should. There opinion is why there not updating. (why not the majority, the users decide)
Why can't we get hardware based updates? HTC magic/hero got tons of updates..
Yes new models will come out, but it's the same OS to update, not that much off a difference, our devs do there work in spare time and takes 2-3 weeks to come up with ASOP OS, (which is what i prefer anyway). Imagine an entire DEV team full time? yes it takes more time for testing ect but still.....
At least SE have reconized they F'd up. that's the first step!
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You are comparing with 2 companies with different calibers.
Apple - every designer/ad agency/design house/design school in this world purchase their 'godly' machines for work purposes. And these macs don't come cheap, mind you. With that amount of revenue, they can afford to create an iPhone, using their 'lagless' (yeah, right) macintosh reputations to breed a colony of iZombies to support their cause.
With the iZombies having the need to own a iAmagodlyproduct, with such supporters pumping money into their pockets, they can afford to offset any losses by being nice to
Update old iPhones even if new models are out, cos they know iZombies are already impressed with them playing the nice card and that they are confident that with their good reputation and a better new phone out, A majority of iZombies who have too much money to spare will still buy it. They are just giving an aww-I understand-you-can't-afford-a-new-phone-yet-so-I-will-update-you-periodically-so-that-you-will-come-back-to-me-when-you-have-money message to the poorer parties.
Now for Sony Ericsson (or just insert any other brand names). Let me ask you. Though they are an established brand, but let me ask you, how many people will own 1 of those expensive TVs or VAIOS? Comparing with Apple, no competition.
They don't have that much extra revenue to play nice. They can only strategize and try to earn as such as possible before their products become obsolete.
It's just like people like Donald Trump, who has so much money to play with, he can just give away to some random person on the street if he wants to. But if you try doing up a business yourself, would you give away your money to charity organizations, knowing that you cannot afford to spend the money that way? Most probably not. Unless you don't mind closing down your business due to losses.

All these threads are getting sooooooo repetitive!!! There should be one big sticky for anyone who wants to ***** and complain in any way shape and form about SE. That way this form isn't flooded with every thread turning into a SE bashing thread. It really is getting tiring logging on to see what's new and the first 50 threads are people *****in about SE.
Sent from my X10a using XDA App

Lonelee - agree with much of what you say.. but it is also true that there are many many many people who go back time and time again to buy the next apple product BECAUSE they know that Apple will not leave the OS lagging behind on the old device when a new one comes out.. it's spectacularly good brand loyalty. SE (and many other) are taking a very short term view, and a missing a great opportunity to get us all on the hook for the next product..
In the UK for example, many phones bought on contract are free with a 2 yr contract tie in.. so if I know that they will look after me for 2 years, then I'll go back for more.. my contract's not due until Feb 2012.. so I'm eagerly awaiting to see their behaviour over the next 12 months!

well I m back on XDA after exiting from blackberry platform...blackberry provided me a stable messaging device for a while but as needs changed, it was very poor for browsing and getting work with attachments done.
i was at a party few weeks ago and my friend took out his Xperia Z claiming this is the best camera phone.
to his disappointment, it was the darkest blurriest pic i have seen whereas my lumia 920 took a pic with DSLR-like clarity and image characteristics.
i am not sure how much sony has improved but seems like they are still a market follower and using marketing dollars to brag about their phones that do not perform as advertised.
after having wasted my student savings on 2 of their phones, I regret and wish I had bought a better phone for my first android experience.

product lifecycle
Hi,
I am not sure if I should blame any company for moving to newer (and maybe better) products. In the android phone market we have the nearly unique situation to be able to get our hands and minds at the software which is driving the product, at least partly.
This is quite different from cars or coffeemakers.
What I would like to from Sony is that when they decide to abandon a product (eg X10), they open up the sources of drivers etc, so that interested people can maintain their products for themselves.
I can understand that they wont open up the sources for current products.
A.

[DISCUSS] Unlocked Bootloader Dilemma

Ok so after doing some research I found out that only Xperia Plays that are sim-unlocked have the ability to unlock the bootloader.
Where am I supposed to buy a sim-unlocked Xperia Play. If I bought an Xperia Play then sim unlocked it will that work.
Why is everyone so happy when probably 2% of all Xperia plays sold will have this feature?
Source

Just look for websites that sell the phone without a contract or prepaid-SIM.
There ought to be some like this around where you are. You have to make sure you buy a "factory unlocked" phone. I bought mine from http://www.gummobile.com/ but they only sell the European version of the phone.
You can probably also get unlocked versions of a phone in Sony Ericsson/Sony stores.
You should also take into consideration that you'll most likely not need the unlocked boot loader. For most people that just want to use the phone normally and have some little extra-features, root will probably be enough already. It'd be like one of the Motorola Droid phones from late. Just look into the Droid 2/X forums to see what's possible with those.

Do you guys think that the developers might be able to unlock one that is sim-locked?

RacecarBMW said:
Do you guys think that the developers might be able to unlock one that is sim-locked?
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That'll be pretty hard, as we have seen with the Droid 2/X/Milestone and Sony Ericsson X10. The Sony Ericsson was X10 recently... Well, not unlocked, but at least worked around. Motorola's Devices remain uncracked. Still, as I said, you'll probably be able to do most things with the phone even if the boot loader is locked for you.

I totally understand that but here is the thing. I am choosing between the atrix and this phone.
In terms of how long a device is supported depends on the development community. The atrix has a locked bootloader but really advanced hardware. The Play has older hardware and probably outdated soon but if the bootloader is unlocked it should make it last longer. Look at the G1.
Whats giving me hope is that sony said it will unlock the bootloader and we have geohtoz on board.

RacecarBMW said:
I totally understand that but here is the thing. I am choosing between the atrix and this phone.
In terms of how long a device is supported depends on the development community. The atrix has a locked bootloader but really advanced hardware. The Play has older hardware and probably outdated soon but if the bootloader is unlocked it should make it last longer. Look at the G1.
Whats giving me hope is that sony said it will unlock the bootloader and we have geohtoz on board.
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I wouldn't count on Geohot. When he gets the phone and realizes that he's able to run almost anything he wants on it right from the get-go (as this is an Android device), I think he'll loose interest.
As for your choice of devices: Do you want to play more involving and deep games on the go? Get a Play.
Do you want to have a phone that's very fast and plays almost everything perfectly but has a screen that limits your enjoyment of gaming to very simple time wasters? Get an Atrix.
It's that easy. I wouldn't really look at the stats, both phones will be almost equally outdated by the end of the year. However, since the Play (hopefully) has some Sony Computer Entertainment Steam behind it, it might not get tossed aside as quickly as Motorola Phones are.

Meister_Li said:
I wouldn't count on Geohot. When he gets the phone and realizes that he's able to run almost anything he wants on it right from the get-go (as this is an Android device), I think he'll loose interest.
As for your choice of devices: Do you want to play more involving and deep games on the go? Get a Play.
Do you want to have a phone that's very fast and plays almost everything perfectly but has a screen that limits your enjoyment of gaming to very simple time wasters? Get an Atrix.
It's that easy. I wouldn't really look at the stats, both phones will be almost equally outdated by the end of the year. However, since the Play (hopefully) has some Sony Computer Entertainment Steam behind it, it might not get tossed aside as quickly as Motorola Phones are.
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Click to collapse
I will probably be playing GranTurismo1 and 2 through an emulator a lot and maybe a few classics. That is all the gaming I see myself doing. But I also want a phone that is very fast...
So what should I get. Which phone do you think will have a better development community like I said the G1 is outdated but its still supported by the developers.

RacecarBMW said:
I will probably be playing GranTurismo1 and 2 through an emulator a lot and maybe a few classics. That is all the gaming I see myself doing. But I also want a phone that is very fast...
So what should I get. Which phone do you think will have a better development community like I said the G1 is outdated but its still supported by the developers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have the choice. I'd say the Atrix probably will get more developers than the Play, just because Motorola has more people following, it's the first dual core phone and more leaned towards the "Buisness" user, which, let's face it, most developers probably are. But the Play is incredibly much better for playing games on and by no means slow. So, your choice

Meister_Li said:
You have the choice. I'd say the Atrix probably will get more developers than the Play, just because Motorola has more people following, it's the first dual core phone and more leaned towards the "Buisness" user, which, let's face it, most developers probably are. But the Play is incredibly much better for playing games on and by no means slow. So, your choice
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I kind of had the feeling the play would attract more developers because a lot of gamers are also hackers at heart. I'm sure I cant go wrong with either one but I'm still having a hard time choosing.

RacecarBMW said:
I kind of had the feeling the play would attract more developers because a lot of gamers are also hackers at heart. I'm sure I cant go wrong with either one but I'm still having a hard time choosing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
okay ill make this easy
Atrix:
Everything you need
Xperia play:
Everything you need PLUS
the ONE THING YOU WANT

RacecarBMW said:
I totally understand that but here is the thing. I am choosing between the atrix and this phone.
In terms of how long a device is supported depends on the development community. The atrix has a locked bootloader but really advanced hardware. The Play has older hardware and probably outdated soon but if the bootloader is unlocked it should make it last longer. Look at the G1.
Whats giving me hope is that sony said it will unlock the bootloader and we have geohtoz on board.
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Click to collapse
forget about Geohot after the settlements in Sony trial is he not going to touch any more Sony products..

AriStar said:
okay ill make this easy
Atrix:
Everything you need
Xperia play:
Everything you need PLUS
the ONE THING YOU WANT
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ahh it's a sony marketing spokesperson!
burn it with fire!

johnsongrantr said:
ahh it's a sony marketing spokesperson!
burn it with fire!
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Click to collapse
haha i wish. i bet they would have access to some play's apparantly they will hit canada on april 28th.

Since their headquarters is in Europe they probably have acces to the play indeed

Sanjay Jha talks about Motorola

"The Atrix phone, which was sold through AT&T Inc. (T), didn't perform as well as Jha liked, he acknowledged. But he said the handset did better than people were expecting. The Atrix was hamstrung because it was bundled with its key accessory, a laptop dock, at a price that critics felt was too high."
http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20110602-709868.html
This is from an article from today about Motorola Mobility.
Is he really that stupid to wonder why the Atrix did so horribly? Maybe he should type in the word "Motorola Atrix" into Google and see how many things about the locked bootloader and lack of support show up.
This is also from the article.
"He said that while its products are now known for their quality and trustworthiness, they aren't what people aspire to buy."
Trustworthiness? Really? None of us in the dev community know them for that as of recently!
Just thought I would share this with you guys. Thought it was kind of funny.

your 2% opinion does not compare to the other 98% that brings in the real revenue.

The article proves just how out of touch he is with reality.
The lapdock isn't what killed it... users weren't forced to buy one with the phone so saying the "bundling" killed it is pure BS.
He needs to be replaced by a CEO who actually understands the market.
The consumers who buy geek toys like the Atrix are not the same ones who will buy a DX2. Not saying geeks won't buy a DX2 either.
Most mainstream users are intimidated by something like the Atrix.

@facetubespam
Seriously? He clearly said that the Atrix didn't do very well, so obviously more than 2% feel the same way. Your comment makes 0% sense.
Sent from my rooted, gingerblured badass atrix!

I dont understand how the dock is to blame. I think the reviews were mediocre because of the software. I agree that the xda community is tiny compared to all of the people who have android phones, but any one can see that motoblur just does not look very user friendly compared to sense. If 70% of returns were because of the openess of the android appstore and problems with apps, did 70% of people switch to the iphone who returned their phones? I wonder what the questionaire said to lead to that conclusion.

lyon21 said:
@facetubespam
Seriously? He clearly said that the Atrix didn't do very well, so obviously more than 2% feel the same way. Your comment makes 0% sense.
Sent from my rooted, gingerblured badass atrix!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What he's saying, and what I generally believe is logically true, is that we are the fringe 2% of people who believe, like you stated, that the locked bootloader is the reason it didn't sell well.
The other "98%" of the people who bought the Atrix have no idea what the hell a bootloader is, nor do they care. They see a phone, and they see a price. A good reason the Atrix sold poorly was because it was undercut by the half-price Inspire-4G. It was also the same price as the iPhone 4, which the general consumer is inclined to choose because of the brand strength of Apple.
I want an unlocked bootloader just as much as the next person on XDA, but to think that issues we find major on XDA are actually the widespread opinion in the real world is a little misguided.

chria01 said:
I dont understand how the dock is to blame. I think the reviews were mediocre because of the software. I agree that the xda community is tiny compared to all of the people who have android phones, but any one can see that motoblur just does not look very user friendly compared to sense. If 70% of returns were because of the openess of the android appstore and problems with apps, did 70% of people switch to the iphone who returned their phones? I wonder what the questionaire said to lead to that conclusion.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What reviews were bad for the Atrix? Engadget gave it a 9 and most sites I saw reviewed it high.

Just take a glance at Motorola's Facebook page. It is completely run rampant by customers who want the bootloader unlocked. Doesn't matter what Motorola posts- it's completely compromised. You don't think the 98% notice that and wonder what all the racket is about?

rex-tc said:
What reviews were bad for the Atrix? Engadget gave it a 9 and most sites I saw reviewed it high.
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Click to collapse
I said the reviews were mediocre. They all cut the phone slack because it was the best on ATT
Android isn't quite ready for the stellar hardware in the Atrix 4G. It will be soon if what we're hearing about the "I" version of Android is true, but until then you'll have to be willing to put up with some random slowdowns and general weirdness every once in a while if you pick up the Atrix. Only you can decide if that's worth it. Then there's the bootloader issue to come to grips with if you're the hackery type.
Applications that have been built to take advantage of the hardware, like my favorite Fruit Ninja THD, show what the hardware is capable of, and the Atrix handles them with ease. I'm not blowing smoke here -- The Atrix runs the beefed-up versions of Dungeon Defenders and Fruit Ninja much better than the Nexus S runs the "lesser" versions in side-by-side tests. For most people, that is enough to justify the wait for Motorola and AT&T to update to an improved version of Android that takes better advantage of the hardware -- we have already seen that with the Xoom, so it's coming. Just know what you're getting yourself into from the start.
Second review down searching on google search

Tons of negative press. Huge, negative facebook following. Google the atrix and you will find plenty of unhappy people and a negative buzz. Endgadget gave it a review but once it came out not many positive. Oh and look at the commentary on those endgadget pages... angry individuals I tell ya.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA Premium App

This is how "dock bundling" can affect the sales of device like Atrix...
When every single ad on TV or printed ad in the stores shows Atrix being used with the lapdock, it creates perception in the average person's eyes that "oh, this Atrix thingy needs to be used with this expensive lap dock thingy and I don't need that, I just need a cool phone, so let me check that iPhone4 for the same price or that HTC Inspire for 1/2 the price".
And I also think that 98% of people don't know what the hell "bootloader" is or what is "locking" anyway.

OSNPA said:
Just take a glance at Motorola's Facebook page. It is completely run rampant by customers who want the bootloader unlocked. Doesn't matter what Motorola posts- it's completely compromised. You don't think the 98% notice that and wonder what all the racket is about?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Who the hell actually goes to Motorola's facebook page? Only people who are there to complain about the bootloader. I have never been there, and have no care to, and neither do a majority of Motorola's actual consumers.

Well, point is there is an undeniable negitive buzz about the phone and the people that were hot about its powerful capabilities were turned off by its software limitations. The biggest drawback being the lack of hsupa at first. Although as we all know, its been upgraded and enabled. I still believe that all of these complaints affected the once positive wave of potential buyers and made them think twice. This all went on in its initial release month. I think it had to affect sales. Then other companies played the catch up game. I mean how hard is it to google a review for something these days. My granpa can do it. Hes Not my daddy he's my grandpa.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA Premium App

A phone is not something you cna just pick up and buy like a 6 pack. YOu need to do a lot of research because you will be stuck with it for 2 years (3 in the frigid north) or else pay a lot of money to buy one off contract.

Problem is Geek reference
I think if you want a successful phone you need to have geek cred. Most folks I know, reference a geek somewhere to help with the phone decision. That geek may just be the person at the store. So, yes, 98% don't know what a boot loader is, but they likely either talked to someone who did, or at least someone who did research on the device and came across the negative reviews. Like the rest here, I weighed the pluses and minuses and decided to "HOPE" for Motorola/AT&T to get Amazon Appstore on the phone and allow sideloading (yes, i should have known, it'd be like moving mountains). Gingerbread at the same time AND before too many other phones are released with the capabilities above would certainly help it.
If it doesn't happen before SGSII or Nexus Next the phone is really toast. There is hope with the Moto droids getting gingerbread now however.

You guys are all ignoring the simple fact that the Inspire 4G was $99 while the Atrix was $199. I am willing to bet the farm that that was a main factor in at least half of consumers' decisions NOT to get the Atrix.

Regardless of the Inspire at $100 there's still a large market for a phone like the Atrix on specs alone. Motorola was Naiive if their target demographic was the $100 or less phone market. Especially if they thought they would buy because of the dock. It may have worked with a dock at $200 and if AT&T didn't slap a required $45/mo data plan with it. I'd be inclined to pin the failure on AT&T seeing the potential and as usual getting a bit too greedy. Don't get me wrong, I support their right to greed, but I'd like the balance to be better toward long term sustainable profits.

Whoever said something about no one visits Moto's facebook page...
People may not visit the page themselves, but they will see that their friend's have been posting there several times and will eventually get the hint that something isn't right with this company that's spawning such hate.
Give Facebook credit where it deserves, and stop downplaying its usefulness. And don't forget Twitter as well. Go and look at the timelines and see how many are tweeting to Moto.
But whoever also said that we're only about a 2% minority, I believe that's correct.

I've never argued that we were 2%. I argued that our 2% influences a lot of people.
Sent from my rooted, gingerblured badass atrix!

lyon21 said:
I've never argued that we were 2%. I argued that our 2% influences a lot of people.
Sent from my rooted, gingerblured badass atrix!
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Click to collapse
You misunderstand me. I know we influence a lot. And I mean a lot! Never said we didn't.

Sony Mobile confirms 2011 Xperia devices will NOT get Jelly Bean

Title says enough.
We expected this kind of news, but as the article says, we already went through this heartache before when a Sony Mobile UK employee said that these devices wouldn’t get Android 4.1. Sony Mobile then came out with an official statement a few days later to say that this was an error and that they were “actively investigating Android OS upgrades for all devices”.
So yeah, it's Sony Dont.Believe being an ass again... which shouldn't be new anyway.
I'm keeping my Xperia PLAY for the next 2-3 years maybe. But when it's time for a phone change, I'm considering Samsung... or LG.
Article HERE.

Nice sony... Do you known who is going to buy yuo a new phone? Me no...
Jelly Bean is smoother than ICS, why do you do that?
- f3w1n -

My god.
Its why cuz Gameloft, EA etc.. said that they wont support ICS/JB.
Sent from my R800i using xda app-developers app

I really can't understand how Sony and a lot of other companys, manages to completely miss the fact that updates ARE important if you wish to sell phones. How long has is been sins JB were released? How many phones are sold with JB, almost none at all. How many can be officially upgraded to JB, almost none.

Google sort this fragmentation out, I'm so glad I'm dumping my Play in 17 days, Sony are being piss heads.

Shame but can't say that I'm surprised by it, can anyone really?
I won't ever buy another Sony branded product again, short of an Xperia PLAY 2 being announced, and even then it would only be because there isn't any alternative to it.
It used to be back in day that Sony products were expensive but you were essentially buying a premium product and could expect a high level of support with it. Remember the 5yr warranties on new tvs? Needless to say, those days are gone. The prices remain high but the quality and level of support certainly hasn't.
If it isn't shoddy workmanship (PS3 YLOD, broken laptop hinges, exploding batteries) for which they will fight the consumer kicking and screaming to deny any responsibility for, then its the total abandonment of products less than a year after launch.
Long may the financial losses for this retched company continue :good:
Code:
https://www.facebook.com/sonymakeforget

Make.CustomersMad
Sent from my R800i using xda app-developers app

I can't really understand why Sony rejects to upgrade their 2011 line to JB when it's CLEAR that these phones can handle it flawlessly, as proven by the CyanogenMod and FreeXperia teams with CM10. In fact it's faster than the official ICS from Sony.
In fact I'm using CM10 as a daily ROM, though sometimes I'm quite pissed about the cam and HDMI problems due to Sony, AGAIN, not willing to support their phones neither officially nor unofficially.
Sony: If you don't want to do the job then at least release the cam and HDMI libs so others can do it!!! Sincerely: an ex-customer, as I won't be buying another phone from you.

LordBattleBeard said:
Shame but can't say that I'm surprised by it, can anyone really?
I won't ever buy another Sony branded product again, short of an Xperia PLAY 2 being announced, and even then it would only be because there isn't any alternative to it.
It used to be back in day that Sony products were expensive but you were essentially buying a premium product and could expect a high level of support with it. Remember the 5yr warranties on new tvs? Needless to say, those days are gone. The prices remain high but the quality and level of support certainly hasn't.
If it isn't shoddy workmanship (PS3 YLOD, broken laptop hinges, exploding batteries) for which they will fight the consumer kicking and screaming to deny any responsibility for, then its the total abandonment of products less than a year after launch.
Long may the financial losses for this retched company continue :good:
Code:
https://www.facebook.com/sonymakeforget
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't begin with your stupid anti-Sony campaign. ALL the companies do the same, they show their new mobiles as the most cool things but after one year they will be completely forgotten. We'll have to stand this until somebody understands that is stupid to lose an update while other devices will get it. Android updates should be the same for all devices!
If you name PS3, say that has been 6 years recieving software updates for example. Ah, and the yellow light of the PS3 it's not the same as the red lights of Xbox 360, so don't call it "yellow light of death". If you're gonna say something, say it right.

Miles Wolf said:
Don't begin with your stupid anti-Sony campaign. ALL the companies do the same, they show their new mobiles as the most cool things but after one year they will be completely forgotten. We'll have to stand this until somebody understands that is stupid to lose an update while other devices will get it. Android updates should be the same for all devices!
If you name PS3, say that has been 6 years recieving software updates for example. Ah, and the yellow light of the PS3 it's not the same as the red lights of Xbox 360, so don't call it "yellow light of death". If you're gonna say something, say it right.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I will post about whatever I like. It is on topic and perfectly relevant. Sorry if that offends fanboys such as yourself
Yellow light of death (YLOD) was exactly the same as the RLOD for the 360 in that when you got it, 9 times out of 10 your console was bricked. This was due to inherent fault in the design of the console which results in insufficient air flow cooling the circuit board. At least in the case of the 360 Microsoft eventually took responsibility and extended the warranty of the console to 3 years. Sony continued down the path of denying any liability and charging $150 for a repair.
More here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/watchdog/2009/09/playstation3_and_the_yellow_li.html
The "they're all at it" line is pathetic, accepting that is to accept a race to the bottom. If you wish to be treated poorly as a consumer and be willing to accept it as normal, go right ahead, but don't be surprised that other people have different ideas.

LordBattleBeard said:
I will post about whatever I like. It is on topic and perfectly relevant. Sorry if that offends fanboys such as yourself
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First of all, you're mixing different things, as long as the Sony responsible of Playstation is not the same Sony responsible of the Xperias (how many times i've told you this?), so it's offtopic, Playstation 3 has nothing to do here.
Second, I'm just telling you that is useless to say "I'm not gonna buy any more Sony devices" for this reason because all companies (except one or two mobiles like the Galaxy S series) do exactly the same with its devices, so don't call me fanboy because I think to be a brand-lover is as wrong as to be a brand-hater.
Sorry if you don't understand a simple thing like this, but don't insult me. Thanks.

Miles Wolf said:
First of all, you're mixing different things, as long as the Sony responsible of Playstation is not the same Sony responsible of the Xperias (how many times i've told you this?), so it's offtopic, Playstation 3 has nothing to do here.
Second, I'm just telling you that is useless to say "I'm not gonna buy any more Sony devices" for this reason because all companies (except one or two mobiles like the Galaxy S series) do exactly the same with its devices, so don't call me fanboy because I think to be a brand-lover is as wrong as to be a brand-hater.
Sorry if you don't understand a simple thing like this, but don't insult me. Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
/yawn ...still talking? nvm...
This page is for people disappointed by Sony's decision to stop future updates for all 2011 Xperia devices:
Code:
https://www.facebook.com/sonymakeforget

LordBattleBeard said:
/yawn ...still talking? nvm...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh, now you don't know how to answer you act is if you were ignoring me, and all after insulting me. Not surpising being from you.
Another day you could respct a bit the others when you talk.

Why doesn't rl have a button like this?
Sorry for minor disruption, continue discussion...

I'd like that Sony updates to JB all the 2011 devices but I also understand that with ICS they brought a good and reasonable support to Xperia users, well, XP excluded.
Sony is launching this year a ton of new devices and the effort needed for a stable JB release to a little part of the users is not a good deal for them. You must admit that Xperia 2011 devices is getting old so they must face that a lot of users are thinking about a new phone, others have a sim locked version and depend of the carrier and lastly there's a lot of people who don't mind about it.
And, well, how many companies are giving better update support than Sony? Most of them forget their non high end phones very quickly. Maybe Sony isn't better than them but neither is the worst.
That's what I think.

Two words.
They wont....
Sent from my R800i using xda app-developers app

i've read that on " xperia blog " and i believe that its not worth to make new thread about that .
why ?
cause that happened AS I EXPECTED
again , it remind me " X10 mini and mini pro " - " xperia play " and now ...

you know i expected this kind of BS from Sony they have made Phones more then capable of running JB But nooooooooooooo, they gota treat there loyal customers like crap.... smooth move Sony, smooth move

Ok, I was hoping for an official update by Sony, but it is also true that the 2011 series is becoming old, and Sony want to update only his last terminal; for the haters, first to talk bad of Sony look how much phone Samsung have and how much would be updated, or look to the lg phone (2x sound new?). Yes, this isn't a good thing, but remember that Sony for now is the most reliable for the update, in fact if I need to change my phone in the next 5 years I will probably buy or a nexus or another Sony phone.
Ok, I say my opinion, now ignore me and restart your childish flame

if you wanted all new updates when you boghtthis phone, then you needed to buy a High end device, and not a mid range!