Related
from Sony Ericsson Developer World
https://developer.sonyericsson.com/device/loadDevice.do?id=c0cd39f0-42ff-4662-be20-1a57657faa4e
It's great for a PPC phone: H.264 30fps 2Mbps @ VGA!
Who can verify this with a mp4 file encoding with H.264 on X1's Windows Media Player (not TCPMP/CorePlayer)?
AVI files can't be supported by Windows Media Player. You can test them with TCPMP/CorePlayer.
------------------------------------------Testing files---------------------------------------
http://rapidshare.com/files/156736115/GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.24fps.mp4.zip
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.24fps.mp4.zip
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.24fps.1.2Mbps_H.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.24fps.1.2Mbps_L.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.24fps.2Mbps_H.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.24fps.2Mbps_L.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.24fps.800kbps_H.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.24fps.800kbps_L.mp4
http://rapidshare.com/files/156739548/GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.30fps.mp4.zip
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.30fps.mp4.zip
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.30fps.1.2Mbps_H.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.30fps.1.2Mbps_L.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.30fps.2Mbps_H.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.30fps.2Mbps_L.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.30fps.800kbps_H.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.30fps.800kbps_L.mp4
http://rapidshare.com/files/156737923/GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.avi.zip
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.avi.zip
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.24fps.1.2Mbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.24fps.1Mbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.24fps.600Kbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.24fps.800Kbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.30fps.1.2Mbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.30fps.1Mbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.30fps.600Kbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.30fps.800Kbps.avi
http://rapidshare.com/files/156805403/GTA4_Trailer_800-448.H264.mp4.zip
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.H264.mp4.zip
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.H264.24fps.1.2Mbps_H.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.H264.24fps.1.2Mbps_L.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.H264.24fps.800kbps_H.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.H264.24fps.800kbps_L.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.H264.30fps.1.2Mbps_H.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.H264.30fps.1.2Mbps_L.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.H264.30fps.800kbps_H.mp4
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.H264.30fps.800kbps_L.mp4
http://rapidshare.com/files/156740918/GTA4_Trailer_800-448.Xvid.avi.zip
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.Xvid.avi.zip
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.Xvid.24fps.1.2Mbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.Xvid.24fps.1Mbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.Xvid.24fps.600Kbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.Xvid.24fps.800Kbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.Xvid.30fps.1.2Mbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.Xvid.30fps.1Mbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.Xvid.30fps.600Kbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_800-448.Xvid.30fps.800Kbps.avi
Note:
mp4 files are encoded with winmenc-0.70.
param for H (H.264 main profile with B frame):Xvc=level_idc=3:bframes=3:frameref=2:nopsnr:nossim
param for L (H.264 baseline):Xvc=level_idc=13:bframes=0:frameref=2:nopsnr:nossim:nocabac
avi files are encoded with WisMencoder_2.1.1.0
I'm very interested in this too. Anybody care to test?
find me a video and im happy to try!
Hmzzzz. Hancock what comes on the sd card??
Naffets said:
find me a video and im happy to try!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dear Naffets, I've uploaded some testing video files. Hope for your result.
at work at the moment, will try afterwards
Ok, testin right now. First zip tested, results:
Test 1. GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.24fps.mp4.zip
Only GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.24fps.800kbps_L.mp4 was working at 100% speed with build in Windows Media Player. Versions of movies with H on the end working only with sound (no video). TCPMP not working on X1, only modifided version by eoc for GoForce chip is starting normal but won't play h264 files.
Test 2. GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.30fps.mp4.zip
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.30fps.800kbps_L.mp4 file was working almost ok, only sometimes stops for a second. Rest files was lagging a lot, all tested with WMP. TCPMP not match h264 so not tested.
Test 3. GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.avi.zip
Files not working with WMP and TCPMP.
Test 4. GTA4_Trailer_800-448.Xvid.avi.zip
Files not working with WMP and TCPMP.
TCPMP and WM won't get you desireable results on the X1, mainly since WMP doesnt support xvid and other codecs and WMP is a weak video player. Your gonna want to use Coreplayer to really see a difference most likely as its much more enhanced then TCPMP (former project name) and WMP. At least I'm pretty sure that'll be the case with more recent devices. Then again TCPMP was obtimized back then for the ATI chip so who knows.
@ell82: Have you tried using SE internal video player instead? Thats what most users used to play the bond trailer shown online.
I tried watching the 800x448 trailer on my touch pro and it opened just fine, ofcourse the lower bit rates played a bit better around 75-80% but the the higher rates made my device cry lol.
Results with SE player which is on Panels are exactly the same.
Many thanks for your testing!
ell82 said:
Ok, testin right now. First zip tested, results:
Test 1. GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.24fps.mp4.zip
Only GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.24fps.800kbps_L.mp4 was working at 100% speed with build in Windows Media Player. Versions of movies with H on the end working only with sound (no video). TCPMP not working on X1, only modifided version by eoc for GoForce chip is starting normal but won't play h264 files.
Test 2. GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.30fps.mp4.zip
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.H264.30fps.800kbps_L.mp4 file was working almost ok, only sometimes stops for a second. Rest files was lagging a lot, all tested with WMP. TCPMP not match h264 so not tested.
Test 3. GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.avi.zip
Files not working with WMP and TCPMP.
Test 4. GTA4_Trailer_800-448.Xvid.avi.zip
Files not working with WMP and TCPMP.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I uploaded a new zip "GTA4_Trailer_800-448.H264.mp4.zip".
http://rapidshare.com/files/156805403/GTA4_Trailer_800-448.H264.mp4.zip
800*448 is the best 16:9 resolution for X1's WVGA screen.
Could you test it, especial the four mp4 files of 800kbps?
Stuttering at 800kbps/30fps?
2mbit/s @ 30fps fluidly?, ......rigggggght.
GOOD JOB S.E. !
And btw, afaik Coreplayer does not care one bit about the Imageon sitting there in the corner of the chipset. So 2mbit is just plain crazytalk if you'd ask me.
SomeoneSimple said:
Stuttering at 800kbps/30fps?
2mbit/s @ 30fps fluidly?, ......rigggggght.
GOOD JOB S.E. !
And btw, afaik Coreplayer does not care one bit about the Imageon sitting there in the corner of the chipset. So 2mbit is just plain crazytalk if you'd ask me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But Coreplayer allows users to choose how to play videos using which video mode on the system, for instance you can choose DirectDraw, Imageon Driver, Framebuffer, and etc. Each with plays with its own capabilities so it does in fact make a difference. the Tytn was a perfect example that had horrible playback on wmp until coreplayer came in and utilized the Imageon chip allowing a huge difference in video playback. Sooooo i'm pretty sure it does care. You just have to choose that mode under preferences.
Anyone willing to test these videos with the different options in coreplayer?
pleaaaase, someone have to test this!!! I need this information very, very much, its the main point for me buying an Experia..!! I don't want to convert movies anymore, so please tell me!
Greez, cad^^
cadenza said:
pleaaaase, someone have to test this!!! I need this information very, very much, its the main point for me buying an Experia..!! I don't want to convert movies anymore, so please tell me!
Greez, cad^^
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
2nd you! .. I would really like to know as well since I want a device where I dont have to convert.
cadenza said:
pleaaaase, someone have to test this!!! I need this information very, very much, its the main point for me buying an Experia..!! I don't want to convert movies anymore, so please tell me!
Greez, cad^^
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most video's from the internet (P2P XviD's) have bitrates around 800kb/s @ 720x416 @ 24fps. Even without the "enhanced [email protected] hardware acceleration" the MSM720*A chipset will do just fine within Coreplayer.
No worries there.
[edit] Oh, and my bad for the misunderstanding of the advanced options of Coreplayer. Though, 2Mbit still seems pretty far-fetched in my opinion.
Yes, but I have many videos in very good quality with rates about 1.3-1.5 Mbps. Of course I don't need 2Mbps, but at least I want 1.5Mbps fluid. I hooooope...... Greez^^
SomeoneSimple said:
Most video's from the internet (P2P XviD's) have bitrates around 800kb/s @ 720x416 @ 24fps. Even without the "enhanced [email protected] hardware acceleration" the MSM720*A chipset will do just fine within Coreplayer.
No worries there.
[edit] Oh, and my bad for the misunderstanding of the advanced options of Coreplayer. Though, 2Mbit still seems pretty far-fetched in my opinion.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I kinda agree with you, 2mbit seems kinda high to handle right off the bat. Im assuming at most around 1.2 in reality. Hopefully mine comes in asap but im hating this wait game for it >_<
ahyi said:
from Sony Ericsson Developer World
http://rapidshare.com/files/156737923/GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.avi.zip
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.avi.zip
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.24fps.1.2Mbps.avi
GTA4_Trailer_640-480.Xvid.24fps.1Mbps.avi
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Anyone managed to test this yet in CorePlayer? ))))))
FunkyMike said:
Anyone managed to test this yet in CorePlayer? ))))))
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tomorrow my phone turns up, assuming the Core team don't take weeks and allow me to get a new serial for my new phone, I have an 8gb micro SD card full of 350mb TV shows that I want to test. Will report back as soon as I can get CorePlayer on the phone.
So here's my story:
I recently bought Samsung Omnia on which I did extensive tests on video playback
with CorePlayer 1.2.5 and TCPMP and with various video formats such as:
H264 Baseline 3 480x272 (originally encoded for playback in iPod Touch)
Various XviD encoded videos with resolutions varying from 640x360 to 720x400
Using DirectDraw as video output in both CorePlayer and TCPMP
the result was awful, dropped frames, awful motion and distorted colors.
However since the Omnia has the fastest CPU I know in WM Device so far,
the Marvell PXA312, 624MHz with IntelXScale acceleration,
the CorePlayer and TCPMP gives this as an option for video output the IntelXScale acceleration.
So when using this setting the video playback of any type of encoding was absolutely beautiful.
Colors were correct, performance was amazing (even in double playback speed) it was in general as smooth as it gets.
For a powerfull (hardware-wise) device such as omnia, I was very disappointed
in the resolution of the screen (240x400 - wqvga) and its size 2.8".
For this kind of device which has literally everything one would expect it
to have same screen size and resolution as the touch hd.
I rushed to buy this device I must admit and so I sold it to a friend after experimenting with it for one week.
The reason that I gave away so fast the Omnia was simply the Blackstone.
Since I am kind of perfectionist as far as it concerns screen resolutions, the touch hd is no match with any other phone/ppc device out there.
So here comes the real concern, how is the performance on video playback on the blackstone?
For a multimedia device like this one would expect that the performance
would be excellent (much like the omnia or even better if it can).
But what concerns me is the Qualcomm cpu at 528Mhz which as far as I can tell
doesn't have IntelXScale acceleration (plz correct me if i'm wrong on this)
So if it uses only DirectDraw and the results are crappy, then this would be such a turn off.
Can this CPU give a smooth video playback performance on a 640x360 XviD avi video
with "Smooth zoom: ON" and "Zoom: Fill Screen" settings on either CorePlayer or TCPMP?
And keep in mind that we are talking about realtime upsizing of the video to 800x480
which IMHO requires quite a lot of cpu power for such device.
Because really I am not willing to spend 700 euro on a multimedia phone
that can't actually perform well on multimedia.
I'd love to hear someone that has it and tested it on that matter.
Thanks for reading!
We really want to know the answer for your question, And I think that we have to wait until we see the phone on the market and get some benchmarks.
Also I think that SE in their xperia phone did what you are asking for ..! In the same beautiful screen resolution 800x480
Thank you,
Mohammed
mohdtmn said:
We really want to know the answer for your question, And I think that we have to wait until we see the phone on the market and get some benchmarks.
Also I think that SE in their xperia phone did what you are asking for ..! In the same beautiful screen resolution 800x480
Thank you,
Mohammed
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
More like SE said to HTC "We want an awesome phone, but we don't want you to tell us what's in it, and we'll just make Magnus make up stuff as we go, also we suck at marketing."
touch HD has a slower cpu, without xscale acceleration. but it has a dedicated graphics chip, which matters more in video play back. at the resolution you have mentioned, i have full confidence it will do just as well if not better than omnia.
buggybug0 said:
touch HD has a slower cpu, without xscale acceleration. but it has a dedicated graphics chip, which matters more in video play back. at the resolution you have mentioned, i have full confidence it will do just as well if not better than omnia.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I sure hope so, because I would say I'm not so satisfied with the Touch Diamond performance. Let me explain:
Since this matter is really killing me, I need to be sure it can perform well on video (not extreme stuff, the standard-like video formats we all use).
So I decided to make a test, since i don't own a Touch Diamond (which has the same hardware), I went to a local retail store that had the device on display for ppl to see and experiment with, I installed coreplayer and sent a 40" 608x400 xvid video with ~900kbps bitrate to test it.
CorePlayer was set automatically with video mode QTv and with TytnII Driver mode enabled (which i suppose is the accelerator driver)
I made sure nothing else was running in the background and the results was not so ok. I was playing just ok, I noticed some frame skips and some "lag" in fast motion.
I just hope the Touch HD has revised hardware (if that's possible) and better drivers maybe?
I really would like to hear an answer from someone that has already his hands on the touch hd
buggybug0 said:
touch HD has a slower cpu, without xscale acceleration. but it has a dedicated graphics chip, which matters more in video play back. at the resolution you have mentioned, i have full confidence it will do just as well if not better than omnia.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
but htc is also notorious for not not allowing 3rd party software to use the graphic chip, that is when they do provide drivers for the chip
fallenczar said:
but htc is also notorious for not not allowing 3rd party software to use the graphic chip, that is when they do provide drivers for the chip
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so are you saying if i were to install a 3rd party video player, when i try to play video, i will see a blank screen? because this player is 3rd party and can't access the graphic chip?? :S
buggybug0 said:
so are you saying if i were to install a 3rd party video player, when i try to play video, i will see a blank screen? because this player is 3rd party and can't access the graphic chip?? :S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, i'm saying that coreplayer/TCPMP will only be able to use the default qualcomm chip, its exactly like having a graphic card in your pc with no drivers and no in built support
Thats sux
I hope Touch HD has better driver ... because the hardware is the same.
Quite a downer ...
mkMoSs said:
I sure hope so, because I would say I'm not so satisfied with the Touch Diamond performance. Let me explain:
Since this matter is really killing me, I need to be sure it can perform well on video (not extreme stuff, the standard-like video formats we all use).
So I decided to make a test, since i don't own a Touch Diamond (which has the same hardware), I went to a local retail store that had the device on display for ppl to see and experiment with, I installed coreplayer and sent a 40" 608x400 xvid video with ~900kbps bitrate to test it.
CorePlayer was set automatically with video mode QTv and with TytnII Driver mode enabled (which i suppose is the accelerator driver)
I made sure nothing else was running in the background and the results was not so ok. I was playing just ok, I noticed some frame skips and some "lag" in fast motion.
I just hope the Touch HD has revised hardware (if that's possible) and better drivers maybe?
I really would like to hear an answer from someone that has already his hands on the touch hd
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
fallenczar said:
No, i'm saying that coreplayer/TCPMP will only be able to use the default qualcomm chip, its exactly like having a graphic card in your pc with no drivers and no in built support
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If that is the case, then I dont understand it. I mean why HTC would go through all this trouble to have an extra graphics chip in their devices when no other than their own app could ever use? So they put a graphic chip with 3d capabilities and video acceleration for just their own apps like touchflo 3d ?
Isn't it just stupid?
Yes, that would be stupid. Fortunately though, there is quite some talk about the HD having an optimized chipset compared to the Diamond, even though this does not include the processor. It is already evident by the many movies that the device performs faster than the diamond even with the same processor, so I doubt you'd have exactly the same performance issues as with the diamond. Though there is only one way to be sure: wait 2 more weeks and everybody will own one.
nin2thevoid said:
.......... wait 2 more weeks and everybody will own one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hell...i cant agree with you more..almost everyone i know is either 'buying one' or 'Wants to buy one'....whatever happened to the times when there were a few geeks like me who went out and bought a winmo phone....whatever happened to the iphone??...lol
gauravdc said:
Hell...i cant agree with you more..almost everyone i know is either 'buying one' or 'Wants to buy one'....whatever happened to the times when there were a few geeks like me who went out and bought a winmo phone....whatever happened to the iphone??...lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
iPhone died, blackstone killed it
Blackstone is a killer... Woohoo.. We have to send it to prison!!.. I think I might have a good prison here at my home so my blackstone, come for punishment *roarr* lol
Coreplayer 1.3.0 is said to have major improvement with QTv rendering on MSM7201A/7200A. This was promised by them on their forum about a month ago.
Head over there and hurry them up! Those guys are reeaaaalllly slow, probably too busy working on Coreplayer for stupid iPhone.
wuzy said:
Coreplayer 1.3.0 is said to have major improvement with QTv rendering on MSM7201A/7200A. This was promised by them on their forum about a month ago.
Head over there and hurry them up! Those guys are reeaaaalllly slow, probably too busy working on Coreplayer for stupid iPhone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, if I buy the current coreplayer-version from them, do I get a free update when the 1.3.0 will arrive? Or should I wait until it comes out? This would be the most important application for me on the Touch HD.. Greez, cad^^
wuzy said:
Coreplayer 1.3.0 is said to have major improvement with QTv rendering on MSM7201A/7200A. This was promised by them on their forum about a month ago.
Head over there and hurry them up! Those guys are reeaaaalllly slow, probably too busy working on Coreplayer for stupid iPhone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Fingers crossed!
They should just forget the iPhone, ppl will be finding out about blackstone and they will be throwing their iPhone from the window xD
I guess no problem with playing video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fv9lLAVidgA&fmt=18
Thanks to johnkorver who own the device, create the video review, and upload it to youtube.
looks promising even though we don't have any other info on the video file except the codec used (xvid).. anyway upscaling works nice and that says much..
one more video playback demo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wo7I6K8U7L4
Will there be issues on video playback like all other HTC devices ?
Will leo be able to play a not converted divx ?
firiel said:
Will there be issues on video playback like all other HTC devices ?
Will leo be able to play a not converted divx ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think it's able to play till 480p res. videos even no exist video acceleration or drivers... It's powered by brute cpu force with snapdragon to process vid. codecs IMO...
firiel said:
Will there be issues on video playback like all other HTC devices ?
Will leo be able to play a not converted divx ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not gonna worry about that. For Touch HD, I used Total Video Converter, I used Iphone H264 MP4 best settings and play in Windows Media Player, even in Touch HD it is smooth and stunning at full 800 X 480, only that scrolling through time frames or during video startup is sluggish. And for HD2, I believe the loading time will be shortened.
Playing high quality videos have been non issue with these HTC devices, you just need to do it right.
precsmo said:
Playing high quality videos have been non issue with these HTC devices, you just need to do it right.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you don't mind wasting time on conversion, that is.
From HTC website: Video supported formats: .wmv, .asf, .mp4, .3gp, .3g2, .m4v, .avi
Can't speak to quality because the phone isn't out. ;-)
Reason4444 said:
I think it's able to play till 480p res. videos even no exist video acceleration or drivers... It's powered by brute cpu force with snapdragon to process vid. codecs IMO...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which means that when a device from another manufacturer like samsung or acer grabs the snapdragon we will cry with the results, right ?
And dont have me even mention tegra
rebecker said:
From HTC website: Video supported formats: .wmv, .asf, .mp4, .3gp, .3g2, .m4v, .avi
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Touch Diamond2 specs also mention .avi, but it's a half-truth. I use a Topaz ROM on my Touch HD and can't view regular DivX/XVid videos with anything built-in. Maybe the FullScreen Player from HTC Album (or Windows Media Player) here can play .avis with some weird codecs, but it's absolutely irrelevant to real-life scenarios.
vangrieg said:
Touch Diamond2 specs also mention .avi, but it's a half-truth. I use a Topaz ROM on my Touch HD and can't view regular DivX/XVid videos with anything built-in. Maybe the FullScreen Player from HTC Album (or Windows Media Player) here can play .avis with some weird codecs, but it's absolutely irrelevant to real-life scenarios.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've gone back to the stock rom on my hd, after an unfortunate incident with some muggers. But Coreplayer (ver 1.3.2) seems very adept at handling any native divx/xvid files
AshHD said:
I've gone back to the stock rom on my hd, after an unfortunate incident with some muggers. But Coreplayer (ver 1.3.2) seems very adept at handling any native divx/xvid files
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then we probably have very different HDs because mine reminds me of the era of 200MHz HTC devices. Playback of unconverted is jerky with visibly very low FPS, dynamic scenes are more like slideshows than films, even with 700MB rips, 1.4GB ones are even worse. This is not to mention that CorePlayer doesn't support AC3 audio which means that half of the movies I have are mute. If this is called being "very adept at handling" then I don't know what isn't.
Stock ROMs are exactly the same in terms of video performance, the reason why I mentioned Topaz ROM is simply because that device boasts .avi support, which it is in fact lacking. That said, ".avi support" is pretty much a meaningless phrase since .avi is just a wrapper, there could be a full zoo of codecs inside.
firiel said:
Which means that when a device from another manufacturer like samsung or acer grabs the snapdragon we will cry with the results, right ?
And dont have me even mention tegra
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In what way do you imagine that these devices will be superior to the HD2 when it comes to video playback? If the HD2 can play back video at full screen resolution (800x480) with no dropped frames at all and support any wrapper or codec you might want, how much better can any other device really get? That (most likely) is what the HD2 running Coreplayer will deliver.
The only time there's likely to be an issue is if you expect to play back a high-definition (e.g. 1280x720) video downscaled to the screen resolution in real time. But, even if it's only for reasons of storage space, you'd probably want to downscale any clips like that to 800x480 resolution anyway.
It's possible that other devices (the ones that can use GPU acceleration when playing xvid and divx stuff) will offer better battery-life during video playback, I guess, but I doubt it'll be that big a margin.
Shasarak, it's not clear how the downscaling will work performance-wise without GPU support, and CorePlayer doesn't support AC3 sound. Not that I need to listen to AC3 on a phone, but I certainly have movies with it. So at this moment CorePlayer is definitely a mediocre solution as far as I'm concerned.
Shasharak,
Am not arguing that the device hopefully might be able to play, by CPU power 480p, but what about HTC not delivering for once again, what our money worth.
If u search for comparisons of omnia and any htc 528 based model, you will see great differences on video playback. This is unacceptable from me.
And what about gaming or 3d accelerated apps. We are getting to a new age of handheld devices, that should be (MUST BE) able to deliver video, web, audio and entertainment. And should do it with all their power.
vangrieg said:
Shasarak, it's not clear how the downscaling will work performance-wise without GPU support, and CorePlayer doesn't support AC3 sound. Not that I need to listen to AC3 on a phone, but I certainly have movies with it. So at this moment CorePlayer is definitely a mediocre solution as far as I'm concerned.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, as I say, I don't imagine anyone will want to downscale video on it anyway - HD video won't look any worse if it's downscaled off-line, and it will take up far less space on the memory card than the original HD file.
Coreplayer not supporting AC3 is a problem, I'll grant you. It's possible that Coreplayer version 2 will support it. If not, then you'll have to see if you can get TCPMP running on the Leo - I expect there will be a version that does.
firiel said:
Shasharak,
Am not arguing that the device hopefully might be able to play, by CPU power 480p, but what about HTC not delivering for once again, what our money worth.
If u search for comparisons of omnia and any htc 528 based model, you will see great differences on video playback. This is unacceptable from me.
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Yeah, but that's the point: you won't see those differences on the HD2. I own a Touch Pro2, so I understand how annoyed you are. But the difference with the HD2 is that the CPU is so powerful that it should be able to play back anything with a resolution of 800x480 or less without dropping any frames using the CPU alone - why would you care if it's using the CPU or the GPU if you can't see any difference in the playback? The Snapdragon CPU is nearly three times as powerful as the one in the TP2. Even without GPU acceleration it'll still work just fine.
firiel said:
And what about gaming or 3d accelerated apps. We are getting to a new age of handheld devices, that should be (MUST BE) able to deliver video, web, audio and entertainment. And should do it with all their power.
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Well, we know from existing benchmarks that the Leo will deliver hardware-accelerated OpenGL ES, so that's a good start. On some 3D benchmarks it's more than 20 times as fast as a TP2. (I doubt there will be any 3D-accelerated apps for Windows Mobile, anyway - otherwise people who own cheaper, slower WinMo phones will buy them and then complain they can't run them. WinMo apps tend to be written for low-end hardware.) Web should be fine - especially once we have a version of FlashPlayer 10.1 which will be in beta before the end of the year. I wouldn't worry.
Shasarak said:
Well, as I say, I don't imagine anyone will want to downscale video on it anyway - HD video won't look any worse if it's downscaled off-line, and it will take up far less space on the memory card than the original HD file.
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I, on the other hand, can't imagine why anyone would want to convert any videos to watch on the phone. I have a notebook with a 60GB SSD and some 1.16GHz processor - it's blazing fast for Office/internet use but it'll take forever to convert any videos. I also store files like videos on a network drive, so using the more powerful desktop is still slow. And I need to watch videos only occasionally - when going on a trip I can copy a movie or two to take with me on a plane. So space isn't a problem really while ability to watch unconverted video is.
In any case, there was a question you asked about how another device may be more powerful in video playback - I guess with proper driver support they can be, and there are use cases when this is important.
vangrieg said:
I, on the other hand, can't imagine why anyone would want to convert any videos to watch on the phone. I have a notebook with a 60GB SSD and some 1.16GHz processor - it's blazing fast for Office/internet use but it'll take forever to convert any videos. I also store files like videos on a network drive, so using the more powerful desktop is still slow. And I need to watch videos only occasionally - when going on a trip I can copy a movie or two to take with me on a plane. So space isn't a problem really while ability to watch unconverted video is.
In any case, there was a question you asked about how another device may be more powerful in video playback - I guess with proper driver support they can be, and there are use cases when this is important.
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As a TP2 owner with a slow desktop PC I feel your pain, I really do. I'm simply pointing out that the HD2 won't suffer from this problem to anywhere near the extent that current-generation HTC phones do. My best guess is that no video clip that runs at 800x480 or lower will require conversion; it's only ones in higher resolutions that will. And the chances are that even your netbook wouldn't be able to play a 720p video smoothly, so what use is it to store the videos in hi-def format in the first place? You might as well download a lower-res version.
If you end having to convert something very occasionally then just leave it running on your desktop PC overnight - it's not that big a deal.
The key difference, here, is that a TP2 can't even get close to playing a 624x351 xvid clip without conversion, while the HD2 will play it perfectly. It'll play anything other than high definition clips perfectly without conversion - so there is exactly one use-case where GPU acceleration is relevant, and it's not an important one.
Shasarak said:
I'm simply pointing out that the HD2 won't suffer from this problem to anywhere near the extent that current-generation HTC phones do.
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This is most certainly true. I still bought HD even though I knew about these problems, but it's still an annoyance. HD2 will be better for sure.
Shasarak said:
And the chances are that even your netbook wouldn't be able to play a 720p video smoothly,
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It's not a netbook, it's a "real" notebook, Thinkpad X300, but anyway - I don't watch movies on my computers - I use a network media server and a network player, they are streamed to my TV. So my phone is the only computer-like device that needs to be able to play videos, actually.
Shasarak said:
so what use is it to store the videos in hi-def format in the first place? You might as well download a lower-res version.
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In fact, I try to avoid downloading HD videos whenever I can as I don't care for viewing them in high resolutions even though I have a large Full HD TV. The problem is only that low-res versions aren't always available, and increasingly so. It's not my preference but rather an unfortunate trend.
So you think that the snapdragon "RAW" is enough. Enough for what ? There are no limits for what to expect.
Should HTC, continue to ignore what GPU means, we should not. once again accept it It was like 2 years ago when I complained about my TC performance, without getting any answer. And now Samsung, on their first winmo device (omnia), has really better results, using the same processor. There will be tons of snapdragon devices, or even tegra powered (hopefully) soon enough.
If Qualcomm refuses to give the guys who write CorePlayer access to their intellectual property, that isn't altogether HTC's fault. Any software actually written by HTC does use GPU acceleration - there's a limit to the extent that they can be held responsible for the deficiencies of third party software.
firiel said:
So you think that the snapdragon "RAW" is enough. Enough for what ? There are no limits for what to expect.
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I set down very precise limits in my prediction: CPU-only video decoding will (IMO) be adequate for all videos with a resolution of 800x480 or lower. Any video with higher resolution may require transcoding - but it obviously couldn't look any better than an 800x480 video if it's being played back on an 800x480 screen.
firiel said:
Should HTC, continue to ignore what GPU means, we should not. once again accept it
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And how exactly should we "not accept it"? I am also pissed off at HTC, but I don't think we can do anything except buying something else, but there are also reasons not to (all of them very individual).
Shasarak said:
If Qualcomm refuses to give the guys who write CorePlayer access to their intellectual property, that isn't altogether HTC's fault.
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True, with a BUT: they (HTC) could enable their software to play real-life video formats. Samsung's Touch Player does that. And a smaller "but": they could also provide generic driver that would provide DirectX/OpenGL interfaces for Qualcomm's quirky technologies. Both options would cost them money I guess, so they chose not to.
According to wikipedia
In 2009 HTC Corporation used QSD8250 1GHz chipset in the HTC HD2.[5] However, the Snapdragon's 720p High-Definition video decoding was disabled on the HTC HD2, because its operating system, Windows Mobile does not recognize HD video.
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So anybody have idea how is it disabled ? If suppose WM 6.6 or WM 7.0 OS have HD video support and we install on HD2.
Question 1 : Is HD video decoding is disabled at CPU iteself by qualcomm or at HTC in bios or somthing sort off or is it due to OS/Kernel limitation ?
Question 2 : Can we play 720p videos if we rom update with HD Video supported WM 6.6/7 ?
I searched on here / google but didnt get the ans...
source:
wikipedia
New drivers might/could open up these possibilities on upcoming WM6.6-WM7 releases. However, there is no real use in playing back 720p movies on your device due to it's limited resolution.
It would, however, be nice not having to re-encode the file before putting it on your phone. Still, it wouldn't be of much use without TV out imo.
BLAST3RR said:
However, there is no real use in playing back 720p movies on your device due to it's limited resolution.
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On the contrary, it would be very useful indeed: you could download and store just one version of the video for use on either a desktop PC or a phone, and no transcoding would be required, with consequent enormous savings in time and electricity.
BLAST3RR said:
New drivers might/could open up these possibilities on upcoming WM6.6-WM7 releases. However, there is no real use in playing back 720p movies on your device due to it's limited resolution.
It would, however, be nice not having to re-encode the file before putting it on your phone. Still, it wouldn't be of much use without TV out imo.
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Yeah i agree with you that its not wise to play 720 videos considering screen resolution and cpu / battery usage.
But what i will like , that if copy movies / videos at work I can watch while returning home in metro.
Or while journey in train etc i can copy videos from passengers (many are carrying notebooks for watching movies or mail on olong distance journeys) and play them on my HD2..
One more question considereing 1ghz processor is there any app for conevrting Videos from phone only....(I know video encoding is resource heavy task still.. ???)
I don't know about a movie cause most of full lenght movies ar in mkv and bigger than 4 gigs, and as far as i know ntfs file system is not supported by any phone. Although series episodes would be nice without conversation its just consumes a lot of time apart from downloadig.
file size is definately going to be an issue for most people here (imo), regardless of whether the device will play 720p or not.
Some people will never get it, but 720p playback without HDMI out is COMPLETELY USELESS.
Because it does NOT remove the need of converting the videos. Even if a phone is capable of playing back 720p videos, it plays only specifically converted videos and NOT every 720p video.
yeah only x264 ones so where is the problem, standard 720p warez rels are x264
freyberry said:
Some people will never get it, but 720p playback without HDMI out is COMPLETELY USELESS.
Because it does NOT remove the need of converting the videos. Even if a phone is capable of playing back 720p videos, it plays only specifically converted videos and NOT every 720p video.
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It is useless because the device resolution isnt great enough to fully appreciate the HD content.
Conversion is also an issue but as has been said x264 is supported.
Only in the right container and with the right conversion settings. 90% of all "warez" videos would have to be converted anyway...
...you want HTC to make the device even more expensive only to be able to play 10% of your illegally downloaded videos without conversion?
Ridiculous. As long as there's no HDMI out, 720p is completely useless, it only adds additional costs and efforts and delay to the release of the devices.
freyberry said:
Only in the right container and with the right conversion settings. 90% of all "warez" videos would have to be converted anyway...
...you want HTC to make the device even more expensive only to be able to play 10% of your illegally downloaded videos without conversion?
Ridiculous. As long as there's no HDMI out, 720p is completely useless, it only adds additional costs and efforts and delay to the release of the devices.
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I think it would be closer to 100% of peoples illegal downloads would be playable on the leo if its Snapdragon's 720p High-Definition video decoding was enabled.
But... not much point without bigger storage volume on the device.
I could be wrong, but aren't most illegal downloaded videos in the divx container? Those would not play without conversion to .mp4. It's not enough that they are H.264, they also need to be in the right container, with the right audio format and bitrate etc.
Definitely not worth the additional cost and wait on the device.
freyberry said:
I could be wrong, but aren't most illegal downloaded videos in the divx container? Those would not play without conversion to .mp4. It's not enough that they are H.264, they also need to be in the right container, with the right audio format and bitrate etc.
Definitely not worth the additional cost and wait on the device.
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you are not seeing the bigger picture my friend!
pirates upload movies that have been converted for playback on whatever device already,... you would start to see 720p_HD2_Movie illegal downloads all over the place... this is what i mean
freyberry said:
I could be wrong, but aren't most illegal downloaded videos in the divx container? Those would not play without conversion to .mp4. It's not enough that they are H.264, they also need to be in the right container, with the right audio format and bitrate etc.
Definitely not worth the additional cost and wait on the device.
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What additional costs ??? considering Nexus 1 with snapdragon processor plays 720p vidoes then why HD2 can't ? Where the limitation is ?
and i know 720p videos playing on small resolution has no advantage but disadvantage at the cost of cpu and battery.. but i remebery the days i owned Sony erricson which supportd only 176X220 cannot play videos even 320x240 ... the videos has to exactly encoded at 176x220 resolution to play on it. tha was a pain as videos larger shared by frnds mobile will not play....
freyberry said:
Some people will never get it, but 720p playback without HDMI out is COMPLETELY USELESS.
Because it does NOT remove the need of converting the videos. Even if a phone is capable of playing back 720p videos, it plays only specifically converted videos and NOT every 720p video.
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The reason people don't "get" that statement is because it's WRONG. There is no reason at all to assume that 720p videos would require conversion under those circumstances. It simply isn't true that there is something special and unique about specific codecs that makes them suitable for hardware-accelerated playback while others are not: it's merely coincidence that certain hardware-accelerated applications happen to support only those codecs now. Even if it were the case that only H264 video could be played at 720p, that's the format that virtually all 720p video is already in! This has been argued out at some length in previous threads, for example: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=604437&highlight=720p&page=4
It's also simply not true that there is no point in playing 720p video on a 480p screen. There would be an enormous benefit in terms of convenience: you'd only have to download a single version of a file for desktop PC and phone use, and no transcoding would be needed.
freyberry said:
I could be wrong, but aren't most illegal downloaded videos in the divx container? Those would not play without conversion to .mp4. It's not enough that they are H.264, they also need to be in the right container, with the right audio format and bitrate etc.
Definitely not worth the additional cost and wait on the device.
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Even if that were the case (and, as already explained, it isn't - there's nothing magical about .mp4 that makes it easier to play back) conversion from one container format to another is hugely much faster and easier than converting between codecs and resolutions.
Incidentally, divx is not a container, anyway, it's a codec.
Of course all codecs can, in theory, be hardware accelerated. But there is no manufacturer that enables hardware acceleration for more than one codec. That's a cost and time issue and it's simply not going to happen anytime soon.
At the moment, there is absolutely no point in adding 720p playback capabilities to a phone without digital TV out.
And Shasarak, I'm really getting tired of all your false or unfounded statements, it really seems like you're trying to spread FUD. If you say things that you can't be sure about (like your statements about the availability of WM7 for example), then please tell people that it's your opinion. Otherwise, your statements are no better than lies.
freyberry said:
Of course all codecs can, in theory, be hardware accelerated. But there is no manufacturer that enables hardware acceleration for more than one codec.
There is absolutely no point in adding 720p playback capabilities to a phone without digital TV out.
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And again, wrong on all points. I explained why 720p playback would be useful in my last post: convenience. As for hardware acceleration of multiple codecs, are you not aware that there is a version of CorePlayer which runs with hardware acceleration on the Toshiba TG01? (Possibly also on the Acer NeoTouch, I'm not sure). The standard video player on Samsung phones also supports multiple formats with acceleration. Even HTCAlbum handles .mp4 and .3gp files using either of the codecs the HD2 camera can use, while Pocket Media Player handles .WMV's as well.
Coreplayer with hardware acceleration for ALL codecs? I believe it when I see it. Till then, you're simply wrong.
I wouldn't want HTC to spend time and money on that anyway, until they release a device with HDMI out. I want my devices earlier and cheaper. I think you're a minority, anyway
freyberry said:
Coreplayer with hardware acceleration for ALL codecs? I believe it when I see it.
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You're just determined to make yourself look silly, aren't you? I've seen it. It was even briefly posted on this forum at one point before the Coreplayer writers requested that the thread be removed on the grounds that it was basically a warez thread - distributing copies of commercial software for free. Do some googling for "OEM CorePlayer" if you don't believe me. Of course it cannot legally be run on anything other than a TG01 (which ships with it) as only Toshiba have paid the money to Qualcomm to license Qualcomm intellectual property.
I'm so tired of all your unfounded claims. Link please or it didn't happen!
And as you realized yourself, it's a money issue. I do NOT want HTC to spend money (and time) on this useless feature.
Of course, as soon as they release a device with HDMI out, it'll be a different story.
I haven't seen anything one way or another but does anyone know if the Evo will support divx I know HTC has it planned for the desire and Samsung already had it on the galaxy s n the moment. It just makes sense with the hdmi out
It would definitely make sense considering everything. We'll have to wait and see.
The H.264 video codec and mp4 format provides superior video quality, especially on the screen that the Evo uses.
Apple has done 1 thing in their existence that is actually useful.
VoXHTC said:
The H.264 video codec and mp4 format provides superior video quality, especially on the screen that the Evo uses.
Apple has done 1 thing in their existence that is actually useful.
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If it wasn't for Apple, I don't think Android would be the way it is now.
There is a lot to thank the competition for.
VoXHTC said:
The H.264 video codec and mp4 format provides superior video quality, especially on the screen that the Evo uses.
Apple has done 1 thing in their existence that is actually useful.
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sure it does better quality, but I really don't want to have to encode all my files from mkv to mp4 just to put them on my phone, i'd rather just play em straight
I don't know about you, but I don't want to copy 15GB movies to my phone. Conversion is really the only way to go.
or just stream them to the device. I'm just not up to date with HD streaming, but normal video streams well.
you'd need nearly a 20mbit connection for that. 15GB/120min/60sec*8
divx plays okay on evo using xyzflash player but looks better and played smoother when I converted to h.264
Does DoubleTwist automatically convert stuff for you?
mrniceguy715 said:
divx plays okay on evo using xyzflash player but looks better and played smoother when I converted to h.264
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I noticed (in another thread) you saying you got to play with one. Do you still have access to it?
yes i do indeed
watzone69 said:
I noticed (in another thread) you saying you got to play with one. Do you still have access to it?
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dump it..dump it!
ehh im a puss. pics and my opinion on programs isnt proprietary and wouldnt risk my job. Ripping the source and uploading it before launch would be.... so im going to chill and be selfish for a good little while.
Slightly off topic, but would you consider recording some video on the Evo camcorder and posting it so we can check it out?